Another religion site

[StallionMcBeastly]

Man, I was over there defending our LDS religion and sharing my testimony and I see so much hate and disrespect spewed on the forum and chat room. I do not understand how other Christians can speak such hate towards another?

It's so frustrating! I try to be nice and correct the false statements I see and I get pounced. One poster had the nerve to say Mormons have a mental disability to believe in our religion. I got a warning from a mod for saying that was not a Christian thing to say. It almost appears that there is a strong bigotry towards LDS on that site.

I'm sorry, I just need to vent. Its really frustrating me

Edited August 25, 2008 by pam

[Moksha]

Is that the CARM site? I know I do not wish to post where I am not wanted, on such sites as CARM and MAD. Much better to seek out sites where folks do not rattle sabres and are more sympatico.

[StallionMcBeastly]

I had the website name in my topic title, but a mod edited it. Maybe they don't want it in the title, or can I not say it at all? Well yes, it is CARM Christian Apologetics & Research Ministry. If I am not supposed to say that, I apologize.

It is just so frustrating trying to converse with the members of that site. One poster told me to "repent or face hell forever". Repent of what!? Following Jesus?? Never!

[pam]

I worry about putting links to sites that investigators may go ahead and click on to go to and receive the wrong information. That's why I edited it.

[StallionMcBeastly]

I worry about putting links to sites that investigators may go ahead and click on to go to and receive the wrong information. That's why I edited it.

Oh, I completely understand. I agree, I won't do it again.

Thanks!:)

[Maya]

A couple of other possibilities

about lds: www.lds1.org

You could say it is a bit specialised on MB history, since Dr Ainsworth is there answering guestions on Maya and around.... also from Mormon Sites - rising from the dust...

Any religion: Nondenominational Christian Cyber Missionary Discussion Board CTR1.org • Index page

Both forums are very new and there are not that many people ... yet Both have possibilities to grow and they have good moderating . People in the forum form the forum, so everyone has still a change to modell these forums, if the mod squard allows .

[mnn727]

Yeah, CARM is the worst, I went there a couple years ago for a few days. Their posters act like 15 year old boys seeing who can come up with the biggest lies and who can be the rudest.

1 Cor. 13: 11

11 When I was a child, I spake as a child, I understood as a child, I thought as a child: but when I became a man, I put away childish things.

[goofball]

I appreciate the website name being published so I can avoid the site all together.

[Hemidakota]

Man, I was over there defending our LDS religion and sharing my testimony and I see so much hate and disrespect spewed on the forum and chat room. I do not understand how other Christians can speak such hate towards another?

It's so frustrating! I try to be nice and correct the false statements I see and I get pounced. One poster had the nerve to say Mormons have a mental disability to believe in our religion. I got a warning from a mod for saying that was not a Christian thing to say. It almost appears that there is a strong bigotry towards LDS on that site.

I'm sorry, I just need to vent. Its really frustrating me

I am listening...keep venting.

Yes! Many sites I had visited in the past, including some academic ones, were embarrassing to be called a Christian.

[justamere10]

I'm not including CARM where I think you have to accept the Trinity concept to even post, but if you have a verrrry thick skin and can calmly reply to caustic insulting comments with a message that teaches a gospel principle, you can eventually make some inroads on boards where you'd expect most members to be quite anti-LDS.

I started an "Ask a Mormon" thread on such a site a couple of months ago and today it has had more than 10,000 views, far more than any other thread their religion forum has ever generated.

There's a whole lot of interest in what Mormons believe. Harsh mocking opposition generates break out the popcorn interest, and opportunities to calmly teach gospel principles and promote Mormon.org to the lurkers.

As my Ask a Mormon thread progressed I came to know that most of the critics were former or inactive members of the LDS Church!

One thing to keep in mind is that you don't have to play within the boundaries of someone else's sandbox. If responders try to politicize the discussion for example and make it a conservative vs liberal topic, you can ignore that and calmly reply with posts that bring it back to God and our relationship with him. (Especially if it is a "Religion" forum.)

I think I'm doing some good as an LDS Cyber Missionary even in the darker corners of CyberSpace. I'm sure others can do the same.

It's not for everyone, it requires thick skin, a calm temperament, and an unshakeable testimony. If you have those qualities, why not start an "Ask a Mormon" thread somewhere today?

You can learn more about LDS Cyber Missionary work at http://www.lds1.org

[Guest bren1975]

I can relate to this! This is my third site, as I search for friendly respectful people to converse with. I was motivated to go online because of Elder Ballard's admonition, but have encountered a lot of nastiness.

