warnerfranklin

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  1. Haha
    warnerfranklin reacted to prisonchaplain in Bridging the Gap   
    @zil Perhaps it's you that's avoiding the underlying reality?   We all know what dancing leads to, so... are all your provisos, nuances, and general hazy murky wonderings truly causing confusion? The answers are simple. The angels (all good, actually) know how to dance, but won't. The demons (no longer worthy to be called 'angels') very much want to dance, but are too stupid to know how. Then there is us. So, what shall we therefore do?
  2. Haha
    warnerfranklin reacted to zil in Bridging the Gap   
    See there?  You're just avoiding the question, which doesn't specify "good" angels, only angels - the devil has his angels, too, you know.
    However, as phrased, the question is imprecise - does it mean "how many angels can dance at the same time on the head of a pin?"  or is it simply "how many angels have the knowledge and physical capacity to dance on the head of a pin?"  Further, the question doesn't say what sort of dancing we're talking about - the answer to that could have serious impact on the both interpretations of the question.  And finally, it's entirely possible I haven't considered some other vagary inherent in this question.
    Nope, I'm thinking if someone wants to discuss this question, it's going to have to be improved first.
  3. Haha
    warnerfranklin reacted to prisonchaplain in Bridging the Gap   
    Now, for the most fundamental of Evangelicals this debate has long been resolved. After all, no good angel would be caught dancing! 
  4. Like
    warnerfranklin got a reaction from Sunday21 in Bridging the Gap   
    What a great topic of discussion!  
    "You can do a lot more good by having a kind word to say about your own faith than you can by having a disparaging one to say about someone else's"  Joseph Smith
    As Christians, and I used to be VERY guilty of this, we spend too much time arguing over items that are tantamount of "how many angels can dance on the head of a pin".  What members of my ward did prior to my becoming LDS, is to simply listen to what I had to say, thank me for sharing my opinion, and simply explain what and why the church teaches a certain principal.  
    No arguing, no telling me I was wrong, but listening to better understand me and help me better understand them.  Then they simply left it at that!  In the process we got to know each other as fellow brothers and sisters in Christ and found out that we have so much more in common than we don't.  
    They were interested in helping me develop as a Christian instead of tearing me down by poo-pooing what I knew based upon my background as an evangelical.  
    And when I saw that they were there to help me in my walk with Christ I was able to move past many of the prejudices and misconceptions I held.  I was able to look beyond doctrine to the fruits they bore and see them as Christians, different from myself, but Christians nonetheless.   
     
     
     
  5. Like
    warnerfranklin reacted to prisonchaplain in Bridging the Gap   
    Keep in mind too that the Pentecostal movement, birthed in the 1905 Azusa Street revival, which now claims roughly 600 million adherents (including Charismatics), contended that the gifts of the Holy Spirit (as described in 1 Corinthians 12 & 14) had been allowed to go dormant (mild apostasy?), as had the ministries of divine healing and deliverance (casting out demons and demonic influence).  They would argue that they have seen a restoration of these practices, though probably with a small case-r. 
  6. Like
    warnerfranklin reacted to prisonchaplain in Bridging the Gap   
    I recently had a Christian ask me what the deal was with Muslims and Jews. It reminded me of a conversation I had with an imam once. He asked why we (Evangelicals) seemed to favor Jews over Muslims, since Muslims consider Christ a true prophet, and Jews say he was false (based on the Talmud)? My answer came down to the reality that once the sonship and deity of Christ are denied, the other nuances do not matter much.
    Anatess2 is spot on, in suggesting that it is the LDS prophetic revelations the contain the major gaps in our faiths. The insight is helpful to an extent. It certainly points to wear our common beliefs will lie--from the point of creation to the point of the 2nd coming.  I would add that our holiness codes are quite similar--especially concerning sexual mores, substance abuse, modesty, etc.
  7. Like
    warnerfranklin got a reaction from Sunday21 in BOM vs New Testament Scripture Study   
    I come from an evangelical background and I perfectly understand your appreciation of the New Testament!  Since I'm new to the LDS faith I don't know what the "church guidelines" are as far as scripture study goes.  
    Speaking only for myself, what I like to do is divide my scripture study into three parts:  1) LDS scriptures; 2) Bible Study; 3) Teachings of church leadership.
