Windseeker

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  1. Like
    Windseeker got a reaction from Irishcolleen in Stuck in between a rock and a hard place.   
    I'm sorry for what you are going thru, that has to be hard. I myself have been thru divorce. 
     
    IMHO I just don't feel that someone leaving the Church justifies divorce. I read an article but forgot the name of a very outspoken women who left the Church and spent years writing anti-mormon literature. She recently returned. Her husband thru those any years remained faithful to her and to the Church.
     
    It can be done. I read a book about helping Children develop resilience and one of the things that brought me comfort was when the author mentioned that studies show as long as there is one positive, good influence in their lives that they will turn out ok. In other words, your spouse may not be on the same page...as long as one of you is on the right page it will be ok.
     
    Because of your wife’s choices your children may have the option earlier to leave their faith. I say earlier, because eventually everyone grows up and makes their own choices. I think your influence will be stronger under one roof then it would be split. And perhaps just seeing them on the weekends.
     
    I don't mean to be offensive but your wife’s demonstrated ignorance when she calls you a hypocrite for not being perfect is only matched by your ignorance that you can't have the church in your life and be married to someone that's not a member.
     
     
    It certainly does not speak well of our faith and its values regarding the family if we abandon each other when we slip and fall. Our faith should be stronger than that.
     
    If I were you and wanted an Eternal Family, I would tell your wife it's ok for her to leave the Church. Assure her that you are committed to her. I'd would discuss with her that it's important to you that your kids attend church and ask for her support in establishing rules and come up with a timeline. I would think 18 is old enough for kids to make up their own minds about attending Church. Up till then if you are supporting them under your roof, the Children need to attend. It's not going to be easy..a house divided and all...but I wouldn't entertain divorce
  2. Like
    Windseeker reacted to classylady in Stuck in between a rock and a hard place.   
    Keep in mind that if you do divorce your wife, she could be the parent that receives physical custody of the children the majority of the time.  You would even have less influence on your children if you perhaps only have the children every other weekend. Divorce would not end the influence she has on the children.  All it does is open a door to a different set of problems.
     
    When my husband was going through problems in his first marriage (his ex wife was excommunicated for infidelity), he sought the advice of a marriage therapist. The therapist told him he could either let-go of the reins or tighten them.  My husband chose to tighten the reins, and his ex rebelled even further.  IMO, force and coercion are not the Christlike way to tackle problems. I sometimes wonder if my husband had not chosen to demand that his ex change her behavior, if she would have a better feeling towards the church today. Demands, coercion, or force, leave most people with a sour feeling. And, if your wife looks to you as the Priesthood in the home, that feeling could be extended to other leaders of the church, whereas, charity and love leave a person with warm, good feelings.  Christ loved those whom he taught and served.
  3. Like
    Windseeker reacted to Silhouette in Stuck in between a rock and a hard place.   
    You are very welcome. To the OP I only have this to offer:'Twas battered and scarred, and the auctioneer thought it scarcely worth his while
    To waste his time on the old violin, but he held it up with a smile.
    "What am I bid, good friends," he cried, "Who'll start the bidding for me?
    One dollar! Only one? And who'll make it two? Two dollars once, and three...
    Three dollars once, and three dollars twice, and going and going..." But no.
    From the back of the room, a gray haired man
    came up and picked up the bow.
    And wiping the dust from the old violin, and tightening the loose strings
    He played a melody pure and sweet as
    caroling angels sing.
    The music ceased, and the auctioneer, in a voice
    that was quiet and low,
    said "What am I bid for the old violin,"
    As he held it up with the bow.
    "One thousand dollars! And who"ll make it two?
    Two thousand, and three!
    Three thousand once, and three thousand twice,
    and going, and going, and gone!" said he.
    The people cheered, but some of them cried, "We don't quite understand...what changed its worth?"
    Swift came the reply, "'Twas the touch of the master's hand."
    And many a man, with life out of tune, and battered and scarred with sin
    Is auctioned cheap to the thoughtless crowd,
    much like this old violin.
    A mess of pottage, a glass of wine, a game, and he travels on.
    He's going once, and going twice, and going and almost gone.
    But the Master comes, and the thoughtless crowd
    never can quite understand
    the worth of a soul, and the change that is wrought by the touch of the Master's hand.
    Your wife is a daughter of God and a sister of Christ, no matter what she says or does. It is my prayer for you that you will seek Their help in this matter, and that the touch of the Master's hand may be made manifest in both your lives.
  4. Like
    Windseeker got a reaction from Finrock in Stuck in between a rock and a hard place.   
    At some point you have to make a decision. You certainly have a toxic environment at home. But from what you have written I think you equally share the responsibility. Do you think your wife feels loved right now? Do you think she feels heard or listened too? 
     
