Traveler

Perhaps I should have been more clear. I do not think it harms the righteous to weep over or because of the wicked. The Traveler

Can you give me an example (since we are thinking of the pre-existence) it may have to be theoretical. I am a little confused - I am under the impression that following the path of righteousness brings lasting (eternal) joy. The sorrow for the wicked is unfulling and benefits no one - so it is temporary and unsustained. The Traveler

My worse teachers were when I was in college (BYU). And also some of my best were at BYU (Hugh Nibley, Dr. Hall and Dr Harrison). I had one of the most meaningful discussions with a high school teacher that told me, “If I make the test and homework really hard there will always be some that will do well and some that will fail. If I make the tests and homework super easy there will still be some that will do well and some that will fail. It should be no surprise that in both cases it is always the same that do well and the same that fail. I have learned that my best efforts are always in pushing the best students to be better.” I discovered in jr. high school that if a teacher thought I was smart that they would work much harder to successfully teach me. If they thought I was rather stupid, they were hardly interested in any kind of extended effort to teach me anything. Mostly, students learn best from the teacher they like but I came to believe that my best effort as a student ought to be to convince the teacher that of all the students they had, that they liked me the most. Most of this I discovered from a Sunday School teacher at church that became one of my greatest examples of Christ and that love is the greatest motivator of the best teachers – and students as well. The Traveler

Quoting from my personal scripture concerning Satan: “For behold this is the work and glory of Satan – to bring to pass the immorality and infernal life of man”. The Traveler

It is ironic that when I was in college thinking about what profession I would pursue – my first choice was to become a teacher. There was a movie titled “To Sir With Love”. There was a theme song by the same name as the movie that was popular at the time that had convinced me that teaching youth was the most noble profession that I could pursue. The standards to become a teacher were quite high and I failed to meet the standards. I am dyslectic – some are more dyslectic than me, but my problem is that I cannot spell worth a darn – I cannot read phonetically either. Because I failed remedial spelling 3 semesters in a row, I was kicked out of the education (teaching) department and was forced to become an engineer. I had also considered teaching Seminary but had to have a teaching certification. I was quite disappointed. As I read through this thread, I am very disappointed with the attitudes towards teachers. I had some poor teachers, but the vast majority of my teachers has a strong influence for good in my life. I had one teacher that I am sure hated me – but looking back now, it was mostly my fault. And that teacher did add to my benefit in life. Currently I have 3 good people I know and am close to that are teachers in our public schools. Hearing their comments about parents and the problems parents are causing in education is quite different than where the blame is headed on this forum. Recently a student here in Utah (Davis county) committed suicide. The student was one of what is currently referred to as a ferry (identifying as an animal). Other students were making fun (bullying by some definitions) and the teacher was not doing anything about it. It is important to note that the so-called bullying was not taking place in the class room. But because the teacher did not support the student in the classroom the school district was sued by the parents, the teacher fired and convicted of a crime – sentenced to probation. Teachers are not wealthy, and this has destroyed the teacher. This single case has every teacher in the state (including my 3 friends) scared to death. All three are close to retirement and losing their pensions would be financially devastating for them. Perhaps the most devasting element out of all this is that the teachers I know feel abandoned and left out on a limb to die by society that they intended to serve through their profession choice. I forget who said it but all that evil needs to succeed is for good people to do nothing. The Traveler

