I Am Resigning From The Church

[Setheus]

And the winner is.....Snow! in the 3rd round!

If we could all see it, Tr is at this very moment fighting back bitter tears of anger and resentment. He is brainstorming for something whitty and (untrue?) to say to me for my insults. Come now Tr, quickly! The clock is ticking......

[Tr2]

When I call you a liar, that is because you lie. The lie you told was that Mormons don't believe the Bible. Here is the lying quote:

"It just doesn't believe in all the bible."

I know it is a lie, you know it is a lie, Naomi knows it is a lie and every single person on this board knows you are a lying liar. There is the proof, in quotation marks. Now, where is the lie you say I told? You can't find it because it is not there. So that makes you a double liar.

I will tell you a few things that mormons don't believe.

- that there is only 1 God, none before and none will come after. This comes from the book of Isaiah, yet mormons seem to think they can become gods if they are worthy enough.

- that Jesus was the only son of God. mormons seem to believe that Jesus and satan are brothers.

- that Jesus is the only way to the father. mormons seem to believe that mormonism is the only way to the father.

You know very well that mormons do not believe in the fullness of the bible. That makes you a liar. Stop lying, liar.

and even if you have a problem with Snow's posts that you have seen, I don't think that you have seen the insightful inspiritional posts that he has shared with us

I have been posting on this board longer than the vast majority of people here and i can say that the posts lindy is speaking of are very few and far between. snow says nice things when you agree with him. Dare to disagree and you will be insulted, told how wrong you are, and called a liar for saying otherwise.

And you need to know that Tr2 is not a memeber of the LDS church

That's obvious because I don't have a persecution complex. And I don't see differing opinions as "hateful".

[Snow]

Originally posted by Tr2@Jun 6 2004, 07:25 PM

And you need to know that Tr2 is not a memeber of the LDS church

That's obvious because I don't have a persecution complex. And I don't see differing opinions as "hateful".

Okay okay okay Trident.

Let's drop the insults for a second. You just inferred, and quite overtly, that a defining characteristic of a Mormon is that they have a persecution complex.

First, I don't think you understand what a "persecution complex" means.

Second, It is untrue and you are dreadly unprepared to prove it.

Third, You look cute in Jordache jeans, and NO, they definately don't make your butt look big. wink wink, nudge nudge, say no more say no more. http://www.astabgay.com/gayicons/qalex.jpg

Forth, Pelease don't threaten to hurt me again.

[Setheus]

Jesus was NOT the ONLY son of God. He was and is the ONLY BEGOTTEN son of God. There is a HUGE difference in that.

Research it.

And yes there is only one God. And none shall come before (that we worship) and none will come after (that we will worship). But as far as there being other gods (little g) there are! How else could it be if we are all His children?

What else could a child of a god be other than a "god in embryo"?

And if we are ALL His children then it only makes sense that J and S are brothers and so are you and me and snow and starsky and Rodney and LT and etc.......

And lastly, Jesus Christ is the only way to the Father. And the LDS church is the church of the first born. This is Christ's church. So yes "Mormonisim" is the way to the Father because this is His Only Begotten's Church.

How do I know this? Because I have done as the book of James has said to do. I have lacked wisdom and I have asked for the answer. I have prayed and I have been answered. I know this church is the true church. It is the perfect church, with imperfect members. <---and thats why we work to perfect the saints.

[Lindy]

that there is only 1 God, none before and none will come after. This comes from the book of Isaiah, yet mormons seem to think they can become gods if they are worthy enough.

- that Jesus was the only son of God. mormons seem to believe that Jesus and satan are brothers.

- that Jesus is the only way to the father. mormons seem to believe that mormonism is the only way to the father.

-One God as Setheus as stated....1 that we worship PERIOD! As for "other gods?"

Jesus is referred to as Lord God in the Bible is He not?

-Jesus IS the only way to salvation...to the Father...I don't get where you think that mormons believe that mormonism is the only way to the Father. I guess that maybe you are right in a sense if you want to think of it as such because we believe that Christ suffered, bled and died for our sins, that He made the way possible for us to return to our Heavenly Father....if that brands us...so be it.

Boo frickin Hoo.

-Only BEGOTTEN Son of God.....don't you read your New Testiment? It is PART OF THE BIBLE!

It is the perfect church, with imperfect members. <---and thats why we work to perfect the saints.

I really like that saying Setheus....it is so very true..... that's why I love the church INSPITE of it's members.

[Tete]

Originally posted by naomi@Jun 6 2004, 05:46 PM

...It does not work that way....

