NeuroTypical

You just identified a core, foundational belief of liberals. You can't find many conservatives who believe similarly.

Heather is like Porter Rockwell. It's no longer possible to tell myth from reality.

Well Johnny, I've encountered many, many former mormons. They've told a wide range of stories, but similar themes to this guy. I've heard similar stories firsthand from many believing saints as well. (My buddy lost his virginity at a mutual swimming activity, for example.) And finally, I know a handful of very screwed-up LDS families with similar stories or worse. Surely, he could have made other choices, found and accepted better council. As I said earlier, I find some similarities between my upbringing and his. I don't see any reason to believe he was lying, or even exagerating.

I would be surprised if the SSM supporters want to claim this guy as part of their 'side'.To me, it doesn't matter how closely some violent nut's opinions or politics align with any particular 'side'. Once they pick up a gun (or bomb, or knife, or what have you), they distance themselves in my mind from association with that side. I don't believe this guy is a member of the Same Sex Marriage rights brigade - no matter how much he sounds like one. (I guess if they want to claim him though, I'm happy to rethink things...)

Yeah. Some people mistakenly think the blessings of repentence is sort of a reward for the bad behavior one is repenting of. Much of the time, those folks are having a hard time forgiving the former sinner.

Ugh - breaking news: Family Research Council shooting leaves security guard wounded According to the CFA critics I've talked to, The Family Research Council was top on their list of 'hate groups'. Don't expect to see much about this shooting, the FRC, or Chick-Fil-A, in the news any time soon.

Wow. Ok, well, that's a clear position I guess. I mean, I hold CC people to the highest standard possible - I don't believe there are many accidents, only negligence. But even I can't bring myself to actually laugh and applaud when someone gets shot. I'll leave taking pleasure in other's pain to you. Disagree. The safest place for a firearm to be, other than locked in a safe somewhere, is safely strapped to a responsible person. Much safer than leaving it in your car to get stolen. Don't worry anne. You are in very good company with that response. In fact, it's about the only response anyone ever gets when the conversation turns to such matters.

I'm hearing lots of stories about individuals who have formed negative or false conclusions. That's part of our human condition, and not really unique to the subject of mormonism. But I'm not hearing stories where churches or other organizations actually host professional critics to fill their member's heads with criticisms. I wonder if those days are over, after so many respected Christians like Ravi Zacharias and Owens and Mosser started dragging this stuff into the light and exposing it for what it was.

Is that what we are doing, LoudmouthMormon? You read my mind better than I do!!Well, you started a thread called "Guns in Theaters are a Good Idea?", and your opening post consisted of a news story and a sarcastic jab*, so that was my guess. If I was wrong, it wouldn't be the first time.So since I'm off base, could you go ahead and clarify why you started the thread? I have been carrying when I take my kids to a theater for many years. Nobody has ever written a news story about me, nor has anyone had reason to. LM (*At least I assume you're not actually glad that he shot himself)

We're using news stories as evidence that carrying is good or bad? Oh goody! Concealed carry permit holder prevents robbery 71-year-old Robbery victim defends himself with permitted concealed gun In this one, the victim didn't take any action until the robber turned back around and pointed a gun at him and the three elderly women he was with. Armed citizen stops multiple victim public shooting in its tracksThis guy stopped an active shooter who had already killed three people, and was about to kill a responding police officer. 65-year-old woman thwarts robbery on jewellery store after opening fire on five armed men These are just some of the stories less than a month old. I'm grateful for the mature, sensible folks out there carrying, who stop robberies, muggings, and killings, thousands of times a year. It's a pity that immature unpracticed idiots like the guy from anne's link grab more attention.

So, have you personally experienced something like that recently Anddenex? I haven't. The last sort of thing I encountered, was an "Are Mormons Christian" class held at the local megachurch. They let me attend a few classes (before I was politely disinvited for opening my mouth), but the tone was the exact opposite of the experience I quoted above. The lady practiced what she called "convicted civility", which basically meant she was right and I was wrong, but she was also going to be civil about it in all her efforts. I could respect that. She and I had a good email back-and-forthing for a while, and she sent me condolences when Pres. Hinckley died, telling me she had attended his funeral and saying it was beautiful. So if you have a personal experience, please share. I am unaware of anything as hateful and blatantly lying as my story above, happening in the last decade or so. Of course there are still anti websites, and people continue to write books and what have you, but Chrisitan churches paying professional critics to 'expose the monstrous lies of the mormon cult'? Please share.