    Threatening divorce is not going to fix things for you or your family. That really needs to stop right now. It's coercion and using it in your home is against the oath and covenant of the Priesthood that you hold. 
     
    I know your frustrated and desperate but you can't resort to threats. 
     
     
    In my opinion...coercion is always unrighteous because it's the opposite of Charity. 
     
     
    I don't see considering divorce an option unless one of the 3 A's (Abuse, Addiction, Adultery) become prevalent.. 
     
    ...the things that led to my divorce were #1 Not paying tithing, #2 Pornography (a slow caustic once a month addiction) 3# Verbal abuse  #4 Not loving my wife, not listening to her (love=listen) and ignoring her needs (time together).
     
    Long story short, she left me and our four kids even though I forgave her after her multiple affairs. Then she moved in with some men. It was at that point that I decided it would be best if we divorced.
     
    Have you heard of the Love Bucket analogy? I think if you could see your wife's it might just be handle with a rusted out ring. I think that's what happened to my wife. I changed, I forgave, I begged and pleaded for the sake of our kids, but she literally told me "I can't stop". She had completely lost her ability to control herself and her decisions. Years later, She has so much regret now, she struggles with alcohol. 
     I'm remarried (temple) and moved across the country. It's been hard, my youngest daughter attempted suicide a couple months ago, she moved in with her Mom. It was hard letting her go, but she was angry and blamed me for everything. Before the summer was over she called me in tears wanting to move back home. She felt bad how she treated me and wanted to mend things. She changed after living with her mom, it's been a blessing having her back...she is so much happier lately and just awesome to be around.  
     
    This second marriage has been hard, easily twice as hard as my first, but things are getting much, much better. I've learned somethings. I'm not perfect but I've changed allot. I wanted to end my life because everything I thought mattered I failed at.
     
    So I pulled a jiujitsu    move on myself and did end my life, figuratively.
     
    I'm still not satisfied with who I am, I still fall way short. But some things have become clear to me. "if ye have not charity, ye are nothing"...how powerful is that? Our first calling is to Love and our second is to Forgive. Remember? "..On these two commandments hang all the law and the prophets." ..in other words...are you putting the law and the prophets above the thing they are hanging on? 
     
    I'm telling you all this because I've been in your shoes. I'm telling you, you have to work on your marriage. If your ready to change then you can start by forgiving your wife, and asking her forgiveness. You've got to get back to what really matters. You can only change yourself. You can't change her. There are simply no guarantees in life. Your spouse is walking a dangerous path for sure, you should be concerned and you're in a very difficult position. 
     
    The best thing you can do...really the only thing you can do is start living the Gospel..not perfect family prayer, family home evenings, 100% home teaching...and all that fun stuff...
     
    no...
     
    Go back and work on the real stuff, the stuff you learn in primary. Stuff like "As I have loved you, Love one another", and "I want to be kind to everyone" and "Do as I'm doing..follow follow me"
     
    ...remember without this stuff...we are nothing.
     
    "Once there was a Snowman... j/k 
     
    I live in the highest baptizing Stake in the U.S. 3 years running, our Stake President said the Mission Field starts in our homes...if your wife does not experience the fruits of the gospel in her own home and marriage then what's the point of all this? When we returned home from our missions and got married, we jumped right back into the "mission field".  In any mission field we can't force anyone, just love them and hope they make the right decisions. 
     
    ...sorry for the length...dang! 
  5. Like
    Windseeker got a reaction from Crypto in Stuck in between a rock and a hard place.   
    At some point you have to make a decision. You certainly have a toxic environment at home. But from what you have written I think you equally share the responsibility. Do you think your wife feels loved right now? Do you think she feels heard or listened too? 
     
    Threatening divorce is not going to fix things for you or your family. That really needs to stop right now. It's coercion and using it in your home is against the oath and covenant of the Priesthood that you hold. 
     
    I know your frustrated and desperate but you can't resort to threats. 
     
     
    In my opinion...coercion is always unrighteous because it's the opposite of Charity. 
     
     
    I don't see considering divorce an option unless one of the 3 A's (Abuse, Addiction, Adultery) become prevalent.. 
     
    ...the things that led to my divorce were #1 Not paying tithing, #2 Pornography (a slow caustic once a month addiction) 3# Verbal abuse  #4 Not loving my wife, not listening to her (love=listen) and ignoring her needs (time together).
     
    Long story short, she left me and our four kids even though I forgave her after her multiple affairs. Then she moved in with some men. It was at that point that I decided it would be best if we divorced.
     
