Do We Honor Jesus And Worship God

[jimradictis]

Please bare with me, I have been trying to understand this for a little while now. I am still new to the Church and reading from the Book of Mormon, so I have not come to a conclusion yet., From what I thought I understood, we worship only Heavenly Father through Jesus. I then later read that Prophet Hinckley stated that he worships both Heavenly Father and Jesus. So now I am a little confused, while I respect, honor, and love Jesus for the Atonement and pray to our Heavenly Father through Jesus, I have not been worshiping him, nor praying directly to him. I repent through Jesus Christ to Heavenly Father during prayer, I do not repent directly to Jesus Christ in prayer.. Am I doing so incorrectly? If both Jesus and Heavenly Father are both worshiped, does that make us polytheistic? I looked for a question similar to this one, but did not find any answers on this board.

Thank you.

[a-train]

Polythiestic, sure label it what you want. The fact is this: God the Father is a Celestial Glorified Being and so is Jesus of Nazareth. They are NOT the same Being. They ARE both Gods. They ARE both God. They ARE one. They are together with the Holy Ghost (Yet another Being) the Godhead.

The confusion here is all semantics. Everyone is trying to fit all the verses throughout the Scriptures through the same semantic peg-hole. But not all verses are round and not all pegs are square. This is why the Trinitarian definition came about. It is simply a word game designed to make every verse agree with their definition of God.

Just think simple. Let the Holy Ghost testify what is true and what is right. The rest becomes easy.

Do Mormons believe Jesus is God? YES! Check the first page of the Book of Mormon. The book of Mormon was written to convince both Jew and Gentile that "Jesus is the Christ, the Eternal God." (BOM cover page)

Do we worship Jesus? YES! Nephi said plainly: "And now behold, I say unto you that the right way is to believe in Christ, and deny him not; and Christ is the Holy One of Israel; wherefore ye must bow down before him, and worship him with all your might, mind, and strength, and your whole soul; and if ye do this ye shall in nowise be cast out." (2 Nephi 25:9)

So what does this mean? It means that what you have been doing in praying to the Father in the name of Christ is absolutely right. Christ taught: "When ye pray, say, Our Father which art in heaven, Hallowed be thy name. Thy kingdom come. Thy will be done, as in heaven, so in earth. Give us day by day our daily bread. And forgive us our sins; for we also forgive every one that is indebted to us. And lead us not into temptation; but deliver us from evil." (Luke 11:2-4) To worship Christ is to do as He does. By praying to the Father in that manner we also worship the Son.

Do we worship the Father? YES! Jacob said speaking of "all the holy prophets": "Behold, they believed in Christ and worshiped the Father in his name, and also we worship the Father in his name." (Jacob 4:5)

By following the Saviour's Example, we worship the Father, and by doing so, we also worship Christ.

Our Example is Christ, but who is His example? He said: "Verily, verily, I say unto you, The Son can do nothing of himself, but what he seeth the Father do: for what things soever he doeth, these also doeth the Son likewise." (John 5:19)

I hope this helps a little. But don't worry about it too much. When we have questions or concerns, take it to the LORD and go about your life in faith. After the trial of your faith you will receive a witness. That is how the LORD teaches us. Thanks for the good questions.

-a-train

[jimradictis]

Thank you a-train, it is important to me to know such things because when I talk to friends, or family I feel as though I am a representative of our Church. I have been browsing around the net looking for answers and thus far I have come across three methods of worship.

<blockquote>1.Worship of only Heavenly Father.

2.Worship of both Heavenly Father and Jesus

3.Worship of the God Head.</blockquote>

I should have not used the word polytheism, but for lack of a better word I had to include it. I do agree with you though it is just semantics, but with my wife asking me I feel obligated to give her an answer. I find it difficult to give her satisfactory answers regarding our church because she is an atheist and wants definitive answers, and refuses to see missionaries. It was a concern to me because I did not wish to be breaking a commandment, I prayed to God but was still unsure.

Thank you =)

[Dr T]

polytheism was the correct term.

[BenRaines]

I agree with a-train's description.

I bet it is hard to prove anything to an athiest. If I were atheist I would be hedonist too. Eat, drink and be merry for tomorrow we die.

Out of the vast universe that our planet, to our knowledge, is the only one habitable by our type of life has to be more than accident.

I like liked CK's description of Big Bang theory. First there was nothing and then Bang something.