Thank you all for your input. I expected more negative comments – but let me proceed with things so far. I am thinking that the really rich and wealthy of eternity are the more glorious. In section 11 of the D&C we are told that “he that hath eternal life is rich.” It is my understanding that the reference to “eternal life” is not the resurrected immortal living for ever but rather those that are Celestial. That eternal is a reference to our eternal Father – so it is a life like his. This is a way of saying that Celestial beings are rich. But the Celestial way of thinking is not about hording one’s wealth. My impression that is Lucifer’s reason for wanting Glory. Rather the Celestial rich dedicate all their wealth for the benefit of others. I thought about this for a while, and I do not think that Celestial individuals only care about those that are Celestial. They help the poor. That would mean that they maintain those of lessor or no Glory. Because of the attitudes of Satan towards the Father and the Son – it is my impression that he is very jealous and covetous of their wealth (Glory). But because he is fully dependent upon the grace and kindness of those that are Celestial – he is forced to be obedient to their commands. I have wondered why Satan obeys the Father and Son – even though reluctantly. He and all that are not Celestial have no choice. Perhaps this can give insights into the war in heaven. Since there was no pain, suffering or even death – what then would be the weapons. What would be the chains that would bind the wicked. A couple of ideas here. First – wickedness would not be defined by what someone does to others – because there is nothing they could do to harm others. Wickedness would be the harm that they do to themselves. The only harm that they could do to themselves is refuse to be obedient to the laws, ordinances and covenants – especially the Celestial laws, ordinances and covenants. Their acts of war would be to attempt to convince others to be disobedient to the laws, ordinances and covenants. The scripture descriptions of this is to tempt others to become miserable like unto them. The second idea is that righteous would be defined as someone that is obedient to the laws, ordinances and covenants. Therefore, the weapons of the Celestial or righteous in fighting the eternal war between good and evil – is the light of truth. This is why the war in heaven is still being fought and what is the means of the fighting. This means that repentance is not so much about getting past or forgiven of sin as it is about embracing light and truth and being obedient to the laws, ordinances and covenants. We have had some discussion on this forum about the one and only true Church. This is why believing in the one and only true G-d involves one faith, one hope and one baptism. This is why the Saints of G-d are willing to do the work in the temples for the dead – despite that many of those that died without the law, ordinances and covenants will remain in their wickedness by the exercise of their agency. It is the kind of thing that divine Celestial beings do with their riches. Thanks for reading – and for input. The Traveler

Finely - I understand. 🤢 The Traveler

Hmmmmmm -- still not worth it. The Traveler

Really --- I have to have a facebook account to access this??? Not worth it. The Traveler

Recently I was having a discussion with my brother, and he introduced to me an idea that I had not thought much about – divine currency. Because currency is closely associated with the economy – I thought defining economy would be a good place to start. Among the definitions of economy – I would project that economy is, in essence, the practices, discourses and expressions associated with the production, use and management of resources (copied from Wikipedia). The word from scripture that seems to deal with G-d and his overseeing of resources is, in scripture, the term “Glory”. In the councils of our pre-existence, it seems that the focus of Lucifer was on two principles or things. One was the empowering of individuals with agency (Lucifer strongly opposed this) and the second was that Lucifer wanted G-d’s glory. I have understood that Lucifer intended to utilize G-d’s glory to take over heaven and place himself as the supreme Suzerain of the Kingdom of Heaven. With G-d’s glory Lucifer would oversee, manage and control all the resources of the universe – both physical and spiritual. Here in mortality and on earth – our currency (wealth) is associated only with physical stuff like silver and gold. But silver and gold is such a limited commodity that we use the glory of our government to print and distribute dollars – which are guaranteed by our government rather than actual gold and silver. If our government loses its glory the money will be worthless. It would seem that anyone with unlimited access to dollars has the ability (power) to do purty much whatever they want. I am still in the process of thinking this through – any input would be appreciated. Anyone willing to discuss with me and deal with questions would make me very happy. If you have better ideas – it would be better than gold. The Traveler

