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God shakes the Earth. Natural forces are controlled by the Spiritual. Just like the sin of Gluttony will destroy us with diabetes, high blood pressure, heart diseases, strokes and cancers so is the earth affected by Sin when nations step over the bounds and sink into gross wickedness. I use the sin of gluttony because being overweight cannot be hidden and explained away neither can the diseases that come because of it. And the people who are afflicted by this sin do go to the grave with much earlier with afflictions and pains and sorrows. Deuteronomy 32:22 - For a fire is kindled in mine anger, and shall burn unto the lowest hell, and shall consume the earth with her increase, and set on fire the foundations of the mountains. Do not be deceived when righteousness is on the earth. Nature is regulated by the angels in charge of the spiritual forces that controls nature. Psalms 82:5 - They know not, neither will they understand; they walk on in darkness: all the foundations of the earth are out of course Hebrews 12:26 - Whose voice then shook the earth: but now he hath promised, saying, Yet once more I shake not the earth only, but also heaven. Much more is coming. The ancient religion of Enoch that Israel rejected would have been very useful today in learning how things actually work. But men shall trust the explanations of Science more than seek the wisdom of GOD. bert10

We live in Babylon and all of us has acquired learning in order to deal with the world. The problem is not earthly wisdom...it is men who begin to rely on it instead of that of God. It is hard to not rely on it once we have it. We can see where worldly wisdom hurt people...for example I find some Bible translations are so horrendous that they are now an abomination and hide the truth instead of illuminating mankind. Also remember all the time spent acquiring earthly wisdom is time taken away from finding the Kingdom of God. And what is the promise of GOD to them that shall seek the kingdom first in their lives...that they are not to worry where clothes and food and shelter will come from...these are the worries of the Gentiles. That God is able to clothe the flowers better than Solomon ever could clothe himself. That God can feed all the birds that He created...He certainly can clothe and feed and house the Elect. bert10

The Spirit of the world versus the Spirit of God. And also comparing Spiritual things with the Spiritual. The intelligence of GOD is not man's thoughts or ways. We see slivers of the truth and God sees the whole from the beginning to the end. Men usually take their slivers of truth and try to make it the whole truth for themselves and then force it on others. We follow a line of reasoning sorta..... well based on what we call "Horse Sense." In that line of reasoning limits are imposed on our thinking and we close our mind to the possibilities of GOD where walking on water is a viable solution to a problem for example. Isaiah 55:8 - For my thoughts are not your thoughts, neither are your ways my ways, saith the LORD. Isaiah 55:9 - For as the heavens are higher than the earth, so are my ways higher than your ways, and my thoughts than your thoughts. When we seek to understand the spiritual with the logic and reasoning of men, we will fail. Paul said.... 1 Corinthians 2:12 - Now we have received, not the spirit of the world, but the spirit which is of God; that we might know the things that are freely given to us of God. 1 Corinthians 2:13 - Which things also we speak, not in the words which man's wisdom teacheth, but which the Holy Ghost teacheth; comparing spiritual things with spiritual. Do you understand now? We only know the truth when we are filled with Light. In the OT it was called... Isaiah 11:2 And the spirit of the LORD shall rest upon him, the spirit of wisdom and understanding, the spirit of counsel and might, the spirit of knowledge and of the fear of the LORD All these things underlined are in the Light of GOD and when men are filled with Light..they do not walk according to the knowledge, understand and counsel of men but of God. The power and knowledge and understanding etc is given to men when they walk in Light as Christ is in Light (John) And so they are called fools and mad by the world. Hosea 9:7 - The days of visitation are come, the days of recompence are come; Israel shall know it: the prophet is a fool, the spiritual man is mad, for the multitude of thine iniquity, and the great hatred. The natural man and all his ways are enemies to GOD and His Righteousness as he tries to impose solutions raised by His Ego...Only they who become the Spiritual man are reconciled to the Father. bert10