Ben Raines

[CrimsonKairos]

I think it is key to separate "worship" from "prayer."

We worship God the Father in the name of the Son. We also pray to God the Father in the name of the Son.

We worship Jesus by serving him and those around us, and keeping his commandments. However, we do not pray to Jesus.

Thus, we worship both the Father and the Son (the Son passes all worship up to the Father anyway), but we only pray to God our Father.

Anyone who believes in the Trinity is polytheistic. Period. The scriptures bear this out. Either there are three or there is one God. Can't have it both ways. The question is do we pray to all three members of the Godhead.

The answer is no.

[shanstress70]

I bet it is hard to prove anything to an athiest. If I were atheist I would be hedonist too. Eat, drink and be merry for tomorrow we die.

Ben, in defense of the atheists that I know, they are not this way at all. There are a few people I work with who are atheists. They are not 'hedonists', by any means. They spend a lot of time helping others. I have had many conversations with them about all of this. Atheists very well may be good people... they just don't do it for some reward as in going to Heaven. They do it in order to just be a decent person and to help their fellow men. In fact, they may be even more helpful to others, generally speaking, because they do think this is all there is so they want to make the best of it.

Just had to say that. I do have sympathy for atheists, as I know it would be so depressing to me if I didn't believe there was anything after this life. But they aren't all about doing whatever pleases them, regardless of consequences... at least the ones I know aren't.

[BenRaines]

Sorry if I didn't explain it properly. I thought I said "If I was athiest". I do not make any judgement of another. Only if I didn't believe in God I would grab all I could and enjoy what living has to offer if after living I was only dead.

Ben Raines

[prisonchaplain]

The confusion about what constitutes polytheism is both a matter of perspective, and ultimately, of which religion is true.

1. Jews and Muslims (and perhaps Oneness Christians) argue that all religions that believe there are multiple God-persons are polytheistic. Thus, they would condemn trinitarian Christians, and certainly LDS, with that term. I say "condemn," because we all agree that we are to worship one God only.

2. Trinitarian Christians believe that God is three persons (Father, Son, and Holy Spirit), yet one essential God. The three are not only united in person, but in essence. "Ontological unity" is the theological shop talk for this belief.

3. LDS believe that the Godhead is three separate beings, united in purpose only. Yet since they are united in purpose, the Church argues, the belief is still in one God.

So, from the perspective of Jews and Muslims, nearly all Christians are polytheists. From the perspective of Trinitarian Christians, LDS are polytheists.

Of course, as I hinted at the beginning, the really big, gigantic question is: What is God's perspective?

[Maureen]

Anyone who believes in the Trinity is polytheistic. Period.

Maybe from your perspective CK but not mine. I believe in the Trinity, but I only worship the one true God.

Either there are three or there is one God. Can't have it both ways.

Three persons or three Gods? I believe in the three in one because I believe with God, all things are possible, even God's divine nature.

M.

[CrimsonKairos]

I believe in the Trinity, but I only worship the one true God.

And that's what it boils down to.

The scriptural condemnations of multiple gods is almost always a "ye shall not serve other gods" injunction.

In essence, God is saying, "I am the only God ye are to worship, I am the only source of salvation from death and hell."

Believing in a God/god is not the same as worshipping them.

Sure LDS believe the Godhead is composed of three Gods. But we only pray to God the Father. We don't pray to Jesus or the Holy Ghost. We worship God the Father in the name of Christ Jesus.

If Trinitarians aren't polytheists because they only worship one God, then LDS aren't polytheists either.

It comes down to how you're defining polytheism.

Is it just believing in the existence of more than one God? If so, LDS are polytheists as are Trinitarians.

Is it believing in and praying to/worshipping more than one God? If so, neither LDS nor Trinitarians are polytheists.

What's confusing about that?

[prisonchaplain]

<div class='quotemain'>

I believe in the Trinity, but I only worship the one true God.

The scriptural condemnations of multiple gods is almost always a "ye shall not serve other gods" injunction.

In essence, God is saying, "I am the only God ye are to worship, I am the only source of salvation from death and hell."

Believing in a God/god is not the same as worshipping them.

Sure LDS believe the Godhead is composed of three Gods. But we only pray to God the Father. We don't pray to Jesus or the Holy Ghost. We worship God the Father in the name of Christ Jesus.