I DEFINETLY AGREE...BUT DID YOU DID SOME THING ABOUT IT? OR YOU ARE THOSE KIND OF PEOPLE WHO KEEPT EVERYTHING INTO HIS HEART AN THEN JUST LET EVERYTHIN GO OUT AND CRY TO THE OTHERS SAYING : "YOU SEE WHAT DO THEY HAVE DONE TO ME I'M GOING TO LEAVE" MOSES DID NOT RECEIVED EXACTLY WHAT HE EXPECTS FROM THE PEOPLE HE HELPED WHEN THE COMANDMENTS AND DID NOT JUST "CRY" AND LEAVE, HE WENT TO LORD AND THE LORD SHOW WHAT TO DO, SAME WITH JESUSCRIST, HE DID NOT JUST CRY WHEN HIS "FRIEND" TURNED AGAINS HIM. HE DID NOT LEAVE HIS WORK TO BE DONE, DO YOU KNOW YOURS?

DO YOU KNOW WHAT IS YOUR PORPOUSE IN THIS LIFE? BECAUSE I DON'T THINK IS JUST CRYING.

THE LDS CHURCH IS FULL OF PEOPLE NEEDED OF HELP! DID YOU KNOW WHAT WAS YOUR ASIGMENT WHILE A MEMBER? THE LORD FOUND PEACE SERVING WHEN HIS SACRIFICE HE KNEW HIS PORPOUSE AND THE MOST IMPORTANT PART WAS THAT HE DID NOT HOLD HIS HOPE ON MAN KIND BUT ON HIS FATHER HE KNEW ALL OF US GOT THE CHANCE TO FAIL.

WHAT WOULD YOU COULD DO IF YOU WERE IN HIS PLACE? CRY AND LEAVE HAVING THE KNOWLEGE THAT HE HAD? IF YOU HAVE SOME OF IT USE IT, SO YOU CAN SEE IN THE DARKNESS OF UNFRIENSHIP YOU HAD FORM AS A MEMEBER -BECAUSE YOU SAID YOU FOUND GREAT PEOPLE TO REMMEMBER- SO IS NOT LIKE NO ONE CARES ABOUT YOU. YOU ARE BEING FORMING A HOLE FROM WERE YOU ARE NOT BEING ABLE TO GET OUT. AND YOURE CRYING TO SOME ONE HELP YOU OUT BUT ONLY YOU HAVE THE KEY TO DO IT NO BODY WOULD TAKE YOU OUT, SALVATION IS PERSONAL! IS YOUR DECITION. FIGHT! TO BECOME STRONG! DO NOT BE A COWARD!

OR DO NOT MATTER WERE YOU GO YOU WOULDN'T BE ABLE TO GET OUT.

[Snow]

Originally posted by Tr2@Jun 6 2004, 07:25 PM

You know very well that mormons do not believe in the fullness of the bible. That makes you a liar. Stop lying, liar.

I am going to take pity on you Trident. Well actually no, I am just pretending, like Naomi, that you are worthy of pity because, like Naomi, I wanted to make an insult. But, I am going to show you some mercy and I, Snow, do being you are worthy of mercy.

Here is you big chance Trident, this could be the one time you ever win a debate with me. Show me one single Bible verse that I don't believe, just one... cept of course the part about the earth being flat and square - I don't believe that one; and the one about the talking donkey - I don't believe that donkey's talk, and 1 Chronicles 20:5 that says the Elhanan, not David, slew Goliath,; and the ones that say that God commanded the his people to murder the married spouses of their enemies, steal their cows, kidnap and enslave their childrenses and steal the virginses and keep them as sex slaves ---- because I don't believe those ones.

But besides those types of ones, show me one single Bible verse that I don't accept and you win. This is your supr dupr big-ol chance to beat me.... Come on daddy with the 20% pay raise and paid off mortgage.

[DisRuptive1]

Tete:

7/16ths of an inch.

That is the distance you'd have to move your pinky finger from the "a" key to the "CAPS LOCK" key in order to get people to read your post.

Naomi:

Make sure you find a bible-loving church with a prophet. Otherwise make sure it has some good reason to explain all the problems with the bible.

[Guest Starsky]

- that there is only 1 God, none before and none will come after. This comes from the book of Isaiah, yet mormons seem to think they can become gods if they are worthy enough.

- that Jesus was the only son of God. mormons seem to believe that Jesus and satan are brothers.

- that Jesus is the only way to the father. mormons seem to believe that mormonism is the only way to the father.

First of all TR...you are showing your lack of insightful knowledge.....Yes there is one God....FOR US!!!! We will not become each other's God's.....There is only one God for us...

As for Christ and God the Father....Christ was given us from our Father....sort of like being adopted....so we have One God/Christ....and One Eternal Father in Heaven/the Father of Christ and us...

Why is that so hard for you to get right?

[Tr2]

Yes there is one God....FOR US!!!! We will not become each other's God's.....There is only one God for us...

