sixpacktr

Slight correction. Keith Olberman has FANTASY'S about Obama--Chris Matthews gets the tingling up his leg when he hears him speak...Both of them are hateful people. I laugh when I see how others on this board claim Fox is 'unfair' and 'biased'. But I watch Fox a lot and never see anyone of them advocate that someone in the administration die or have terrible things happen to them or say 'God forgive you sir' like they do. I see them give Obama a fair shake (it is just that there are few of those to go around). And, to be honest, if Obama had bowed to the Japanese emperor or the like, where that is accepted (while shaking his hand) I don't think that would have caused the stir. But couple Obama's bow to the Saudi Prince (or King, can't remember now) with his apologizing for how wicked and evil and mean America is? Now you have someone that is embarrassing. And don't worry. The only people that played the bow was Fox. The libtards at CNN, PMSNBC, etc., don't play it. And since Fox is soooo lame and noooobody watches it anyway, not a problem, right? Oh wait, that's right. Fox is kicking every other news org's behind on cable and is approaching beating perky little Katie Couric. By more than double. Why? In poll after poll, it is because they are as they say they are: fair and balanced, and they give the news as it is, not spun so much you get dizzy trying to figure out how they came to that conclusion.

Vort, I think I saw the prelim to your work. It was on Monty Python, titled 'The Bishop'. Or was it 'The Spanish Inquisition'. No matter, I was captivated...

Having been a SS teacher for the youth and for the adults, as well as in PH, I know that the teachers are counseled to not let the lesson drift into unknown paths (read EQ discussions!), but to keep to the lesson plan. Now, I don't ascribe wholly to that, in that I don't believe the General SS Presidency just wants the teachers to read straight from the book. They want them to prepare and bring their own insights and thoughts into the lessons. So if a teacher is asking 'who is the Savior of the world?' in GD class, then he needs to be released, IMO. Or at least talked to by the SS President. I have always loved SS, and when I have taught I have tried to make it interesting for those I taught. Because learning the Gospel SHOULD be fun and exciting. But, we also need to be sure that what we teach is rooted in gospel doctrines, not pet theories, etc. I have a real problem in that area, so much so that my arm can be black and blue from my wife punching me. In my current calling I feel I need to correct incorrect statements right then and there. She (my wife) thinks I offend others, and I tend to be rather blunt, but I always talk to the person afterwards to apologize if I was blunt but to teach. About a year ago or so, we had a woman get up during F&T meeting. I had opened the meeting and before turning it over to the congregation had bore my testimony of the power of the PH and it's effect in our lives. This woman got up and affirmed what I had said and then proceeded to tell how she had had her 14 year old son come in and give her a PH blessing when she was sick one time! I looked at the Bishop, he at me, and just then my wife called me because she was very sick and needed a blessing. So I wasn't able to correct the outright false doctrine that came over the pulpit. And no one did, apparently. So 2 months later when I was giving a talk I addressed that issue point blank. Said I didn't mean to offend, but that is false doctrine and we need to be aware of that. I had several come up to me afterward and thank me for correcting that. This isn't to toot my horn, but rather to point out that these types of things are constantly being spouted out by members who don't understand or don't want to understand.

Beeche, To me, yes, you can fall away. Just as I can, just as anyone here can. I used to get annoyed with my wife when she'd say that, because I wasn't mature enough to think that she or I would. I now know better. When Pres Hinckley stated several years ago in a conference talk 'I hope I will endure to the end' it made my heart glad. Because I realized that it was okay for me to have that worry, to know how fickle the Spirit can be IF I don't do my part. All of your examples are areas that Satan will work on. I was talking to my wife about our daughter's impending wedding. Her fiance is a recent convert, and she brought him into the gospel. They just told his folks that they can't be part of the wedding ceremony, per se, but we are letting them handle the reception so that they can feel more a part of things (this is sticky: my wife and I were in the same boat, as her folks aren't members). He is close with his folks, and my wife said she hoped that they wouldn't have too big of a struggle with it. I told her that was EXACTLY where Satan would concentrate, because he ALWAYS goes after the weak spots in our armor. This will be a trial for them, but I'm confident that they'll be okay. That is why we must be constantly vigilant to our thoughts and feelings. If we allow ourselves to justify our actions, or be offended, or be lax in our approach to Diety, we are setting up an area for Satan to attack and weaken.