The Answer to them that say there is no need for temple is this...Jesus said that He came to call sinners into repentance...He did not come to cleanse and restore temple rule. Also He is not the Restitution of all things as prophesied. In the times of the restitution of all things which we are in now...we are required to build temples. And the LDS alone have been given the burden of the temple. And Restitution of all things means all things. In Revelation we have a temple in heaven and it is being used. Even now. Ordinances are being performed in it...such as cleansing the lips of Isaiah and John and all those who went there. The tribulations are also ordinances being performed in heaven. And there shall be ordinances being performed on the earth...For all works of salvation must voluntarily be done by men of flesh and blood while they are on the Earth. If they do not believe this nor the multitude bible verses concerning end times prophecies and revelations..they shall not believe it even when destruction comes for them. For these there is nothing to be done. bert10

I know but when I come across such false thoughts I am reminded....Plagiarism is man's term of ownership of things that do not belong to him. All thoughts words and actions are because of the power of the Lord and all things belong to GOD. The words of Isaiah are not Isaiah but of the Spirit and so no man can claim ownership of anything...specially things that comes from GOD and is GIVEN BY GOD TO MAN. People are deceived and are using man's law and reasoning in order to justify rejecting the BOM. The BOM was not only for J. Smith day...it was also a remembrance for the people while they walked the Earth. And so it is normal to find the words of Isaiah and other teachings...and the GOD of the authors of the plate is the same GOD that spoke with Moses and Isaiah. bert10

OSAS...not. OSAS is totally false doctrine and it comes from Satan. It is Satan last chance to deceive those who have received the promises into thinking that they can do no harm spiritually. The Sons of GOD who left their habitation in Genesis became perdition. bert10

Guidance versus intellectual reasoning. One is worldly and one is Spiritual...and normally the worldly reasoning will be opposite of what heaven says. Because all intellectual reasoning comes from the Ego and the Ego is an enemy of GOD. When the proper order is set in man...it is the Spiritual that rules over the Ego and then our actions are pure because our motives are pure since they come from the Spirit. And so it is written in Galatians...if one is led by the Spirit he is not under the law. All others who are led by their Ego...are under the law...for one the purpose of the law is to make men that are rule by their ego guilty. Another is to be a shoolmaster unto Christ. They that come unto Christ are made free. bert10

Brigham Young I feel was a somber no non-sense type of Prophet. He was from another Era where the conditions are a little different. You have to remember that the wicked could only overcome the Church and inflict all harm they did. Because only few were faithful. The LDS had a lot of problem when they came to UTAH And they needed to have some of the power of GOD to help them overcome and tame the land and set up the government. We cannot know all things that occurred in that Era and we did not live in that time period. Now, I imagine as people grow up Spiritually they will realize and know that if anything is happening with the Church it is because God has permitted it. And Brigham Young was exactly what was needed at the time. Also there is a lot you do not know...The seed of Cain will come to an end and so will the curse. in the millennium everything that is needful to be fixed shall be fixed. Everyone that shall resurrect shall not resurrect in any other race than that of our Father. All men and woman shall be in the image of our heavenly Father and Mother. So you see it is not needful that you judge anything at this time until the Lord gives it to you as true of false. This life is not all there is to it. It is best when you read church material to accept all things as information neither good nor evil. In this way you are removing filters that would allow you to prejudge the information. It is natural to have filters on when we see, hear or sense something. But we can prevent them from interfering if we just see all things as info and wait upon the Lord for confirmation. bert10

We do not need to have a problem...Nor disagree. we can both express what we know about a subject and let what each has said sink in. And perhaps in time both our viewpoints will be changed so that we can be of one mind on the subject. bert10