    Have you heard of the Love Bucket analogy? I think if you could see your wife's it might just be handle with a rusted out ring. I think that's what happened to my wife. I changed, I forgave, I begged and pleaded for the sake of our kids, but she literally told me "I can't stop". She had completely lost her ability to control herself and her decisions. Years later, She has so much regret now, she struggles with alcohol. 
     I'm remarried (temple) and moved across the country. It's been hard, my youngest daughter attempted suicide a couple months ago, she moved in with her Mom. It was hard letting her go, but she was angry and blamed me for everything. Before the summer was over she called me in tears wanting to move back home. She felt bad how she treated me and wanted to mend things. She changed after living with her mom, it's been a blessing having her back...she is so much happier lately and just awesome to be around.  
     
    This second marriage has been hard, easily twice as hard as my first, but things are getting much, much better. I've learned somethings. I'm not perfect but I've changed allot. I wanted to end my life because everything I thought mattered I failed at.
     
    So I pulled a jiujitsu    move on myself and did end my life, figuratively.
     
    I'm still not satisfied with who I am, I still fall way short. But some things have become clear to me. "if ye have not charity, ye are nothing"...how powerful is that? Our first calling is to Love and our second is to Forgive. Remember? "..On these two commandments hang all the law and the prophets." ..in other words...are you putting the law and the prophets above the thing they are hanging on? 
     
    I'm telling you all this because I've been in your shoes. I'm telling you, you have to work on your marriage. If your ready to change then you can start by forgiving your wife, and asking her forgiveness. You've got to get back to what really matters. You can only change yourself. You can't change her. There are simply no guarantees in life. Your spouse is walking a dangerous path for sure, you should be concerned and you're in a very difficult position. 
     
    The best thing you can do...really the only thing you can do is start living the Gospel..not perfect family prayer, family home evenings, 100% home teaching...and all that fun stuff...
     
    no...
     
    Go back and work on the real stuff, the stuff you learn in primary. Stuff like "As I have loved you, Love one another", and "I want to be kind to everyone" and "Do as I'm doing..follow follow me"
     
    ...remember without this stuff...we are nothing.
     
    "Once there was a Snowman... j/k 
     
    I live in the highest baptizing Stake in the U.S. 3 years running, our Stake President said the Mission Field starts in our homes...if your wife does not experience the fruits of the gospel in her own home and marriage then what's the point of all this? When we returned home from our missions and got married, we jumped right back into the "mission field".  In any mission field we can't force anyone, just love them and hope they make the right decisions. 
     
    ...sorry for the length...dang! 
  6. Like
    Windseeker got a reaction from classylady in Stuck in between a rock and a hard place.   
    At some point you have to make a decision. You certainly have a toxic environment at home. But from what you have written I think you equally share the responsibility. Do you think your wife feels loved right now? Do you think she feels heard or listened too? 
     
    Threatening divorce is not going to fix things for you or your family. That really needs to stop right now. It's coercion and using it in your home is against the oath and covenant of the Priesthood that you hold. 
     
    I know your frustrated and desperate but you can't resort to threats. 
     
     
    In my opinion...coercion is always unrighteous because it's the opposite of Charity. 
     
     
    I don't see considering divorce an option unless one of the 3 A's (Abuse, Addiction, Adultery) become prevalent.. 
     
    ...the things that led to my divorce were #1 Not paying tithing, #2 Pornography (a slow caustic once a month addiction) 3# Verbal abuse  #4 Not loving my wife, not listening to her (love=listen) and ignoring her needs (time together).
     
    Long story short, she left me and our four kids even though I forgave her after her multiple affairs. Then she moved in with some men. It was at that point that I decided it would be best if we divorced.
     
    Have you heard of the Love Bucket analogy? I think if you could see your wife's it might just be handle with a rusted out ring. I think that's what happened to my wife. I changed, I forgave, I begged and pleaded for the sake of our kids, but she literally told me "I can't stop". She had completely lost her ability to control herself and her decisions. Years later, She has so much regret now, she struggles with alcohol. 
     I'm remarried (temple) and moved across the country. It's been hard, my youngest daughter attempted suicide a couple months ago, she moved in with her Mom. It was hard letting her go, but she was angry and blamed me for everything. Before the summer was over she called me in tears wanting to move back home. She felt bad how she treated me and wanted to mend things. She changed after living with her mom, it's been a blessing having her back...she is so much happier lately and just awesome to be around.  
     
    This second marriage has been hard, easily twice as hard as my first, but things are getting much, much better. I've learned somethings. I'm not perfect but I've changed allot. I wanted to end my life because everything I thought mattered I failed at.
     
