Public resistance to church...why?

[hordak]

So you would consider someone like the Dalai Lama as lost? What about Siddharta Gautama?

I could go on for about 20 pages or so my point is God and Jesus are not the only way. Just as Buddhism Taoism Islam Judaism etc. etc. are not the only ways.

Religion is more cultural than spiritual more often than not.

No one religion has the market of truth cornered.

One of the the greatest things about LDS theology is while it teaches that not only is Jesus the only way, but that extra ordinances/ rules are required (to get to the celestial kingdom) , It does acknowledge that there are millions who will not have this access to this knowledge, (Like Siddharta Gautama who died hundreds of years before, and thousands of miles away from the birth of Christiany) who will learn of it latter and get the same chance as everyone.

It is actually kind of ironic that one of the big "protest" ,from other Christians, against the LDS church is it's "exsclution" via the extras work required for the Celestial kingdom, when compared to the traditional "saved by grace" Christianity. However i have never heard any of them preach of "another opportunity" for those who didn't get the chance in this life. In fact some teach that those born without the truth are just out of luck.

[FunkyTown]

Biased truth as you admit you as a christian see it right?

Truth is truth regardless of whether it's biased, Lost. Certainly, if I was Buddhist, I would take a Buddhist view, but the simple truth is: If Buddha was right, Christ was wrong. If Christ was correct, Buddha was wrong. The same goes with various other world religions.

I respect that people have difficulties finding the truth: This is a confusing world, with the waters muddied by numerous religions all claiming to have the truth. I blame no one for not seeing what I see. I believe in God and pray for him to open the eyes of everyone to truth.

But I still must defend what I know to be true, and will continue to do so. To do otherwise would be to water down the message of truth.

[JohnnyRudick]

Plus, if even in the end of it all you still choose not to hook your wagon to the Jesus Team, you can still be judged in the general Great White Throne Judgment according to your works (only in your own name) and see how far you get:)

[Hemidakota]

This what a nameless author writing in another persons name who never met Jesus said that's what Jesus said. I like to get my information from the horses mouth not from questionable literature.

Knowing it was John who wrote it and Joseph Smith had no problem in accepting this man as the author, I would opt for the Seer who would know more than me and not scholars of the world.

[Hemidakota]

So you would consider someone like the Dalai Lama as lost? What about Siddharta Gautama?

I could go on for about 20 pages or so my point is God and Jesus are not the only way. Just as Buddhism Taoism Islam Judaism etc. etc. are not the only ways.

Religion is more cultural than spiritual more often than not.

No one religion has the market of truth cornered.

There is but one way and one way only. There is no other way in entering into the Celestial Kingdom. It is not by Muhammad. It is not by the Pope [being a former Catholic here]. It is not Dalai Lama, and it is not Siddhartha. None other religions in this world are of GOD but one whom GOD has restored. As Nephi witnessed as what John saw in his vision, in the last day there is but two great churches, a church of the few who are the servants of GOD, and Church of Babylon where the rest of the world belongs. Either we belong to the one who GOD had restored, or we simply belong to the other.

How do we find the truth and receive a personal answer from the Creator? If one can apply enough faith as the Brother of Jared, the questions can be answered to whom GOD authorized as HIS only gospel and HIS voice upon this earth.

[Hemidakota]

One of the the greatest things about LDS theology is while it teaches that not only is Jesus the only way, but that extra ordinances/ rules are required (to get to the celestial kingdom) , It does acknowledge that there are millions who will not have this access to this knowledge, (Like Siddharta Gautama who died hundreds of years before, and thousands of miles away from the birth of Christiany) who will learn of it latter and get the same chance as everyone.

It is actually kind of ironic that one of the big "protest" ,from other Christians, against the LDS church is it's "exsclution" via the extras work required for the Celestial kingdom, when compared to the traditional "saved by grace" Christianity. However i have never heard any of them preach of "another opportunity" for those who didn't get the chance in this life. In fact some teach that those born without the truth are just out of luck.

True! It is through hope and desire; these men will be converted and allowed into the Celestial realm based on desire of acceptance if they had the opportunity in this mortal probation.

Edited September 15, 2009 by Hemidakota

[JohnnyRudick]

There is but one way and one way only. There is no other way in entering into the Celestial Kingdom. It is not by Muhammad. It is not by the Pope [being a former Catholic here]. It is not Dalai Lama, and it is not Siddhartha. None other religions in this world are of GOD but one whom GOD has restored. As Nephi witnessed as what John saw in his vision, in the last day there is but two great churches, a church of the few who are the servants of GOD, and Church of Babylon where the rest of the world belongs. Either we belong to the one who GOD had restored, or we simply belong to the other.

How do we find the truth and receive a personal answer from the Creator? If one can apply enough faith as the Brother of Jared, the questions can be answered to whom GOD authorized as HIS only gospel and HIS voice upon this earth.