If I were king of the world and could dictate education – I would consider monitoring a false misleading issue. The first thing I would do with education is make the teachers the highest paid individuals in the education system. More than any administrator regardless of the level – especially at the college level. However, the pay of teachers would be incentive based. The more students that performed at grade level or better the more the teacher would be paid. The teacher would have complete control over the classroom and curriculum methodology – also including if there is monitoring and if desired which students are monitored. If a teacher did not want a student – no argument or discussion - the teacher could remove the student from the classroom at any time for any reason. The one caveat would be that teachers could receive bonuses for dealing with previously determined problem students. Second – I would do away with the letter grading system. All subjects would be pass/fail. However, grading would be with a caveat. Advanced students could be placed (recommended by the teacher and accepted by the student) in advanced courses with a higher standard of passing. Third - I would have uniforms for students according to their birth gender and grade or advanced placement. In addition to uniforms – I would require uniform hair styles and grooming – advanced students and upper grades would have slight increases in freedoms for hair and grooming styles. Fourth – Parents would have just enough control to remove their kid from any teacher’s class – but would require a teacher’s consent if requesting their child be in a specific class. If a regular class could not be found for a specific (problem?) child – they would be assigned to specialized teachers for problem students. During the time the children were in the specialized classes the parents would be required to either pay a monthly fee or provide service. If necessary – by law – extreme problem students would be placed in 24/7 military schools. I am thinking that I would give students in foster care to roll in specialized military schools (not the problem military schools) that would allow them to opt out of foster care. The Traveler

I do not think it is enough just to have children (which can only come from heterosexual relationships). Much more important than having children is the proper care and feeding of them – much more so (not less then) a beloved pet. The Traveler

I have said in discussions with my Islamic friends that it cannot be a Gehad if the majority of those they are trying to liberate are being killed. I have never had any disagreement. The Traveler

Sometimes I think that just because I grew up in a different era – I grew up on a different planet. I grew up in Provo, Utah, two blocks from the BYU campus. I would say half our yard was garden and fruit trees. We raised rabbits and chickens for meat. We hunted and fished for additional meat. My mother never worked outside the home but the work she did at home was a lot. I considered that both my parents were workaholics. I would say that less the 10% of what we ate or wore was bought in a store. Mom ran everything associated with our home. The only clothing we bought was our Sunday clothing and our work overalls – mom made everything else. We had a washing machine with a roller winger. Stuff was hung on a clothesline to dry. Laundry was a lot of work. In the winter clothing would freeze and we would bring it in and by the time it thawed – it was dry. Anything nice had to be ironed. I thought we were poor because by the time I was eight I was expected to earn money to purchase my stuff and pay for my part of family vacations. Doing chores at home did not count – I had to earn money from a job. Picking fruit was a good summer job along with yard work for neighbors and shoveling snow where we could find it. At age 10 dad would hire us to work at his apartments or office buildings. I did not know anything about mechanics until I purchased a car for $50 and had to rebuild it. We got up about 4:00 am to deliver paper routes, work at the welfare farm, shovel snow, fish or hunt or whatever. Going to school was like party resting time. I firmly believe that anyone that does not have a profession (man, woman or especially teenager) better be working towards one. Stay at home mom can be a profession – but not much of one if all one has is one or two children (unless one or more is severely handicap). There are too many conveniences in modern living. Do kids now days even know how to wash and dry dishes? Or cook anything from scratch? I honestly believe a single person can have a full-time job and own a home and take care of it and their yard all by themselves and still have time to play. I do not believe that a mom can be efficient in our modern-day society in this day and age when all the kids are in school without an additional something to keep them gainfully occupied. Home schooling can help if they are professional about it. I hate to sound unhappy about things, but many mothers cannot even manage their household. As a result, their children are next to useless. When I was called as a scoutmaster (back when the Church was into boy scouts) I would have boys come on their first campout having never even made their own beds. Teaching such kids to do anything useful while camping was quite difficult, but we figured it out. However, it was interesting to me that such parents were the most likely to complain about how their “children” were being treated. Just as a side note – it has been almost 40 years but I still have many of my scouts visit and tell me that scouting was an important part of their lives (though some are no longer church active). I believe this is one of the primary reasons many kids come home early from church missions. This is also a reason that I believe military obligation should be mandatory. My wife would start early with our newborns. She would sit with our kids as soon as they could sit – she would sit with them in our front room teaching them how to behave at church (or anywhere in public – including on airplanes). She taught them that anything other than behaving was not going to work out well for them. I strongly believe that too many in our society have a sedate (lazy) lifestyle and that is a major problem for so many reasons. The Traveler

