Trailor Trash

[Guest Emma Hale Smith]

Whew! I must say, I thought I was the only one "fighting the good fight."

Not that I expect everyone to agre with me, not at all.

I just felt like like I was the only one who believed it was wrong to use these stereotypes, and I'm glad others have spoken up.

Also, Yediyd and I did talk last night and she mentioned she has observed women with the "entitlement attitude." In fact, it was obnoxious enough it was very unsettling to Yediyd. I admit I have not personally experienced this but I absolutely believe Yediyd. We suspect it is a phenomenon that occurs on the coasts, but I certainly have no evidence of that. CK and Six have also argued this "entitlement attitude exists." So I ralize that I do not have enough information to argue against it and need to do more research. I apologize for taking a stance when I was not educated enough to do so.

CK: TRAILER TRASH" DESCRIBES AN ATITTUDE OF LAZINESS, INDOLENCE, APATHY AND GET-SOMETHING-FOR-NOTHING BEHAVIOR WHEN PEOPLE ARE CAPABLE OF MUCH, MUCH MORE.

Let me see if I can try a different tact.

Thirty years ago, especially in the south, white people thought nothing about calling a black man a "nigger." (I'm sorry, but I have to be graphic to make my point.)

If you've watched any documentaries about the Civil Rights movement, you know that it was common for a white man, especially in the South, to stick his nose into a black man's face and with all the hate he had in his being, spit "Nigger" into the black man's face. It was a condemnation, backed up by bus seats, toilets, restaurants, hotels and dignity denied to the black race because the whites believed, amongst many things, that they were lazy, indolent, apathetic and wanted something for nothing.

And you know what? Maybe that white man was right!

Maybe that black man was indolent, lazy, and apathetic. Maybe he just wanted something for nothing. Maybe he was a drunk who just mooched off everyone and thought he was entitled to help from everyone else.

So, CK, my question to you is, when that white man got in his face, was he justified in calling this man a "NIGGER"?

Would you EVER call anyone that today, whatever his/her circumstancess?

I ask, because that is what you do every time you call someone "trailer trash." I realize you don't agree with me, but that's because you don't live in a trailer park, and you don't live near the poverty level.

While I agree "trailer trash" is not quite as eggregious as N****R, it is just as powerful. when it comes to the image it evokes, and therefore should always be avoided.

By the way, here's the man's background story: When the man was a boy, he knew his daddy and grandaddy and loved them fiercely. Then one day when he was just a little boy they built a cross in his front yard and lit it with fire. The next morning his grandaddy was dead, hanged on a tree branch.

After that his father changed, He stank of alcohol all the time and beat him if he came in the room. His mama finally had enough and left, and even though he begged her to take him with her, she wouldn't.

So he grew up starving, dirty and alone. He stole from the neighbor's garden and got caught, so he went to jail, which he sort of liked because he got more food than he did at home. But terrible things happened there too.

The rest of his life was a haze of alcohol, starvation, homelessness and islation. His suffering numbed him into begging in the streets, where the white man found him.

My point is you walked into people's trailers where you saw apathy, indolence and laziness, but you knew nothing about their background stories. You could have been absolutely right on, or you cold have been completely wrong. The point is you don't know!

If you want to convey that you have observed people who have behaved this way, then just leave "trailer trash" ou of your vocabulary. Just say "I visited these people who _____________________________."

In fact, why is it even necessary to mention they lived in a trailer? Lots of people live in house who are apathetic, lazy , etc. Do you call them "house trash"?

CK: I WON'T USE THE TERM "TRAILER TRASH" ON THIS SITE ANYMORE. INSTEAD, I WILL SAY "LAZY, GREEDY LIARS." HOPEFULLY NO ONE WHO LIVES IN A TRAILER WILL TAKE OFFENSE THAT WAY, SINCE "TRAILER TRASH" HAS BECOME A STEREOTYPE APPLICABLE NOT ONLY TO PEOPLE WHO LIVE IN TRAILERS!

By George, he's got it! By George, I think he's got it!

Emma

[CrimsonKairos]

I just felt like like I was the only one who believed it was wrong to use these stereotypes, and I'm glad others have spoken up.