I am not speaking of the last battle between the sons of the light and the sons of the darkness at the end of the millennium....In this scenario Zion comes down on the earth. Why because the earth is not destroyed by a flood this time. The verses below will give you an idea on how God will cleanse the earth. Isaiah 4:4 - When the Lord shall have washed away the filth of the daughters of Zion, and shall have purged the blood of Jerusalem from the midst thereof by the spirit of judgment, and by the spirit of burning. Isaiah 4:5 - And the LORD will create upon every dwelling place of mount Zion, and upon her assemblies, a cloud and smoke by day, and the shining of a flaming fire by night: for upon all the glory shall be a defence. Isaiah 4:6 - And there shall be a tabernacle for a shadow in the daytime from the heat, and for a place of refuge, and for a covert from storm and from rain. Nowhere does Isaiah say that the people are to be taken from the face of the earth for the second Coming. Now I speak plainly here and say that the wicked are the ones which shall be removed. Yes, there shall be earthquakes, volcanoes, poisons, biological, chemical warfare even nuclear wars, plagues and famines etc. There is not anything here that the power of God thru the priesthood cannot deal with. The Tribulations will take many and they who are left and are still wicked shall not be able to tolerate The SPIRIT OF JUDGMENT AND BURNING OF THE LORD. The last plague in Egypt....The Lord removed the first born of Egypt while preserving the rest. So it shall be in the last day...the Spirit of judgment and of burning shall take one and leave the other on the earth. How close are we? The filth of the daughter of Zion...what they do is revealed by Isaiah if you read this...remember it when you go to church and see how far off the standards have been lowered. When I read this many years ago...as a teenager...the woman were dressed very conservatively...(I was Catholic). They had to wear long sleeves and be buttoned up. Their dresses had to be below the knees etc. Now I can find both women and men fulfilling the following. The Daughters of Zion are the LDS for we call ourselves of Zion. Isaiah 3:16 - Moreover the LORD saith, Because the daughters of Zion are haughty, and walk with stretched forth necks and wanton eyes, walking and mincing as they go, and making a tinkling with their feet: Isaiah 3:17 - Therefore the Lord will smite with a scab the crown of the head of the daughters of Zion, and the LORD will discover their secret parts. Isaiah 3:18 - In that day the Lord will take away the bravery of their tinkling ornaments about their feet, and their cauls, and their round tires like the moon, Isaiah 3:19 - The chains, and the bracelets, and the mufflers, Isaiah 3:20 - The bonnets, and the ornaments of the legs, and the headbands, and the tablets, and the earrings, Isaiah 3:21 - The rings, and nose jewels, Isaiah 3:22 - The changeable suits of apparel, and the mantles, and the wimples, and the crisping pins, Isaiah 3:23 - The glasses, and the fine linen, and the hoods, and the vails. Isaiah 3:24 - And it shall come to pass, that instead of sweet smell there shall be stink; and instead of a girdle a rent; and instead of well set hair baldness; and instead of a stomacher a girding of sackcloth; and burning instead of beauty. Just something to think about. Men are about to become few ...even more precious than a golden wedge of Gold from Ophir. (prophecy of the Lord by ISaiah) bert10

Both Noah and Zion was surrounded by wickedness and violence. And the wicked were afraid of Both. The people of Zion were easy to be recognized by virtue of their garments and when they went out on missions they were given wide berth. Using the bible we know that there were giants in the world and corruption of the flesh. And also that there were much violence in the world. Only in Zion was peace to be had. The inhabitants were using Giants for protection and attacking other villages..until they became too numerous to control and they turned on the inhabitants. After the flood, we know that God allowed Satan to give knowledge to men to bring the giants back. In the days of Joshua there were many Giants. By the days of David the giants were almost all wiped out. King Og's bed for example was 9 cubits long and 4 cubits wide. It was said that Goliath was the last of them and that he was small in comparison of his fellows. This is just from using the bible now imagine when a person listens to the Spirit and reads Enoch and all the other so called lost books of the bible. I read what you put down from Moses and it does not changed what I said..concerning the Flood not being able to be called as long as Zion was on the Earth. Do you imagine that the Lord did not have the option of sending all the inhabitants of Zion to preach to the world in power and might of heaven? Now...remember that there is another great battle to come at the end of the millennium and it is in this battle that the earth is destroyed and dies. But it will be resurrected into a Celestial body. Many have confused prophecies dealing with the last battle with that of the Second Coming. It took Enoch a long time to prepare the people for translation. There is not one person that was given this gift without first being prepared to receive it. bert10

This relate to the Apostasy of the early Churches. There are holy communities and the Elect are the only ones Jesus said shall not be deceived. Satan gained the power over all kindreds and tongues and nations. As the earth sank again into darkness. The Book of Revelation contains what would happen to men from the beginning to the end. IF people do not understand this they will continue to miss-interpret the prophecies. Also certain prophecies applies more than once. As I have said...the tribulations is not for the removing the righteous but exist for the removing the wicked. If God allowed the wicked to destroy all the righteous then when the wicked are removed there would be no one left alive. And translated people would defeat the purpose. For the millennium must continue on with men of flesh and blood. I tell you the truth if a man is not worthy to see Christ right now...He is not any more worthier just because the tribulations have started. The Righteous are overcome at this moment and who is listening to them..do they not call them fools and even Mad today? For the glory of the Lord is a burning fire...the very same fire that will remove the wicked at the last that will cause even the Elements of the earth to melt and be restored. Again I tell you the truth..if a man is not able to withstand this fire right now...He shall not be able to if the tribulation were to be tomorrow. bert10