Occasionally I visit the old sites, and am quickly reminded why I left. One of the problems I've found is that the majority of posters are young (teens and 20's), and blatantly immature. Many young people are great, but the rude ones just seem to be noisier and more aggressive. Of course many of the older posters could use a lesson in respect also.

One site the ex-LDS were among the problem. The other site, even some of the LDS posters, along with the non-religious were abusive.

Which raises the question: Why do non-religious people post in religion-based forums?

All in all, it's kind of depressing.

[justamere10]

I can relate to this! This is my third site, as I search for friendly respectful people to converse with. I was motivated to go online because of Elder Ballard's admonition, but have encountered a lot of nastiness.

Occasionally I visit the old sites, and am quickly reminded why I left. One of the problems I've found is that the majority of posters are young (teens and 20's), and blatantly immature. Many young people are great, but the rude ones just seem to be noisier and more aggressive. Of course many of the older posters could use a lesson in respect also.

One site the ex-LDS were among the problem. The other site, even some of the LDS posters, along with the non-religious were abusive.

Which raises the question: Why do non-religious people post in religion-based forums?

All in all, it's kind of depressing.

As I mentioned, it's actually exciting to have even mocking responses to your posts because that is what brings in sometimes hundreds of lurkers looking for entertainment. And that provides you with golden opportunities to teach gospel principles and link in your signature to Mormon.org. Who knows, the Spirit may guide even only ONE of those lurkers to mormon.org and reach and teach him or her, and you will have JOY IN HEAVEN!

I find that if I ignore things like depression and fear they quickly fade away or are soon replaced by their opposite, which is of God. Depression is just an attitude, we have power to change it to love for our fellow brothers and sisters who share our turn on earth. This is OUR watch, we are the ones who have been blessed with a knowledge of the fulness of God's truths. It's up to us to pass at least portions of that knowledge along to those who haven't, and it's up to them to make their choices.

I encourage you to do what you can. If you write for twenty years and it brings only one soul to Christ it will be worth it. But always keep your calm when you write so you do no harm. The Holy Spirit is in this cyber missionary work, I experience that daily...

[StallionMcBeastly]

I am listening...keep venting.

Yes! Many sites I had visited in the past, including some academic ones, were embarrassing to be called a Christian.

Thanks man!

They say they are Christian and then call the LDS beliefs "crap" and say other hateful things.

I just don't get it. Where did this hate come from? I disagree with other religions too, but I don't hate them and show disrespect.

I am going to change my way of approaching the site. I am not going to waste my time trying to get them to understand our church, I am just going to share my testimony and refer them to lds.org.

That's awesome about the cyber missionary thing, Justmere. Keep it up!

[ldsmissionary]

It's a scary religious world out there, for sure. People ready to pounce on you before you even have a chance to speak up.

[justamere10]

It's a scary religious world out there, for sure. People ready to pounce on you before you even have a chance to speak up.

I see it as a rich environment in which to calmly teach gospel principles. Rants are the fireworks that bring in the crowd, LDS Cyber Missionaries are the main speakers. We're only after those who will hear their Master's voice when it's spoken by Him or by His servants. If they are lurking there you may encourage them to go to Mormon.org and the lost shall be found.

[ldsmissionary]

I see it as a rich environment in which to calmly teach gospel principles. Rants are the fireworks that bring in the crowd, LDS Cyber Missionaries are the main speakers. We're only after those who will hear their Master's voice when it's spoken by Him or by His servants. If they are lurking there you may encourage them to go to Mormon.org and the lost shall be found.

Selling Mormonism on sites that aren't friendly to Mormons is probably as effective as knocking doors in the mission field.

[justamere10]

Selling Mormonism on sites that aren't friendly to Mormons is probably as effective as knocking doors in the mission field.

Possibly but we do what we can and we can knock on thousands of doors in one afternoon without wearing out a single sole!

[Snow]

I had the website name in my topic title, but a mod edited it. Maybe they don't want it in the title, or can I not say it at all? Well yes, it is CARM Christian Apologetics & Research Ministry. If I am not supposed to say that, I apologize.

It is just so frustrating trying to converse with the members of that site. One poster told me to "repent or face hell forever". Repent of what!? Following Jesus?? Never!

Let me put this as delicately and charitably as I possibly can... and I speak from experience here. That website is run by and frequented by the worst possible examples of decency and Christianity. They are fundamentally hateful, dishonest, immoral and immature. They are simply engaged in boundary maintenance seeking to boost their low self esteem and confidence in their own beliefs by denigrating the beliefs of others. It is pointless to try and engage with them re the gospel as they lack a foundation in or appreciation of moral principle.