    I find it most helpful when I am able to contrast and compare similar scriptures in the Book of Mormon with those in the Bible.  See Ephesians 2:8 and 2 Nephi 25:10 - it really helps me develop a better understanding of the whole.
    Reading/listening to the teachings of Church leaders has been helpful (as well as theologians like CS Lewis) because these men and women and God have insights and a way of explaining doctrinal principals in a new light.  I have really appreciated the talks from Elders Uchtdorf and Holland as they have a way of explaining LDS doctrine (that I'm still learning) in a way that is easy to understand while remaining impactful.
  8. Thanks
    warnerfranklin got a reaction from scottyg in An Evangelical Minister Speaks to a Mormon   
    I am a recent convert to the LDS faith, having been baptized in late 2016.  I came from a strong evangelical background.  It wasn't too long ago, say 15 years, that I too, in my ignorance, believed Mormons were cultist.  And yes, I was very vocal about that opinion.  But let me be clear, when I would try to reach out to my friends and associates who were/are Mormons to leave their faith it wasn't because I thought little of them (because I loved and deeply respected for  all of them), it was because I wanted to see them in heaven.  Remember, "traditional" Christian denominations have a very different outlook on the afterlife than Mormons do.  There is no second chance in the afterlife as most protestants see it.  It was out of love that I would try to witness to my Mormon friends and associates.  
    But to be honest, as I said before I believed this out of ignorance.  Had I looked past doctrinal differences and saw the fruits of the spirit that most Mormons bear in abundance I wouldn't have seen a cultists, I would have seen a fellow brother or sister in Christ.
    It was only after I became associated with seasoned LDS members who took the time to explain what and why our church believes certain principals that my attitude slowly began to change.  As I became more familiar with LDS doctrine my attitude evolved from Mormons are cultist to Mormons are an odd denomination to becoming a member of the church myself.  
    When I began attending church at our local ward, which was five years before I became LDS, I was always treated like another brother in Christ.  When I drew outside the lines in Sunday School or Priesthood (which was often) the members of my church didn't tell me to shut up, they simply listened, thanked me for sharing, and then explained what the LDS faith believes.  They practiced the admonition of Joseph Smith when he said, "You can accomplish a lot more good by having a kind word to say about your own faith than you can by having a disparaging one to say about someone else's."  And as my knowledge and understanding grew I found that I could easily agree with 90% of what I heard at church and in General Conference.  I found that our differences weren't as many as I thought.  I found that my brothers and sisters at the Mormon church wanted the same thing that I wanted:  to see our family, and loved ones, and friends, and the guy we pass on the street to spend the rest of eternity with then with our Father in Heaven.
    As Mormons we believe that certain lost principals of the Gospel were restored to the earth by our Father through the Prophet Joseph Smith.  It is not the fault of those outside our faith that they are unaware of these truths.  
    I would hope that when we come across those who unaware of what we know to be true that we first remember to always treat them like another brother or sister in Christ.  That we remember the words written in II Nephi 33:10:  :And now my beloved brethren and also Jew, and all ye ends of the earth, hearken unto the words and believe in Christ;  and if ye believe not in not in these words believe in Christ;  and if ye shall believe in Christ ye will believe in these words for they are the words of Christ and he hath given them unto me and they teach all men that they shall do good."
    I became a Mormon in large part because members of my ward helped me with my walk with Christ (they helped me to believe).  And as my relationship with God became stronger my desire to become a member of the LDS faith grew.  When I needed a blessing or someone to agree with me in prayer it was members of my ward who prayed with me and blessed me.  When my family was is a bad financial situation it was the church who helped us (despite only two members of our family being active members).  I could go on and on about the examples of members of my local church who looked past the fact that I wasn't a Mormon and wanted to help me become the best Christian I could be even if it meant that I might never join the Church.  
    I loved and respected the Mormon church long before I became member because I saw that the love and the light of Christ shining through so many of the people of my ward. People who looked past the fact that I was operating on incomplete information and just helped me become the best Christian I could be.