I was going through an old file of LDS-related stuff I used to update. This story was told by a poster named Bernard Gui on the old Zarahemla's Lighthouse board, probably over ten years ago: I'm guessing that most of us mormons have experienced something in the ballpark of misunderstanding, or ignorance, or fear. But has anyone experienced anything similar in the last 5 or 10 years?

I'm guessing here, but this line of reasoning would make sense to me: You can compete against some chick. You can't compete against the false perfection of pr0n.

I've read almost all of them. I loves me some good end-timesy apocolyptic fiction. The speculative doctrinal aspects didn't bother me a bit. The best part IMO was the open field when the lady stood up against the tresspassers, and the angels and demons were squaring off on the other side of the veil too. Great stuff. I found out Chris Steward was also the author of one of my family's most cherished Christmas traditions - A Christmas Bell for Anya. I wholeheartedly recommend it to everyone who wants an extra impactful Christmas.

A good book on our basic beliefs would be the Gospel Principles manual. We teach a Sunday School class out of this manual to any investigators or new members who wish to attend. Chapter 1 Our Heavenly Father Chapter 2 Our Heavenly Family Chapter 3 Jesus Christ, Our Chosen Leader and Savior Chapter 4 Freedom to Choose Chapter 5 The Creation Chapter 6 The Fall of Adam and Eve Chapter 7 The Holy Ghost Chapter 8 Praying to Our Heavenly Father Chapter 9 Prophets of God Chapter 10 Scriptures Chapter 11 The Life of Christ Chapter 12 The Atonement Chapter 13 The Priesthood Chapter 14 Priesthood Organization Chapter 15 The Lord’s Covenant People Chapter 16 The Church of Jesus Christ in Former Times Chapter 17 The Church of Jesus Christ Today Chapter 18 Faith in Jesus Christ Chapter 19 Repentance Chapter 20 Baptism Chapter 21 The Gift of the Holy Ghost Chapter 22 The Gifts of the Spirit Chapter 23 The Sacrament Chapter 24 The Sabbath Day Chapter 25 Fasting Chapter 26 Sacrifice Chapter 27 Work and Personal Responsibility Chapter 28 Service Chapter 29 The Lord’s Law of Health Chapter 30 Charity Chapter 31 Honesty Chapter 32 Tithes and Offerings Chapter 33 Missionary Work Chapter 34 Developing Our Talents Chapter 35 Obedience Chapter 36 The Family Can Be Eternal Chapter 37 Family Responsibilities Chapter 38 Eternal Marriage Chapter 39 The Law of Chastity Chapter 40 Temple Work and Family History Chapter 41 The Postmortal Spirit World Chapter 42 The Gathering of the House of Israel Chapter 43 Signs of the Second Coming Chapter 44 The Second Coming of Jesus Christ Chapter 45 The Millennium Chapter 46 The Final Judgment Chapter 47 Exaltation

Fortunately for me, my wife makes the same choice every time we get into an argument.

Got kids?

No I'm not saying that at all. The choices and sacrifices made by the folks in Alma 24 brought great miracles to pass. It's also interesting to note that the sons of these pacifists were the stripling warriors, who marched off to rain death and destruction on their enemies, while protected by God such that none of them were killed. Zion truly does sound wonderful. I don't like guns, or what they do, or why they're useful. Gimme a better way that would work today, and I'd jump at it. And it shall be said among the wicked: Let us not go up to battle against Zion, for the inhabitants of Zion are terrible; wherefore we cannot stand. It sounds to me like Zion will be protected the same way people protect things these days - through superior strength or by instilling fear in their enemies.

I've been thinking of changing my username to something less out-of-the-gate provokative. What do y'all think?

Sounds great. I wonder how Zion will be protected from the wicked? I hope it's not by reinacting Alma 24.

My motivations for carrying a concealed firearm (in no particular order):* My wife and I helped put a felon behind bars, and have helped to keep him there and modify terms of his parole. He finishes his nickel in September and may come looking for revenge. He knows who we are, what we and our children look like, and where we live. I'd be happy if he stays away. I'd be happy if we heard about him coming into our area and we just got a hotel room until he got bored trashing our house and went away. I'd be happy if we saw him coming and ran the other way and got away. But if none of those things are possible, and he intends us serious harm or death, I carry to have the means to stop that threat. * We live out in the middle of nowhere, with a long drive through deserted wooded areas. If I got stuck in a ditch for a few days in a storm, a gun could signal for help, or scare away bears. (Ok, maybe those are in a particular order.) Anyway, that's about it. I'm no hero. You won't catch me running out to my car and run back into some firefight. (The security guards at my work share the same opinion, by the way.)

