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Everything posted by mikbone
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Should the Old Testament be treated like the Apocrapha?
mikbone replied to Survivorman's topic in LDS Gospel Discussion
Actually the first part talks about Jehovah following in the path of his Father. Then it states that we must follow the same path. Palms 82:6 teaches that we are gods. D&C 132:29 teaches that Abraham has already entered into his exaltation and sits upon his throne. So there appears to be multiple levels of godhood. Do you believe the first portion of the Lorenzo Snow couplet? As man is God once was? And if so how do you interpret it? -
Should the Old Testament be treated like the Apocrapha?
mikbone replied to Survivorman's topic in LDS Gospel Discussion
Moses 4: 1-2 is a curious interchange. Lucifer wants to be the 'savior' without the personal struggle but still receive the honor. Jehovah volunteers to become the Savior and I believe that He had an idea what this calling entailed. Notice how Jehovah offers to give all the honor that is obtained via this position back to Father. But here is the thing, Jehovah is not a vector that simply transfers Glory to the Father. Jehovah has earned honor and glory. And He has it in spades. What would have happened if Jesus would have backed out? Would we still honor him the same? -
Should the Old Testament be treated like the Apocrapha?
mikbone replied to Survivorman's topic in LDS Gospel Discussion
I will honor your position. Yet I cannot recant mine. I salute you. -
Should the Old Testament be treated like the Apocrapha?
mikbone replied to Survivorman's topic in LDS Gospel Discussion
The website is a legit site. It is very well documented. And is the simplest manner to view Joseph Smiths Sermons. It is of note that these recording were done by separate people on lectures separated by almost a year. Do you think the Holy Ghost will be an un-embodied spirit eternally? D&C 93:33-34 -
Should the Old Testament be treated like the Apocrapha?
mikbone replied to Survivorman's topic in LDS Gospel Discussion
D&C 122 7 And if thou shouldst be cast into the pit, or into the hands of murderers, and the sentence of death passed upon thee; if thou be cast into the deep; if the billowing surge conspire against thee; if fierce winds become thine enemy; if the heavens gather blackness, and all the elements combine to hedge up the way; and above all, if the very jaws of hell shall gape open the mouth wide after thee, know thou, my son, that all these things shall give thee experience, and shall be for thy good. 8 The Son of Man hath descended below them all. Art thou greater than he? You can hit the option from the LDS.org website to remove footnotes. Took me a while to figure this out. The above council that the Savior gave to Joseph Smith is significant for a few reasons. 1) The Savior explains that these painful experiences will give Joseph experience and be for his Good. 2) The Savior refers to his own atonement in explaining to Joseph that He understands the difficulties that Joseph was experiencing. 3) To me Christ is explaining that He personally gained experience from the Atonement. Prior to the atonement Christ could not have made this statement. -
Should the Old Testament be treated like the Apocrapha?
mikbone replied to Survivorman's topic in LDS Gospel Discussion
We have imagined that God was God from all eternity. These are incomprehensible ideas to some, but they are simple and first principles of the gospel, to know for a certainty the character of God, that we may converse with him as one man with another, and that God himself; the Father of us all dwelt on an earth the same as Jesus Christ himself did, and I will show it from the Bible. I wish I had the trump of a arch angel, I could tell the story in such a manner that persecution would cease forever; what did Jesus say? (mark it elder Rigdon; ) Jesus said, as the Father hat power in himself, even so hath the Son power; to do what? why what the Father did, that answer is obvious; in a manner to lay down his body and take it up again. Jesus what are you going to do? To lay down my life, as my Father did, and take it up again.---- If you do not believe it, you do not believe the Bible; the scriptures say it, and I defy all the learning and wisdom, all the combined powers of earth and hell together, to refute it. Here then is eternal life, to know the only wise and true God. April 7, 1844 - "The King Follett Discourse", Joseph Smith Jr. as recorded in the Times and Seasons Minutes The argument here made by the Prophet is very much strengthened by the following passage: "The Son can do nothing of himself, but what he seeth the Father do; for what things soever he [the Father] doeth, these also doeth the Son likewise." (St. John 5:19) - Note by Elder B. H. Roberts, Teachings of the prophet Joseph Smith, p.346 See Also John 10: 17-18 I saw my Father work out his kingdom with fear and trembling, and I must do the same; and when I get my kingdom I shall present it to my Father, so that he obtains kingdom upon kingdom, and it will exalt his glory, so that Jesus treads in his tracks to inherit what God did before; it is plain beyond disputation, and you thus learn some of the first principles of the gospel, about which so much hath been said. When you climb a ladder, you must begin at the bottom and go on until you learn the last principle; it will be a great while before you have learned the last. It is not all to be comprehended in this world; it is a great thing to learn salvation beyond the grave. I suppose I am not allowed to go into an investigation of any thing that is not contained in the Bible, and I think there are so many wise men here, who would put me to death for treason; so I shall turn commentator to-day. April 7, 1844 - "King Follett Discourse", Joseph Smith Jr. as recorded in Times and Seasons Minutes -
Should the Old Testament be treated like the Apocrapha?
