Should I reach out to my ex's family?

[bethejoy]

I've posted my story here before but am in a new phase, facing new difficult decisions. I am divorced (it's only been final for two weeks). It took over eight months for the true reasons behind my ex-husband's insistence on the divorce to come out. I found out through my bishop that my ex is having an emotional affair that had, at least for a time, become physical. He also has a mood disorder and has determined that God told him to divorce me and that God wants his new love interest to divorce her husband as well (both affair partners have several children at home). I could do nothing to change his mind about divorcing me, but I took everyone's great advice and used an experienced lawyer to help me retain primary custody and I was awarded a minimal amount of child support (my income is greater than his). Now that I am divorced, I am trying to begin the healing process for myself, especially trying to work through the feelings of betrayal and rejection and the hurt of some of the nasty things he did and said during the divorce process. He continues to try to control and manipulate me, but I have a great bishop and a helpful therapist, so I am learning to set boundaries between us.

So finally, on to my question. I have seen evidence of the manipulation and emotional abuse my ex is inflicting on the other woman (her husband found some emails between them and shared that with my bishop). Even though her family has tried to stage a couple of interventions to wake her up to the manipulation and control, she believes the "revelations from God" my ex is basing this whole affair on and for now at least is still pursuing a divorce from her husband, who sees her as tragically brainwashed and still wants to save the marriage. All of this seems fueled by my ex's mental illness, although in his day-to-day interactions at work and elsewhere he can play the part of a very friendly, generous and competent person. My ex's family knows he has a mood disorder, but they have believed his story that our divorce is just a result of me being very difficult to live with and emotionally abusive (wildly untrue). We have never been very close to his siblings (parents are not alive) as they are all very independent, so through this whole process I have not been in contact with any of them although one sister-in-law reached out briefly through text to say she knows how hard this must be and she hopes we can stay in touch. At this point, I am wondering if I should reach out to her and fill her in on the affair situation and the revelations he claims to have had. Her husband is a medical doctor and in a bishopric and they are a very active LDS family. My motivation would be to hopefully show them the truth behind what he's doing so they can try to help him see he needs to get professional help for the mental illness and encourage him to leave this other married woman alone. Should I reach out to my ex's family to at least try to help minimize the damage being done? My main reasons for not talking to his family before are 1) trying to make sure my own motives are pure and not fueled by vindictiveness or hurt and 2) I am concerned it could cause him to lash out more at me and further damage the co-parenting relationship I am trying to build with him. But he has been suicidal, too, and if her family succeeds in getting her to leave him, I believe it is a strong possibility he will hurt himself. I don't know what to do. This is my children's father and the repercussions of his choices and my decisions about how to respond to all of this will have lasting impact on everyone's lives.

[Jane_Doe]

Kudos for taking all the steps you have thus far.  May I suggest that talking to your therapist about your question would also be a good idea?

But if you really want the opinion of an untrained stranger of the internet: you cannot force or manipulate your ex into seeking help for his mental illness.  Neither can his siblings.  Trying to do so will only backfire.  He has been told about his illness, he lives the consequences of it daily, he makes choices to feed it, and he's the only one who can make the choice to seek help.

Another thing I saw in your post: "But he has been suicidal, too, and if her family succeeds in getting her to leave him, I believe it is a strong possibility he will hurt himself."  This is you being manipulated by him.  Yes, it may be true that he'll go suicidal, but that is his poor choice to react poorly to a situation-- you weren't his keeper as his wife and certainly not now.  If/when he and this women break up, you can alert people to be on watch then.  In the meantime, don't stop living your lives and healing based on his manipulative threat.  

[Suzie]

5 hours ago, bethejoy said:

 At this point, I am wondering if I should reach out to her and fill her in on the affair situation and the revelations he claims to have had. Her husband is a medical doctor and in a bishopric and they are a very active LDS family. My motivation would be to hopefully show them the truth behind what he's doing so they can try to help him see he needs to get professional help for the mental illness and encourage him to leave this other married woman alone. Should I reach out to my ex's family to at least try to help minimize the damage being done? My main reasons for not talking to his family before are 1) trying to make sure my own motives are pure and not fueled by vindictiveness or hurt and 2) I am concerned it could cause him to lash out more at me and further damage the co-parenting relationship I am trying to build with him. But he has been suicidal, too, and if her family succeeds in getting her to leave him, I believe it is a strong possibility he will hurt himself. I don't know what to do. This is my children's father and the repercussions of his choices and my decisions about how to respond to all of this will have lasting impact on everyone's lives.