It's my understanding that traditional LDS theology is that the three persons of the Godhead are one in purpose, and that such a belief is not polytheism--not a belief in three Gods--Unless Prof. Robinson got it wrong.

If Trinitarians aren't polytheists because they only worship one God, then LDS aren't polytheists either.

Trinitarians are not polytheists because we understand ourselves to believe in the existence of only one God. We not only worship one God, we declare that there is only one God. Our Jewish and Muslim friends cannot except our further understanding that this one God is three persons.

Is it just believing in the existence of more than one God? If so, LDS are polytheists as are Trinitarians.

The difference is that trinitarians believe in one essential God, whereas LDS believe that the Godhead is made up of three separate beings who are united in purpose only. Official teaching would not say "three Gods," though, interestingly, you have.

[CrimsonKairos]

The difference is that trinitarians believe in one essential God, whereas LDS believe that the Godhead is made up of three separate beings who are united in purpose only. Official teaching would not say "three Gods," though, interestingly, you have.

Official LDS doctrine is that there are three separate Gods in the Godhead (though they're not equal in dominion or authority). We believe in God the Father, God the Son, and God the Testator. God the Father presides over the others.

No matter how hard I try I can't wrap my head around the Trinity concept. It's just full of self-contradictions. One God but three persons of one essence shared by the three that are really one...makes my head hurt.

[Dr T]

It does boggle the mind CK. My limited understanding though, is as, M and PC have stated, One God, three personages (Father, Son, H.S.) that are all essentially one God. For me, it is not about worship but about there only being "one true God" and all other gods discussed in scripture are false. We might hold up our home as god or our cars as god but they are not. Just my two cents.

[Blessed]

I was always taught that the Trinity was like an apple. God is the core, Jesus is the flesh and the Holy Gohost is the skin. They all have three unique purposes, but still just one apple. One cannot one without the others or it would cease being an apple. I dunno, it has always made sense to me that way. ANd it makes me hungry too.

[prisonchaplain]

Official LDS doctrine is that there are three separate Gods in the Godhead (though they're not equal in dominion or authority). We believe in God the Father, God the Son, and God the Testator. God the Father presides over the others.

Three Gods, one Godhead? That is clear. In a sense, it is the opposite of Modalism--one God, one person, three roles. You have three Gods, three persons, one ultimate role.

No matter how hard I try I can't wrap my head around the Trinity concept. It's just full of self-contradictions. One God but three persons of one essence shared by the three that are really one...makes my head hurt.

I avoid the "it's a mystery" line, because most skeptics see it as a copout. So, I'll offer an imperfect example:

1 x 1 x 1 = 1. Each number has its own place in the equation. Only one is first. On the other hand, they are co-equal, co-eternal. They truly are one.

It may seem that we are straining at gnats theologically, but for most Christian traditions, it is inconceivable to concede that other Gods exist. It is the same reason we struggle with the belief in premortal eternal existence.

[CrimsonKairos]

I appreciate your attempt to explain the Trinity to me further, PC.

I just can't get past the fact that even in your example, there are three ones. I don't see what the point is of saying there are three persons if there is in reality only one being. Don't worry, I'm confident I'll never understand it (especially having been taught the LDS doctrine on the Godhead first).

[a-train]

I am not trying to confuse anyone here, but I want to just throw something out about praying to Jesus. As LDS, we unequivically claim Jesus of Nazereth to be Jehovah, the Great I Am, Creator of Heaven and Earth, the Alpha and Omega, the Beginning and the End. We further state that he is the Christ, the Eternal God.

Now, have a look at the Dedicatory Prayer of the Kirtland Temple offered by Joseph Smith by revelation in D&C 109. Who was this prayer offered to? Look at verse 34 and 42 and you will see that the Holy Father and the God of Israel Joseph addressed was Jehovah.

Now can our prayers and oblations go up to the throne of God and not come before Jesus who has ascended there to sit with his Father in His throne?

I am not trying to confuse or say that prayers should be offered in any other manner than that shown to us by the Prophets through the scriptures, I just want to point out that to say that a prayer is offered to the Saviour is not blasphemous, neither should we feel uncomfortable saying that Jesus hears our prayers and answers them. Jesus is GOD.

