Seanette Posted June 16, 2009 Report Share Posted June 16, 2009 I'll see about the movie. Will the movie deal with this issue and how the original BOM was written in a KJV before the KJV came out in 1611.Hello, it's a TRANSLATION! Or are you trying to claim that the prophets who wrote the Book of Mormon were writing in English? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
beefche Posted June 16, 2009 Report Share Posted June 16, 2009 God has me here for a reason. I am sincere about my relationsip with the Lord. Either you are suppose, to win me with God's help to Moronism or God is trying to deliever you from deception. If it is the latter, I have failed to reach you, but I have been obedient in delivering my soul to you. If it is the former, you have failed because you cannot identify or discern someone who sincerely Loves Jesus Christ and might be going about things the wrong way.Here's a thought: how about we don't try to convince you of anything and you don't try to convince us of anything? I do not appreciate people trying to convert me, just as I'm sure you don't appreciate people trying to convert you.We have many on this forum who are wonderful people and they happen to be non-LDS. We share common beliefs, feelings, emotions, etc. We engage in discussion, debate, and sometimes downright arguments. But, with something so personal as a testimony of God, I would never presume to tell anyone that they are deceived. I would never presume to tell someone that their experiences with God are false or misguided or wrong. Yet, that seems to be your position with LDS on this board.While LDS on this board generally love answering sincere questions, we get defensive and downright offended if we have to convince anyone of anything, especially that what we believe or know is real. If your motivation is to have someone convince you of the truth of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints, then you'll be a long time waiting. I have never convinced anyone--only the Lord can do that. If your motivation is lead me or other LDS away from being deceived, then your time here will be very short. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kawazu Posted June 16, 2009 Report Share Posted June 16, 2009 Hello, it's a TRANSLATION! Or are you trying to claim that the prophets who wrote the Book of Mormon were writing in English?Oh--that makes sense. Nevertheless, why not translate into 19th-century English? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Justice Posted June 16, 2009 Report Share Posted June 16, 2009 I'll see about the movie. Will the movie deal with this issue and how the original BOM was written in a KJV before the KJV came out in 1611.What?From this quote I can see that you have absolutely no idea what the Book of Mormon is. Also, it's very apparent you have no desire to know what it is. All you know is it's false based on something someone told you.In fact, why don't you explain to us what you know about the Book of Mormon: what you think it is, and when you think it was writted, who wrote it... all that stuff. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dravin Posted June 16, 2009 Report Share Posted June 16, 2009 Oh--that makes sense. Nevertheless, why not translate into 19th-century English?My guess is because Joseph Smith was familiar with the KJV so for him such prose was the language of scripture so when translating scripture he used said prose. Some find it hard to understand but I find it rather poetic and that actually helps me remember to a degree. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Palerider Posted June 16, 2009 Report Share Posted June 16, 2009 Maybe your right I don't know. It seems like the stories keep changing with time. If your going to judge someone, at least tell them where they have lied and manipulated the facts. What you have accused me of is and as never been what I am about on here. God has me here for a reason. I am sincere about my relationsip with the Lord. Either you are suppose, to win me with God's help to Moronism or God is trying to deliever you from deception. If it is the latter, I have failed to reach you, but I have been obedient in delivering my soul to you. If it is the former, you have failed because you cannot identify or discern someone who sincerely Loves Jesus Christ and might be going about things the wrong way. You can tell more about a person from what he says about others than what others say about him. Think about it, and think when you point your finger you have three fingers pointing back at you!!! as far as trying to change someone, it hasn't worked yet. I see people like you all the time. I am trying to figure out why you are trying to judge us....I know...your gonna say...I am not....if you are leaving....see you on the sunny side of the street. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aj4u Posted June 16, 2009 Author Report Share Posted June 16, 2009 Hello, it's a TRANSLATION! Or are you trying to claim that the prophets who wrote the Book of Mormon were writing in English?Well, I am not sure what I see here. What bothers me is the BOM has hundreds or thousands of words from the KJV even some verbatim quotations to a significant length. Moroni 10 with 1 Corinthians 12:1-11 would be an example but not the only one. It appears Joseph Smith made use of the KJV Bible to go along with or supplement the mysterious revelation of the golden plates in question. Mormons will agree that Christ appeared on the American continent after His resurrection to preach to the Nephites right? The problem I have is He used the KJV or the language as recorded in that Bible. What checks out with me is when Nephi came to America he brought copies of Hebrew Scriptures, which explains for quotations from the OT. The problem, however, I would like for you to explain is the miracle plates some how or another end up under the translation of the King James English without variation about a thousand years before the 1611 version was written and many quotes that follow the translation errors in that text. This is one of many reasons I have trouble praying and asking God if this is true. It strains the limits of believability to the max for me, and I am honestly trying to understand why and how you can believe this. I can pray and ask God to show me how He sees this. If it is true, God can explain this and show me that the BOM is true. But I will not blindly and naively believe what any prophet or prophets tell me until they check out with Scripture. I would be begging for deception in my life and I have had my fill. I would think you'd feel the same way. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JohnnyRudick Posted June 16, 2009 Report Share Posted June 16, 2009 (edited) I'll see about the movie. Will the movie deal with this issue and how the original BOM was written in a KJV before the KJV came out in 1611.Do you really believe that the people in Shakespeare's day spoke in the same way he wrote his Shakespearean plays?The people of the early 1800s did not have that much trouble;e with the language the language of the English Bibles of the day like Tyndale's or the Common Bible which was what we call the King James Version.Which at that time was not just another "version" but was the common Bible in use.The bibles which came after were considered another version of the King James and shunned by most Christians.The ads always compared their "New and Improved" bibles to the King James.It was not until people who secretly wished to pollute the Bible with misinformation under the guise of making it more accurate and what ever. . . The Lord saw fit to translate His record of the people of the Americas in the language and pattern of the Scripture the young Gentile nation was already accustomed.We are not today use to the idea of a "High English".A proper English set aside for better things.Most of us today laugh at such niceties but such was the case in the day.The Book of Mormon puts it's stamp of approval on the King James Bible.God had placed in the Book of Mormon for His own purposetext that backs up the TR texts and the King James translators.Bro. Rudick Edited June 16, 2009 by JohnnyRudick Afterthought;) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Seanette Posted June 16, 2009 Report Share Posted June 16, 2009 Oh--that makes sense. Nevertheless, why not translate into 19th-century English?I of course don't have direct knowledge of the Prophet's mental process at that time, since this was 170 years before my birth , but based on what I know about the history, I can make some reasonable guesses.At that time in his life, Joseph Smith's education was rather limited, and most of his reading had probably been the Bible (common situation in his time), so to him, Scripture would be in KJV English rather than the vernacular of his time. There was a certain amount of material from Isaiah in the text he was translating, so he quite likely at that point figured using the language of the KJV would communicate the meaning of the text and be appropriate for Scripture.Please note that's not official, just my interpretation. To me, it makes sense that a rather uneducated young man faced with translating Scripture would have gone with the style of English he was accustomed to hearing in Scripture, namely the KJV. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Justice Posted June 16, 2009 Report Share Posted June 16, 2009 aj4u, the more important question is, is what you read in the Book of Momron true? Do you believe Moroni 10 is true? If it is, it should peak your curiosity. With your curiosity peaked, you should begin reading from the very beginning. Learn what the Book of Mormon claims to be. Becuae, it does not claim to be what you saying it is. It was not written in English before 1600. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Carl62 Posted June 16, 2009 Share Posted June 16, 2009 · Hidden Hidden AJ, THIS is why I, as an LDS Christian, have a very strong testimony that the Book of Mormon is truly the Word of God - www.bomchristian.com. Check out these Christian-based facts that support the claim that the Book of Mormon is really from God and not just merely "another gospel".:) Link to comment
bytor2112 Posted June 16, 2009 Report Share Posted June 16, 2009 Well, I am not sure what I see here. What bothers me is the BOM has hundreds or thousands of words from the KJV even some verbatim quotations to a significant length. Moroni 10 with 1 Corinthians 12:1-11 would be an example but not the only one. It appears Joseph Smith made use of the KJV Bible to go along with or supplement the mysterious revelation of the golden plates in question. Mormons will agree that Christ appeared on the American continent after His resurrection to preach to the Nephites right? The problem I have is He used the KJV or the language as recorded in that Bible. What checks out with me is when Nephi came to America he brought copies of Hebrew Scriptures, which explains for quotations from the OT. The problem, however, I would like for you to explain is the miracle plates some how or another end up under the translation of the King James English without variation about a thousand years before the 1611 version was written and many quotes that follow the translation errors in that text. This is one of many reasons I have trouble praying and asking God if this is true. It strains the limits of believability to the max for me, and I am honestly trying to understand why and how you can believe this. I can pray and ask God to show me how He sees this. If it is true, God can explain this and show me that the BOM is true. But I will not blindly and naively believe what any prophet or prophets tell me until they check out with Scripture. I would be begging for deception in my life and I have had my fill. I would think you'd feel the same way.The Bible and the Book of Mormon....good stuff. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aj4u Posted June 16, 2009 Author Report Share Posted June 16, 2009 Here's a thought: how about we don't try to convince you of anything and you don't try to convince us of anything? I do not appreciate people trying to convert me, just as I'm sure you don't appreciate people trying to convert you.I don't mind people trying to convert me. I never have and never will. I would like to be at a place in my life with God where I have no will of my own. The thought you shared is your thought not the Lord's. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pam Posted June 16, 2009 Report Share Posted June 16, 2009 If it is true, God can explain this and show me that the BOM is true. But I will not blindly and naively believe what any prophet or prophets tell me until they check out with Scripture. I would be begging for deception in my life and I have had my fill. I would think you'd feel the same way. Seriously have you read ANYTHING that anyone on this board has posted? I mean really read it. Frankly, I've had it. This line that I bolded clearly states to me that you feel the LDS religion and what it stands for, our prophets and how we follow and believe in them as well as scripture is nothing but hogwash.I'm sick of debating and arguing. Sick of it. I think I better quit right here before I say something I know I will regret. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
john doe Posted June 16, 2009 Report Share Posted June 16, 2009 After consulting with the mod staff, we have decided that this thread has outlived its usefulness. It will now be closed. AJ, if you would like to start a new thread, feel free to do so. However, it would behoove you to narrow your focus somewhat and not constantly switch subjects without signaling first. We will be cracking down on the fishing trips in this area for a while too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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