In my humble opinion you shouldn't contact her unless you are prepared to face the consequences of that action. Your number one priority right now is taking care of yourself and your children. He is your ex-husband now and even though I completely understand and I can empathize to the fact that he is also the father of your children and you want to ensure he doesn't hurt himself, I don't believe going through the sister in-law route will help in any way but quite the contrary, make matters even worse between you two. Contact the authorities if he is suicidal.

Hope you don't take this the wrong way but your comment of "encourage him to leave this other married woman alone" speaks volumes to me. Now, I do understand where you are coming from and I can only imagine how hurt you must feel about all this but I must also point out that it seems to me that you want someone to convince him to leave the other woman alone because you still very hurt, but careful with that. This means you are now crossing a boundary that I am not sure you should be crossing since he is no longer your husband. He is your ex, and whatever choices he wants to make with a single or married woman (right or wrong choices) is not longer something you should be involved with.

You cannot and should not control his choices from now on. It takes a while to adjust to the fact that he is your ex, that's completely understandable. But please keep in mind that his relationship with you is ONLY about the children. Whatever choices he is making, has nothing to do with you. I know it must be hard to let go but sometimes holding on hurts more. I wish you and your children all the best.

[Guest]

1 hour ago, Suzie said:

 Contact the authorities if he is suicidal.

Superb advice!  If he is suicidal, he needs to get help NOW before he does something.  If he is not really suicidal, being involuntarily committed will end the manipulation real quick.

Edited March 5, 2017 by DoctorLemon

[Just_A_Guy]

I think you should preserve your relationship with your in-laws for its own sake; especially since the one sister-in-law has already reached out.  Invite them over with their families one evening when you have your kids.  

But no, I wouldn't dish out on your ex's problems unless they ask.  If you seem too eager, it will just confirm in their minds the horror stories he has been telling about you.  The best thing you can do right now is keep the lines of communication open and show them that, whatever he might be saying, you're actually the same one. 

"Bend over backwards to show you're the sane one" is the advice I've traditionally given my divorce clients.  It can be emotionally and physically (and sometimes financially) taxing; but given enough time, it always pays off in the end.  Always.

[NeuroTypical]

3 hours ago, bethejoy said:

I could do nothing to change his mind about divorcing me, but I took everyone's great advice and used an experienced lawyer to help me retain primary custody and I was awarded a minimal amount of child support

I'm very sorry you had to go through everything (and still are going through it).  But I'm very glad to hear you got a lawyer.  So often, that advice is brushed aside until it's too late, and the wife and kids end up in poverty as a result.  

 

3 hours ago, bethejoy said:

I have not been in contact with any of them although one sister-in-law reached out briefly through text to say she knows how hard this must be and she hopes we can stay in touch. At this point, I am wondering if I should reach out to her and fill her in on the affair situation and the revelations he claims to have had. 
...
My main reasons for not talking to his family before are 1) trying to make sure my own motives are pure and not fueled by vindictiveness or hurt and 2) I am concerned it could cause him to lash out more at me and further damage the co-parenting relationship I am trying to build with him. 

 

You honestly sound very aware of the impact this process is having on you.  I've met lots and lots and lots of divorced people, and one thing they tend to have in common, is to one extent or another, they have a bunch of strong negative emotions and things to say about their exes.  Some of them are good at not letting it out, some try hard and then it erupts like a volcano, some dress it up in nice friendly terms ("I probably am the most responsible for the divorce, but he [insert laundry list]".)  But I guess everyone has it.  If you do choose to stay in touch with the sister-in-law, and you guys stay friends and talk about stuff, you can probably expect at least once to have some sort of vindictiveness-fuelled thing to say.  You're human.  I think we're hard-wired to do it.  

Maybe just be aware of the possibility, maybe just share this worry with the SIL, and if you find yourself doing it, be transparent and ask forgiveness.  But yeah, I would consider preserving the relationship with SIL.  

"Thank you so much for the text.  I'd like that too, but it'll probably be a while before I can have a decent conversation without a bunch of grief and anger bursting out.  Maybe we could try lunch in a month?"   (or something like that)

 

Don't give his suicidal melodrama a second's thought or lose a second's sleep over it.  If he has you on the phone and is talking about method and timeframe, hang up and call 911, then wash your hands of it.   f he sends an email or text, don't reply and just hand them over to the police.  "Hi, I thought you folks might want to know my ex-husband sent me this.  I'm just going to give it to you, and it's up to you if you act on it or not."    Otherwise, just don't bother with it.  As you probably know, once he discovers what he can do to get you to respond, he'll do it more often.  