The bible mkaes no distinction. It says there is only one God, PERIOD!!! You are making things up.

Show me one single Bible verse that I don't believe, just one

"Love your enemies as yourself". You do not believe this because if you believed it then you would apply it to your life. You may acknowledge its existance and importance but if you believed it then you would do something about it. I have never ever seen you show that this is relevant to your life. Prove me wrong.

I don't get where you think that mormons believe that mormonism is the only way to the Father

Because I have talked to many mormons. If this is not true, then mormonism is irrelevant to the world.

But as far as there being other gods (little g) there are! How else could it be if we are all His children?

What else could a child of a god be other than a "god in embryo"?

You are going on your assumptions rather than what is written very plainly in scriptures. It is remarkable how you just make scriptures say what you want them to say without a shred of evidence to support such things. If it is true, then use the bible to back it up. Something as important as this surely has to be made very clear.

One of you please look up the greek word for begotten. Tell me what it says. #3439.

If your church is so true, then prove it. Naomi is somebody that tried to believe what you believe and saw right through it (like so many others). Any church that is so true and so good, there should be some kind of irrefutable evidence. If you have some kind of tugging at the heart strings testimony then I ask you to look at people like Naomi who have opened their heart up and received nothing worthwhile to hold onto. Some of you sound like salesmen who are losing your commissions. It is pathetic. You lack any proof beyond your opinions of how great your church is.

[Lindy]

If your church is so true, then prove it. Naomi is somebody that tried to believe what you believe and saw right through it (like so many others). Any church that is so true and so good, there should be some kind of irrefutable evidence. If you have some kind of tugging at the heart strings testimony then I ask you to look at people like Naomi who have opened their heart up and received nothing worthwhile to hold onto. Some of you sound like salesmen who are losing your commissions. It is pathetic. You lack any proof beyond your opinions of how great your church is.

Prove that our church is true? To a non believer? I'm not that talented....I'll let someone else take a shot at it. It reminds me of someone asking to prove that God exists....somethings you have to take on faith and the knowledge that you have received thru studies. But in order to accept that which you cannot see, or touch yourself...a lot rides on faith. And to be termed as a salesman losing commission? I think that those who defend what they believe, do so without a thought of losing any "commission" as you put it. It doesn't hurt our salvation to hear someone leaving the church... and lacking any proof beyond our opinions? I don't need any proof.......I have faith beyond reason.

[Nicodemus]

Good points. :) Your opinion is much appreciated to me lindy.

[Tr2]

And to be termed as a salesman losing commission?

I wasn't talking about you. I am talking about the people using various tactics to try and scare/convince Naomi back into your church.

Prove that our church is true? To a non believer? I'm not that talented

That's because the only "proof" that the LDS church is the true church of God is nothing more than the opinion of its members. I have heard numerous testimonies of mormons that are nothing more than their opinion that the church is true. I have opinions too, but that doesn't necessarily mean they are true just because I want to believe them. Whenever I give my opinion, people expect some type of evidence to back it up. If i have no evidence, I am not taken seriously.

[shanstress70]

Originally posted by lindy9556@Jun 6 2004, 10:28 PM

-Jesus IS the only way to salvation...to the Father...I don't get where you think that mormons believe that mormonism is the only way to the Father. I guess that maybe you are right in a sense if you want to think of it as such because we believe that Christ suffered, bled and died for our sins, that He made the way possible for us to return to our Heavenly Father....if that brands us...so be it.

Boo frickin Hoo.

This is untrue. Jesus is not the only way to salvation in your church. You cannot go to the celestial kingdom if you don't believe that Joseph Smith was a prophet.

You guys (non-LDS) shouldn't even bother debating here. They will all defend each other, no matter what each one says, and tell you how you are being so mean and wrong... when all the while, they are defending someone who is being mean as

Setheus, you speak of Snow 'winning' this round, but he is only a winner to you LDS folks. Some things he said made me cringe.

[Setheus]

"Some things he said made me cringe"...

Well ma cherie, sometimes the truth hurts. What can I say?

[shanstress70]

Originally posted by Setheus@Jun 7 2004, 12:13 PM

Well ma cherie, sometimes the truth hurts. What can I say?

Yes, I agree. The truth does hurt...

Jesus said, "I am the Way, the Truth, the Life. No man comes to the Father except through me".

Personal insults and sarcasm aren't the truth.

[Setheus]

I believe that He is the way the truth and the light. So what made you cringe?

And since the LDS church is "His church" wouldnt that stand to make its why His way and thus "the way"?

Elementry my dear watson. E l e mentry.

[shanstress70]

Originally posted by Setheus@Jun 7 2004, 12:39 PM

I believe that He is the way the truth and the light.   So what made you cringe?

And since the LDS church is "His church" wouldnt that stand to make its why His way and thus "the way"? 