-a-train

[jimradictis]

I am not trying to confuse anyone here, but I want to just throw something out about praying to Jesus. As LDS, we unequivically claim Jesus of Nazereth to be Jehovah, the Great I Am, Creator of Heaven and Earth, the Alpha and Omega, the Beginning and the End. We further state that he is the Christ, the Eternal God.

Now, have a look at the Dedicatory Prayer of the Kirtland Temple offered by Joseph Smith by revelation in D&C 109. Who was this prayer offered to? Look at verse 34 and 42 and you will see that the Holy Father and the God of Israel Joseph addressed was Jehovah.

Now can our prayers and oblations go up to the throne of God and not come before Jesus who has ascended there to sit with his Father in His throne?

I am not trying to confuse or say that prayers should be offered in any other manner than that shown to us by the Prophets through the scriptures, I just want to point out that to say that a prayer is offered to the Saviour is not blasphemous, neither should we feel uncomfortable saying that Jesus hears our prayers and answers them. Jesus is GOD.

-a-train

I am still learning, so again I am going to ask something that is probably blatantly common knowledge to most LDS, do not think the lesser for me asking

Now, me being fairly new to the church and lacking a lot of the knowledge most of you have. I am just grasping at this concept.. Heavenly Father is our literal Father, and Jesus is our spiritual brother of which was first to come into form. When you say Jesus is God I am thinking in a term that means a literal deity of which we are to worship in the manner that we worship Heavenly Father, as an equal to Father. Is this correct?

[a-train]

Jesus is Immanuel which means Eloheim with us, or God with us (Matt:1 18-25). He is the "God of Abraham, and of Isaac, and the God of Jacob" (1 Nephi 19:10). He stood in the Great Grand Council before the earth was created and was chosen by the Father to be the Propitiator of the Atonement (Abr 3:22). He is therefore also known as "the Lamb slain from the foundation of the world". (Rev. 13:8)

He is as you mentioned the Firstborn of the Father, Hebrews 1 is Paul's powerful epistle on this matter wherein he said that the Father "bringeth in the firstbegotten into the world, he saith, And let all the angels of God worship him." Paul says Christ "hath [the Father] appointed heir of all things, by whom also he made the worlds; Who being the brightness of his glory, and the express image of his person, and upholding all things by the word of his power, when he had by himself purged our sins, sat down on the right hand of the Majesty on high;"

The Saviour was the Firstborn to our Father in Heaven in the Spirit world, there he possessed a spirit body of spirit matter, which was seen by many ancient prophets when they had visions of Him such as the Brother of Jared to whom Jehovah said: "Behold, this body, which ye now behold, is the body of my spirit; and man have I created after the body of my spirit; and even as I appear unto thee to be in the spirit will I appear unto my people in the flesh." (Ether 3:16)

Having come into the world, taking upon himself flesh, living without sin, and returning to the presence of the Father to "sit with Him in His throne" as the "heir of all things" he bears the name of Jehovah, which means I AM. He is the Great I Am. This signifies that He is unchangeable. Of all our Father's spirit children, only the Firstborn came through all estates without any degree of unrighteousness, He therefore bears this name as the Unchangeable One.

He was appointed by the Father to be the Creator, Redeemer, and Judge in the pre-mortal world and is indeed Diety. As His famous words in John 14:6 exclaim: "I am the away, the truth, and the life: no man cometh unto the Father, but by me."

As He said to the Brother of Jared "Behold, I am he who was prepared from the foundation of the world to redeem my people. Behold, I am Jesus Christ. I am the Father and the Son. In me shall all mankind have life, and that eternally, even they who shall believe on my name; and they shall become my sons and my daughters." (Ether 3:14)

Because only He can give us Eternal Life, He is known as our Eternal Father. "Is the Son of God the very Eternal Father? And Amulek said unto him: Yea, he is the very Eternal Father of heaven and of earth, and all things which in them are; he is the beginning and the end, the first and the last; And he shall come into the world to redeem his people; and he shall take upon him the transgressions of those who believe on his name; and these are they that shall have eternal life, and salvation cometh to none else." (Alma 11:38-40)

In short, Christ is a literal Diety whom we are to worship. He is equal with the Father (John 5:18, Phil 2:6).

Our worship of Him must be "in spirit and in truth". I think we too often equate worship with the worship performed by the heathen. Although we bow in reverance and prayer, this is not the only form of worship, nor is it the greatest form of worship. To worship the LORD is to live as He did, to live as He does. We are to worship Him in all that we do.

-a-train