  9. Like
    warnerfranklin reacted to james12 in How Did You Find Your Answer to the BOM and Joseph Smith   
    I like your line of thinking. I would say that having belief or even a desire to believe is a good enough starting point. You have probably read or heard the below from Elder Holland but it bears repeating and consideration. He said: 
     Pay particular attention to the last thought; it is the integrity you demonstrate toward the faith you do have the the truth you already know that will really allow you to gain greater faith. I have, and have had, many questions about details in the BoM, about Joseph Smith, about church history, about stories in the Bible, etc, etc. But I have learned to ask them while firmly planted in the fertile soil of faith and belief. I can ask a question of the scriptures and the Lord can trust me not to throw all the knowledge he has given me away if the answer is not forthcoming. He answers many questions through his spirit, but if there are some questions I don't receive answers to when I ask, then I just move on. Perhaps I'll come back to them at some later date, but I know I'll find answers in time. What I have gained has been hard won and I'm not going to be so faithless as to give that up and crumble to bits if one of my many questions is not answered to my satisfaction or within a certain time table. 
    So keep moving forward in the light you do have. By so doing your light will illuminate one area and then another area. Moving in this fashion, step by step and bit by bit, you will grow until your light becomes a flame of unquenchable fire leading to eternal life.
  10. Like
    warnerfranklin reacted to zil in An Evangelical Minister Speaks to a Mormon   
    Welcome, @warnerfranklin!
  11. Like
    warnerfranklin got a reaction from Sunday21 in An Evangelical Minister Speaks to a Mormon   
    I am a recent convert to the LDS faith, having been baptized in late 2016.  I came from a strong evangelical background.  It wasn't too long ago, say 15 years, that I too, in my ignorance, believed Mormons were cultist.  And yes, I was very vocal about that opinion.  But let me be clear, when I would try to reach out to my friends and associates who were/are Mormons to leave their faith it wasn't because I thought little of them (because I loved and deeply respected for  all of them), it was because I wanted to see them in heaven.  Remember, "traditional" Christian denominations have a very different outlook on the afterlife than Mormons do.  There is no second chance in the afterlife as most protestants see it.  It was out of love that I would try to witness to my Mormon friends and associates.  
    But to be honest, as I said before I believed this out of ignorance.  Had I looked past doctrinal differences and saw the fruits of the spirit that most Mormons bear in abundance I wouldn't have seen a cultists, I would have seen a fellow brother or sister in Christ.
    It was only after I became associated with seasoned LDS members who took the time to explain what and why our church believes certain principals that my attitude slowly began to change.  As I became more familiar with LDS doctrine my attitude evolved from Mormons are cultist to Mormons are an odd denomination to becoming a member of the church myself.  
    When I began attending church at our local ward, which was five years before I became LDS, I was always treated like another brother in Christ.  When I drew outside the lines in Sunday School or Priesthood (which was often) the members of my church didn't tell me to shut up, they simply listened, thanked me for sharing, and then explained what the LDS faith believes.  They practiced the admonition of Joseph Smith when he said, "You can accomplish a lot more good by having a kind word to say about your own faith than you can by having a disparaging one to say about someone else's."  And as my knowledge and understanding grew I found that I could easily agree with 90% of what I heard at church and in General Conference.  I found that our differences weren't as many as I thought.  I found that my brothers and sisters at the Mormon church wanted the same thing that I wanted:  to see our family, and loved ones, and friends, and the guy we pass on the street to spend the rest of eternity with then with our Father in Heaven.
    As Mormons we believe that certain lost principals of the Gospel were restored to the earth by our Father through the Prophet Joseph Smith.  It is not the fault of those outside our faith that they are unaware of these truths.  
    I would hope that when we come across those who unaware of what we know to be true that we first remember to always treat them like another brother or sister in Christ.  That we remember the words written in II Nephi 33:10:  :And now my beloved brethren and also Jew, and all ye ends of the earth, hearken unto the words and believe in Christ;  and if ye believe not in not in these words believe in Christ;  and if ye shall believe in Christ ye will believe in these words for they are the words of Christ and he hath given them unto me and they teach all men that they shall do good."
    I became a Mormon in large part because members of my ward helped me with my walk with Christ (they helped me to believe).  And as my relationship with God became stronger my desire to become a member of the LDS faith grew.  When I needed a blessing or someone to agree with me in prayer it was members of my ward who prayed with me and blessed me.  When my family was is a bad financial situation it was the church who helped us (despite only two members of our family being active members).  I could go on and on about the examples of members of my local church who looked past the fact that I wasn't a Mormon and wanted to help me become the best Christian I could be even if it meant that I might never join the Church.  