Elementry my dear watson.  E l e mentry.

The thing that made me cringe was the rude nature of Snow's posts to TR2 and Naomi. No one specific example - just in general. I found them to be very insulting, but I'm sure no one here will agree with me, except for maybe those two. I have said things that paled in comparison on this board, and was hounded about it for days. When Snow says it, it's cool to all of you. But I can somewhat understand this, I guess. I'm playing on your turf.

And as for the scripture I posted... yes, it is elementary the way I see it, but not the way you see it. In my opinion, it means that it is not necessary to believe that JS was a prophet in order to have the full glory of heaven. According to your church, you CANNOT do this. You must come to the Father through JS.

Edited to change 'Setheus' to 'TR2'.

[Setheus]

Hmmm. Well, I do believe in JS as a prophet. HOWEVER only in the same way that I believe that Elijah or Abraham was a prophet. In the grand scheme of things you do and you don't have to believe that they were prophets.

No I take that back. I don't think you must believe that someone was a prophet. Only the teachings from God through them is what you MUST believe and act upon and yes "Through Christ" to get to heaven.

Am I making sence or does this only compute to my mind?

:)

[shanstress70]

Originally posted by Setheus@Jun 7 2004, 01:55 PM

In the grand scheme of things you do and you don't have to believe that they were prophets.

No I take that back.  I don't think you must believe that someone was a prophet.  Only the teachings from God through them is what you MUST believe and act upon and yes "Through Christ" to get to heaven.

Am I making sence or does this only compute to my mind?

Wrong. To be baptized you have to pass an interview and one of the questions is, "Do you believe Joseph Smith was/is a prophet of God?" If you answer no, you cannot get baptized. Hmmmm..... Seems like you guys have more than one gatekeeper, doesn't it? I question whether you really know what your church teaches, Setheus.

Sorry, but I guess it DOES only compute to your mind - and 90% of the others on this board, who will take up for what you say even if it's untrue.

Hi everyone Sorry My PC has been down...

Snow I think we can lay low on the sarcasm it was a bit much, However Shanstress someof your post were as well. If anyone has any personal complaints please make it to the person in a pm. Some people here agree with the lds gospel and some may not, but it doesnt mean we cannot have an adult conversation...

Laureltree

[Setheus]

Well my dear sweet. During my interview I was asked if I believe if JS was a prophet and I said "Does it matter? I believe what he taught because I have prayed and recieved the answer from the holy ghost."

I was not turned away obviously.

What do you have to say now?

[shanstress70]

If you believe what Joe taught, you believe he was a prophet. That's why they didn't turn you away. How can you believe what he said if you don't believe he's a prophet?

I'm willing to bet that if you tell your bishop that you don't believe JS was a prophet, he will revoke your temple recommend (or not give you one - whichever the case).

Any of you want to chime in? Or do you all believe that you can be baptized and go to the temple if you don't believe he was a prophet? I'm not pretending to know everything, but I am 99% sure I'm right about this. If not, I will gracefully apologize.

[Jason]

Well.......looks like I've been missing out on the mud-slinging....

[Guest Starsky]

Originally posted by shanstress70+Jun 7 2004, 09:44 AM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (shanstress70 @ Jun 7 2004, 09:44 AM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'> <!--QuoteBegin--lindy9556@Jun 6 2004, 10:28 PM

-Jesus IS the only way to salvation...to the Father...I don't get where you think that mormons believe that mormonism is the only way to the Father. I guess that maybe you are right in a sense if you want to think of it as such because we believe that Christ suffered, bled and died for our sins, that He made the way possible for us to return to our Heavenly Father....if that brands us...so be it.

Boo frickin Hoo.

This is untrue. Jesus is not the only way to salvation in your church. You cannot go to the celestial kingdom if you don't believe that Joseph Smith was a prophet.

You guys (non-LDS) shouldn't even bother debating here. They will all defend each other, no matter what each one says, and tell you how you are being so mean and wrong... when all the while, they are defending someone who is being mean as he**.

Setheus, you speak of Snow 'winning' this round, but he is only a winner to you LDS folks. Some things he said made me cringe.

And defending each other is wrong? How hateful is that? Or are you not considered mean when you are mean.? All the rules for others...but none for you?

[Guest Starsky]

Originally posted by shanstress70+Jun 7 2004, 10:24 AM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (shanstress70 @ Jun 7 2004, 10:24 AM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'> <!--QuoteBegin--Setheus@Jun 7 2004, 12:13 PM

Well ma cherie,  sometimes the truth hurts.  What can I say?

Yes, I agree. The truth does hurt...

Jesus said, "I am the Way, the Truth, the Life. No man comes to the Father except through me".

Personal insults and sarcasm aren't the truth.

Then why do you use them so much?