Not enough thanks buttons:rolleyes:

So I just had to see that this was repeated again:)

[Guest Utahrulzz]

There is but one way and one way only. There is no other way in entering into the Celestial Kingdom. It is not by Muhammad. It is not by the Pope [being a former Catholic here]. It is not Dalai Lama, and it is not Siddhartha. None other religions in this world are of GOD but one whom GOD has restored. As Nephi witnessed as what John saw in his vision, in the last day there is but two great churches, a church of the few who are the servants of GOD, and Church of Babylon where the rest of the world belongs. Either we belong to the one who GOD had restored, or we simply belong to the other.

How do we find the truth and receive a personal answer from the Creator? If one can apply enough faith as the Brother of Jared, the questions can be answered to whom GOD authorized as HIS only gospel and HIS voice upon this earth.

Amen Brothers! There is power in these words!

Thank You!

[ADoyle90815]

One thing about Catholics is that they view the Pope in a similar way that the LDS church views the President of the church, that he speaks on God's behalf. If you're a Christian, whether it's Catholic, Protestant, or LDS, you believe that the only way to God is through Jesus Christ. I'm not Catholic myself, but I have family members that are, so I have some idea as to what that church teaches. In fact, for a long time, I thought the LDS church also taught that birth control was a sin because like Catholics, they have larger families than the average. I later learned that wasn't true at all, that in the LDS church, family size is between the married couple and God.

[Lstinthwrld]

There is but one way and one way only. There is no other way in entering into the Celestial Kingdom. It is not by Muhammad. It is not by the Pope [being a former Catholic here]. It is not Dalai Lama, and it is not Siddhartha. None other religions in this world are of GOD but one whom GOD has restored. As Nephi witnessed as what John saw in his vision, in the last day there is but two great churches, a church of the few who are the servants of GOD, and Church of Babylon where the rest of the world belongs. Either we belong to the one who GOD had restored, or we simply belong to the other.

How do we find the truth and receive a personal answer from the Creator? If one can apply enough faith as the Brother of Jared, the questions can be answered to whom GOD authorized as HIS only gospel and HIS voice upon this earth.

I have seen enough atrocities committed in the name of 'god' and people justifying themselves by 'god' in all senses and branches of the judeo-christian tradition that I believe this stance to be a wrong ego driven one. You keep hiding from those 'worldly' scholars maybe when it all comes down to it you find yourself on the wrong side of the fence. When was the last time you saw or heard of a Buddhist start a war or kill some one or perform even the slightest violence against someone for not believing as they do?

[Lstinthwrld]

Truth is truth regardless of whether it's biased, Lost. Certainly, if I was Buddhist, I would take a Buddhist view, but the simple truth is: If Buddha was right, Christ was wrong. If Christ was correct, Buddha was wrong. The same goes with various other world religions.

I respect that people have difficulties finding the truth: This is a confusing world, with the waters muddied by numerous religions all claiming to have the truth. I blame no one for not seeing what I see. I believe in God and pray for him to open the eyes of everyone to truth.

But I still must defend what I know to be true, and will continue to do so. To do otherwise would be to water down the message of truth.

Your wrong. Have you ever looked at Buddhist teachings? Buddhist and christian teachings are almost exactly the same with the exclusion of the judaic concept of 'god'.

If you know what you defend is 'true' you will have no problem proving it to me. If it will help you in this I will pm you my personal phone number.

[Lstinthwrld]

Plus, if even in the end of it all you still choose not to hook your wagon to the Jesus Team, you can still be judged in the general Great White Throne Judgment according to your works (only in your own name) and see how far you get:)

Pure egotism "we are right and you are wrong" please defend your view without religious scare tactics.

[prisonchaplain]

When disusing religion we are not talking about help. We are talking about spiritual truth in christian terms salvation. You wanna mow my lawn that helps me out be my guest. I don't care if you use a machine or fingernail clippers. You wanna talk about the salvation of my eternal soul and tell me if I don't believe like you do then I am lost well then we got an issue.

Your way (I don't care what way it is) is NOT the only way.

Jesus said it, not me. Repeatedly suggesting that I want people to follow MY way, as opposed to Jesus insisting He was the only way, is deflection. Can't have it both ways. Either Jesus was wrong or not. He said He was the only way to God the Father.

[JohnnyRudick]

I have seen enough atrocities committed in the name of 'god' and people justifying themselves by 'god' in all senses and branches of the judeo-christian tradition that I believe this stance to be a wrong ego driven one. You keep hiding from those 'worldly' scholars maybe when it all comes down to it you find yourself on the wrong side of the fence. When was the last time you saw or heard of a Buddhist start a war or kill some one or perform even the slightest violence against someone for not believing as they do?

That really has nothing to do with this subject.

It does not matter how wonderfully behaved a Buddhist is.

