Citizens Plan On Filing a Civil Suit Against Internal Revenue Service

[selek]

Many organizations have been give tax free status that shouldnt have been

Call For References, please.

Your say-so, particularly in light of your partisan "they deserved it" arguments, is suspect, at best.

"Both sides are equally guilty" is a dodge and an attempt at moral equivalency that just doesn't pass the smell test.

You are trying to justify the indefensible by claiming both sides are equally guilty. The facts don't bear out that allegation.

But it wasn't a conservative group that was stripped of funding by an act of Congress due to massive corruption, kick-backs, and voter fraud. ACORN was a bought-and-paid for subsidiary of the DNC, and Obama was a one-time managera/o consultant to the same.

It wasn't a Republican or conservative campaign that was twice cited by the Federal Elections Commission for failing to take adequate safeguards to prevent fraudulent and criminal campaign donations.

It wasn't a Republican or conservative campaign caught on tape advising people on how to commit voter fraud.

It wasn't a Republican or conservative senator's son and campaign manager who was caught on tape advising people on how to commit voter fraud.

It wasn't conservative poll workers who were caught tampering with votes and turning in ballots in excess of 120% of the registered voters in a given district.

It wasn't conservative poll workers who unilaterally ejected, threatened, and in some cases assaulted poll watchers from opposing parties and independent groups.

It wasn't a conservative president who pleaded with and then threatened defense industries to hold off on lay-off notices (as required by law) until after the election- and then tried to bribe them into compliance by promising to pay any fines or penalties incurred for a blatant and willful violation of Federal law.

The president has consistently, regularly, and systematically demanded that his political enemies by treated as enemies of the State.

His Department of Homeland Security cannot bring itself to utter the word "jihad", but is more than happy to characterize returning vets, practicing Catholics, and faithful Christians as terrorists and traitors.

There have been three revelations in just the last two weeks of the Department of Defense labelling Christianity as a "hatecrime" or worse.

Corruption, intimidation, and the demonization of conservatives are the stock-in-trade of this Administration; and I sincerely believe that the IRS scandal is just the tip of the iceberg.

So spare us the pious sanctimony and false equivalency of "both sides are guilty".

Unless and until you can demonstrate a history of similar abuses, you are simply blowing smoke.

[bytebear]

Evidence emerges that Obama administration official knew of IRS targeting during 2012 campaign - CBS News

I expect Obama will not leave this unscathed. I even anticipate and hope for impeachment hearings. If Obama knew of an scandal that would have affected the election and used his office in any way to suppress it, he is guilty. And I can see no other possibility at this point to explain the facts thus far presented.

[selek]

Laugh all you like, Anne- it doesn't change the fact that you've offered us nothing but unvarnished partisan cheerleading.

There isn't a single, substantive fact in any of your responses above.

Your accusations aren't backed by anything other than wishful thinking and the pedantic insistence that things are true simply because you want them to be.

We, on the other hand, can point to the deluge of inconvenient truths you're trying desperately to avoid confronting:

Just Following Their Leader - Carol Platt Liebau

Edited May 19, 2013 by selek

[Traveler]

Just one comment because I have been audited by the IRS. What gulls me about what is going on is that the IRS has been an outlandish intrusion against every American citizen it suspiciously investigates by whatever prejudice it pleases.

The IRS assumes gilt rather than innocence, subpoenas records without any proof of probable cause and without court order, compensates property without legal proceedings and is not accountable for mistakes.

I do not care who the IRS targets - their modus operandi is the very definition of terrorism. And we as a people have given our government the right to terrorize its citizens. I am upset that our government feels upset only when they feel some group is targeted. That some segment is targeted is irrelevant - that fact that the IRS is able to treat anyone is such a manner is the real travesty that we should all be upset about.

The Traveler

[Guest]

“I have not done anything wrong, I have not broken any laws, I have not violated any IRS rules or regulations and I have not provided false information to this or any other congressional committee. While I would very much like to answer the committee’s questions today, I have been advised by my counsel to assert my constitutional right not to testify or answer questions related to the subject matter of this hearing.”

- After Miller's horrific testimony and this, I have to pinch myself several times to remind myself that this is real events and not some badly written movie script...

[MorningStar]

These scandals are all chilling to me. Between the IRS, obtaining phone records on reporters, etc., I talked to a friend who said she is even afraid to write to our representatives now.

One journalist says her friends and family won't call or email her at home or at work.

And I'm sure many people will think twice about donating to causes or compaigns in case anyone hands over their donor lists.

[Still_Small_Voice]

It wasn't conservative poll workers who were caught tampering with votes and turning in ballots in excess of 120% of the registered voters in a given district.

I am not saying this is not true Selek, but please give me the source of your information on this. I am curious.

[selek]

I am not saying this is not true Selek, but please give me the source of your information on this. I am curious.