Stereotypes always have a basis in reality. It's how they come to exist in the first place.

I admit I have not personally experienced [entitlement attitude]...CK and Six have also argued this "entitlement attitude exists." So I ralize that I do not have enough information to argue against it and need to do more research.

Nothin' to research, Emma. You're telling me you've never met anyone, anywhere, in your whole life, who had an attitude of, "Government should take care of me, I shouldn't have to work even though I'm not disabled, I want to get as much as I can for nothing," etc...? This astounds me. Do you live in a cave?

Thirty years ago, especially in the south, white people thought nothing about calling a black man a "nigger." (I'm sorry, but I have to be graphic to make my point.)

This has to be the worst comparison I've ever read. Comparing the emotionally charged "n" word to calling a lazy person "trailer trash" is ridiculous. There are no signs over drinking fountains that say, "Whites only," and "Trailer trash only." There is no law against millionaires marrying those living at the poverty level. Your comparison surprises me, because I know you're intelligent and this is a horrible attempt at parallelism and analogy.

Let me reiterate, again, what I've already said multiple times. I've never "called" anyone trailer trash. I've never said to a buddy, "Dude, look at that trailer trash over there!" nor have I ever shoved my nose into someone's face and spat, "Trailer trash!" Geez Emma, you've got to be kidding me. The only reason I used the term in the first place was in discussing the attitude of someone who'd abuse the welfare system. Everyone here misunderstood my use of the term (except sixpack maybe), so just forget I ever used it.

I didn't mean what you think the term means.

Maybe that black man was indolent, lazy, and apathetic...my question to you is, when that white man got in his face, was he justified in calling this man a "NIGGER"?

Again, this is an amazingly misdirected train of thought. Did I ever call anyone on this site "trailer trash?" No. Have I ever accused anyone here of being lazy and abusing the system? No. So where do you come off comparing my comments to a racist calling a black man the "n" word?

I found this tactic offensive. To compare my remarks to racism is going too far...especially since I've clarified like twice now what I meant by the term "trailer trash" (and it had nothing to do with where you live, how much money you make, what state you grew up in, whether you get welfare or disability, etc... all the things you assumed I projected onto everyone I "misjudged").

Don't bother with the, "So you felt offended by my remarks? Now you know how others feel about your remarks. They're offended too." It's grade school logic and not even applicable. First, because I've never singled anyone out by name on this board (as you did), and second, because I never accused anyone on this board of being trash (or bigoted, as you did).

I ask, because that is what you do every time you call someone "trailer trash." I realize you don't agree with me, but that's because you don't live in a trailer park, and you don't live near the poverty level.

Okay CK...breathe...breathe deep...calm down man...calm down. Emma, did you even read my posts? If so, then you're selectively ignoring the parts that make the above statement of yours useless and unrelated to my use of the term.

Let me repeat what I said earlier. Maybe you just need to read it twice to "get" what I mean by the term "trailer trash"

"TRAILER TRASH" ISN'T ABOUT TRAILERS, OR RACE, OR GENDER, OR SOCIAL CLASS. IT'S ABOUT PERSONAL LAZINESS AND APATHY. SAY IT WITH ME NOW: "JUST BECAUSE I LIVE IN A TRAILER/PRE-FAB, I AM NOT TRAILER TRASH."

Read that again, please. Is it sticking? Do you get it now? Was that clear enough? It's about an attitude, which even rich people that live in mansions can have. It has nothing to do with anything other than personality and character.

My point is you walked into people's trailers where you saw apathy, indolence and laziness, but you knew nothing about their background stories.

Emma, please stop telling me what I did or didn't know. You weren't there. You don't know how many people opened up to me and my companion. It's very arrogant and annoying to be told what I did and did not know by someone who definitely doesn't know. So please, cut it out.

If you want to convey that you have observed people who have behaved this way, then just leave "trailer trash" ou of your vocabulary. Just say "I visited these people who _____________________________."

I don't plan on discussing it with anyone on this board anymore, since everyone is unable to get past their personal definitions of the term and focus on my point, not my diction.

