Assuming G/L marriage becomes law of the land

[Moksha]

Bytor, have you heard anything about how Lesbian Commandos will break into all the Halls of Record and substitute pictures of Justin Bieber in place of the heterosexual marriage certificates?

[Suzie]

And you aren't the only one who takes a post and picks one thing out of it to harp on or turn it into something bigger than it is.

You are assuming a lot here, specially intention. I would appreciate if you don't do it with my posts. You are trying to "read" more than what is written IMO. Thanks.

In fact, what does everyone who is defending gay marriage really believe about celestial marriage? How do you reconcile it all in your mind?

I don't condone gay marriage however, I believe Church and state should be separated from this issue. I wouldn't do anything to support gay marriage but at the same time I wouldn't do anything to stop it.

[carlimac]

You are assuming a lot here, specially intention. I would appreciate if you don't do it with my posts. You are trying to "read" more than what is written IMO. Thanks.

I don't condone gay marriage however, I believe Church and state should be separated from this issue. I wouldn't do anything to support gay marriage but at the same time I wouldn't do anything to stop it.

I won't if you won't.

[carlimac]

What do i think about celestial marriage? That's a good question. I think a lot people think it just means finding someone to get sealed to in the temple and that's pretty much the end of it. I"ve found that after the temple most people tend to forget what sealed means, if they ever really understood what it meant going into it. I know a woman who had been married for years to her husband, but she was in love with another man. This woman's husband started to push for them to get sealed in the temple and even though this woman was not being honest with her husband or fully faithful she got sealed, and proceeded to love this other man and then get into yet another emotional affair with another man after being sealed. Coming from a mixed Catholic and LDS family so far the Catholics have a better history of strong loving relationships where most of the LDS friends and family married in the temple have divorced at least once if not more or on the verge of it. I think the pressure behind getting married in the temple leads to more people doing it for the sake of doing it with out always being ready. Does this make "Celestial marriages" less important or special, no. Do i think they are needed? no. When i was raising the LDS kids i made my views clear, while i didn't believe it was needed, if it is what they believe they need to do to progress in life and spiritually then i'll be waiting outside the temple for them with a huge smile on my face. I remember a talk i had with the kid's mom and her sisters when the girls were almost at dating age. The mothers were so focused on the guys their daughters date be RM's and able to take their daughters to the temple, but not one of them mentioned that he be a good man, or a loving man. There's a lot of guys out on missions who aren't there for the right reasons, and a lot of people who lie to get into the temple, so while i understand the focus on these traits i think we need to look at the people before titles and pieces of paper, maybe then celestial marriages might be closer to what they were meant to be again. Just my personal views and opinions.

Also, while I'm not a big believer in Celestial marriage as anything hugely important, I'd never do anything to remove the choice from people who want to, even though it conflicts with what i believe. People should be able ot make choices themselves about what goes on with consenting adults. One of the huge arguments people had against gay marriage was we'd start forcing it on churches and how wrong it was, but churches had no problem forcing their views on us, why is it ok for one group to do it and not the other? If you really want us to stay away and respect your views then shouldn't there possibly be leading by example instead of doing exactly what you're asking us not to do?

I think you're right about the pressure- it's a big responsibility. Some probably DO lie to get into the temple. But I don't think we have any way af knowing how many do this. I don't think we need to worry about them. They'll get the reward they deserve.

I don't know all that goes on in the personal lives and in the minds of my friends, but I know of far more happy healthy marriages among them than not. I had a neighbor who wasn't a member of the LDS church but a very good person. Very Christ-like in many ways even though she didn't go to any church. (That's just a side note) Anyway she was telling me about her circle of friends from high school from Missouri. None LDS. Even though they weren't really bad kids, most of them are divorced, in prison or dead now. Out of 14 of my friends who I'm still close to, there were 14 temple marriages and only 1 divorce in 30 years. We still get together several times a year and from what I can see, all seem to be pretty solid marriages. And out of me and my 5 siblings and my husband and his three- all temple marriages and no divorces. Not to say there haven't been bumpy times, but there has been a deeper level of commitment that has held us together where the world would probably tell us to give up during those hard times.

So that's MY experience. I know the stats vary depending on lots of factors.

Edited August 22, 2010 by carlimac

[Soulsearcher]

See and i have the opposite experience. Out of the 20 or so marriages from the temple only two have survived and are any where near close to being healthy. Where out of all the rest not one couples has been divorced when either married civilly or in another church. The point i'm making is, even in families where this it taught to be the only way, it doesn't make it a sure thing. People grow up and make their choices. Parents can teach what's right all they want, kids will make their final choices. If the couples in my experiences were all born in the church and raised by LDS parents and most of them can't keep a marriage together because they are weak, or selfish, or lost, then do we blame them or their parents? You can say gay's can't teach proper gospel principals but that's been proven not true by me and i believe Gaysaint, but in the end no matter what we teach, the child makes their own choices. You have said you are a sinner, you provide examples of these sins to your children, so does that make you unable to teach proper principals? In the end as parents we do our best and when it's time we hope they make the right choices, not our right choices, but what's right for them.