 

Edited March 5, 2017 by NeuroTypical

[Guest]

I can't help but to feel that everyone - the ex's family, the kids, and anyone who knows anything about the situation - knows the ex is both totally wicked and totally, completely nuts.  Having an affair with a married person is one of the scummiest, dirtiest, most unworthy things a person can do, and doubly so for an LDS priesthood holder.  If the family is not articulating this right now, it is because they are in pain and denial, but deep down everyone knows whose fault it is, and what kind of person the ex has become.  They also know the eternal consequences that this choice will bring.

With this in mind, is damage control really necessary with the ex's family?  I would say, let the ex's actions speak for themselves, because people who do these kinds of things cannot keep a facade of being a good person up for long.  Everyone can see right through them, particularly their children.  They don't have the Spirit and they don't have the blessings of the Lord, so they will act increasingly erratic.  If any doubts remain, wait until the ex's adulterous relationship with this married woman flies apart, as we all know it will...  I think taking matters into your own hands and attempting damage control with the family can backfire in a million ways, especially if the ex's family is a little crazy too.  

I agree, bend over backwards to be the sane one.  Your children need someone sane to lean on, and your ex is obviously anything but sane.  By taking the high road, you bolster your credibility.  Meanwhile, as your ex continues his downward spiral into sin and craziness, what little credibility he has will be lost.

I know a thing or two about this - my parents divorced 17 years ago under similar circumstances!  I am grateful my mom took the high road and bent over backwards to be the sane one, as it was a huge source of stability for me and my brothers during a horrible time.  As for my father, well... let's just say his actions at the time of the divorce, and pretty much ever since, have spoken for themselves.  My father walked out of the house for the last time bellowing, "I deserve to be happy!"  Twenty years later, let's just say he isn't happy in ANY way, nor does he still have his adulterous relationship, nor does he have a career, a house (but he does have a trailer!), his health, his soberness, likely his eternity, or even really a family in any meaningful sense of the word.  Wickedness never was happiness.

Edited March 5, 2017 by DoctorLemon

[bethejoy]

5 hours ago, Jane_Doe said:

you cannot force or manipulate your ex into seeking help for his mental illness.  Neither can his siblings.  Trying to do so will only backfire.  He has been told about his illness, he lives the consequences of it daily, he makes choices to feed it, and he's the only one who can make the choice to seek help.

I have no intention of encouraging manipulation or force. Sometimes, I think if someone close to him that he respects can talk to him, it might help him open his eyes. No one that is close to him knows about this affair except my bishop and a few of my close friends.

I can see how this really boils down to his agency, though, and you're probably right that I am being naive to think someone talking to him could make much of a difference at this point. My worries for the other woman being victimized in a similar fashion as I was, I guess, are misplaced. She's a grown woman making her own choices too. Thanks for your input.

[bethejoy]

5 hours ago, Suzie said:

In my humble opinion you shouldn't contact her unless you are prepared to face the consequences of that action. Your number one priority right now is taking care of yourself and your children. He is your ex-husband now and even though I completely understand and I can empathize to the fact that he is also the father of your children and you want to ensure he doesn't hurt himself, I don't believe going through the sister in-law route will help in any way but quite the contrary, make matters even worse between you two. Contact the authorities if he is suicidal.

Hope you don't take this the wrong way but your comment of "encourage him to leave this other married woman alone" speaks volumes to me. Now, I do understand where you are coming from and I can only imagine how hurt you must feel about all this but I must also point out that it seems to me that you want someone to convince him to leave the other woman alone because you still very hurt, but careful with that. This means you are now crossing a boundary that I am not sure you should be crossing since he is no longer your husband. He is your ex, and whatever choices he wants to make with a single or married woman (right or wrong choices) is not longer something you should be involved with.

You cannot and should not control his choices from now on. It takes a while to adjust to the fact that he is your ex, that's completely understandable. But please keep in mind that his relationship with you is ONLY about the children. Whatever choices he is making, has nothing to do with you. I know it must be hard to let go but sometimes holding on hurts more. I wish you and your children all the best.

Thanks for sharing your observations in a kind way. This seems very good advice. Now that we are no longer married I need to focus on my life and children and on moving on. While I honestly don't feel any anger toward her, I think your bigger point here is that this is not really any of my business any more. That's a freeing thought.

[bethejoy]

3 hours ago, Just_A_Guy said:

I think you should preserve your relationship with your in-laws for its own sake; especially since the one sister-in-law has already reached out.  Invite them over with their families one evening when you have your kids.  

But no, I wouldn't dish out on your ex's problems unless they ask.  If you seem too eager, it will just confirm in their minds the horror stories he has been telling about you.  The best thing you can do right now is keep the lines of communication open and show them that, whatever he might be saying, you're actually the same one. 

"Bend over backwards to show you're the sane one" is the advice I've traditionally given my divorce clients.  It can be emotionally and physically (and sometimes financially) taxing; but given enough time, it always pays off in the end.  Always.