    I loved and respected the Mormon church long before I became member because I saw that the love and the light of Christ shining through so many of the people of my ward. People who looked past the fact that I was operating on incomplete information and just helped me become the best Christian I could be.
  12. Like
    warnerfranklin got a reaction from Sunday21 in How Did You Find Your Answer to the BOM and Joseph Smith   
    Although I have been a Christian for a very long time, I am relatively new to the LDS faith, having been baptized late in 2016.  I have not gotten all the way through the book of Mormon yet.  When I first became LDS most of my LDS scripture study (half being the Bible and the other half being LDS) I spent most of my time going through D&C and writings on church history (so I'd have an idea of how the church was run and and idea of who you all were talking about when you'd drop names like Sidney Rigdon and Oliver Cowdery).  
    So imagine my surprise when I was assigned to give a talk on the my testimony of the Book of Mormon.  At the time I had only gotten half way through Alma, so I first thought that, "Wow!  This is really going to be a short talk."  But as I thought about it, I came to the conclusion that if I really didn't have a testimony of the Book of Mormon I probably wouldn't have become one in the first place.  Then I remember the scripture from Galatians 5:  But the fruit of the Spirit is love, joy, peace, long suffering, gentleness, goodness, faith, meekness, temperance: against such there is no law.  And they that are Christ’s have crucified the flesh with the affections and lusts.  Gal 5:22-24.    When I thought of this it occurred to me that I did have a testimony of the Book of Mormon. I had a testimony of the BOM because the members of my ward displayed the fruits of the spirit. The testimony was of the the people in my ward, the fellow members of priesthood quorum, it was those people who had helped me in my walk with Christ.
    I attended our local ward for five years before becoming a Mormon.  I came from a strong evangelical background and regularly attended the local Assemblies of God church.  But never did the people in my ward treat me like an outsider.  If I shared what was on my heart on Fast Sunday in Sacrament Meeting, no one said boo.  When I participated in Sunday School or Priesthood quorum no one told me to shut up, even when I drew outside the lines (which was often).  If I showed up to help with a service project they were happy for another set of hands.  In fact there was never a time when I was treated like anything other than another brother in Christ.  When I needed someone to agree with me in prayer or give me a blessing it was the members of my ward who were there to do that.  When my family was going through a rough time financially it was the church who helped us (despite only two members of our household being members at the time).  When my wife was deployed to Iraq the Bishop and Stake President made regular visits to make sure my family and I were okay.  Etc, etc, ad nasium....
    I have a testimony of the Book of Mormon long before I became LDS because I saw the effects that it had on the people in my church family.  I have a testimony of the Book of Mormon because of how my own life has changed since becoming a member of the church.
     
     
  13. Like
    warnerfranklin got a reaction from zil in How Did You Find Your Answer to the BOM and Joseph Smith   
    Although I have been a Christian for a very long time, I am relatively new to the LDS faith, having been baptized late in 2016.  I have not gotten all the way through the book of Mormon yet.  When I first became LDS most of my LDS scripture study (half being the Bible and the other half being LDS) I spent most of my time going through D&C and writings on church history (so I'd have an idea of how the church was run and and idea of who you all were talking about when you'd drop names like Sidney Rigdon and Oliver Cowdery).  
    So imagine my surprise when I was assigned to give a talk on the my testimony of the Book of Mormon.  At the time I had only gotten half way through Alma, so I first thought that, "Wow!  This is really going to be a short talk."  But as I thought about it, I came to the conclusion that if I really didn't have a testimony of the Book of Mormon I probably wouldn't have become one in the first place.  Then I remember the scripture from Galatians 5:  But the fruit of the Spirit is love, joy, peace, long suffering, gentleness, goodness, faith, meekness, temperance: against such there is no law.  And they that are Christ’s have crucified the flesh with the affections and lusts.  Gal 5:22-24.    When I thought of this it occurred to me that I did have a testimony of the Book of Mormon. I had a testimony of the BOM because the members of my ward displayed the fruits of the spirit. The testimony was of the the people in my ward, the fellow members of priesthood quorum, it was those people who had helped me in my walk with Christ.