mikbone replied to Survivorman's topic in LDS Gospel Discussion
Would you at least concede that Christ now has a greater investment in your success? -
Should the Old Testament be treated like the Apocrapha?
mikbone replied to Survivorman's topic in LDS Gospel Discussion
Is the Holy Ghost as perfect as the Father? Sermon delivered at Nauvoo temple grounds on Sunday August 27, 1843 Franklin D. Richards "Scriptural Items" Holy Ghost in Probationary State Joseph also said that the Holy Ghost is now in a state of Probation which if he should perform in righteousness he may pass through the same or a similar course of things that the Son has. Joseph Smith, June 16 1844, as recorded in the George Laub Journal But the holy ghost is yet a Spiritual body and waiting to take to himself a body. as the Savior did or as god did or the gods before them took bodies for the Saviour Says the work that my father did do i also & those are the works he took himself a body & then laid down his life that he might take it up again. Revelations 3:21 -
Should the Old Testament be treated like the Apocrapha?
mikbone replied to Survivorman's topic in LDS Gospel Discussion
D&C 122:7-8 Lorenzo Snow's Couplet John 5:19 Joseph Smith's multiple sermons in 1844 The temple narrative -
Should the Old Testament be treated like the Apocrapha?
mikbone replied to Survivorman's topic in LDS Gospel Discussion
I do not wish to get into a contentious argument with you. I respect your beliefs. I agree with you that Jehovah (pre-mortal Christ) was full of mercy, truth, and knowledge. Yet his atonement changed him in a way that we may never understand. His love for us increased significantly. The act in the Garden of Gethsemane and upon the cross likely not only left physical scars upon his body but also significant spiritual changes. I know that these doctrines are not commonly discussed, nor easily found within scripture. But Joseph Smith in my mind believes as much. He loves you more than you can know. -
Should the Old Testament be treated like the Apocrapha?
mikbone replied to Survivorman's topic in LDS Gospel Discussion
I respectfully disagree. When talking about God, one has to differentiate between God the Father, Jehovah / Jesus Christ, and the Holy Ghost. Jehovah did learn and grow during his mortal ministry. The atonement changed him. If you are arguing that Elohim is Perfect and un-changeable I could agree with you. -
Patriarchal blessings, Fordination, Children 1 Cor 10:13 1 Ne 3:7 All of the above convince me that God has singular intention in all of our lives.
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I have hated peeps till this year. We made Peep S'mores and they were Amazing. I mean who doesn't like roasted marshmallows? And with a caramelized candied rind... With Chocolate!?!
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Anyone else have difficulties watching conference at their Stake Center? We sang hymns for 30-40 minutes, then watched the rest of the steaming content with multiple interruptions. I'm wondering if this is a common occurrence or if we just need a new computer / AV guy.