From your mouth to God's ear, Ram...I remember Reagan's speech. It gave me chills then and still does. It is funny that those that actually move history rarely get the credit for it. Gorby was forced into acquiesence, but since Reagan was the original Bush (in lib's eyes), he is undeserving of the credit, apparently. Reagan and the Iron Lady in GB forced Gorby's hand. Thank you, Pres Reagan. Thank you, Prime Minister Thatcher. If only you were around now....But Europe now, as it did then, must have its Gorbasm. Because now, instead of forcing our enemies to fear us, and our allies to respect us, and those that are oppressed to hope on us (such as Solidarity and several other groups in those days), we instead ask them to check the grease under the bus after we threw them under there...

Right on the mark, Tarnished. Too often we look for excuses to justify our behavior instead of repenting and trying harder to be more like Him. Not pointing at your friends in particular, but as I said, I have seen the same things, and their lives are a mess now. I still stick by my initial post: little things, little things, little things. If we do them, we'll have the Spirit. If we don't, we won't (or at least not as strongly as we should)...

that is what HT/VT is for. And yes, we are not to judge. But by the same token, they need to be warned. Lovingly. But simply listening and agreeing with them so that they don't get angrier, etc., is not correct either. If we have friends/family/etc., that have fallen away for whatever reason, or, perhaps more importantly, we see them beginning to fall away thru evil practices, we need to warn them of the road they are heading down. Otherwise, we are just as culpable, IMO, because we didn't try to help them see the error of their ways. King Benjamin, Jacob, Alma come to mind...

Another great week in college football! LSU loses, Oregon loses (after beating USC at least!) and Iowa loses. Cincy barely beats UConn, which may hurt them a bit in the polls. Does Bama jump Texas for beating a higher ranked team? I don't know. 2 and 1/2 weeks to Rivalry weekend! I'm gonna eat turkey and watch college football until my belt snaps!

TG,You are okay with number two. Having spent 6 glorious years in the Atlanta area, the Dawgs are my team (after BYU, of course). You are WAY off base on Miami and Florida! This year has been tough for Dawgs' fans, though. Hoping next year is better. The Alabama/LSU game was a great game! I like LSU (I like all the SEC teams except Tennessee and Florida), but I have been a Tide fan for much, much longer (see above statement for my change in allegiance!). I am rooting for Bama to win out (although the Auburn game should be tough, just because it is Auburn). Then I hope they make steaks out of the gators! Bama/Texas on Jan 92nd (after the 91 other bowl games in Jan!) for the National Championship!

Traveler, You are always spot on with your assessments. I do have to take issue with a comment someone stated on the 1st page that the church swings too far to the 'works' side and has to be corrected from time to time. I do believe that individual members may do that, thinking they can earn their way into heaven. This, to a degree, is true, which is why falsehood is so easy to sell for Satan: base it in truth and pervert it enough to lead people away (even just 1 degree, as per Elder Uchtdorf's talk a conference or two ago). But I don't think that church has ever swung that way: it has always been the grace of Christ that saves us. Nephi tells us that we are saved by grace, after all we can do. Well, there is precious little we can do, but what we can do, we need to do. The grace of Christ will make up the vast majority of our salvation 'earnings', as it were, as we enter into that partnership with him for our salvation. I was in the Palmyra temple on Friday night with my lovely wife. We were able to do sealings for those that have gone before. As I sat as a witness and at times as a proxy, and as the sealer pronounced the welding of those marriage's thru time and eternity and then pronounced the blessings that attend that union, I could see chains being welded together. Literally, I had that image in my mind when he would pronounce those blessings. My wife had a very special experience being a proxy for a daughter on one union, and there was a feeling there that that family had waited a LONG time for that ordinance. Nothing in life is guaranteed. In another thread I noted of people I have known that did all they were supposed to up to a point in their lives and then chucked it away, becoming more and more bitter against the church for their problems. They can, as the prodigal son, still come back and be welcomed back, but they need to make that effort themselves. They are only abandoned as much as they choose. In a like manner, we can receive the necessary ordinances to get us back to our Father's presence, and he has paid 99.9% of the 'toll' to get us there thru the beauty of the plan of salvation and the law of sacrifice. So while our portion is miniscule, it is our ALL, which is what the Lord requires of us. And that doesn't mean that we don't mess up from time to time. But it does mean that we repent all of the time and try to be more like Him....