Where are you getting this? Abraham lived the law of Consecration even though He paid Melchizedek only a tithing of what He had. Living the law of consecration does not preclude having servants for there need to be order in any society. Abraham was taught by the Patriarchs. Lot wanted to have possession apart from Abraham and this began to cause friction between those loyal to Lot and those loyal to Abraham. And so there came a parting of the ways between Abraham and Lot his Nephew...whom Abraham had come to regard as his son and heir. God had other plans though. He would give Abraham and actual son. The events will show that when Lot separated from Abraham...He also lost the blessing and guidance from God through Abraham. We can see that Lot received his inheritance and lived separately from Abraham. Also Lot chose what he thought was the best for him. However, events later proved that Lot did not choose well and Lost his wealth and all that remained of his family ....only two daughters. And through Lot and his daughters...two people that would later became bitter enemies to Israel. bert10

You are right this is in a sense taking us away from the main thread. However, the gospel is ONE. Every thread relate to each other in a way...only you do not see it. Debating woman and the priesthood and how many ways the priesthood can be conferred...we must leave the what is given and go into the area of inspiration. Endless debates in these areas will not do anything except to divide. And whatsoever men do to divide themselves is not of GOD. I have explained that woman have a priesthood whether it is the same priesthood as men I do not know at this time. Women are born with it. They have it automatically because of their nature and what they need to do on the earth concerning pro-creating. If I pursue it I will know at some point in the future. So they do not need men's priesthood. We deal directly authority wise with the Father via Jesus. Our heavenly Mother has no direct dealing with us on the earth. And so it is written.... The order was set at the fall see Genesis....When God made the man the head of woman...by Saying to Eve....Thy desire shall be to thy husband and He shall rule over thee. It is at this time impossible to give woman anything that would give them authority over the man. That is not GOD's way. There is Order in heaven so there is order here on the earth. The scriptures say that the head of woman is the man and the head of the man is Jesus and the head of Jesus is the Father. Remember Adam was formed first and the woman is the rib of man. Adam was both Mother and Father to Eve since she came from him. They are one flesh. And remember that Eve was given to Adam as a solution to his Loneliness. The man was not created for the woman but the woman for the man. Another reason why man was made the head of woman is that Adam was not deceived but the woman being deceived was in transgression. Any teachings that seek to make this of none effect is not of GOD but of Satan. And so we have in the NT....the method of salvation for woman. 1 Timothy 2:13 - For Adam was first formed, then Eve. 1 Timothy 2:14 - And Adam was not deceived, but the woman being deceived was in the transgression. 1 Timothy 2:15 - Notwithstanding she shall be saved in childbearing, if they continue in faith and charity and holiness with sobriety The key for woman at this time....childbearing, faith, charity, holiness with sobriety. There are enough clues in the bible to teach the highlights but not enough to fill in the fine points unless we learn to listen. And they who shall receive who shall believe them since it is of the Spiritual and most likely will go against the will of the woman who have been led astray by philosophies of men inspired by Satan? I normally answer the question being posed and sometimes it leads us into other areas of the scriptures. By going for example to Melchizedek there is more of the priesthood that I would have spoken on and who Melchizedek was before God gave Him His new and everlasting Name that will never be removed and so on. Every part of the gospel holds a bit of the answers that we are seeking. Since the gospel is One. bert10

You speak as a Christian. When did God stop people from going past the canon. The thing is what I say is not authoritative until the person receives a testimony of it. Until then because it is not coming from a General authority....you have the leisure to consider it only as information. As for where I am getting this stuff...the Lord ensures that those who ask, seek and knock receive it one way or another. Sometimes it can be by the still small voice, burning bosom or by having our path crossed by what Isaiah used to call "wayfaring men" There are not many around but God somehow arranges things to happen that will give us answers...and then we have to ponder them until they be either true or false. That is the way I go. In the end though the source of all things is either light or darkness. And when we are not sure we can judge by the fruits of a thing. And then we can can know for ourselves. Yet a lot of stuff what I say is backed up by the bible or by the BOM or by some of the so called lost books of the bible even by the books of Enoch and so on. bert10