[shanstress70]

I've been reading all this and wasn't going to speak up, but changed my mind. I was brought up by a single mother who worked her butt off to make sure we had what we needed. We lived in a trailor growing up... not a trailer park, but on a remote mountainside in the Appalachians. I was always bothered by the stereotypes and had low self-esteem for a lot of reasons. I went to elementary and high school in the closest town, which happened to be rich, touristy places. As a result, most of my friends were wealthy. I hung out their families and went to shows, out to eat, even vacations with them. I was always hesitant to take them to my home, but they never really cared for some reason. However, I NEVER brought guys to my house when I was dating. Too embarrassing!

I was the first person in my family to complete a college degree. Now I live and work in an affluent area with a good career. Until the last couple of years, I would always cringe and feel like less of a person when someone would make fun of trailors, which is common talk in the more metro areas of NC. I would NEVER tell that person that I used to live in one.

But then I realized that I'm not ashamed of the way I grew up. My mom did what she had to and we had a good life, for the most part. Now once in a while when that happens, I share it with them. Their expression is priceless. :)

Anyway, all this to make my point that no one can make you feel bad... no one can offend you... you let them do it. You choose to let yourself feel bad, or be offended. People have the right to say whatever they want. If they're not allowed to say it, they're thinking it anyway! I'm not saying these things are good for people to say. What I'm saying is that you will never be able to control other people, so learn to control yourself and don't get bothered by the ignorance of others. No one can make me feel a certain way... I decide whether or not to feel that way. I just get tired of all the complaining about PC-ness... people have the right to say whatever they want.

Yediyd, I've said before and I'll say it again: You're an awesome person!

[sixpacktr]

CK,

Some people are going to be offended no matter what. I have given up. I know that AlMom and Yed were pointing out the cruelty of the word, and, as you said, it was never our intent to label them or anyone else. It is an attitude, and it used as such.

The problem is that people like to twist words or see hidden meanings that aren't there (again, not you Yed or Almom) and it gets a little tiring.

Why, it's almost as bad as being asked to define "is"

I just stumbled on that. Here was a man that was a "lazy, greedy liar" (yes pls read between the lines on that one! ) that did feel that everyone was entitled to something that someone else had paid for (except of course, for the evil rich, who were going to have to give their hard earned money to him for him to redistribute as he saw fit...).

Unfortunately for us, the terms "lazy, greedy liar" and "woman or man that milks the system by collecting food stamps when they could get off of their lazy behinds and work" (don't want to get too unPC here) have become taboo to use to describe most of those that fit it. Again, since I was never subjected to that ridicule I will admit that I didn't realize I was inflicting hurt on several that had had that term applied to them.

But as I've stated over and over again, I truly feel that those people, such as Yed and AlMom and Emma, aren't that type. They may have been unfairly labeled those terms but it WASN'T THEIR UNDERLYING ATTITUDE. And that was the basis for the terms in the first place!

From this time forward, instead of the unPC term I will use Billary...

[Guest Yediyd]

Works for me!!!!! Billery it is then!!!!

Sure hope nobody up here has been called a "billery"

Shan...I read your post and agree with it, but am not sure how that translates into me being awsome...but I'll take it anyway!!! Thanks!!!!

CK, I understand your frustration and am sorry I opened up this can of worms. I believe that you guys ment no harm in what you said.....

And Ben.....

You forgot to sign the check!!!

[shanstress70]

Shan...I read your post and agree with it, but am not sure how that translates into me being awsome...but I'll take it anyway!!! Thanks!!!!

I just think you're great and I like your attitude... that's all. Has nothing to do with this thread.

[Guest Yediyd]

<div class='quotemain'>

Shan...I read your post and agree with it, but am not sure how that translates into me being awsome...but I'll take it anyway!!! Thanks!!!!

I just think you're great and I like your attitude... that's all. Has nothing to do with this thread.

Oh?....kool!

I like you too!!!!!!

Can I borrow 20$?

LOL. Someone drove by today and stopped and said, "Hey look at that cute cat." The child next to her said, "Who'se is it?" And she said, "It has a collar on, it must be somebodies." Did I say, "That's my cat" or "That is my children's cat"? NOPE. Did not claim it one bit. Dismissed out of hand.

Dr T...

Your mother wasn't an old woman with a little yellow bird as a pet, was she?

[shanstress70]

Can I borrow 20$?

