pushka

I agree with Jason and Snow on this matter...socialism/communism is a not an evil concept, born of Satan...if practised in the way in which it was supposed to be, it would be ideal, however Man is corrupt and it was the corrupt Stalinist Government which made Communism in Russia at that time evil...

I think this is the place where Jason might be handy in discussing the Orthodox Catholic church and its beliefs about the Bishops of X country and Y country, and about the Bishop of Italy (the Pope) having broken away from the others, and therefore the Roman Catholic church being created? Sorry Jason...I've really simplified that, and left out tons, I know, but if you care to join this thread again and fill in the gaps, if you still believe the Orthodox Church is sort of right? Thanks :)

Well, I fed my two cats today (care of the small, furry and needy! lol) and I've been cooking for and washing up after myself and my friends who shared their holiday with me this week...and have cancelled a meeting I was gonna attend tonight, so that I can spend some time with my kids when they get back from their dad's tonight...so hopefully I've done some little good deeds...

Fiannan, thanks for your reply...I'm pleased to hear that you get on well with people from other religious denominations, and I can understand your discomfort with the changes over the years, within the Lutheran church...I just felt that your arguments were getting a little too personal with Maureen, a bit like children arguing in a playground? and got the impression that ALL Swedish people must be bad, in your opinion. Thanks for correcting my assumptions. I think it is better to be cautious in our speech, than to openly spread hatred about one another and thus sparking riots and other 'nasty' events. Don't you believe in freedom with responsibility? Don't you think that should apply to all aspects of our lives? USN: Do you feel that we should settle all disagreements by shooting each other? Quote, USN: 'Countries that exercise strict gun control seem to have alot of "freedom" problems.' Unquote.

I haven't been following the news or reading the Press enough to have my own opinion on what is happening in France or why...however a good friend of mine printed this on our web forum: From: http://www.anarkismo.net/newswire.php?story_id=1692 Eyewitness to Paris riots by Anarkismo Editorial Group Wednesday, Nov 9 2005, 4:19am france / belgium / luxemburg / community struggles / non anarchist press Eyewitness to Paris riots charges police with deliberate provocation By Antoine Lerougetel 5 November 2005 Source: Athens Indymedia Rioting in Paris suburbs and other urban areas in France entered its second week Friday, as impoverished and angry youth continued to battle police. The fighting has extended to the eastern city of Dijon and the southern port city of Marseilles. As France’s political elite vacillated between empty promises of “action” on unemployment and threats of even more severe repression, a document published on the Internet by the anti-racist site Les mots sont importants (lmsi.net—Words are Important) provides an eyewitness account of police provocation on the Chêne-Pointu housing estate. That estate, in Clichy-sous-Bois, a suburb northeast of Paris, was home to the two youths whose electrocution while fleeing police October 27 set off the current wave of unrest. The Web document alleges that a massive police operation was deliberately designed to exacerbate the conflict with the youth on the estate after initial riots following the deaths of the two teenagers had subsided. The author of the account, Antoine Germa, a geography and history teacher, prefaces his account by saying, “I have been on several visits to Clichy-sous-Bois since Saturday morning to prepare a series of programmes with a France Inter radio journalist on the situation in Clichy-sous-Bois. The town has been in turmoil since Thursday 27 October.... This is what I saw, heard, understood and was told.” He finds implausible, in the first place, the denial, by Nicolas Sarkozy, France’s right-wing minister of the interior, that police were chasing the youth. “Why would the youths go into that alley and climb a fence to hide in an EDF state electricity company transformer when their estate was close by?” he asks. That night and the following night saw fierce rioting and battles with the heavily equipped CRS riot police. However, on October 30, the day of a silent march in commemoration of the tragic deaths of Zyad Benna and Bouna Traore, mobilised by Muslim groups and the local mosque, “everything seemed calm throughout the day and the forces of the law kept out of sight.” German continues: “On Saturday night, at the end of the fast of Ramadan, at about 6:30 p.m., 400 CRS and gendarmes came...in cohorts like the Roman legions, at a run, visors down, shields on their arms and rubber and plastic bullet guns in their hands, they went through each street against an invisible enemy. At this time, everyone is eating and nobody is outside. Why this demonstration of force when the streets were particularly calm? ‘Police provocation,’ reply as one the local people.” The teacher’s account continues: “After an hour, a few youth emerge and face up to the police, everyone waiting for the confrontation to start. What sense can we give to this police strategy except the wish to ‘mark their territory,’ that is to say, to apply an animal and brute version of the return to ‘republican order.’ ” However, Antoine Germa considers that Saturday night was less violent than the two previous nights and that it took an attack on a mosque with tear gas at 9 p.m. Sunday night, for which crime police are the prime suspects, to really relaunch the rioting. The question that must be asked is: Who ordered the police to intervene and stoke up the anger of the community and to goad the youth into action? Who benefits from such seemingly gratuitous state provocation against the most vulnerable and excluded sections of society? Of course, the political forces that think they stand to benefit are those with a repressive, law-and-order agenda. There is every reason to believe that Interior Minister Nicolas Sarkozy is bent on stoking up the revolt of the youth on the suburban council estates ringing Paris. After widespread criticism—some it from his own party, the ruling Union for a Popular Movement—for his provocative description of the largely immigrant and Muslim youth on these poor, working class estates as “scum” and “gangrene,” which need to be sandblasted away, he defended his stance on November 3. “What is extraordinary,” he said, “is to concentrate on the words and not on realities.... There is no future for our districts if we do not rid them of the gangs, the black economy, dealing and drug dealers...the two main words are firmness and justice.” He also claimed that the disturbances were “in no way spontaneous” and “perfectly organised.” Sarkozy made no mention of the poverty and social distress of these estates nor of his government’s cutting of resources: the basic cause of the resentment felt against all representatives of state authority, which his repressive police actions and demeaning language have stoked to fever pitch. Since the massive incursions by heavily armed riot police, the whole of the northern suburbs of Paris have been hit by disturbances and running battles between the youth and the police. The night of Sarkozy’s latest remarks marked a sharp escalation of the elemental and destructive anger of the youth. A total of 519 vehicles were torched in Île-de-France, the Paris region, as opposed to 222 the previous night. There were attacks on symbols of state authority: a police station; the Bobigny magistrates’ court, where many arrested youth are appearing; a bus depot in Trappes; a primary school in Stains. Shops, car showrooms, a supermarket and warehouses were also fired and looted. Highly mobile groups of youth moved, according to reports, to different estates and forced the 1,300 police to spread throughout the area. In the rest of France, 77 vehicle burnings were reported and skirmishes between youth and the police took place in Dijon estates and in Marseilles. In the first week of the urban revolt, 135 arrests were made; 27 adults were charged and 16 have been given jail sentences. On Wednesday evening in Bobigny, one young adult was jailed for a month and another for three months. Three others had suspended sentences of six to nine months. Amar Henni, in charge of a training centre in Essonne, near Paris, told the press: “One day there’s going to be a general flare-up—when the resentment reaches other than the younger generations.” Fearing such an eventuality, the editorial of the Socialist Party-oriented Libération, which previously had urged caution, threw in its lot with the forces of repression, declaring that the youth’s “violence is only in part an expression of a malaise nourished by exclusion, injustice and poverty.... The power must stay with the law. We cannot abandon whole areas to minority violence that poisons the life of those who live on the estates.” Meanwhile the right-wing Le Figaro, which in a recent editorial mildly reproached Sarkozy for his verbal excesses, featured an article that the neo-fascist Jean-Marie Le Pen would entirely endorse. The roots of the problem, it claims “are the consequence of an uncontrolled immigration policy.” The sharp movement to the right of the French political establishment, under cover of an anti-immigrant hysteria, serves as a warning to the whole working class of ever-increasing attacks on all basic gains and rights.