    So I pulled a jiujitsu    move on myself and did end my life, figuratively.
     
    I'm still not satisfied with who I am, I still fall way short. But some things have become clear to me. "if ye have not charity, ye are nothing"...how powerful is that? Our first calling is to Love and our second is to Forgive. Remember? "..On these two commandments hang all the law and the prophets." ..in other words...are you putting the law and the prophets above the thing they are hanging on? 
     
    I'm telling you all this because I've been in your shoes. I'm telling you, you have to work on your marriage. If your ready to change then you can start by forgiving your wife, and asking her forgiveness. You've got to get back to what really matters. You can only change yourself. You can't change her. There are simply no guarantees in life. Your spouse is walking a dangerous path for sure, you should be concerned and you're in a very difficult position. 
     
    The best thing you can do...really the only thing you can do is start living the Gospel..not perfect family prayer, family home evenings, 100% home teaching...and all that fun stuff...
     
    no...
     
    Go back and work on the real stuff, the stuff you learn in primary. Stuff like "As I have loved you, Love one another", and "I want to be kind to everyone" and "Do as I'm doing..follow follow me"
     
    ...remember without this stuff...we are nothing.
     
    "Once there was a Snowman... j/k 
     
    I live in the highest baptizing Stake in the U.S. 3 years running, our Stake President said the Mission Field starts in our homes...if your wife does not experience the fruits of the gospel in her own home and marriage then what's the point of all this? When we returned home from our missions and got married, we jumped right back into the "mission field".  In any mission field we can't force anyone, just love them and hope they make the right decisions. 
     
    ...sorry for the length...dang! 
  7. Like
  8. Like
    Windseeker got a reaction from Backroads in Stuck in between a rock and a hard place.   
    At some point you have to make a decision. You certainly have a toxic environment at home. But from what you have written I think you equally share the responsibility. Do you think your wife feels loved right now? Do you think she feels heard or listened too? 
     
    Threatening divorce is not going to fix things for you or your family. That really needs to stop right now. It's coercion and using it in your home is against the oath and covenant of the Priesthood that you hold. 
     
    I know your frustrated and desperate but you can't resort to threats. 
     
     
    In my opinion...coercion is always unrighteous because it's the opposite of Charity. 
     
     
    I don't see considering divorce an option unless one of the 3 A's (Abuse, Addiction, Adultery) become prevalent.. 
     
    ...the things that led to my divorce were #1 Not paying tithing, #2 Pornography (a slow caustic once a month addiction) 3# Verbal abuse  #4 Not loving my wife, not listening to her (love=listen) and ignoring her needs (time together).
     
    Long story short, she left me and our four kids even though I forgave her after her multiple affairs. Then she moved in with some men. It was at that point that I decided it would be best if we divorced.
     
    Have you heard of the Love Bucket analogy? I think if you could see your wife's it might just be handle with a rusted out ring. I think that's what happened to my wife. I changed, I forgave, I begged and pleaded for the sake of our kids, but she literally told me "I can't stop". She had completely lost her ability to control herself and her decisions. Years later, She has so much regret now, she struggles with alcohol. 
     I'm remarried (temple) and moved across the country. It's been hard, my youngest daughter attempted suicide a couple months ago, she moved in with her Mom. It was hard letting her go, but she was angry and blamed me for everything. Before the summer was over she called me in tears wanting to move back home. She felt bad how she treated me and wanted to mend things. She changed after living with her mom, it's been a blessing having her back...she is so much happier lately and just awesome to be around.  
     
    This second marriage has been hard, easily twice as hard as my first, but things are getting much, much better. I've learned somethings. I'm not perfect but I've changed allot. I wanted to end my life because everything I thought mattered I failed at.
     
    So I pulled a jiujitsu    move on myself and did end my life, figuratively.
     
    I'm still not satisfied with who I am, I still fall way short. But some things have become clear to me. "if ye have not charity, ye are nothing"...how powerful is that? Our first calling is to Love and our second is to Forgive. Remember? "..On these two commandments hang all the law and the prophets." ..in other words...are you putting the law and the prophets above the thing they are hanging on? 
     
    I'm telling you all this because I've been in your shoes. I'm telling you, you have to work on your marriage. If your ready to change then you can start by forgiving your wife, and asking her forgiveness. You've got to get back to what really matters. You can only change yourself. You can't change her. There are simply no guarantees in life. Your spouse is walking a dangerous path for sure, you should be concerned and you're in a very difficult position. 
     
    The best thing you can do...really the only thing you can do is start living the Gospel..not perfect family prayer, family home evenings, 100% home teaching...and all that fun stuff...
     
    no...
     