Sorry, I'm not loaded like Ben!

[StrawberryFields]

"TRAILER TRASH" DESCRIBES AN ATITTUDE OF LAZINESS, INDOLENCE, APATHY AND GET-SOMETHING-FOR-NOTHING BEHAVIOR WHEN PEOPLE ARE CAPABLE OF MUCH, MUCH MORE.

FOR THE LAST TIME, PEOPLE LIKE EMMA, YEDIYD, AND OTHERS WHO ARE ON DISABILITY SUPPORT FROM THE GOVERNMENT AREN'T TRAILER TRASH. YOU ARE HONEST-TO-GOSH DISABLED. IF YOU HAD YOUR WISH, YOU WOULD BE "ENABLED" OR BETTER, AND WOULD WANT TO WORK AND DO MUCH MORE THAN YOU CAN NOW. YOU ARE NOT WHO SIXPACK AND I ARE TALKING ABOUT!!!

METAPHORICALLY SPEAKING, WOULD Y'ALL PLEASE STOP JUMPING IN FRONT OF TRAFFIC AND COMPLAINING THAT I OR SIXPACK PUSHED YOU INTO THE ROAD!!!

"TRAILER TRASH" ISN'T ABOUT TRAILERS, OR RACE, OR GENDER, OR SOCIAL CLASS. IT'S ABOUT PERSONAL LAZINESS AND APATHY. SAY IT WITH ME NOW: "JUST BECAUSE I LIVE IN A TRAILER/PRE-FAB, I AM NOT TRAILER TRASH."

NO ONE'S JUDGING ANYONE HERE. HOLY COW, SIXPACK AND I WERE USING THE TERM TO REFER TO A LIFESTYLE AND ATTITUDE, THE KIND OF PERSON WHO WOULD ABUSE THE WELFARE SYSTEM. WE NEVER, EVER, EVER, EVER, EVER, EVER, EVER, EVER SAID ANYONE HERE WAS "TRAILER TRASH" OR SHOULD BE ASHAMED FOR COLLECTING DISABILITY (WHICH I'VE DONE AND AM NOT ASHAMED OF).

*CK takes a deep breath and glues back in place the hair he pulled out of his head in frustration*

I'M SORRY IF PEOPLE HAVE MISJUDGED YOU AND MADE YOU FEEL LIKE A LOSER DUE TO YOUR UPBRINGING, GEOGRAPHIC LOCATION, TYPE OF HOUSE OR ANYTHING ELSE, BUT I WILL NOT BE HELD RESPONSIBLE FOR THOSE ERRORS. I WON'T USE THE TERM "TRAILER TRASH" ON THIS SITE ANYMORE. INSTEAD, I WILL SAY "LAZY, GREEDY LIARS." HOPEFULLY NO ONE WHO LIVES IN A TRAILER WILL TAKE OFFENSE THAT WAY, SINCE "TRAILER TRASH" HAS BECOME A STEREOTYPE APPLICABLE NOT ONLY TO PEOPLE WHO LIVE IN TRAILERS!

I agree with this but I would also like to comment that some people are perfectly happy living with this lifestyle and just so they are not hurting anyone else why should anyone care?

My husband and I have been taking the Sunday morning shift at the hospital watching over my FIL. The route we take goes past Liberty Park in Salt Lake City, Utah. We see people there with their lawn chairs, coolers, shade awnings, and bbq's. We see shopping carts, musicians, jewelrry merchants and artists. Even before this thread was here I mentioned to my husband that there all people who enjoy so many life styles in this world. These people don't bother me, it's just a different lifestlye than I have chosen to live. After driving by I thought briefly what their life might be like. Some of these people might be homeless, some might sleep a in a different place each night. Some might work in a Factory and some might be there because they simply like the park. Each one of those people have a family and someone who loves and cares for them.

Another "group" that might surprise some are those who ride Harley Davidson's. When I was growing up there was a group of riders who lived not too far from us who were called "The Sundowners" and if I remember right they were a rough scary group. Today HD Riders are from all walks of life and many have them have a good cause which they support.

BTW, Can anyone tell me how dread locks come to be. Do they form naturally or are they created?

[TimA.]

CK and Six.