I agree that we should not profile everyone that practices Islam. However, I do believe that there was a level of PCness that crept into this instance for FEAR of offending the Muslim. Just as if this had been some white guy claiming Tim McVeigh had a point, or a Latino claiming Fidel or Che had it right with armed overthrow of the gov't, in this instance there should have been some concerns raised (yes, as you said, hindsight is 20/20). We don't live in normal times. It is unfortunate, but true.

Methinks that TrulyKiwi is a 'truther'....Somehow this is all evil Bush's and Cheney's fault....I see that people still don't want to come to grips with this man's Islamic persuasion, at least not call this what it is: a terrorist act. Sure, he may have been a nut job, he may have been a coward, he may have been 'pushed' against his will. I think that the media should be careful before painting with a broad brush a religion or ethnicity or whatever in a case like this. I was glad to hear that some Islamic org denounced this act of insanity right after it happened, which they don't often do. Unfortunately, we have forgotten 9/11, at least we have tried to spackle over that wound with PCness. We are so afraid of calling a spade a spade and saying that we are under attack by Islam and that we have to take some precautions when it comes to this issue that we leave ourselves open to things like this. It seems that this guy didn't just snap, he led up to this act with some pretty outlandish statements. IOW, he left signs all over the place, and yet nothing was done for fear of offending the muslim. We need to understand that there is a faction in a religion that desires to destroy anything and everything western, particularly Christianity. And we need to awaken as a nation to this fact or we will continue to have problems like this...

Beefche, I have wondered the same thing. I have known friends, RMs, great guys, strong in the church, and are now completely inactive and blaming the church for their problems. I sat in a meeting where a guy gave one the best talks I've ever heard, someone I looked up to as a leader (he was a HC), and 6 months later he was inactive (actually completely against the church), had abandoned his family, etc. He didn't even come to his mother's funeral. I was the one that took her the sacrament every other week as YM's President because he was gone. All I could ask myself was 'what was the point of it all? He did everything he was supposed to for 60 years, and then just chunks it away.' My wife is big on stating that it is the little things that determine if we'll be faithful or not, and indeed, if we'll make it to the CK or not. Why? Because Satan rarely puts a (pardon me for this) gorgeous naked woman in someone's path that is reading the scriptures, praying, paying tithing, following their leader's counsel, etc., and expecting them to fall right then and there. The big things are easy, but if we neglect the little things, the big things become easier to succumb to because we no longer have the Spirit as we should in our lives. Ridiculing leaders is a HUGE problem I see in the church right now. More local leaders than our GAs, although I see some of that as well (kind of 'cafeteria style' acceptance of what they teach--I like that one, but not so crazy about THAT teaching, etc). I see it here on this forum way too much, so much so that it is very easy to see who will and won't have problems down the line when things get really tough. We haven't even begun to see the bad yet, and if we don't hold to the rod, ALL of the rod with our whole hands (hearts and soul) we tempt fate in being led into 'unknown paths' that are covered in mists of darkness...

It is unbelievable. I was glued to Fox all last night, up to the news conference around 9:30 my time. I was glad to hear at least the civilian cop wasn't killed, that she was in stable condition. I'm also glad that Hassan wasn't killed, so that they can find out if there is anything more to this than just him deciding he didn't want to go. Then today, another 8 are shot in Orlando? I heard that on the news as I was out getting some lunch. We are living in a time when people are doing heinous things. The creep in Ohio that raped women and had, what, 10 bodies buried around his yard? I keep thinking of Christ's warning that the love of men shall grow cold. News like this is horrendous, and yet somehow I'm not shocked. Is it because we are inundated with death and destruction so much that we are getting callous to it? I think of the Jaredite and Nephite nations, at the end, and how there was war continually before them. I got to think that they had become so immune to suffering that it didn't faze them anymore.

Seems so easy to start calling everyone a 'racist' that doesn't hold with your enlightened beliefs. And Cleon Skousen, to boot. I've read 'The 5000 Year Leap', as well as his series of the 1st 4000 years. Funny, can't find anything racist in any of these books, which, it would seem to me, would be impossible to hide, given how he is just a dispicable, typical Mormon racist. But then, I guess that makes ME a racist as well, since I don't see it in his writings, right? Unbelievable. Choose to be offended, and guess what? You'll find that you are...