It does not matter how well behaved a Baptist is or a Catholic.

What matters is

Is there a God?

Is there a Savior?

Who is that Savior?

Can you reach Him?

It matters not if I can prove it or not.

What matters is, is it true or false.

Don't dismiss it out of hand by who has the most docile followers.

Bro. Rudick

[prisonchaplain]

This what a nameless author writing in another persons name who never met Jesus said that's what Jesus said. I like to get my information from the horses mouth not from questionable literature.

If you don't accept the New Testament as accurately quoting Jesus,then you are left with nothing to accept. His words and teachings are better documented than most others from that era. But is it really that the historical citations and documentation doesn't meet your standards, or that you do not fully appreciate the message?

[MrsAri]

I have seen enough atrocities committed in the name of 'god' and people justifying themselves by 'god' in all senses and branches of the judeo-christian tradition that I believe this stance to be a wrong ego driven one. You keep hiding from those 'worldly' scholars maybe when it all comes down to it you find yourself on the wrong side of the fence. When was the last time you saw or heard of a Buddhist start a war or kill some one or perform even the slightest violence against someone for not believing as they do?

Generally speaking, Christians don't start wars; those who persecute Christians start wars.

[prisonchaplain]

Biased truth as you admit you as a christian see it right?

Oh I don't know. If there is bias, it is that we accept John's gospel as being true. And John quotes Jesus saying He is the only way to God the Father. The "Christian bias" is that we believe John quoted Jesus accurately, and that his words were inspired by the Holy Spirit.

'cause really...what other way is there to interpret that passage, once you accept it?

[prisonchaplain]

Your wrong. Have you ever looked at Buddhist teachings? Buddhist and christian teachings are almost exactly the same with the exclusion of the judaic concept of 'god'.

If you know what you defend is 'true' you will have no problem proving it to me. If it will help you in this I will pm you my personal phone number.

You make a fair point here. There are even forms of Buddhism (Zen, certainly) that some Christians have found help them in their Christian meditation practice. Buddhism's "failure," might simply be that it would distract followers from seeing and appreciating their need for Christ.

[Lstinthwrld]

Generally speaking, Christians don't start wars; those who persecute Christians start wars.

Ever hear of a little event called the crusades. How about the Balkan war.

[Lstinthwrld]

Jesus said it, not me. Repeatedly suggesting that I want people to follow MY way, as opposed to Jesus insisting He was the only way, is deflection. Can't have it both ways. Either Jesus was wrong or not. He said He was the only way to God the Father.

Prove he said it without referring to flawed and in most cases discredited literature and I will drive the bandwagon.

[Lstinthwrld]

That really has nothing to do with this subject.

It does not matter how wonderfully behaved a Buddhist is.

It does not matter how well behaved a Baptist is or a Catholic.

What matters is

Is there a God?

Is there a Savior?

Who is that Savior?

Can you reach Him?

It matters not if I can prove it or not.

What matters is, is it true or false.

Don't dismiss it out of hand by who has the most docile followers.

Bro. Rudick

And they shall be known by their fruits.

[Lstinthwrld]

If you don't accept the New Testament as accurately quoting Jesus,then you are left with nothing to accept. His words and teachings are better documented than most others from that era. But is it really that the historical citations and documentation doesn't meet your standards, or that you do not fully appreciate the message?

Where other than the bible is this documentation?

[MrsAri]

Ever hear of a little event called the crusades. How about the Balkan war.

I said "generally speaking". Obviously, Christians didn't start the war in Iraq.

[prisonchaplain]

Prove he said it without referring to flawed and in most cases discredited literature and I will drive the bandwagon.

Scholars have hardly come to a consensus that the Gospel of john is flawed and discredited. I can't imagine how you come to such certainty, when learned professors of many faiths have dedicated their lives to the study, teaching, and even translation of the very piece of literature you so easily dismiss.

[FunkyTown]

Where other than the bible is this documentation?

Are you asking because you honestly want to know, Lst? If so, I can point you to several non-canonical writings that talk of the founding fathers of the church.

The Bible is not one writing, but several writings by several different authors. There are more writings on the bible and biblical times, more writings of Jesus than of George Washington.

I can point you to the earliest works in the Patrologia Latina that show people who met the Apostles and can testify that the apostles died defending their belief in Christ.

You can say that the Apostles were mistaken in their belief, but to claim that they didn't believe or didn't exist would be to call in to claim mountains of historical figures. To claim they were inveterate liars would be to claim con men are willing to die for their con.

How many people dispute the presence of Hammurabi? How many contemporaries and writings of Hammurabi do we have? What about of Pliny the Elder? How many historians dispute his existence?

If you are looking for evidence - More evidence than almost any other historical person - I can provide that. I can give you reason enough to believe if you choose to. If, however, you are determined to follow your own course, all the mountains of evidence there are could not convince you.