I don't carry to make anyone around me comfortable or uncomfortable. So your issue here really isn't my problem. As long as I'm being responsible and safe, you won't have a clue. And unless you're staring at various areas of my body you shouldn't be staring at, you won't notice any bulges.I forget which state you live in Anne, but I assume it's one with conceal carry laws. Tell me - since CC is exploding in popularity, and such sizeable percentages of populations legally carry when they can - what is it like to be you? I mean, just about any sizeable group of people in a public place is more and more likely to have a person or two legally carrying concealed. Do you wander around in discomfort or fear, wondering who is a good guy packing? Do you worry more about the good guys than the bad guys? I'm genuinely interested. If it helps you feel better, many places have laws about 'brandishing', that can be applied to people carrying concealed that let someone else know (on purpose or accidentally) they are carrying. Help keep me and my CC buddies in their top game - tell a cop the next time you see an imprint, or someone brushes up against someone. Yep. I have 5 acres, and often don't bother concealing when I'm out and about. I've gone shooting with my neighbors, so I'm not worrying them. I'd probably choose differently if I had a small yard with close neighbors. Oh, me either. 99.999999999% of the situations I find myself in, require absolutely no gun at all. If I could, I'd raise it to 100%. But I can't, so I responsibly carry.Tell you what - if you can discover a foolproof way to let folks know when they'll need a gun and when they won't, I'm sure most law-abiding carriers will stop carrying, except for when they know they'll need it. (Exceptions would include the open carry idealogues.) Yeah, because bad guys never try to kill innocent people in towns... A good guy with the ability to stop an active shooter would never be needed in a town... Really anne? Well, I agree when talking about stupid or careless or unpracticed carriers, or those who carry to prove some dumb point. They mess up and make the news. Someone drops it in the toilet, or it goes skittering across the floor when they stand up, or they reach for their car keys and pull it out instead and scare the crap out of everybody. Or they have to be cool and show their friends and end up shooting one of them. I have a zero tolerance attitude with knuckleheads with deadly weapons.But the vast majority of us, as evidenced by the simple statistics, are not those people.

The last time I heard someone arguing against such advice was in 1991. All the smokers I know, already understand the health impacts. Do you have a story to tell us braun?

Sorry, let me take the namecalling out of it, before I end up having to issue myself an infraction. Oh no. Open carry people give me a couple of different reasons for arming themselves. Reasons I've personally been given include (and I'm paraphrasing here): "I'm exercising my 2nd amendment rights", "just educating the sheeple", "exposing governmental abuse", "I refuse to let my rights be trampled on by government thugs", and "I'm an American - that's the only reason I need". Yes, self defense is usually there too, although never, in the dozen or so conversations I've had with open-carry enthusaists over the years, never ever has 'self defense' been the only reason they've given me. Oh, I know they see themselves as such. And I know staunch constitutionalists such as yourself tend to see them in that light as well. But turning themselves into walking billboards for their idealogical point means they are not "just law abiding citizens". They are idealogues - which is fine - but no, they are not "just law abiding citizens".And 'due dilligence' is learning rights and laws and statutes. But they don't do this due dilligence to defend themselves, they do it so they can win arguments against cops and enable social change by posting stories of their encounters on gun forums, and videos on youtube. And exercising rights to self defense doesn't require wandering around in public raising anxiety of the people who really are just the law abiding citizens. I've sucessfully been legally carrying a firearm solely for the purpose of self defense, on and off for over a decade now, and I've never caused a scene or provoked an encounter with the police. No, they are absolutely NOT "just law abiding citizens exercising their right to defend themselves". They are idealogues out to prove a point and change the world. Again, nothing wrong with that, except for the deadly tools they employ, the occasional ignorance they demonstrate about what guns are and what they do, and the occasional psychological denial they sometimes carry about their motives and motivations. When I make a subjective evaluation of their maturity level, I figure many of them have more in common with this occupy protestor than they do with me and my conceal-carry buddies.

Their juvenile point is "I can carry a gun out in the open and you can't stop me because I know my rights so neener-neener." They are yay-hoos because they are using a deadly weapon as a tool in their desire to prove their point. In every open carry enthusaist I've ever encountered (including those I just encountered in your links), I see a lack of respect for their fellow man, for the police they force encounters with, and/or for the deadly nature and purpose of the tool they carry around.