It was the other way around. The Flood could not come as long Zion was around. Because if Zion was left on the earth...they would have converted the entire earth and the plan of the Lord for His children to experience good and evil would have ended. The Lord also took away Salem after the flood, under Melchizedek to prevent them also from converting the whole world before the time. Imagine having 10,000 Moses /Elijahs running loose in the world. In Hebrews chapter 11 Abraham did not just go to Melchizedek to pay tithing...what is written.....that Abraham considered himself a pilgrim on the earth. That he was seeking a heavenly country, even a city whose foundation whose builder and maker is GOD. Abraham was not permitted to enter into the city and go with Melchizedek and be with the inhabitants of Salem. Abraham recognized their city the builder and maker it was GOD. Instead Abraham was to continue on to His mission to be a father of a multitude of nations and receive The Everlasting Covenant by promises. As I have said...in the days of the flood it was the wicked that was made to leave. From those days until the days of the tribulations it was the righteous that was made to leave for other lands and countries. But those days are passed. The ALPHA and the OMEGA are the first and the last and the last shall be first. I am sure you have heard this before. bert10

While respect is good for the Ego...humiliation is good for the Spirit. The Christian will respect you yet you know that it is written that God is no respecter of person. Even they teach this that God is not a respecter of person...but in their lives they value respect and honors more than humiliation....even their pastors are called Doctor because of the piece of paper their churches issue them. They are inconsistent with the revealed words of GOD. I believe if you do not lose sight of the LDS teachings you can still associate with them and go to their churches. It is not what we do without that really counts...it is what we do within. The kingdom of GOD is within us. Is there any chance of reconciliation with your former wife? Though you may be divorced by earthly standard it may not be so in heaven. That is for you to find out. I am not judging you here. However, my feelings are if you do seek another relationship and your activities do not become family centered then you are doomed to have a repeat performance of your first divorce. LDS activities even works are for promoting Spirituality in individuals. This becomes lost on many as they view activities and callings for other purposes. I can understand your feeling that there is no place for you there. I often feel it too myself. Everyone is so busy with callings and family and all. However, I do not let it stop me from pursuing in my asking and seeking and knocking. Remember the kingdom of GOD is within and it is our responsibility to reach it. Nevertheless, the Christian way is a lot more rockier Spiritually then the LDS way: because of their many errors in understanding their scriptures. A good rule of thumb is: the rockier the road appears to be in the flesh...the easier the way is for the Spirit. The easier is the way of the flesh the more rocky is the way of the Spirit. The Lord gave the LDS a heavy burden and it is for their own good and the burden is for the cleansing of our Spirit. Just be aware that the LDS and the Christians are opposite in their view point concerning many things. IF you always seek internally for your guidance then you will remove being deceived by other men. If is one less thing that you not need to worry about. And if you do listen to the wrong voice....so what? The fruits will manifest themselves in your life and if they are bitter then you can keep searching until you recognize the voice of truth. And then all your fruits will become sweet in your life. bert10

Babel also stands for confusion...for God confounded their language by the removal of the Holy Ghost from them. Now without the Holy Ghost they could not comprehend each other and had to split up in groups. They not only wanted the tower to reach into heaven...they meant to assault heaven by force. Satan was in charge of this foolishness. In order to build this tower...Government was founded,,,and force and even slavery came to remove the liberty of the people. Also from Babylon came other things such as Writing using words. As before the books of God were all in Glyph and required men who were inspired to read them. After Babylon false ministers became the rule. And they used religion to bind men further into error. Now everyone who could read whether they were inspired of GOD or not...could go about and preach what the scriptures meant according to their own wisdom and knowledge. Many of the laws of the Code of Hammurabi were adopted by the Priests of Aaron and put in the bible almost word for word. Many of the things we have today came from Babylon. And Babylon shall be destroyed by GOD and we shall have a society built on Righteousness instead of on wickedness. bert10