    Go back and work on the real stuff, the stuff you learn in primary. Stuff like "As I have loved you, Love one another", and "I want to be kind to everyone" and "Do as I'm doing..follow follow me"
     
    ...remember without this stuff...we are nothing.
     
    "Once there was a Snowman... j/k 
     
    I live in the highest baptizing Stake in the U.S. 3 years running, our Stake President said the Mission Field starts in our homes...if your wife does not experience the fruits of the gospel in her own home and marriage then what's the point of all this? When we returned home from our missions and got married, we jumped right back into the "mission field".  In any mission field we can't force anyone, just love them and hope they make the right decisions. 
     
    ...sorry for the length...dang! 
  9. Like
    Windseeker reacted to priesthoodpower in Stuck in between a rock and a hard place.   
    Thank you!
  10. Like
    Windseeker reacted to Dravin in Stuck in between a rock and a hard place.   
    Threatening huh? That's a healthy relationship dynamic.
  11. Like
    Windseeker reacted to andypg in Who really killed Jesus?   
    So I wrote a paper about this last year for a class. My professor at the time was Urban von Wahlde who is considered a leading American scholar on John and the Johannine community. So when I look at the question of "Who killed Jesus" especially with allegations of "It was 'the Jews'", I tend to look at it through the lens of the Gospel of John.
     
    The Gospel of John went through three editorial stages by three separate authors in the Johannine community. The first edition refers to the Jewish leaders as the “Pharisees” and “Scribes” however, in the second edition the author uses the term “the Jews” in order to describe the Jewish religious leaders, not the Jewish people as a whole. The Gospel writer (of the second edition) uses the Greek word Ioudaios.
     
    So when the Gospel of John refers to the Jews (Ioudaios) who opposed Christ, it is referring to the religious leaders, not the entire Jewish community. While the Gospel of John talks about the plot of the Jews to kill Christ, it is a very small and specific group the author is referring to. It is the religious leaders responsible.
     
    Now, looking at the passage from Matthew, and I’m much less familiar with the Matthean tradition so I may be reading this wrong, the first two verses of chapter 27 reads: “When morning came, the chief priests and the elders of the people conferred together against Jesus in order to bring about his death. They bound him, led him away, and handed him over to Pilate the governor.” (NRSV)
     
    The “they” that bound him and led him to Pilate were the chief priests (arciereis) and elders (presbuteroi). Now, in verse 25 that you quoted, it says that “all the people” called for Barabbas. Now, this is where my lack of knowledge of the Matthean tradition puts me at a disadvantage. In John, Ioudaios (the Jews) could to us bring about images of a large group of people, but in reality to the Johannine tradition and author it was just the religious leaders. In Matthew, the Greek says, pas ho laos translated “all the people”. We could take it to mean a large group of the Jewish community, but it doesn’t necessarily have to be that. It could be all the people who were present, and since there is no evidence provided by the author of Matthew that a large following went with the chief priests and elders to Pilate, all the people who were there could well be just the chief priests and elders, the religious leaders of John’s Gospel.
     
    If I had more time on my hands, I’d try to find out the wording of the Marcan and Luke traditions, though I think they might agree with Matthew.
     
    Now in all this I think it’s important to remember this: When Christ is being crucified in The Passion of the Christ, it is Mel Gibson’s hand that is hammering the nail. Why? Gibson wanted to symbolically show that he (and all of us) have a role in the crucifixion. That’s the important part we need to remember when discussing who crucified Christ.
  12. Like
    Windseeker reacted to Backroads in The happiest state is......   
    I find it humorous a happiness study is causing so much resentment and misery.
  13. Like
    Windseeker reacted to Backroads in Stuck in between a rock and a hard place.   
    I got to admit, I'm bothered by your wife's behavior. I'm very much in the "believe what you want" camp, but constant criticism is not okay and is clearly harming your marriage. I agree, your wife probably needs to vent and be heard by her husband (that being you). But you're struggling under all her criticism. If you haven't brought it up with her, do so. Let her know that you are satisfied in your faith and require respect. I hope you are respecting her faith choice here so you can ask the same. Ask for limits on what she can be nasty about, for your sake. Also, I suggest that if she doesn't want to go to church, she shouldn't. Are your kids old enough to attend alone? Sit down as a family and decide what to do about religion, what boundaries and expectations there are.
    Why? Because you deserve to practice your religion in your own home without criticism. So do your wife and kids.
    You can have your faith and your wife, but only if both you and your wife agree to it.
  14. Like
    Windseeker reacted to yjacket in Stuck in between a rock and a hard place.   
    A very difficult situation that you find yourself in and I will start off by saying that  the things you should be doing will be found through prayer, meditation, scripture reading and attending church.
     