I'm not afraid of fiction...films, books, games...but reality does scare me. I agree with the posts by ToasterOften and Setheus, regarding being cautious in order to protect ourselves against that which we fear, and about learning about what we fear, so as to overcome the fear. As for the events in the world...It really saddens me when I see/hear about what is happening to people and places, I think the best we can do is to offer whatever help we can in a given situation, be that financial, spiritual, practical or whatever...It angers me that there is much happening in the world which could be prevented/put to right if our World Leaders could talk more and be more reasonable with one another, instead of having to start wars...a pipedream perhaps, whatever the case, if you think you can alter a bad situation..politically even, then go out and do your bit...try to rid the world of a little bit of the insanity!

I think teaching can only take place when there is mutual respect... without it... you get columbine high.. ← I agree Please...

Thanks Please! I was worried that some people might think I meant that there should never be any discipline at school, or teachers being firm or anything, but I do believe in firmness and discipline, I just don't believe in humiliating people or losing your temper when you're in a position of authority...

← Whilst I agree that children/young adults ought to be taught the practicalities of life, dealing with people who are not 'so nice', learning how to cope financially and such, I do not agree that a teacher who scowles, yells and points out your weaknesses is teaching correctly. It is fine to chat in private about your difficulties in a particular subject, or general manners, however I don't see any benefit from being shouted at, scowled at or 'put down' in front of other classmates. I would say that this type of behaviour from the teacher would only teach the child that it is okay to respond to everyday situations in the same way, and would not teach them to react reasonably to confrontations/problems...it would cause a lot of resentment to build in that child instead of instilling confidence.

I believe in free speech, however I believe in responsible free speech. Over here in the UK we have a ban on speech which incites HATRED, mainly racial hatred at the moment, because that seems to be most prevalent due to immigration issues...therefore, I would advise any preacher, in any religion, to exercise caution when preaching against homosexuality, as his/her words may be used as an excuse for extremists to be less than Christian towards homosexuals as a result of listening to their sermon. Oh, and Fiannan, don't you think it's about time you stopped all your anti Swede/Lutheran posts? spreading discontent like this isn't very Christian is it? I suggest you sort out your personal hang ups about that religion and your wife in private instead of bringing it to the message board and using it against Maureen on the other thread...not nice!