The problem with your assessment is that when the bombings took place the militaries had already been defeated and the cities were defenseless. I have been to some of the sights where this bombing took place. In Dresden a brick church (cathedral) (among many of the buildings destroyed) that were not directly bombed were brought down by the intense heat as the city burned that melted the bricks. 60 years after the bombing the damage was so extensive that repairs were still taking place in civilian areas burned. I have also visited Hiroshima. The epicenter of the damage was not the seaports but the city itself. The economy of Hiroshima is mostly agriculture - not military. Unlike London (I have visited Churchill’s bunker), that was bombed extensively wjere most buildings remained standing, the cities I mentioned were bombed so heavily nothing was left alive (so I was told). My point is – that as horrible as the destruction and loss of life in Gaza – what we did in the mentioned cities to end WWII was much worse. No one wins a war. Whatever the loses are in Gaza it is not enough for Hamas to surrender and forever end the conflict – or for that matter allow the nation of Israel to even exist or allow any Jew to live anywhere without being harassed. When I was in the middle east I could not find and single Muslem that did not want to live in peace and allow Israel the same. However, the banking structure of the “West” is a problem and I have yet to find a Muslem anywhere that does not believe Satan is in direct control of societies burdened by compound interest (think credit cards and mortgage). There is a disconnect between western societies and the Muslem world and it seems to me that leaders on both sides are exploiting the disconnect and that the matters are moving rapidly towards getting worse rather than better. That our current administration (Biden in particular) is not willing to expand or even continue the Abraham Accords is, in my mind, the greatest blunder of our generation and time. But then – all this is – I believe – prophesy that we LDS (or any Christian) should expect. What ever one’s individual status is – I would suggest a renewal of covenants and repentance. The Traveler

I am convinced that those that worship and covenant at our temples are living a higher law and are preparing for the Messiah. I do not believe that beyond what is currently provided in our temples will have any need for change until the Messiah returns. The Traveler

During WWII the USA was directly involved in the firebombing of Hamburg and Dresden in Germany as well as Tokyo in Japan. The USA also dropped nuclear bombs on Hiroshima and Nagasaki in Japan. None of these were military targets but intended to quail any civilian resistance to our military victories. Israel followed the lead of the USA in WWII by notifying the civilians of the intents to use their cities as targets of war thinking to end the conflict. I do not believe any of this was as necessary in WWII, as was thought at the time. I also believe that the Nephits in the Book of Mormon were advised not to take the offensive attack to the Lamanites civilization cities as a tactic of war. I am under the impression that Hamas (and Iran) are outmaneuvering Israel (as well as the USA) with worldwide support in the conflict they initiated. That they have weaponized their own civilization population and using their innocent civilian deaths to their advantage. It looks to me that even the demonstrations planed in support of Hamas here in the USA have exploited much of our own civilian ignorance and caught our leaders (national security and news reporters) completely off guard. As a nation we are divided and conflicted in our leadership. We are losing and will be defeated should we continue on this course of action. For several months I have had the spiritual impression that this summer will bring violent tribulations of conflict within our borders which will bring to pass generations of modern prophecy concerning the arm of the flesh. Though things will continue to get worse – I believe it will be it will not be fast enough to alarm very many; like heating up water in a pot with a frog – by time the water begins to boil – it will be too late for the frog. We have some time of warming up still remaining – so life will continue without major interruption – for a while longer. The Traveler