    My 2 cents.  I like windseeker cannot see this as a justification for divorce and I think phrasing the question as my wife or beliefs is a false dichotomy.  You can have both your wife and your beliefs.  
     
    I think to be honest the hardest thing (at least for me) would be can I learn to live with someone who doesn't share my religious beliefs, especially when it is something that we had in common to start.  Our religious beliefs are some of the most personal thoughts we have and no one has the right to force us to try and believe in something that we don't.  Persuade, yes, force, no.
     
    I personally think this ""So as long as we are raising our kids together you will continue to support them in attendance of sunday meetings and weekly church activities".
    is a really bad idea.  If her heart isn't into attending church, forcing her to take the kids will invite all manner of ill-will and pushback.  
     
    Your kids are a little older, but still 3 young kids in sacrament meeting isn't a cakewalk and if she is only doing it b/c you told her to . . . it doesn't surprise me in the least that she is taking them to McDonalds or Walmart on Sunday.
     
    I think this is a really great opportunity for you to change things in your life for the better.  I have no idea what job you have or what it may require (it could be a nurse or police), but the message that you are sending your kids is very conflicted.
     
    From a child's perspective, on the one hand, Mom doesn't like church but is forced to go and on the other hand Dad loves church but doesn't go.  If I'm a kid I'd end up siding with mom b/c actions speak louder than words.
     
    So my advice is 
    1) Let your wife do whatever she wants with regards to the church; if she wants to attend meetings great, if not great.
    2) Pull whatever strings you have to so you can attend church (even for 1 hour)
    3) Let either home teachers, Elder's quorum president, bishopric (someone you trust, doesn't have to be all of them) know of the situation and tell them you need help getting your kids to/from church and activities.
    4) Take the lead in religious matters, do not expect or ask your wife to do anything religious wise.  We always read scriptures after dinner, so read at the dinner table-if she doesn't want to be there she can clean up.  Take the lead in FHE, if she doesn't want to be there, that's okay.
  15. Like
    Windseeker got a reaction from Wingnut in Stuck in between a rock and a hard place.   
    One more thought...and this may just be my rebellious streak...but had my father left my mother because she lost her faith, I may be more prone to developing negative feelings regarding that faith.
     
    Sitting in Primary and singing "Families can be together forever" would be much easier holding to hope that my mother might come back to the faith then trying to understand how my father could love this religion so much he broke our family for it. 
     
    It still brings tears to my eyes thinking of that moment, when my 10 year old daughter, frantic and grieving,  asked me "What happened to Families are Forever?!". 
     
    The sad part is I still can't answer that to this day even to my satisfaction. 
  16. Like
    Windseeker reacted to Jane_Doe in Stuck in between a rock and a hard place.   
    For years your wife has looked up to church leaders.  Now she’s found out that they’re not what she thought, and she feels betrayed.  She’s angry, she’s bitter.  And she needs a hug. 
     
    Love you wife as you always have.  She’s going through a really tough time, and needs you to be there for her.  Listen to what she feels—you don’t have to agree with her, but let her speak her very real emotions.  Wherever her path leads, listen to her and love her.  Healing from this level of hurt will take a long time, and she needs you.
     
    As to the children… my two cents would be rather than telling them “don’t believe this, don’t believe that”, is to tell them things TO believe.  Your wife believes that Jesus is her savior, have her teach them that!  Teach them positive things you believe as well (like their values as children of God).  Join forces with your wife in that regard.  As to things like whether or not JS was a prophet, take that off the table for 6 months or so, until your grown-up wounds have healed. 
  17. Like
    Windseeker reacted to Roseslipper in Stuck in between a rock and a hard place.   
    I agree with the two other  comments given above.  Marriages go thru roof times as well as good times, with time we also change.  It is unfortunate that your wife has became anti, hopefully this will just be for a season.It happens Satans time is short he will try us and he wants all to fall.  Id stay stick it out love  your wife, continue to support each other, continue to communcate with each other on all leveles,  and love her back, but dont force her, she has her free agency.  Treat your marriage as if you were married to a nonmember.  Will this be easy for you, her and the children, probably not.  You stay strong in your faith, keep the commandments, live the church ways in your home with the children if she doesnt want to join, dont get upset or hurt, or even mad.  Not one of us is perfect, we all have weakness.  Hold on to your Spiritually strengh let this make you stronger this is your big trail now (its your whole familys) The Lord knew it wouldnt be easy, but He said it will be worth it!!!!  Let her see you praying for your family, for her, put her name in the Temple.  Above all alse dont stop loving her.  We are all tested.  It is the last days lots of temptation and anti stuff out there, Tread softly, tread gently.  The Lord wont give up on her, so why should you. It can work just needs time and a different focus for you to look at.   God will Bless you through this, hold on tight.....Stay close to the spirit!!!
  18. Like
    Windseeker got a reaction from Roseslipper in Devastated   
    Hi Valdree, 
     
    I'm a dude..but have experienced the same thing and was left with 4 kids. I feel for you and know what your going thru. They say that coping with a divorce is harder then dealing with a death and I believe it.
     