If I offended you or anyone with my comments here I am sorry for that. I did not mean to do that.

You asked if anyone read what you wrote? Yes I did and I would ask did you read what I wrote? I do very much understand the entitlement attitude you speak of. Well I cant say I understand it but I am very aware of it. I think there are reasons why people are lazy and apathetic that we cant see and understand. My point is that in my understanding of the gospel I must not shun these people. I must love them and associate with them just as I would those who appear less lazy and apathetic. Now that being said I believe it is wrong to enable further self destructive behaviour from someone. We dont buy the alcoholic a drink or give the gambler money. But what should we do when he has drank or gambled away his pay day and now cant buy food? I could say well it is time for a diet brother, but what about the wife and children that will suffer inocently? It is hard to know what is right sometimes and can be very frustrating. Then those children learn these self destructive patterns and repeat them in their life and we see the sins of the fathers visited on the children. Gees brother where is Solomon when you need him?? Christ can heal though and I must be His representative to all I meet perhaps especially those who appear to me to be lazy and apathetic.

Anyway I hope you understand what I am trying to say, I know I dont express it very well but most of all I hope you will forgive any offense I have given.

Tim

[sixpacktr]

I never took offense, from anyone's post, so I think everything along those lines is cool... :)

and you are right: you can't punish spouse/kids (more often than not wife/kids, but there are examples of the other as well) because someone can't seem to straighten their life out.

This whole thread started in the "Can't figure out who to vote for? I'll tell you" thread, where some were of the opinion (including me) that electing someone like Billary or Barack Hussein Obama would lead to disaster, partially because of the entitlement sentiment they play. Someone (probably me) mentioned welfare queens, then trailer or white "Billary" (as stated, I won't use the other word) and here we are, with two threads completely devoted to "Billaries". My point the entire time is one of attitude, not people, and also that gov't is the worst way of solving anything. Ever. Except defending the country.

In the church, I have sat with the Bishop in doing needs assessment. And if someone is married, especially with children (another great show, BTW), you don't punish the kids because of the shortcomings of parents. You have to be Christlike in your dealings with people, and give people as many chances as possible.

FWIW...

[Dr T]

Hahahaha. No maam. But she did have other birds.

[Guest Emma Hale Smith]

But as I've stated over and over again, I truly feel that those people, . . . Emma, aren't that type. They may have been unfairly labeled those terms but it WASN'T THEIR UNDERLYING ATTITUDE. And that was the basis for the terms in the first place!

Hi Six,

I would like to make a clarification here.

Please correct me if I'm wrong, but I get the sense you and CK think I am so passionate about this because you feel that I have been personally offended by someone labeling me in the manner I have accused you two of, i.e. "trailer trash," or "welfare queen."

The truth is, I have not. No one has ever called me any of the names we have been discussing. My debate with you has not been personal at all, and it bothers me a bit if either of you think that.

The reason I am so passionate about this is because when you speak of a woman as a "welfare queen" you are talking about my sister, your sister, your mother, my daughter. Additionally, you are speaking of her children, who grow up subtly aware of your condemnation her mother faces each day of her life as she walks out her front door. The daughter grows up with that, and if you think that has no effect on her, you're a blind man.

That's why you can't shake me. That's why I hang on and let you insult me as if I'm just an emotional woman and therefore I'm not worth listening to, or that my information is worthless to you. These women are too important to me, as are their sons and daughters. They should be to you as well, but ultimately, that's up to you.

Cops. I hate that show. You should talk to the producers some day. Are you aware there are just as many white-collar crime arrests per day as street crimes?

I'm not excusing the criminals. It's just sad, so sad to me. Everyone watches the stupid kids,most of whom happen to be black, do stupid things, and so the whole country thinks all criminals are black, while all the middle-aged white men are off to jail with nary a camera in their faces.

Emma

[CrimsonKairos]

Emma, just forget it. You are being too emotional about this.

Oh, the poor sisters, daughters, wives, mothers out there...being scarred for life because they've been unfairly labeled. Gimme a break.

Neither sixpack nor I go about calling people "welfare queens" or labeling people in real life. For cryin' in the freakin' mud!!! Does anyone pay attention to our posts?