    I attended our local ward for five years before becoming a Mormon.  I came from a strong evangelical background and regularly attended the local Assemblies of God church.  But never did the people in my ward treat me like an outsider.  If I shared what was on my heart on Fast Sunday in Sacrament Meeting, no one said boo.  When I participated in Sunday School or Priesthood quorum no one told me to shut up, even when I drew outside the lines (which was often).  If I showed up to help with a service project they were happy for another set of hands.  In fact there was never a time when I was treated like anything other than another brother in Christ.  When I needed someone to agree with me in prayer or give me a blessing it was the members of my ward who were there to do that.  When my family was going through a rough time financially it was the church who helped us (despite only two members of our household being members at the time).  When my wife was deployed to Iraq the Bishop and Stake President made regular visits to make sure my family and I were okay.  Etc, etc, ad nasium....
    I have a testimony of the Book of Mormon long before I became LDS because I saw the effects that it had on the people in my church family.  I have a testimony of the Book of Mormon because of how my own life has changed since becoming a member of the church.
     
     
  14. Like
    warnerfranklin got a reaction from Anddenex in How Did You Find Your Answer to the BOM and Joseph Smith   
    Although I have been a Christian for a very long time, I am relatively new to the LDS faith, having been baptized late in 2016.  I have not gotten all the way through the book of Mormon yet.  When I first became LDS most of my LDS scripture study (half being the Bible and the other half being LDS) I spent most of my time going through D&C and writings on church history (so I'd have an idea of how the church was run and and idea of who you all were talking about when you'd drop names like Sidney Rigdon and Oliver Cowdery).  
    So imagine my surprise when I was assigned to give a talk on the my testimony of the Book of Mormon.  At the time I had only gotten half way through Alma, so I first thought that, "Wow!  This is really going to be a short talk."  But as I thought about it, I came to the conclusion that if I really didn't have a testimony of the Book of Mormon I probably wouldn't have become one in the first place.  Then I remember the scripture from Galatians 5:  But the fruit of the Spirit is love, joy, peace, long suffering, gentleness, goodness, faith, meekness, temperance: against such there is no law.  And they that are Christ’s have crucified the flesh with the affections and lusts.  Gal 5:22-24.    When I thought of this it occurred to me that I did have a testimony of the Book of Mormon. I had a testimony of the BOM because the members of my ward displayed the fruits of the spirit. The testimony was of the the people in my ward, the fellow members of priesthood quorum, it was those people who had helped me in my walk with Christ.
    I attended our local ward for five years before becoming a Mormon.  I came from a strong evangelical background and regularly attended the local Assemblies of God church.  But never did the people in my ward treat me like an outsider.  If I shared what was on my heart on Fast Sunday in Sacrament Meeting, no one said boo.  When I participated in Sunday School or Priesthood quorum no one told me to shut up, even when I drew outside the lines (which was often).  If I showed up to help with a service project they were happy for another set of hands.  In fact there was never a time when I was treated like anything other than another brother in Christ.  When I needed someone to agree with me in prayer or give me a blessing it was the members of my ward who were there to do that.  When my family was going through a rough time financially it was the church who helped us (despite only two members of our household being members at the time).  When my wife was deployed to Iraq the Bishop and Stake President made regular visits to make sure my family and I were okay.  Etc, etc, ad nasium....
    I have a testimony of the Book of Mormon long before I became LDS because I saw the effects that it had on the people in my church family.  I have a testimony of the Book of Mormon because of how my own life has changed since becoming a member of the church.
     
     
  15. Like
    warnerfranklin got a reaction from clbent04 in BOM vs New Testament Scripture Study   
    I come from an evangelical background and I perfectly understand your appreciation of the New Testament!  Since I'm new to the LDS faith I don't know what the "church guidelines" are as far as scripture study goes.  
    Speaking only for myself, what I like to do is divide my scripture study into three parts:  1) LDS scriptures; 2) Bible Study; 3) Teachings of church leadership.
    I find it most helpful when I am able to contrast and compare similar scriptures in the Book of Mormon with those in the Bible.  See Ephesians 2:8 and 2 Nephi 25:10 - it really helps me develop a better understanding of the whole.