That Jesus Christ lived, died for our sins, and was resurrected. That is the main tenet of our church. Another important part of the gospel is the priesthood authority to act in God's name for the saving of his children here upon the earth, particularly the sealing of families together throughout the eternities. Another important factor is continuing revelation, thru living prophets on the earth today, that reveal God's will to his children as situations warrant. I'm sure there is more, and while we share the belief in Christ with other Christian churches, the PH authority (particularly sealing) and continuing revelation set us apart from them.

WN,You're about to get an 'attaboy' or 'attagirl' (which ever fits) for being a better Mormon than the rest of us cretins, so be careful (or proud. I'm sure it is meant as a compliment).

But wait... are hairs classified as veggie or animal? Most animals have some type of hair....so just how did you get hairs to spit out in the first place? Could it be that you LIKE meat???

Cydonia, It is obvious you just want to argue. It is also obvious that you are somewhat self righteous because you are a veggie. IF YOU DON'T WANT TO EAT MEAT AT A WARD FUNCTION, THEN DON'T! Does the bishop hold a knife to your throat, or put a tube down it, and force you to eat meat? I'd wager not. And why this obsession with the WoW and meat? Since when are ANY of us perfect? As I said previously, there are few that keep the WoW perfectly. Just as few of us are perfectly honest, perfectly chaste (lustful thoughts do enter our minds), perfectly doing all we should do. That is why there is repentance. So, instead of asking like a 2 year old 'why, why why?' when you've been given answers, grow up and do as you will. Go eat some cabbage, or an apple, or maybe some tofurkey. Have a ball! Just quit acting like you're somehow better than the rest of us that love a good steak, chicken, ostrich, whale, whatever....

Umm....Newt backed the demo.., uh, repub candidate. Not Hoffman. And frankly, we all can see what happens when repubs embrace the 'big tent' with gay marriage, abortion, big govt'. They get their tails kicked. Scuzzy should have never been a repub. Not even here in NY. and the great thing is that Hoffman was a NOBODY 6 weeks ago, and lost by only 3 percentage points. All moderates can just go join the dems. Please. Quit mucking up the message. If not, then a third party based upon the ideals and principles of the tea party movement is coming and will replace the 'repubs'.

Because we're not as righteous as you are. You've been given answers to your 'questions' over and over again, yet you continue to beat the same dead horse. Beer is not a mild drink. And yes, you DID claim the D&C said beer was okay. It isn't. Mild barley drinks can mean lots of things. To me, it is barley tea, which I drink gallons of during the summer, since it is one of the national summer drinks in Japan. Are you saying that those people that lived in the 1800's were too stupid to figure out to steep roasted barley, or wheat, or anything else, and drink the tea they had made? Are you so blinded to making sure that everyone ELSE understands that they are not following the letter of the WoW law that the ONLY rational explanation to what the Lord said thru Joseph for 'mild barley drinks' was beer? What, exactly, is your point? I would wager that most members, by being overweight, also don't follow the WoW. Or that they don't get enough exercise, or sleep, or some of the other things. Again, what in the flip is your point?

Only if you put it in your brownies....

Thanks for clarifying that. Another reason for a playoff!

At least BYU didn't play last week. It seems to be the best way for them to stay in the top 25... What I loved was that after Florida, Texas and Alabama, you have Cincinnati, Boise State and TCU. I have no love for BS or TCU, and could care less about Cincy, but will root for all three teams to bust the BCS this year. They won't play in the title game because of the way it is set up, but it will wreak havoc with the other BCS bowls. Isn't the national championship game the Rose Bowl this year? If so, then the Orange, Sugar, and Fiesta Bowls must be shaking in their boots right now: Big East, MW, and WAC in their precious bowls! Gotta love college football. Even if the Cougs break your heart year after year after year...

We all ought to pray that somehow the Constitution is protected. What she did was appropriate. When I was at BYU many, many years ago I attended the Asian ward with my wife. It was made up of Japanese, Chinese, Polynesians, Vietnamese, other Asians, etc., and their American husbands/wives. It was a great ward, but there was acrimony because of the war, etc., but I digress. Once Sunday just before the 4th of July, our Bishop got up and told all of us that we should all celebrate this great national holiday even if the US wasn't the place of our birth or nationality because the US Constitution was set up by the hand of God and without the US and the freedoms enshrined within it the church could not have come forth. So while it is SO cool to denigrate those of us that believe that the Constitution is being dismantled at an alarming rate, always, always remember--Joseph himself talked of the Constitution, talked of the founders of this country, and that those men appeared to either John Taylor or Wilford Woodruff so that their temple work would be done. We have forgotten what it is to be American.