A "welfare queen" is married to my cousin. He's trailer trash (remember, this refers to his attitude of laziness). They both mooch off the government. Someone won't change unless they recognize the problem. That's why you can't shake me. If it takes telling someone, "You're lazy and lying to the government and should be ashamed of yourself," then so be it.

But please, save yourself from getting a tender butt from riding the saddle so much, get off your high horse, and join the rest of us on planet earth.

[Guest Emma Hale Smith]

Emma, just forget it. You are being too emotional about this.

Oh yes. The man arguing with the woman who won't shut up, so he must play the "you are being too emotional" card. Sorry CK, doesn't work with me. And by the way, you might want to take a look at your post and see who is being "emotional.

Later edit:

A "welfare queen" is married to my cousin. He's trailer trash (remember, this refers to his attitude of laziness). They both mooch off the government. Someone won't change unless they recognize the problem. That's why you can't shake me. If it takes telling someone, "You're lazy and lying to the government and should be ashamed of yourself," then so be it.

No, a "welfare queen" is not married to your cousin. He's not "trailer trash."

A "man" is married to your cousin. They both mooch off the government.

See how easy that was?

Aaron has written you a post that explains, in different words, what I've been trying, but failing, to help you understand. Please give him a chance.

Emma

[CrimsonKairos]

No, a "welfare queen" is not married to your cousin. He's not "trailer trash."

A "man" is married to your cousin. They both mooch off the government.

Um...okay. My cousin is a dude, so if a "man" was married to my cousin he'd be gay, which he's not. This is exactly what I'm talking about. If you thought my cousin was female from what I'd written, you aren't reading my posts carefully enough.

[Guest Emma Hale Smith]

<div class='quotemain'>

No, a "welfare queen" is not married to your cousin. He's not "trailer trash."

A "man" is married to your cousin. They both mooch off the government.

Um...okay. My cousin is a dude, so if a "man" was married to my cousin he'd be gay, which he's not. This is exactly what I'm talking about. If you thought my cousin was female from what I'd written, you aren't reading my posts carefully enough.

So I got his/her gender wrong. Your accusation that I did not pay attention to your post is a strawman, because, given the way you wrote it, it was difficult to determine who "he" was." Whatever.

The point is no one is a "welfare queen," and no one is "trailer trash."

They are just a "man" and a "woman," or some variation thereof. That's all.

Emma

[BenRaines]

OK kids "time out".

Lets all play nice. This has gotten to personal attacks and needs to be stopped.

On to the next topic.

Ben Raines

[StrawberryFields]

BTW, Can anyone tell me how dread locks come to be. Do they form naturally or are they created?

So does anyone know? :)

[pam]

<div class='quotemain'>

BTW, Can anyone tell me how dread locks come to be. Do they form naturally or are they created?

So does anyone know? :)

http://www.howtodread.com/

[StrawberryFields]

wHAT A GREAT SITE THANKS pAM

[pushka]

That site was fascinating Pam. I've recently met a man who grew his dreads for 10 years before cutting them all out...after he got rid of them his head was completely bald!

Emma, CK and Sixpack...I'm sorry that your posts have degenerated into personal attacks. I can see the points of view of all of you, I must admit that I do tend to side with Emma and Ogre about the way that people, in general, use terms to mean exactly what the majority believes they mean, so even if you explain that your definition of the terms is different, some people are unlikely to take notice of that...the more the terms are used, even in fun...and I'm no saint, I've used terms in fun too, the more that stereotype is being perpetuated...even if that wasn't your intention.

I hope that the arguing can stop now...I must admit that I wasn't offended by CK or Sixpack, because I just saw the thread as a joke...but that was me not standing up to what society would have us do...trivialise insults by making them into jokes.

[CrimsonKairos]

Okay, I'm done with this topic.

For the record, I never personally attacked anyone in this forum.

[Guest Emma Hale Smith]

Okay, I'm done with this topic.

For the record, I never personally attacked anyone in this forum.

I'll follow CK, and end my participation in the thread as well

I also want to say I never felt personally attacked by anyone in the discussion, nor do I feel I personally attacked anyone else.

Thanks for a lively and hoppin' showdown. I really enjoyed it.

Emma