Polygamy is affecting my testimony

[foreverafter]

when polygamy is done the Lord's way, we won't have all the earthly issues that people have in polygamous relationships. It'll be done righteously.

In heaven if will be different, but on this earth polygamy is one of the most painful & horrific things that can be done to a woman. Righteous men would know this & would humbly insist the 1st wife decide everything & everyone.

[bytor2112]

All these wives were considered a "whoredom" & an "abomination" that Solomon committed, according to the Book of Mormon. He seems to have lost the spirit & committed adultery with these wives & lusted after women long before he fell for Bathsheba.

Err.....David "fell" for Bathsheba" not Solomon.

[pam]

Err.....David "fell" for Bathsheba" not Solomon.

Good catch.

[foreverafter]

Err.....David "fell" for Bathsheba" not Solomon.

Thanks for the correction, "David", like Solomon, lost the spirit & committed adultery way before Bathsheba. Men & women hardly ever fall in a day.

[Moksha]

Err.....David "fell" for Bathsheba" not Solomon.

Of course if he had, he would have sent many wives and concubines to their death rather than Uriah. Faithful monogamy certainly would have prevented these murders. David could have remained pure and delightsome.

:)

[Vort]

All these wives were considered a "whoredom" & an "abomination" that Solomon committed, according to the Book of Mormon. He seems to have lost the spirit & committed adultery with these wives & lusted after women long before he fell for Bathsheba.

You seem to have Solomon confused with Oedipus.

[dnc76v22]

OK, I got you guys on fire. Polygamy is a sin to the traditional Christian. I just wanted to bring out this difference. I agree that we can disagree. However, I would say that your church's position on this subject is very skewed. Thank you for letting me debate the other side of this subject. I know most of you want me to go away for good, but that would shelter you to only one view. Or is that what you want?

Was Martin Luther a traditional Christian?

“I confess that I cannot forbid a person to marry several wives, for it does not contradict the Scripture. If a man wishes to marry more than one wife he should be asked whether he is satisfied in his conscience that he may do so in accordance with the word of God. In such a case the civil authority has nothing to do in the matter.”

(De Wette II, 459, ibid., pp. 329-330.) The Truth About Martin Luther

[dnc76v22]

Is it just me

It's not just you.

[dnc76v22]

All these wives were considered a "whoredom" & an "abomination" that Solomon committed, according to the Book of Mormon. He seems to have lost the spirit & committed adultery with these wives & lusted after women long before he fell for Bathsheba.

Correction: Bathsheba was Solomon's mother.

[Moksha]

Was Martin Luther a traditional Christian?

“I confess that I cannot forbid a person to marry several wives, for it does not contradict the Scripture. If a man wishes to marry more than one wife he should be asked whether he is satisfied in his conscience that he may do so in accordance with the word of God. In such a case the civil authority has nothing to do in the matter.”

(De Wette II, 459, ibid., pp. 329-330.) The Truth About Martin Luther

What an interesting site. How about this one?

"Be a sinner, and let your sins be strong, but let your trust in Christ be stronger, and rejoice in Christ who is the victor over sin, death, and the world. We will commit sins while we are here, for this life is not a place where justice resides... No sin can separate us from Him, even if we were to kill or commit adultery thousands of times each day." ('Let Your Sins Be Strong, from 'The Wittenberg Project;' 'The Wartburg Segment', translated by Erika Flores, from Dr. Martin Luther's

Saemmtliche Schriften, Letter No. 99, 1 Aug. 1521).

[dnc76v22]

What an interesting site. How about this one?

"Be a sinner, and let your sins be strong, but let your trust in Christ be stronger, and rejoice in Christ who is the victor over sin, death, and the world. We will commit sins while we are here, for this life is not a place where justice resides... No sin can separate us from Him, even if we were to kill or commit adultery thousands of times each day." ('Let Your Sins Be Strong, from 'The Wittenberg Project;' 'The Wartburg Segment', translated by Erika Flores, from Dr. Martin Luther's

Saemmtliche Schriften, Letter No. 99, 1 Aug. 1521).