He did say that he might have to be away from the net for a few days...so let's just assume that he's very busy helping his mother at the moment...and keep our fingers crossed, of course :)

I read today, in the UK press, that pessimists have a shorter life expectancy than optimists...I presume it's from all that extra stress created from worrying about things so much, which leads to other disorders!

ApostleKnight, you and all of your family are in my thoughts at this difficult time...I send my best wishes to your dad, for a complete recovery, and look forward to hearing some happier news from you soon... All the best, and whatever happens, stay strong!

Although there has been a proven link between the intake of Caffeine and raised blood pressure, it is possible to reap the benefits of coffee drinking if you drink DeCaffeinated coffee.

D&C 132:54 And I command mine handmaid, Emma Smith, to abide and cleave unto my servant Joseph, and to none else. But if she will not abide this commandment she shall be destroyed, saith the Lord; for I am the Lord thy God, and will destroy her if she abide not in my law.That states pretty clearly that although Emma had Free Agency to deny Joseph permission to marry more wives...because she was wife #1...the alternaltive was that she would be "destroyed" if she exercised that agency. Whether that meant the physical destruction of Emma or a spiritual destruction (outer darkness?) I do not know. The chapter summary states: 51—57, Emma Smith is counseled to be faithful and true; That's sort of a soft way of phrasing it. One could argue that Emma was being threatened, but I suppose the opposing argument would be that she still had Free Agency. I think I am sort of repeating what I already said in the other post, but hopefully I was more clear this time :) ← Thanks again Tao...I suppose I was asking for the quotes from D&C which threatened Emma, so that I could see exactly what they said... I must say, however, that the first quote, about Emma : D&C 132:54 And I command mine handmaid, Emma Smith, to abide and cleave unto my servant Joseph, and to none else. But if she will not abide this commandment she shall be destroyed, saith the Lord; for I am the Lord thy God, and will destroy her if she abide not in my law. I just read to mean that she ought to stay with Joseph Smith, as her husband, and not marry anyone else? It doesn't say anything to me about accepting a polygamous marriage to him? unless the further scripture: 51—57, Emma Smith is counseled to be faithful and true; means that she must also allow Joseph to do as he pleases, without argument? Is that the way you're reading it? Or had the issue of polygamy already been mentioned before d&C 132:54? I'm sorry to keep pressing this point, in view of your further comments regarding God not sending messages such as these any more, and just giving people a 'good feeling' about something or other, but I just like to be certain about why somebody has said what they have about something in the scriptures. I'm sorry that you had to repeat some of your earlier post...that wasn't what I wanted you to have to do!!

Thanks for replying Tao...yes I did realise that the same privelidge would be given to the 1st husband as would be given to the 1st wife under these circumstances... I'm a little confused about the other bit in your previous post, about Emma being condemned (not using your words directly, just trying to use a word that conjures up the same meaning...hope it's the right one) if she didn't give him her permission...can you explain that a little further, and tell me if she would be? This would follow that all wives/husbands refusing their partners the additional husband/wife would also be condemned...sort of makes their choice a bit of a farce doesn't it!

Happy Birthday Jenda! :)

You men still refusing to give a straightforward answer as to whether or not you would be happy if your wife was told by God that she had to take on extra husbands?

I have more respect for a rabid animal...it didn't choose it's condition!

Classic 70's UK rock bands: Queen, Thin Lizzy... Classic 60's US rock Band: The Doors Aerosmith, Iron Maiden, Gun 'n' Roses, Red Hot Chilli Peppers, Rem, Radiohead, Fat Boy Slim, Bowie, The Beatles, Dylan, Johnny Cash. Just a few in my collection :)

Some good tactics there Dizzysmiles... Yes, Shanstress it is all messed up when the victim can become the accused in a trial following the attack! terrible...

I tend to agree with Shanstress that any God worth his weight in salt, would be more concerned with the needs of his people than with having a temple/s built in his name...

What was Jesus' view on it tho?

That method of defending yourself would not be considered acceptable by UK courts where guns are not permitted without a license, to begin with...the majority of people in the UK do not own or carry guns. Also, whether being attacked, robbed or having your house burgled, no person is allowed to use anything but 'reasonable force' otherwise they will be charged for the injuries that their attacker/robber incurs! Obviously I would want to fight to defend myself against Rape, if I thought that it was a viable option and that I would survive, but I wouldn't put my life at risk to protect my body against rape...the wounds, I know are very deep mentally, and would be difficult to live with, but I would hope that with support I would be able to live and perhaps help to bring the rapist to court and prevent any further attacks from him to others.

Happy Birthday John Doe!