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Should the Old Testament be treated like the Apocrapha?
mikbone replied to Survivorman's topic in LDS Gospel Discussion
God in the OT is Jehovah (pre-mortal, unembodied spirit) God in the NT is the Mortal Jesus Christ (mostly, in the Gospels) God in the BoM & D&C are written from the viewpoint of a Resurrected perfect Jesus Chist. (Nephi writes as if He realizes that the success of Jesus's life/atonement is foreordained.) It is a vast difference in the perspective in the mind of God. Mortal life and the Atonement had a significant effect upon the personality of our Savior. -
How many times have you been in church and a teacher ask for a volunteer for an opening or closing prayer and experienced an uncomfortable silence. Happens all the time for me. Have any groups complained that the spouses of general authorities are not allowed to sit on the stand with them at general conference?
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They won? They probably need to go re-read the rules of the game. If 'they' don't change their game plan they are probably gonna lose big.
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The Church is still true. Boyd K. Packer sets the tone for conference. Sister Elaine Dalton gave a wonderful talk. Very nicely on point. M Russell Ballard was succinct It appears that the line up was inspired.
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Official Declaration 2 He has heard our prayers, and by revelation has confirmed that the long-promised day has come when every faithful, worthy man in the Church may receive the holy priesthood, with power to exercise its divine authority, and enjoy with his loved ones every blessing that flows therefrom, including the blessings of the temple. Accordingly, all worthy male members of the Church may be ordained to the priesthood without regard for race or color.
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Article appearing in Times and Seasons 3 (1 April 1842):743 See 1 Corinthians 14:34-35
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What would happen if women got the priesthood? Elders quorum lessons would probably be a bit better prepared. We would probably have to sing more than one verse of each song though... Or, Maybe we could go to a 2 hour meeting block! We could also get rid of YW/YM. Go ahead and revoke The Family: a proclamation to the world. Heck, Elders and Sisters could be mission companions. This is gonna be great for the church!!!!
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D&C 109:77 O Lord God Almighty, hear us in these our petitions, and answer us from heaven, thy holy habitation, where thou sittest enthroned, with glory, honor, power, majesty, might, dominion, truth, justice, judgment, mercy, and an infinity of fulness, from everlasting to everlasting.
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Think of what goes hand in hand with pornography. LMJH - I would trust your feelings. You could confront him about the issue directly and demand that you put some kind of network nanny on the computer and have him give up his smart phone. He will most likely refuse. You can argue that since He started his habit at such an early age that you are concerned about your children following in his footsteps. Check out: Internet filtering (Family Safety) - LDSTech) Or you could live with his dirty habit. Or you could seek local council. I think you should talk to your Bishop.
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It could have been Elohim, but I doubt it. Ever since the fall the Father has manifested himself rarely. And the only thing He does is present the Son. 1) Baptism of Christ - This is my beloved Son, in whom I am well pleased. Matthew 3:17 2) Mount of transfiguration - This is my beloved Son, in whom I am well pleased; hear ye him. Matthew 17:5 3) Visitation of the Nephites - Behold my Beloved Son, in whom I am well pleased, in whom I have glorified my name—hear ye him 3 Ne 11:7 4) First Vision - This is My Beloved Son. Hear Him! JSH 1:17 In all other visitations where it appears that the Father is speaking directly to a prophet, I kinda think that it is Jehovah speaking as if He is the Father. I can see no reason why anyone would need to have a direct discussion with the Father when Jehovah is available. I also feel that Jehovah wanted to give a blessing of comfort to Adam for his job well done despite the hardships that he had to overcome. I also think that Adam / Michael was the Angel that comforted Jesus Christ in the garden of gethsemane during the atonement. These two men, Jehovah and Adam have a special relationship in my opinion. I agree that this event in D&C 107 is after the order of the temple. Instructions delivered sometime in July 1839 by Joseph Smith Jr. Source: Willard Richards Pocket Companion (probably copied in part from notes of John Taylor) It makes sense to me that Jehovah gave the keys to Adam and his posterity and that these keys will again be gathered and returned to Jesus Christ.
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hehe, courageous.