JosephP

This whole concept of different race marriage is rather confusing to me. It's so subjective as to be insane. My mother is Ukrainian, called herself Russian, and my father was a Cuban. Yet when my brother wanted to marry a Polish women she objected because of her nationality. In her mind, Poles were a different and undesirable race. So what of me, being mixed race? Should I find another Ukrainian/Cuban to marry? Is an English/Hawaian close enough or is that interracial? These classifications are archaic and there continued use is equally archaic. For me, the continued defense of these classifications is offensive. Why are we asked to declare a race on almost every government form? Why is there no mixed race option on federal forms? Am I Caucasian or Hispanic? Do I deny my mother or my father when addressing my government? It's simply repulsive to think that some government clerk somewhere will decide what catagory my Germanic fiancé and I fit into when we marry. Lastly, I simply can not understand why we as a free people can be compelled to provide this information, and more so, what possible use this information is to the government other then the continuation of archaic racial distinctions.

I think the words to the song "Sweet Hour of Prayer" covers my explanation.

It seems that the addition of the gate for the specific purpose to prevent solicitation by religious groups says quite a lot. It doesn't seem likely that they are going to be open-minded enough to hear your perspective. To me, the only issue remaining is your willingness and timing in declaring your independence. Your acceptance of the Gospel seems to be included in that independence. I do not agree with those that said allowing them to finish paying for your education would be wrong. You are willing to talk to them now, they are unwilling to listen. Continuing the status quo until you are in a position where you can insist they listen is certainly not unethical. Of course you have the final decisions to make, such as whether to be baptized, the timing of your baptism, and when you declare your independence from your parents. All we can offer you here is our own opinions. You ultimately must make the decision yourself.

From what I recall this whole concept that apologizing shows weakness became popular because of a line in the old John Ford movie "She Wore A Yellow Rinbon" when an old wise Colonel played by John Wayne says to a young Captain; "Never apologize, Mister, its a sign of weakness" Since then this idea has become popular, especially among those who have slight education and parental upbringing. Like many macho concepts of manhood, its deeply engrained into some people and the absurdity of it matters not in the least. It is possible for an abused or weak person to use the term "I'm sorry" compulsively, and perhaps that is the origin of this idea. But anyone who has ever given or received a sincere eye to eye apology knows the courage it takes.

I can't help but wonder what's your parents concern are. There are lots of people who dislike the church, but they do so for a wide variety of reasons. Perhaps understanding what it is they object so strongly about would allow someone to help you better. If we can trust in miracles to the point that we understand that God has restored His church in these days, is it so hard to believe your parent's concern can be addressed if we know what they are? Would you be willing to share a bit about what your parents objections and opinions are?

I took an anti-Mormon class at a Protestant church in 1977, I assure you they were fired up and wanted more. It was mostly illogical emotional arguments about unusual doctrines and personal attacks on Joseph Smith and others I hadn't heard of at the time. Back then I didn't know a Mormon from a Methodist.

I just thought of something. My login name here is Joseph P. Are they going to let me change it to Joseph M. if I can show them the temple marriage certificate? ;-)

Yes, that was helpful. I have a brother who has a son so the name continues. I'm beyond having more children and have only an adult daughter. I think we're going to go for it. Joseph Macdonald, it doesn't exactly sing, but its not too awkward either.

Be yourselves, teens spot and are turned off by pretense. Explain what you expect from her as a guest in your home, and ask what she expects from you so she can be comfortable. If true, explain that your religion is important in your home and she's invited to join you in prayer, FHE, etc. if she wants, but that she isn't required to. Mostly make it a loving family experience. Unless she does something that is in conflict with your standards there shouldn't be much to worry about other than the language barrier, for sure!

To me, deep doctrine are the things we aren't certain of, those that are suggested but not defined in scripture. Things like the role of our spirit children, the idea of a Heavenly Mother, the famous "as God is man may..." concept, etc. I don't concern myself with knowing all the various ideas about each deep doctrine. I'm content with an overview to form a personal opinion about it, but understanding its only my opinion.

Yes this was a big help. When all is said and done I think I'll file this all under 'deep doctrine' and stick to the explanation in Gospel Principles for my day to day thought process. In the end, it changes nothing about my responsibilities to my covenants or my testimony. Great stuff to ponder about from time to time though. Thanks so much everyone. I was able to give a very clear and well documented discription to the person who asked me.

My name is Hispanic (Cuban), but my biological father died when I was four, and my mother remarried a Russian, like herself. My entire background is Russian, I was even an altar boy in a Russian Othodox Church, yet everyone always thinks I'm Mexican just based on my last name, and often expect me to speak and act in a way that is totally foreign to me. I've even been scolded for not embracing my Mexican heritage, so strong are people's misimpression. My fiancé's name is Scott's/Irish, but at least I'm familiar with the culture.

Together they sound like a restaurant no one would dare eat at! ;-)

There is the feelings in my family about laying it aside. I'm also curious what it will be like at work having a new identity.

Neither my fiancé or I like my last name. I had wanted to change it when I was 17 before I enlisted, but couldn't afford the court fees. I've felt stuck with it all my life. In the state where we plan to marry the wife can use her maiden name and the husband can use the wife's name when getting married. I have had some pretty extreme responses to this, and I'm just testing the waters in this forum. Opinions please. It's a big irreversible decision and I want to be happy with the choice.

I'm not sure I can say one way is better than another. My own path toward gaining a testimony was, 1- Is the Book of Mormon true? Once I had an answer that it was scripture my next question was, 2- Is the LDS Church the true church? Again when I felt conformation from the spirit the next step for me 3- Is my joining the church your will for my life. Now of course it wasn't that systematically cut and dry, but that was the general process I went through. I think you need to establish the path that answers the questions you have. I don't think you're likely to get an answer in one big blast, most people get small assurances as they progress in their testimony.

Welcome, you've found a good place to safely ask questions and gain the LDS perspective.

Not yet, but the complete text is available online at Full text of "Three degrees of glory; discourse, Ogden Tabernacle, Sept.22, 1922" Thanks for the suggestion. There does seem to be serious debate about the racial component to his writings.

Not done often any more? It was part of the quarterly challenge from our Stake President that everyone bless their home. It is not a priesthood ordinance however, anyone may do it.

Where did this rumor of a "big announcement" come from? I know I live in the desert, but no one I know is talking about it.

I did understand that some people think they deserve a discount. When I shop at DI I'm glad to be able to contribute to the good work, couldn't imagine expecting a discount. I don't know about the cash donation thing either, but I do try to bring something to donate when I go. I was surprised that DI is no longer asking for volunteers as a ward assignment. Anyone know if that's church wide or just in the Phoenix, Arizona area. Sorry for moving off topic.

I'm not sure I'm getting that from Alma 36. Would you be willing to elaborate, please.

Some discussion where? It seems both unlikely and undesirable from my very limited perspective.

Thank you. That helps

So then is section 138 where we first learn about the captives? Does anyone know where the term spirit prison came from?