the Ogre

Okay, but neither of those fit the traditional definitions of hell (red-dudes with bifurcated-tails, horns, pitch-forks, and an affinity for charcoal or Dante's Infernal) and as such, they do not need/fit the appellation "hell".

Name in the book, but with a different address. I think what you are trying to ask is if going to the Telestial or Terrestrial kingdoms equates salvation.I think it is an argument of semantics. Some will say, if one did not get outer-darkness they earned salvation. Others will say anything not the highest degree of the celestial kingdom equals damnation. Others will take moderate positions between the two. The interesting part of your question is: will those in the Telestial kingdom be living on Mars? The Moon? Inner core of the Sun?

Trolls start threads all the time. You just didn't know how to do it. John had to teach you.

Oh, my eyes well up with tears (actually it is a reaction to mowing the lawn earlier). I wonder how you contrived this "abomination" thing? Hilarious. I love it. You are not a congregationalist, you are a comedian of smashing watermelons, whoopee-cushions, and squirting daisies.Oh, my . . . (sniffle).

Oh yeah, there is absolutely no place for students to live in Provo. It's the dorms or nothing.

Has a specific location ever been revealed? Nope. All we know is that the earth will be celestialized.

yay!!!

I don't think so, but then again Latter-day Saints don't exactly believe in "hell".

These are the twelve steps that I know. I disagree with G-dless, but that's okay. I did stop cold turkey. I went to AA for a few months. The steps work.I will note that some people who go through AA are not religious. I had a religion that I could choose that reinforced abstinence. Of the most importance was following President Kimball's advise to cut off all ties with the environments and groups where I could relapse the easiest. Not being around alcohol helped me kick it. Having a great support system helped me kick it. Having a good reason to quit (my children) helped me kick it. For myself, I'll say: having a loving, supportive H-avenly F-ther provided the miracle of my lasting abstinence. I am a recovering alcoholic. I know I can relapse easily.

Do you know what is really funny? You came here. You came here to talk with us (errr . . . talk at is more likely). The Bible is an absolutely wonderful text. I think it is beautiful scripture and carries much of the Gospel of J-sus Chr-st, but just as Ram pointed out (better than I ever could) over time there have been intentional (and sometimes unintentional) changes to scripture. Because of this G-d picked Joseph Smith to be H-s prophet (I think Joseph would have been quite happy to have lived his life as a Yankee Farmer just as his forefathers and neighbors had if he had never had the faith as a young fourteen year old to pray about a question that bothered him, as well as me, quite deeply: which church is true?) to restore the gospel to its beautiful, simple form.If you didn't like what we had to say or what we have to offer, you shouldn't have come.

Not much.

It is a beautiful prayer. Thank you.

You're a Congregationalist!!! Oh my, That explains a lot. Congregationalist attacks on Mormons are of the most cliched type. Wonderful. This is so good to know. BTW: Not "all" Chr-stians agree; some Chr-stians agree. If all Chr-stians agreed, then everyone would be a Congregationalist.

I think this can be observed best at Carl's Jr.

I particularly like the section above. It is quite beautiful. It is obvious the yogi was a skilled religious poet. I also have quite a selection of prayer books (mostly Jewish). I read them often. They are often quite good at expressing the love the person praying has for G-d. Sometimes, people are not capable of beautiful oratory like this, so the need for a prayer book can be handy. The problem for Latter-day Saints is that we have very few pre-written prayers. We do not have any for daily use. None at all. We do not have prayer-books. We are guided to pray spontaneously from the heart. The weakness, sometimes, for prayers like this is their utility as opposed to art. Too often, LDS prayers do not seek a bonding with G-d through prayer. A mystical-connection per se. Are you making a recommendation?

Right. I remember seeing this when I was in the army (a squad-member invited me to attend with him). I was very surprised to say the least. Pentecostal meeting are much different than LDS meetings. I remember the speaking in tongues part. I do not recall prophesy, but it was quite a long time ago. To be clear though, when speaking in tongues it does not mean to actually speak in a known language?I have read old journals where Brigham Young discouraged "speaking in tongues" as you mention it from the pulpit while he was on one of his missions in England. I know now, if tongues are spoken, there has to be an interpreter. This is an interesting parallel. I, however, am not sure what you mean by prophesy. The section on Joel does not explain the process that well (I think the section you indicate is a post-apocalyptical/millennial prophesy. Ie.. coming after the 2nd coming). Can you give me web site that might help?

Nice. I like the music very much.

Sorry I missed this post. I agree. I do not think they are our allies, rather I think they act in their own self interest in ME affairs making sure they stay on top with as little spending on their military as possible. I agree with this 100%. I think Bush's loyalties here were questionable.

Can you see the parallels between what you said and what is said in Acts and in the Articles of Faith. Faith comes first. For Latter-day Saints that means conversion or being born again. We believe that it is first. Faith, then the ordinance. Why? If you do not accept the S-vior, then what point is the ordinance? There is none. With the faith followed by obedience to what we feel is a commandment, we then have begun the first steps in the path towards salvation. It sounds like you believe the same thing.Where is the conflict?

Interesting . . . in church (elder's quorum) we differentiated between the gift of tongues and the gift of language. I speak Korean and I am learning French, but I do not think this is the result of a spiritual gift. The difference is between an LDS missionary who learns Korean fluently in six-months (trust me, Korean is one of the world's hardest languages, this is a real feat) and someone in fast-and-testimony meeting spontaneously speaking Korean without ever having studied it and an hour later cannot understand a single cha of Korean (I've seen it once, my ex translated for me).I think those are fabulous gifts. How do you feel about the differentiation?

Yet, he would rather prophesy (1 Cor 14.5-6).

I think you are making a mistake in not addressing Pam's suggestion.

Okay, then learn something: what you said was deeply insulting. You have said it a couple of times. Try this: 1 Sam 3.1-10; the prophet Samuel sets this precedent--he was younger (most likely 13 years old). Do you question Samuel's testimony and calling as a prophet? If Samuel could be called as a child, then why not Joseph.

Congrats. When I ETS'd, I lit a bonfire and danced around it like a pagan; burned my uniforms, OD green socks, and issue underwear; painted my cocorans red-white-and-blue and hung them on a telephone line; beat-up my squad leader; smoked three packs of lucky strikes; mooned a passing 2nd LT (dirty West-Point monkey); drank loads of rum and passed out under my friend's Zam (in a puddle of motor-oil and hurl); and a week later I was enrolled at BYU (I got drunk that night, too).I loved my time in and thank you for your service. Go ARMY!!!

Okay, when you talk to your local leaders, they may be able to dig them up. Umm, what naval base were you on when you were baptized?