I have wondered how to respond in this thread. @Vorthas introduced quite a dichotomy already on the issue, but I am of the mind that there is much more to consider – that this goes much deeper as well as wider. The Jews are not the ancient covenant people of G-d but rather a small branch (tribe) of a much greater Israel with whom G-d anciently established his covenant. And yet the Jews do play a most important roll in the events of the last days. Of similar, or even greater importance comes through the descendants of Joseph and in particular Ephraim. It is my understanding that most of the Christian support for Israel comes from ancient Biblical scripture. Perhaps foremost is the Book of Isaiah. I will make a comment here about ancient Hebrew scripture. I am far from an expert; I cannot read ancient text and must rely on inspired translations for which I cannot find any clearly divined divine authorization. I understand that good people like @prisonchaplain and the vast majority of Christianity that believe that the Bible is inviolate, pure, complete and authorized scripture. That the Bible is the Christian canon of scripture. Beyond textual criticism of ancient text from which the Bible is compiled, I have come to believe that the doctrine of canon is a pagan inspired doctrine and part of the great apostasy (paganization of Christianity). I could use stronger vernacular, and more detail but I have found clearer descriptions are likely to upset our Christian Cousins rather than help in understanding. Beyond the Book of Isaiah, I believe the best template for the Last-days is the Book of Mormon. The title page of the Book of Mormon is prophetic and directed specifically to the modern Jews and Gentiles (Gentiles here relate to the scattering of Israel - not just Jews - among the Gentile nations). Of particular importance is the Book of Jacob in the Book of Mormon. But Jacob (chapters 5 – 6) is an abridgement from the ancient prophet Zenos and is somewhat criptic parable. As to the current dilemma of the Middle East – My impression is that there will be a great war that will involve most nations – perhaps we can call this war – World War III. The center focus of this war will be what we currently call Israel – which is occupied by the Jews in their divinely promised land with Jerusalem at its center. The prime center of opposition to Israel will come from the ancient area of Magog – an area that is itself currently involved in war (Russia – Ukraine). From this beginning (in the area of Magog) the nations of the earth with be gathered in war. This war will unearth a movement that has been brewing since Jesus walked among us – this movement is referred to in ancient scripture as the Anti-Christ. This war will take a number of years and I believe nuclear weapons will be used. Two witnesses of Christ (similar to Moses and Aaron in Egypt) will protect the Jews similar to the plagues of Egypt the protected Isarel anciently. I believe the current Nation if Israel will fall, and the two witnesses of Christ will be killed in Jerusalem. Jesus Christ will appear near Jerusalem and will preserve and save a remnant of Jews that will behold Jesus and his hands and feet and be converted to Christ. Those that came to destroy the nation of Israel will themselves be destroyed. Sometime soon to follow this appearance of Christ the sign (spoken of in Matthew 24) will be given of the coming of Christ into the world – at which time all the world (wicked) will be burned with fire and those prepared for this return of Christ will be preserved. As for myself, I believe Israel should defend itself from Hamas. I am conflicted (do not support) all the deaths in Gazza. I am very conflicted as to who to blame though I believe Hamas initiated the conflict and should be held responsible for that – I just do not know how. I do believe the events we are currently observing are fulfilment of ancient prophesy and that we will yet experience many miracles – both in preparation of a people for the return of Christ and to preserve a remnant of the Jews. I am in support of the many miracles to come which I believe will include some Muslims, Jews, Traditional Christians and of course the Latter-day Saints. The Traveler