This is really good advice. Thank you for commenting. You're right, in the long term this will be much better for me and the kids.

I can't invite the ex-in-laws over or anything. They live hundreds of miles away. I think I will just try to maintain friendly casual interactions. Someday they may ask, but until then it's probably a good idea to keep out of it.

[Jane_Doe]

@bethejoy, you are handling this very difficult situation with remarkable grace and humility.  You are exemplary.  

[bethejoy]

3 hours ago, NeuroTypical said:

I'm very sorry you had to go through everything (and still are going through it).  But I'm very glad to hear you got a lawyer.  So often, that advice is brushed aside until it's too late, and the wife and kids end up in poverty as a result.  

 

 

You honestly sound very aware of the impact this process is having on you.  I've met lots and lots and lots of divorced people, and one thing they tend to have in common, is to one extent or another, they have a bunch of strong negative emotions and things to say about their exes.  Some of them are good at not letting it out, some try hard and then it erupts like a volcano, some dress it up in nice friendly terms ("I probably am the most responsible for the divorce, but he [insert laundry list]".)  But I guess everyone has it.  If you do choose to stay in touch with the sister-in-law, and you guys stay friends and talk about stuff, you can probably expect at least once to have some sort of vindictiveness-fuelled thing to say.  You're human.  I think we're hard-wired to do it.  

Maybe just be aware of the possibility, maybe just share this worry with the SIL, and if you find yourself doing it, be transparent and ask forgiveness.  But yeah, I would consider preserving the relationship with SIL.  

"Thank you so much for the text.  I'd like that too, but it'll probably be a while before I can have a decent conversation without a bunch of grief and anger bursting out.  Maybe we could try lunch in a month?"   (or something like that)

 

Don't give his suicidal melodrama a second's thought or lose a second's sleep over it.  If he has you on the phone and is talking about method and timeframe, hang up and call 911, then wash your hands of it.   f he sends an email or text, don't reply and just hand them over to the police.  "Hi, I thought you folks might want to know my ex-husband sent me this.  I'm just going to give it to you, and it's up to you if you act on it or not."    Otherwise, just don't bother with it.  As you probably know, once he discovers what he can do to get you to respond, he'll do it more often.  

 

Again, these are great comments. Thanks for giving me good ideas for handling some of this. In terms of the suicidality, I have boundaries between us now. We only talk about the kids, so if he's verbalizing this threat still, it's with other people. I wouldn't know about it until after the fact. 

By the way, I think you were the first person who told me I needed to get a lawyer, Neurotypical, when I first posted at the beginning of this process. It took a few more months and five or six other people insisting I see a lawyer, including my bishop, before I finally realized the importance of it. Thank you for caring enough to start me thinking about that.

[bethejoy]

2 hours ago, DoctorLemon said:

I know a thing or two about this - my parents divorced 17 years ago under similar circumstances!  I am grateful my mom took the high road and bent over backwards to be the sane one, as it was a huge source of stability for me and my brothers during a horrible time.  As for my father, well... let's just say his actions at the time of the divorce, and pretty much ever since, have spoken for themselves.  My father walked out of the house for the last time bellowing, "I deserve to be happy!"  Twenty years later, let's just say he isn't happy in ANY way, nor does he still have his adulterous relationship, nor does he have a career, a house (but he does have a trailer!), his health, his soberness, likely his eternity, or even really a family in any meaningful sense of the word.  Wickedness never was happiness.

Thanks for sharing your personal experience with this. It helps me think about this with a longer term perspective. Especially to think of the impact my actions now will have on my kids as they grow up and witness more of the consequences of their father's choices. If he turns around or starts making better choices, that will be great for my kids. And if he keeps going down this path, that's all the more reason they need me to be peaceful and healthy.

[bethejoy]

That is so kind of you, @Jane_Doe. Right after my bishop informed me of the affair, I distinctly remember feeling strongly that I could not judge them because I didnt want to be guilty of unrighteous judgment myself. The gift of not completely falling apart through all this and having any kind of peace has come directly from God. He answers prayers and He has been teaching me every step of the way. I feel so blessed

[anatess2]

My advice:

1.  Nurture your relationship with the sister-in-law as something independent of your ex-husband.  Only talk about your ex-husband if she starts the conversation or asks the question.

2.  Let the husband of your ex's fling deal with her.  You don't have to get yourself involved in it because even if you have pure intentions, you're just not in a position to be accepted as such by everybody else.  Only get involved if they ask for your help and even then make sure that it won't negatively affect your children.

3.  What you can do for all involved is to go on your knees and pray for their salvation.  Everyday.

Hope this helps.