Which would also imply that Martin Luther had nothing against polygamy much less adultery.

[JohnnyRudick]

Which would also imply that Martin Luther had nothing against polygamy much less adultery.

I believe Luther's point was that there is no sin that you can commit that can separate

you from the saving power of Christ.

Of course I do also think that he mistakenly believed that even if you chose to live in

that sin the saving power continually worked in you.

Bro. Rudick

[StallionMcBeastly]

We are promised eternal joy in the Celestial Kingdom. If polygamy is asked of us, it won't pain us like it does here on earth.

[breecatasnana]

My daughter has the same problem. I tell her why borrow trouble. We do not know all that is to be known about polygamy. She is worrying about something that may never happen. There are enough real problems to deal with now. Just concentrate on your growth today, and let the future take care of it's self.

Once we become perfect, and are endowed with the pure love of Christ we will no longer be bothered by the weakness of the flesh. If, and I repeat if, we are to be asked to practice polygamy in the Celestial Kingdom it will not make us unhappy. It will only add to our joy. There are many Celestial laws we cannot live now, but when we become Celestial beings we will be able to, and with great joy; so don't worry about all those things that are yet future, and that we only understand in part. Just try to take care of today.

The way I feel is if I am an only wife I will be happy to have an eternal family. If I have sister wives I will just have that much more joy in my larger eternal family. Either way I will have what is best for me. Heavely Father wants my eternal happiness and knows what will give that to me. He will not ask me to do anything that will make me unhappy. Whatever He asks me to do will only bring me joy. Remember the scripture that says Adam fell that men might be and men are that they might have joy. That is the purpose of our creation and will be our eternal blessing.

Penny

Edited July 19, 2009 by breecatasnana

[funkymonkey]

I haven't read the whole thread but here are my thoughts...

I was having a big problem with this just this past week. I was in tears for a couple of days just trying to comprehend the whole thing. I spent a lot of time praying and really did feel the love of my heavenly father. Heavenly Father loves his daughters and wants all of us to be happy, and treated right, loved, and protected. This is not a principle the Lord requires of me and very well may never require this of me, and I am fine with that. I am happy with my hubby and the commitments we have made to each other. He is committed to only me and I only to him...and that's all God has asked of us.

This is something that I cannot compare to the ideas I currently have regarding relationships... *edit* there is sexual perversion everywhere...pornography, fornication, adultery, strip clubs, etc...and the media exposes them to temptations day in and day out. *edit*

But to approach this principle honestly we need to remember that intimacy is a very very different thing now than it was even 200 years ago.

It was an extremely small number of men that were called to this duty. I am sure most of which held this obligation not as an opportunity to exploit women but to truly fulfill the will of God. (keyword, most) In my own life, I don't know any men that would not exploit the practice of polygamy...and which is why I believe that it is not currently lived. But I do believe that in a different time and place in a society with a stronger value set, there were a very select few truly righteous men that respected this calling how God intended.

I think that intimacy will be even more different in the afterlife.

...The scriptures say somewhere that in the afterlife, good looks or bad looks won't matter. We will all have different shaped bodies but our spirits will be so "mature" that it won't matter. To me, intimacy and companionship will hold a very different meaning for us as well...maybe it won't mean the same as it does for us here. Companionship and intimacy most likely will be something quite a bit different from what we understand it to be in this life...but because our understanding will be that much more mature, it won't be bothersome.

For each scripture there is about polygamy, there are many more passages about how to treat your wife and child, and the many many obligations a true man of God has to his family. God holds his daughters of the highest esteem.

The Lord does have a plan for each of us, so we can be the happiest we can be...and he does love value each of his daugthers very very much.

Edited July 20, 2009 by funkymonkey

[Vort]

I am happy with my hubby and the commitments we have made to each other. He is committed to only me and I only to him...and that's all God has asked of us.