I have decided to give my impression why becoming a g-d is a “Doctrine of Christ”. In distinguishing this as a doctrine of Christ is rather bold because – by definition those that disbelieve in any of the “Doctrines of Christ” are aligned with the “anti-Christ”. That is a rather harsh term. In the 10th chapter of the Gospel of John, Jesus is in Jerusalem for the feast of the dedication. This is currently what is called Hanukkah, which is the celebration of the rededication of the temple in Jerusalem that was built when the Jews returned following the Babylonian captivity. Jesus is at Soloman’s porch which is on the east side of the temple (opposite from the west wall where Jews currently come). It would seem that certain Jews did not like Jesus very much already and they are looking to make an example as to why no one ought to listen to him. Perhaps they were also looking for a reason to put Jesus to death. One could ask, for what reason or excuse did the Jews have Jesus crucified. Jesus is asked to plainly tell everybody at the temple of G-d, if he is the Christ – if he is the Messiah of prophesy that many Jews expected to deliver them from the Romans. Verse 24: I personally believe that the stage is now set for Jesus to teach directly concerning the doctrines of Christ. Verse 30 is a direct answer giving a specific point of doctrine of Christ, perhaps not expected by the Jews, as to who and what the Christ is in verse 30: What could this possibly mean? Jesus was speaking directly to the Jews, and it ticked them off – so much so they determined to kill Jesus. The question we need to ask is why did they determine to kill Jesus: Look at verse 31: Jesus cautions the Jews to consider why? What is that they object to? In verse 32 Jesus teaches directly what Christ would do to demonstrate to the Jews what Christ does. Verse 32: A prime reason that the Jews were involved in the crucifixion of Jesus comes out in the next verse and relates directly back to verse 30 for the proof of it. Verse 33: What just happened was not just a point of doctrine to the Jews at the time. This is a critical notion and an important Doctrine of Christ the be recorded and handed down to all generations. There are two points to this Doctrine. First that the Messiah (Christ) is a man ordained by G-d and sent to be born such and do marvelous works. The second Doctrine of Christ is that man can be one with the Father. This oneness means that man can become a g-d. Note that Jesus does not tell the Jews that their interpretation of being one with G-d does not make someone a g-d but rather he affirms that is exactly the doctrine. He then proves the doctrine by quoting Old Testament scripture in verses 34 – 35: I cannot say if being "One" with G-d means we are equal or not equal. Does being one mean being equal? Is there something more needed to be equal? I do not know how to answer that. However, I would say that to be one with G-d is a Doctrine of Christ that the anti-Christ opposed anciently and will continue to do so, especially in the last-days - See John 17:21 The Traveler

It is my impression that the Christian thought (outside of LSD theology) it is sort of a mathematical thing – like asymptotically approaching perfection. We can get closer and closer (infinitely close) but never in all eternity actually reaching G-d’s perfection. The Traveler

I completely agree with your analytics. There is a problem because the meaning and use of words evolve and in the mind of most that grow up using the English term perfect think only in the extended meaning of being completely flawless – without any weakness or error, ever – past present or future. This creates quite a conundrum for many Christians that have English as their first language and only relate to the English translation of the Bible. Many Christians believe G-d is a being that by definition has never had to deal with personal flaws we mortals experience in our fallen state. Because we are flawed, have weaknesses and obviously plagued with errors – It is considered blasphemy to think it possible to be perfect, especially as G-d is perfect. Regardless of if we covenant with G-d or not, or even what is possible for G-d to do concerning us; the meaning of perfect has evolved to such a hard-set meaning, it is just not possible for man to be perfected – ever. We may be able to repent and be forgiven of our sins – but a perfect being? That will never happen in the mind of many. The Traveler

I believe that it ought to be obvious that our earth has all the sustainable resources necessary for life and the evolution of life here. And that there is such an abundance that we, as a human race, ought to be able to move out into our solar system for a variety of reasons. It ought to be possible to utilize plants and photosynthesis to create carbon molecules that will make the use of “fossil” fuels completely sustainable. Such technology would eliminate entirely all concerns that carbon dioxide is causing global warming or climate change – since carbon dioxide is necessary for plant life and photosynthesis. Nuclear fission is a resource that could be more utilized as well as nuclear fusion (if we can figure out a sustainable source of neutrinos). There are many options. We could improve current tech a great deal. For example, rather than transferring heat from gas to gas, it could be more efficient transferring heat from gas to liquid to gas. A great deal of advancement could take place if we could just figure out how to mass produce nanotubes (a carbon-based molecule). This would solve not only heating challenges but cooling (air conditioning) as well. As for providing more food – Tesla suggested that we could excite the ozone layer (causing it to become fluorescent) which could triple the amount of food we grow. We can also use various forms of energy to desalinate ocean water for irrigation (especially hydroponics in sandy deserts) with a byproduct of clean hydrogen fuel. We are at the threshold of solving many problems - with the exception of how to get along with each other and end wars. I would suggest that religion could help with that – but the opposite seems to be true. We have found that the concept of human love through religion (especially mixed with politics) can be a really good engine of war. But then if one is still concerned with over population – why change that? 😎 The Traveler