    You need to put your faith in Heavenly Father and know that things will get better. This experience is so hard, but can make you so much stronger and closer to your Heavenly Father. 
     
    One thing I discovered was running and yoga...believe it or not. But running and yoga really helped my deal with the physical symptoms of the stress I was going thru. It was actually the first thing my psychiatrist recommended and I thought he was an idiot at the time. But after a week of running the aches and pains I was feeling in my body were gone and I could drop the SSRI drugs he was giving me completely. 
     
    ..anyway strange advice perhaps. 
     
    I have a feeling one day we will look back and be grateful for our challenges and we'll witness the hand of the Lord in helping us weather the storms.
     
    learn also to be grateful. Despite our challenges we can look around and find things to be grateful for. It didn't take long to look around and see people that had it much tougher then I did. In my same ward a women with 12 kids had her husband run off to China and marry someone over there leaving them destitute and they were British living in the States so they were basically made illegal as his job was what allowed them their residence here. 
     
    anyway take it a day at a time, be grateful and seek support from the Lord.
     
    much love from a brother
  19. Like
    Windseeker got a reaction from Sunday21 in Stuck in between a rock and a hard place.   
    I'm sorry for what you are going thru, that has to be hard. I myself have been thru divorce. 
     
    IMHO I just don't feel that someone leaving the Church justifies divorce. I read an article but forgot the name of a very outspoken women who left the Church and spent years writing anti-mormon literature. She recently returned. Her husband thru those any years remained faithful to her and to the Church.
     
    It can be done. I read a book about helping Children develop resilience and one of the things that brought me comfort was when the author mentioned that studies show as long as there is one positive, good influence in their lives that they will turn out ok. In other words, your spouse may not be on the same page...as long as one of you is on the right page it will be ok.
     
    Because of your wife’s choices your children may have the option earlier to leave their faith. I say earlier, because eventually everyone grows up and makes their own choices. I think your influence will be stronger under one roof then it would be split. And perhaps just seeing them on the weekends.
     
    I don't mean to be offensive but your wife’s demonstrated ignorance when she calls you a hypocrite for not being perfect is only matched by your ignorance that you can't have the church in your life and be married to someone that's not a member.
     
     
    It certainly does not speak well of our faith and its values regarding the family if we abandon each other when we slip and fall. Our faith should be stronger than that.
     
    If I were you and wanted an Eternal Family, I would tell your wife it's ok for her to leave the Church. Assure her that you are committed to her. I'd would discuss with her that it's important to you that your kids attend church and ask for her support in establishing rules and come up with a timeline. I would think 18 is old enough for kids to make up their own minds about attending Church. Up till then if you are supporting them under your roof, the Children need to attend. It's not going to be easy..a house divided and all...but I wouldn't entertain divorce
  20. Like
    Windseeker got a reaction from srmaher in Has Modern Feminism Weakened Women's Sensibilities?   
    I thought this was a really interesting response on this issue  - 
     
    The Modern Campus Cannot Comprehend Evil by Camille Paglia
     
      ...and case in pointVANDALISM ON IVY LEAGUE CAMPUS ATTACKS CONSERVATIVE AS ‘RACIST RAPE APOLOGIST’ This guy is under malicious attack on his campus after he published his concern that the "affirmative consent" legislation may "muddle the line between consensual sexual behavior and sexual assault because it fails to specify what is needed to establish affirmative consent".      
  21. Like
    Windseeker got a reaction from Roseslipper in Stuck in between a rock and a hard place.   
    I'm sorry for what you are going thru, that has to be hard. I myself have been thru divorce. 
     
    IMHO I just don't feel that someone leaving the Church justifies divorce. I read an article but forgot the name of a very outspoken women who left the Church and spent years writing anti-mormon literature. She recently returned. Her husband thru those any years remained faithful to her and to the Church.
     
    It can be done. I read a book about helping Children develop resilience and one of the things that brought me comfort was when the author mentioned that studies show as long as there is one positive, good influence in their lives that they will turn out ok. In other words, your spouse may not be on the same page...as long as one of you is on the right page it will be ok.
     