This is something that I cannot compare to the ideas I currently have regarding relationships...i.e., all men I've had in my life are driven by one member of their anatomy

Based on your wording, I can only conclude this applies to your aforementioned hubby.

there is sexual perversion everywhere...pornography, fornication, adultery, strip clubs, etc...and well, honestly, all men in this day in age are perverts because of what the media exposes them to day in and day out.

I assume that your low opinion of men means you get along famously with foreverafter. I'll be sure to let the prophet (a man), the quorum of twelve (men), and all the priesthood leadership and membership generally (every last one of them men) know that they're perverts.

Btw: Men on this forum, please know that funkymonkey considers you (yes, you personally) a pervert.

Is your husband aware of your extreme antipathy toward men? I think he must be. Do you likewise believe that all women in this day and age are perverts for the same reason?

[pam]

and well, honestly, all men in this day in age are perverts because of what the media exposes them to day in and day out.

I'm not a man but I find this statement offensive. I know countless men who are not perverts. To lump all men into this category is outrageous.

I think of my father who was one of the greatest men I shall ever know. My brother, my brothers in law. None of them are perverts but good honest, hardworking, active in the Church men.

[funkymonkey]

Ok that totally was not what I meant to write. Sorry. I deserved that. Can I edit that out?

Pam, I think that's great that you have a line of respectable men in your family. In my own family it has been a COMPLETELY different story. Filled with men that claim to be men of God, but in reality they all have "recreational hobbies" involving lotsa women. Probably has a lot to do with why the polygamy thing is really difficult for me.

Anyway what I meant to say was something about the nature of man raised in today's society...they're obviously tempted in much more direct ways than men of earlier times. That's all. Please forgive me.

[pam]

You have an edit option. I think the men would appreciate it if that truly is not what you meant. Thanks.

[JohnnyRudick]

I'm not a man but I find this statement offensive. I know countless men who are not perverts. To lump all men into this category is outrageous.

I think of my father who was one of the greatest men I shall ever know. My brother, my brothers in law. None of them are perverts but good honest, hardworking, active in the Church men.

I am no pervert either:D

Whats a pervert?

Bro. Rudick

[pam]

Funky you are right. I am lucky that I had and have had good men in my family relationships. All have been influences in my life. Especially my dad. I miss him terribly.

Anyway..on with the thread.

[pam]

I do have to agree with you though funky. There are many influences all around with different media sources that make things difficult at times. But that would apply to both men and women.

[annamaureen]

Annamauren, what frightens you about polygamy? That he'll prefer his second wife over you? That he'll ignore you, or prefer to be intimate with her, that he won't have enough love for more than one wife? It seems to me that women who are bothered by polygamy feel threatened or insecure in some way.

Our marriage is special, private, and intimate. It's not to be shared. Of course I feel threatened at the idea that something so personal, important, and sacred will be cheapened by spreading it out among multiple wives.

[ploomf]

Do you really think Heavenly Father would let that happen though? If He loves you and wants you to be happy and places such a high importance on marriage, do you really think He'd command you to live something that would cheapen your marriage? I don't know, I don't like the idea of polygamy either but I don't really let myself worry about it. First I have enough things to worry about in this life, I don't need to borrow trouble, and second I trust Heavenly Father enough to know that He would never command me to do something that I didn't have the strength to do and that would cheapen my marriage. I'm just worried about getting through this life, I'll worry about the next life when I get there.

[Vort]

Our marriage is special, private, and intimate. It's not to be shared. Of course I feel threatened at the idea that something so personal, important, and sacred will be cheapened by spreading it out among multiple wives.

Is this what you tell your child? "My relationship to you is so special, private, and intimate, that I could not possibly share it by having any more children. Spreading that out between multiple children would cheapen the sanctity of such a personal, important, and sacred thing." Most parents of multiple children will confirm to you that this idea is utter hogwash; you don't love your first child less because you have a second. It changes the nature of your relationship with that first child, but not the substance or the intimacy.

NOTE: This is not a defense of polygamy, but an identification of flawed reasoning. Polygamy cannot be wrong because marriage is "special, private, and intimate" or "personal, important, and sacred".