VOTER FRAUD: Obama supporter indicted for voting SIX times » The Right Scoop -

http://www.philly.com/philly/news/politics/20121112_In_59_Philadelphia_voting_wards__Mitt_Romney_got_zero_votes.html

Fraud: Some told they already voted, others brag about voting multiple times - National Elections | Examiner.com

Voter rolls in Ohio are bloated, experts say | The Columbus Dispatch

‘Are You Gonna Do What I Think You’re Gonna Do?’: Latest O’Keefe Video Purportedly Shows DNC Staffer Helping Woman Vote Twice | Video | TheBlaze.com

Task Force Finds More Ballots Cast Than Registered Voters | WISN Home - WISN Home

BREAKING: Massive Voter Fraud in St. Lucie County, Florida - Heather Ginsberg

[talisyn]

http://www.nytimes.com/2013/05/27/us/politics/nonprofit-applicants-chafing-at-irs-tested-political-limits.html?hp&_r=3&

So, I waited a while before commenting here. Because I was pretty sure something like this was going to happen, and I just wanted to enjoy the moment in the peace of a neglected thread.

Ahhhhhhh, that felt good.

Agents may look at what a group publishes in print or on a Web site, whether it provides funds to other organizations involved in elections or whether a group’s officers are also employed by political parties. They may also consider other public information, former officials and tax experts said, though they are required to ask the organization to provide those materials or comment on them before the information can be included in an application review.

“My experience has been that the agents immediately start Googling to see what the organization is doing outside of the application,” said Kevin J. Shortill, a former tax law specialist in the I.R.S.’s exempt organization division. “And that explains why you get these requests for information like, ‘Please print out your Web site and send it in.’

Edited May 28, 2013 by talisyn
forgot to include quote from article

[bytor2112]

http://www.nytimes.com/2013/05/27/us/politics/nonprofit-applicants-chafing-at-irs-tested-political-limits.html?hp&_r=3&

So, I waited a while before commenting here. Because I was pretty sure something like this was going to happen, and I just wanted to enjoy the moment in the peace of a neglected thread.

Ahhhhhhh, that felt good.

Why does that make you feel good? The IRS is an intimidating organization that no one regardless of political bend should ever want having this much power and authority. Now there will be even more with the health care abomination.

This was a case of voter suppression plain and simple. too bad your political ideology blinds you to that reality. the Democrats won't stay in power forever...do you really want this to be tit for tat by the right? Yeah....I do think they would do it as well..power corrupts and:

And agency officials have acknowledged that specialists inappropriately used keywords like “Tea Party” and “Patriots” in searching through applications.

[Just_A_Guy]

In other news, police determined that a recent victim of a sexual assault in Central Park was, indeed, wearing a low-cut top and a miniskirt. During the same press conference, Police Chief Barack Obama noted that the department's crackdown on prostitutes based in the park was ongoing.

Edited May 28, 2013 by Just_A_Guy

[selek]

So, I waited a while before commenting here. Because I was pretty sure something like this was going to happen, and I just wanted to enjoy the moment in the peace of a neglected thread.

Ahhhhhhh, that felt good.

Zen moment?

I would point out two things:

First, no one here (contrary to the hysteria) is arguing that organizations seeking exempt status should NOT face review.

The problem is that as regards this scandal, the reviews were both extraordinarily intrusive (the content of my prayers is NONE of the government's business) and appear to have been ideologically motivated.

Second, the government- especially its enforcement branches- are supposed to be politically neutral.

Obama campaigned on restoring integrity and trust to the government and ending the partisan squalor. Now it looks like his top aides not only betrayed that vision, but deliberately subverted their government posts as weapons.

As the absolute antithesis of neutralty, they acted as willing participants in a partisan campaign of intimidation and abuse.

They set aside their oaths and duty to enforce the law in a neutral fashion and acted to intimidate and punish their political enemies.

That's third-world banana republic crap- we expect more of our public servants, even under President Barack Hussein Quaddafi.

Edited May 28, 2013 by selek

[Guest Danar2amir]

The IRS is auditing both of my sisters and their business.

[Smeagums]

The IRS is auditing both of my sisters and their business. The reason they were getting is that neither of them has a college degree so they can't really be running a business right.

That would be one thing, but they audited one of my sisters a few years ago and dragged it on for 5 years. She felt harassed. They never found any wrongdoing on her part and never apologized.

Among most people I'd be considered a conspiracy theorist. The IRS mess isn't surprising to me in the least bit. In fact it is expected. I believed, before this news came out that they at least targeted good and honest business owners because they want to destroy, absolutely destroy the sovereignty of the United States and small business owners is a large part of it.

They want you working for the man (corporation). My friend's father is audited every single year and he is straight as an arrow! Honestly, I don't understand why the media let this news slip. Either the powers that be want Obama out or they are covering from something larger going on behind scenes. Either way, I'd like to see the IRS abolished. We existed ~200 years or so without it as well as without the income tax.