    Because of your wife’s choices your children may have the option earlier to leave their faith. I say earlier, because eventually everyone grows up and makes their own choices. I think your influence will be stronger under one roof then it would be split. And perhaps just seeing them on the weekends.
     
    I don't mean to be offensive but your wife’s demonstrated ignorance when she calls you a hypocrite for not being perfect is only matched by your ignorance that you can't have the church in your life and be married to someone that's not a member.
     
     
    It certainly does not speak well of our faith and its values regarding the family if we abandon each other when we slip and fall. Our faith should be stronger than that.
     
    If I were you and wanted an Eternal Family, I would tell your wife it's ok for her to leave the Church. Assure her that you are committed to her. I'd would discuss with her that it's important to you that your kids attend church and ask for her support in establishing rules and come up with a timeline. I would think 18 is old enough for kids to make up their own minds about attending Church. Up till then if you are supporting them under your roof, the Children need to attend. It's not going to be easy..a house divided and all...but I wouldn't entertain divorce
  22. Like
    Windseeker reacted to MrShorty in BYU students protesting no-beard policy   
    Yes, BYU has a code. However, the particular part under consideration here (men must by clean shaven) was certainly not part of the code since the beginning (late 19th century). I'm not certain of the history of the dress and grooming standards, but my impression is they started somewhere in the mid 20th century (the article claims '70's), probably in response to the "hippie" movement and similar cultural/political forces of those decades.
     
    IMO, the link between long hair and beards that was present during this era is mostly faded. As  BYU alumnus who works with many professionals who choose to wear beards, I think it is well within these students' rights to ask the administration to reconsider a cultural policy for which the cultural motivation has faded into the sunset.
  23. Like
    Windseeker got a reaction from Sunday21 in Devastated   
    Hi Valdree, 
     
    I'm a dude..but have experienced the same thing and was left with 4 kids. I feel for you and know what your going thru. They say that coping with a divorce is harder then dealing with a death and I believe it.
     
    You need to put your faith in Heavenly Father and know that things will get better. This experience is so hard, but can make you so much stronger and closer to your Heavenly Father. 
     
    One thing I discovered was running and yoga...believe it or not. But running and yoga really helped my deal with the physical symptoms of the stress I was going thru. It was actually the first thing my psychiatrist recommended and I thought he was an idiot at the time. But after a week of running the aches and pains I was feeling in my body were gone and I could drop the SSRI drugs he was giving me completely. 
     
    ..anyway strange advice perhaps. 
     
    I have a feeling one day we will look back and be grateful for our challenges and we'll witness the hand of the Lord in helping us weather the storms.
     
    learn also to be grateful. Despite our challenges we can look around and find things to be grateful for. It didn't take long to look around and see people that had it much tougher then I did. In my same ward a women with 12 kids had her husband run off to China and marry someone over there leaving them destitute and they were British living in the States so they were basically made illegal as his job was what allowed them their residence here. 
     
    anyway take it a day at a time, be grateful and seek support from the Lord.
     
    much love from a brother
  24. Like
    Windseeker got a reaction from Sunday21 in A person cannot be happy without....   
    Gratitude..you can't be happy without it. 
  25. Like
    Windseeker got a reaction from Bini in Turned 30 and decided to do this.   
    I used fly with a Korean flight attendant who's husband was born in Korea and adopted at a young age. He was raised in the U.S. When they got engaged, cheap flights made it easy for him to return to Korea and look for his birth parents. He ended up finding his mother who bragged to the whole town about her rich American son (American yes..Rich? No) and demanded he care for her. This Korean flight attendant was super irritated that she abandoned her husband and now demanded he care for her, his mother even demanded that she be the one to walk him down the aisle at their wedding and the adoptive American parents reluctantly stepped aside to accommodate her. 
     
    I'm not trying to discourage you, but just try to be realistic and understand it might not turn out how you expect. I also feel for your adoptive parents and feel like they are making a mistake by withholding information. Sometimes love means letting go, something most divorced parents have to cope with as children are torn between the two. My sister is supportive of her adoptive daughter in this way and has even taken her to see her brothers and sisters and mother at the age of 10. 
     
    I've shared the story about my first wife (Adopted from Thailand) and feel we were led to find the truth about her circumstances. We found the Nurse who was there when she was born and got the story of her parents. We didn't get any names however. 
     
    I do think it would be cool for my kids to meet their possible cousins, aunts and uncles and even grandparents in Thailand. If they are interested I will help them do so. I look at my family tree and feel bad that my children are missing half their tree when it comes to tracing their genes. 
     
    One bit of advice we were given in Thailand is to contact the media in the birth country, they love a good story and will sometimes provide resources to help you if they can televise the story.
     
    Good luck in your search.