Yes, the energy of people would be best served in acquiring Light of Christ within themselves. The Lord always prepare His servants. They may not be told of the hour or of the day..but they can be told of the year, the month and the week it will occur. Of course such knowledge would not be broadcast ed about. Unless commanded by GOD. But then who would believe seeing all these false groups doing this stuff right now? bert10

The Lord delivered the church in the days of Joseph not once but twice. Each time the Lord used the tribulations to purify his people for what was coming. They required to have achieved a certain level of faith in order to tame Utah and survive there. In the last days....the Saints will be required to have great faith in order to counter the tribulations and to survive to do the will of GOD on the earth. If at first they learned to as you say "grit their teeth and soldier on" in the last days they will need to learn to be thankful and rejoice and exercise faith as individuals, in the midst of afflictions and disasters. They will need to become the "Elect" and the "Elect" do not act as men do. Neither do they see the world as men do but more from the point of view of God. bert10

Prison Chaplain. The end shall be like in the Beginning. In the beginning it was the wicked that was removed from the earth not the righteous. Noah and his family alone survived. The times between Noah and the end of tribulations...it is the righteous who were made to leave, cities, people and countries. But in the end of times it shall be like it was in the beginning. It is the wicked who shall be bundled up and be removed from the earth. For truly the meek shall inherit the earth. There is no way a person gets to filled with Light so he can be translated from one day to the next. To walk in the Light as Christ walks in the light is a process of learning truth at the level of GOD. Luke 17:34 - I tell you, in that night there shall be two men in one bed; the one shall be taken, and the other shall be left. Places called Zions shall be on the earth and there is no power that shall harm those who are in Zion. When the Lord calls His people to leave Babylon...in revelation...it is because God has set up Zions for the protection of all those who shall go there. These Zions like in the days of Noah are ships (places of refuge for them who have had enough of Babylon and are now ready to live as GOD revealed anciently) In Zions shall the light of Christ be and there is nothing on the earth that can harm them within. Again the tribulation is a day of wrath and it is for removing the wicked not the Righteous. For the meek shall inherit the earth. They who shall have power to be translated and be given work in the Spirit world are they who have learned to walk in the Light as Christ is in the Light. bert10

If a person has faith.... He shall not want. He shall be made to lie down in green pastures [prosperity] He shall be led besides still waters [peace and rest] He restoreth my soul (Healing both in body and Spirit) He leadeth me in the paths of righteousness for His Name's sake. (Heavenly Guidance) Sounds familiar? It is important that we have still waters in our lives and that God do leads us in and make us lie down in green pastures....because we require a lot peace and quiet in our lives in order to learn to listen and to grow spiritually. If we have to spend all of our energy in order to survive and remain alive...we shall be stopped in our spiritual progression. Psalms 23:1 - A Psalm of David. The LORD [is] my shepherd; I shall not want. Psalms 23:2 - He maketh me to lie down in green pastures: he leadeth me beside the still waters. Psalms 23:3 - He restoreth my soul: he leadeth me in the paths of righteousness for his name's sake. Psalms 23:4 - Yea, though I walk through the valley of the shadow of death, I will fear no evil: for thou [art] with me; thy rod and thy staff they comfort me. Psalms 23:5 - Thou preparest a table before me in the presence of mine enemies: thou anointest my head with oil; my cup runneth over. Psalms 23:6 - Surely goodness and mercy shall follow me all the days of my life: and I will dwell in the house of the LORD for ever. bert10

Well first of all anyone who believes in the "Rapture" will be as accurate in the scriptures as Noah was raptured in the days of the flood. The tribulations is a place of testing as well as for removing the wicked from the face of the earth. Men of faith are required and it is by faith men shall be saved just like in Noah's day. Israel in Goshen were not translated to heaven when the plagues came either those loyal to Moses prospered in the plagues as Egypted was stripped of all things of value. In revelations we are commanded to come out of Babylon so that we do not partake of her plagues. We as saints are to overcome the world and its woes and establish Zion where we can go out from Babylon. bert10

It is the post. Some stuff is really hard to explain and also to hard absorb. Even Jesus at times would say concerning some doctrines.. "He that hath ears to hear, let him hear" bert10