Many people tend to cry "but who will build the roads"?! Come on.

Just my honest two cents. Sorry to those being targeted by the IRS!

[Traveler]

One very interesting outcome of recent events - indicates that the head of the IRS during the time that the IRS was abusing it power has done 2 rather interesting things. #1 The testified before Congress that no targeting or unusual treatment was going on - when they knew otherwise. And #2 they made an extraordinary number of visits to the White House.

Because a law suit has been filed the court has power to subpoena records - including meetings at the White House concerning IRS operations while such improprieties were taking place. Hmmmm this could get really interesting.

The Traveler

[talisyn]

My goodness it's absolutely useless trying to have a decent discussion isn't it?

[Just_A_Guy]

Why discuss, when you can just audit your opponent--and then imply that your abuse of power is their own darned fault?

Talisyn, I daresay you would never have put up with the Times' attempt to besmirch the victims if it had been directed towards--say--a rape victim; or even a victim of similar government targeting directed against a progressive organization.

Talisyn, what is it about conservatives that makes us--and only us--fair game for this kind of thing? Do you really think that conservative political fundraising is inherently more suspect or prone to tomfoolery than liberal fundraising?

It is time for you, and your co-partisans, to make a choice. Will you stand up for the rights of fellow Americans, regardless of your political disagreements with them? Or will you obey your President's injunction to "punish [y]our enemies", and join the New York Times in clucking about how at least some of those conservatives reeeely had it coming?

Edited May 31, 2013 by Just_A_Guy

[Just_A_Guy]

Well, well, well.

The former IRS head's wife is an executive at a left-wing advocacy group whose stated goal is getting "special interest" (read: center-right) dollars out of politics.

Welcome to the republic--have a banana.

And, from Brian Cates:

The reason the IRS scandal is so awful is that the power of the Federal Government was used by political partisans to single out citizens for abuse based on their completely legitimate political views.

The AP/Fox News scandals are also important because abuse of Federal power threatens a free press, something that is vital to the survival of a democratic republic.

And it definitely puts a burr under the saddle of Liberals that they can't use their usual tu quoque arguments to try to head off any consequences for what's been done.

Their usual 'Bush/Republicans Did It Too' argument can't be used.

When did Bush's administration:

-- lie about a terrorist attack?

-- go after the Left with the IRS?

-- spy on reporters using the DOJ?

-- kill American citizens with no due process through drone strikes?

The things Progressives fear-mongered about, that Bush was going to have people thrown in jail for checking out the wrong library books, didn't happen.

Now that the shoe is on the other foot, Liberals want to pretend the things that are coming to light only now, that went on from 2009-2013 are nothing, a sideshow, a circus, just a political witch hunt. Well it was a witch hunt.

. . .

Think about all the times you heard Progressives shriek Conservatives were witch-hunting them during the Bush years.

That was nothing more than projection. The moment Progressives got control of the Executive branch back in 2009, they set about using the power of the Executive to tilt the playing field back in their favor.

Everything they shrieked the Bush administration was trying to do to Progressive groups & citizens and the Press, Obama's administration went out and DID it. And we probably STILL don't know everything they've been doing.

[Blackmarch]

Most major organizations in the Gov could use a good buttkicking. And in that sense this is probably good, but more likely than not, if the IRS suffers any significant loss it will likely translate into stringent tax acquisition measures (ie being more on the lookout and giving more pressure on those who owe), rather than any good effort at cleaning up the personnel roster.

[talisyn]

So can it be assumed that none of these politically motivated non-profits received tax-free status?

[Just_A_Guy]

Talisyn, if you haven't watched some of the statements that were made before the House committee earlier this week, I'd highly recommend it.

As to the result: I've heard about at least some groups dropping the whole process (which was, of course, the point). Others did bull through and got the approvals. But really, in the words of our dear former Secretary of State: "What difference does it make?"

If I charge you with felony embezzlement, and you spend $5-$10K in attorney's fees (which won't be refunded when you're acquitted), and the whole time you're terrified that even if you don't go down for the alleged offense someone may find some other peccadillo, or feel you've contradicted yourself and thus get you on perjury/obstruction of justice: the knowledge that you're innocent, and even your final acquittal, are cold comfort.

I mean, not to get too histrionic, but the difference between your above post and facetiously asking "so can it be assumed that none of these alleged terrorists survived their waterboarding experiences" or "so can it be assumed that none of these Jews made it through the Holocaust alive?", is only one of degree. A very big degree, granted; but the underlying rationalization process is identical.

The ends do not justify the means, even if the ends are some kind of progressivist Utopia. And I'll tell you bluntly: the fact that you, and apparently some millions of Americans just like you, are thinking that way--it scares the bejeebies out of me. What other indignities will you allow the President to heap upon his political enemies (which, by his standards, includes me)? Where does it end?

Edited June 7, 2013 by Just_A_Guy