Thank you for posting and adding another perspective. As a scientist (secular perspective) the rarest commodity of this universe is life as we know it here on earth. This universe is collectively hostile in every way to this earth life. So much so that science has not found solid evidence that life exist anywhere else – especially intelligent life. Nor has science proven that the circumstance for the generation of life could exist anywhere in this universe. Obviously, we do not understand the genesis of life enough to replicate it ourselves – which would indicate that we should not omit any option – especially the option of divine intelligence. I am somewhat disappointed that you have openly declared that you have eliminated the option of superior (divine) intelligence. I do not believe you (or anyone) have the proof or logic (science) necessary for such a conclusion. Science has proven to be capable of solving the problems of population you are referencing. As societies have become knowledgeable and capable of birth control – all the proof and example of controlling over populations is known to exist. There is no reason to limit population increases through any other means other than individual choice of a woman becoming pregnant by intent. Currently the populations of “enlightened” societies has moved the needle so far that our USA (as well as Western societies and developed countries worldwide) will, if current trends continue, decline and fail without immigration from undeveloped countries. As the world moves towards a class I (Kardashev Scale) civilization – without a change of attitude among our educated and economically solvent population – our civilization will fade away (be eliminated by evolution). The Traveler

I could argue that the concept of man becoming divine in the image and likeness (including becoming an heir of all G-d’s glory that Lucifer sought after to become G-d) is the intent of G-d’s plan and His intent for mankind. For me this goes even beyond scripture into science; that the more we learn about this earth and the universe the more it becomes obvious that the only limitation of man (as a species) – is the limitation (corruption???) we put on ourselves. At the center of all this is Jesus Christ and the doctrine that he was born of Marry and lived among humanity as one of us. Or as the couplet – As man is, G-d (Jesus) once was and as G-d (Jesus) now is, man may become. The proof of this, and the example of this, I believe is Jesus Christ and what he taught both in the words he spoke and the example he set and, in his admonishment to come, follow Him. It is not for me to convince anyone. They must find this out for themselves. In all honesty, I am not so concerned with @prisonchaplain and many others. Temples are built and the millennium has a purpose. I believe in agency and in order for agency to have a purpose, I believe that G-d will ensure that each individual has all the information, knowledge, circumstance, opportunity and understanding necessary (including all the powers of the atonement) to determine their eternal destiny. I am willing to be of some service as I am able and yet flawed and in need of many things myself – therefore unworthy to judge anyone. Prisonchaplen has taught me a great many things and I am better for having known and conversed with him. I fully suspect that he will receive from G-d all that will be offered and given to him. The Traveler

I am impressed to clarify a couple of things. I am not a person driven much by passion – rather I delight more in logic. I do not find anything LGBTQ+ specific to be logical but rather a frail framework of ideology bult on a shifty unstable and unsustainable foundation contrary to necessary evolution through reproduction of our species. In addition – I believe that the first prime directive of G-d and his heaven is the Agency of man. That it is up to the individual to pursue whatever end they will. As a scientist I do not believe any species is sustainable without a strong reproductive drive – thus I see no logic in incentivizing any other sexual activity for an intelligent species outside of loving and caring heterosexual sexual activity supported through a marriage commitment for our human species. I can allow any individual to pursue what pleasure they will as long as they do not interfere with the agency of others (especially children under the age of 25 whose brain has not sufficiently developed executive functions) and as long as they do not intend to incentivize unstainable behaviors or claim such behaviors are beneficial beyond their own personal pleasures. I believe that the prime engine for sexual and gender confusion is early exposure to pornography. As pornography becomes more available to youth the more youth will suffer confusion and misdirection. I am super concerned that the LGBTQ+ society in general seems desirous to indoctrinate children. Thank you for listening! The Traveler