    Reading/listening to the teachings of Church leaders has been helpful (as well as theologians like CS Lewis) because these men and women and God have insights and a way of explaining doctrinal principals in a new light.  I have really appreciated the talks from Elders Uchtdorf and Holland as they have a way of explaining LDS doctrine (that I'm still learning) in a way that is easy to understand while remaining impactful.
  16. Like
    warnerfranklin got a reaction from JohnsonJones in BOM vs New Testament Scripture Study   
    I come from an evangelical background and I perfectly understand your appreciation of the New Testament!  Since I'm new to the LDS faith I don't know what the "church guidelines" are as far as scripture study goes.  
    Speaking only for myself, what I like to do is divide my scripture study into three parts:  1) LDS scriptures; 2) Bible Study; 3) Teachings of church leadership.
    I find it most helpful when I am able to contrast and compare similar scriptures in the Book of Mormon with those in the Bible.  See Ephesians 2:8 and 2 Nephi 25:10 - it really helps me develop a better understanding of the whole.
    Reading/listening to the teachings of Church leaders has been helpful (as well as theologians like CS Lewis) because these men and women and God have insights and a way of explaining doctrinal principals in a new light.  I have really appreciated the talks from Elders Uchtdorf and Holland as they have a way of explaining LDS doctrine (that I'm still learning) in a way that is easy to understand while remaining impactful.
  17. Like
    warnerfranklin got a reaction from Vort in An Evangelical Minister Speaks to a Mormon   
    I am a recent convert to the LDS faith, having been baptized in late 2016.  I came from a strong evangelical background.  It wasn't too long ago, say 15 years, that I too, in my ignorance, believed Mormons were cultist.  And yes, I was very vocal about that opinion.  But let me be clear, when I would try to reach out to my friends and associates who were/are Mormons to leave their faith it wasn't because I thought little of them (because I loved and deeply respected for  all of them), it was because I wanted to see them in heaven.  Remember, "traditional" Christian denominations have a very different outlook on the afterlife than Mormons do.  There is no second chance in the afterlife as most protestants see it.  It was out of love that I would try to witness to my Mormon friends and associates.  
    But to be honest, as I said before I believed this out of ignorance.  Had I looked past doctrinal differences and saw the fruits of the spirit that most Mormons bear in abundance I wouldn't have seen a cultists, I would have seen a fellow brother or sister in Christ.
    It was only after I became associated with seasoned LDS members who took the time to explain what and why our church believes certain principals that my attitude slowly began to change.  As I became more familiar with LDS doctrine my attitude evolved from Mormons are cultist to Mormons are an odd denomination to becoming a member of the church myself.  
    When I began attending church at our local ward, which was five years before I became LDS, I was always treated like another brother in Christ.  When I drew outside the lines in Sunday School or Priesthood (which was often) the members of my church didn't tell me to shut up, they simply listened, thanked me for sharing, and then explained what the LDS faith believes.  They practiced the admonition of Joseph Smith when he said, "You can accomplish a lot more good by having a kind word to say about your own faith than you can by having a disparaging one to say about someone else's."  And as my knowledge and understanding grew I found that I could easily agree with 90% of what I heard at church and in General Conference.  I found that our differences weren't as many as I thought.  I found that my brothers and sisters at the Mormon church wanted the same thing that I wanted:  to see our family, and loved ones, and friends, and the guy we pass on the street to spend the rest of eternity with then with our Father in Heaven.
    As Mormons we believe that certain lost principals of the Gospel were restored to the earth by our Father through the Prophet Joseph Smith.  It is not the fault of those outside our faith that they are unaware of these truths.  
    I would hope that when we come across those who unaware of what we know to be true that we first remember to always treat them like another brother or sister in Christ.  That we remember the words written in II Nephi 33:10:  :And now my beloved brethren and also Jew, and all ye ends of the earth, hearken unto the words and believe in Christ;  and if ye believe not in not in these words believe in Christ;  and if ye shall believe in Christ ye will believe in these words for they are the words of Christ and he hath given them unto me and they teach all men that they shall do good."
    I became a Mormon in large part because members of my ward helped me with my walk with Christ (they helped me to believe).  And as my relationship with God became stronger my desire to become a member of the LDS faith grew.  When I needed a blessing or someone to agree with me in prayer it was members of my ward who prayed with me and blessed me.  When my family was is a bad financial situation it was the church who helped us (despite only two members of our family being active members).  I could go on and on about the examples of members of my local church who looked past the fact that I wasn't a Mormon and wanted to help me become the best Christian I could be even if it meant that I might never join the Church.  
    I loved and respected the Mormon church long before I became member because I saw that the love and the light of Christ shining through so many of the people of my ward. People who looked past the fact that I was operating on incomplete information and just helped me become the best Christian I could be.
  18. Like
    warnerfranklin got a reaction from seashmore in An Evangelical Minister Speaks to a Mormon   
    I am a recent convert to the LDS faith, having been baptized in late 2016.  I came from a strong evangelical background.  It wasn't too long ago, say 15 years, that I too, in my ignorance, believed Mormons were cultist.  And yes, I was very vocal about that opinion.  But let me be clear, when I would try to reach out to my friends and associates who were/are Mormons to leave their faith it wasn't because I thought little of them (because I loved and deeply respected for  all of them), it was because I wanted to see them in heaven.  Remember, "traditional" Christian denominations have a very different outlook on the afterlife than Mormons do.  There is no second chance in the afterlife as most protestants see it.  It was out of love that I would try to witness to my Mormon friends and associates.  
    But to be honest, as I said before I believed this out of ignorance.  Had I looked past doctrinal differences and saw the fruits of the spirit that most Mormons bear in abundance I wouldn't have seen a cultists, I would have seen a fellow brother or sister in Christ.
    It was only after I became associated with seasoned LDS members who took the time to explain what and why our church believes certain principals that my attitude slowly began to change.  As I became more familiar with LDS doctrine my attitude evolved from Mormons are cultist to Mormons are an odd denomination to becoming a member of the church myself.  
    When I began attending church at our local ward, which was five years before I became LDS, I was always treated like another brother in Christ.  When I drew outside the lines in Sunday School or Priesthood (which was often) the members of my church didn't tell me to shut up, they simply listened, thanked me for sharing, and then explained what the LDS faith believes.  They practiced the admonition of Joseph Smith when he said, "You can accomplish a lot more good by having a kind word to say about your own faith than you can by having a disparaging one to say about someone else's."  And as my knowledge and understanding grew I found that I could easily agree with 90% of what I heard at church and in General Conference.  I found that our differences weren't as many as I thought.  I found that my brothers and sisters at the Mormon church wanted the same thing that I wanted:  to see our family, and loved ones, and friends, and the guy we pass on the street to spend the rest of eternity with then with our Father in Heaven.
    As Mormons we believe that certain lost principals of the Gospel were restored to the earth by our Father through the Prophet Joseph Smith.  It is not the fault of those outside our faith that they are unaware of these truths.  
    I would hope that when we come across those who unaware of what we know to be true that we first remember to always treat them like another brother or sister in Christ.  That we remember the words written in II Nephi 33:10:  :And now my beloved brethren and also Jew, and all ye ends of the earth, hearken unto the words and believe in Christ;  and if ye believe not in not in these words believe in Christ;  and if ye shall believe in Christ ye will believe in these words for they are the words of Christ and he hath given them unto me and they teach all men that they shall do good."
    I became a Mormon in large part because members of my ward helped me with my walk with Christ (they helped me to believe).  And as my relationship with God became stronger my desire to become a member of the LDS faith grew.  When I needed a blessing or someone to agree with me in prayer it was members of my ward who prayed with me and blessed me.  When my family was is a bad financial situation it was the church who helped us (despite only two members of our family being active members).  I could go on and on about the examples of members of my local church who looked past the fact that I wasn't a Mormon and wanted to help me become the best Christian I could be even if it meant that I might never join the Church.  
    I loved and respected the Mormon church long before I became member because I saw that the love and the light of Christ shining through so many of the people of my ward. People who looked past the fact that I was operating on incomplete information and just helped me become the best Christian I could be.
  19. Like
    warnerfranklin reacted to prisonchaplain in Non-LDS: Why do you pray?   
    Pentecostal and Charismatic Christians, like myself, would be very comfortable praying for guidance, direction, confirmation, and answers.  "Led by the Spirit" is a common refrain amongst us.  So, this would be one of those areas where the divide between us narrows significantly.