[ldsmissionary]

Possibly but we do what we can and we can knock on thousands of doors in one afternoon without wearing out a single sole!

Single sole. That's funny.

Knocking doors really is a waste of time. 'We' (e.g. those coordinating the missionary efforts of ANY church) can do so much better. We do what we know, and when we know better, we do better. Or we should, anyway. :)

The last market study that the LDS church conjured up to form the 'Truth Restored' marketing campaign found that:

• They needed a different approach to reach their audience.
• People do not know the church or care about it.
• The LDS church should shift to focusing on brand development rather than direct marketing.

You can read about it here.

An incredibly powerful marketing truth, is that people hate door-to-door salesmen. Hate 'em.

[justamere10]

Single sole. That's funny.

Knocking doors really is a waste of time. 'We' (e.g. those coordinating the missionary efforts of ANY church) can do so much better. We do what we know, and when we know better, we do better. Or we should, anyway. :)

The last market study that the LDS church conjured up to form the 'Truth Restored' marketing campaign found that:

• They needed a different approach to reach their audience.
• People do not know the church or care about it.
• The LDS church should shift to focusing on brand development rather than direct marketing.

You can read about it here.

An incredibly powerful marketing truth, is that people hate door-to-door salesmen. Hate 'em.

Knocking on doors may not be glamorous but I and a growing number of my family for generations to come will be forever grateful for the two young missionaries who knocked on my door and taught me the Gospel. When missionaries are living right they are guided by the Spirit. That includes I'm sure being inspired to knock on the right doors.

I think it also builds great skills in our young men. After returning from a mission, one of my sons knocked on doors as a salesman each summer and put himself through university.

I don't think we should knock knocking on doors....

[ldsmissionary]

Knocking on doors may not be glamorous but I and a growing number of my family for generations to come will be forever grateful for the two young missionaries who knocked on my door and taught me the Gospel.

I can understand that. My family was a knocked family. But it's not the glamor game. It's the efficiency game.

Missionaries are taught in the MTC to avoid knocking doors like the plague. It's an activity for when there's absolutely NOTHING else that can be done. And if the missionaries begin thinking of knocking doors, they should explore every other option to avoid it. Because it's ineffective. It's marketing yuck.

When missionaries are living right they are guided by the Spirit. That includes I'm sure being inspired to knock on the right doors.

Soooo, if the 'right' doors don't get knocked (e.g. failure to make a sale) it's because God is punishing the missionaries for not living 'right' enough?

Because the reality is that unworthy missionaries are baptizing in huge numbers anywhere south of the border and parts of Africa. Hundreds. And unworthy.

But even the worthiest of all righteous men/women come home with zero baptisms almost anywhere else.

I think it also builds great skills in our young men. After returning from a mission, one of my sons knocked on doors as a salesman each summer and put himself through university.

Is it really all that great of a skill to be able to knock a door and pitch a sale? Is this what RM's have to look forward to when they get home? 'Welcome home, Elder. With your great door-knocking skills, you can tackle the world!' (Intentional dramatics.)

Seems to me your son was living right. He knocked on the 'right' doors during University to earn some money. :)

[Elphaba]

Man, I was over there defending our LDS religion and sharing my testimony and I see so much hate and disrespect spewed on the forum and chat room. I do not understand how other Christians can speak such hate towards another?

I used to spend time at CARM as well, and finally had to leave. It is a vile place when it comes to discussing Mormonism.

I am an ex-Mormon, but enjoy visiting different sites, and if I can, dispelling as many myths as possible about Morminism. More often than not, I found the forum's members glad for the clairifications. I'm not saying I found lots of these forums, as I did not. I'm just saying, of those I did find, they were usally grateful for my perspective.

So, when I found CARM, I thought I'd have the same experience, but it took me a while to realize they weren't interested in anything other than insisting The Godmakers was THE truth. When I adamantly insisted it was not, they accused me of being a troll, and lying about my ex-membership.

Thus my utter disdain for Ed Decker was born.

Elphaba

[WANDERER]

I have visited MAD...as a reader, not as a contributer. as the place is a kind of newbie poster hell. But the conversations are very interesting. While the discussions can be heated there are tangents in discussions that are worth investigating. Though it is a very closed kind of forum in my view...you wouldn't want to accidentally trigger off a religious lynching frenzy *LOL* although I would qualify it as much milder in reaction than you would get if you *trolled* (although trolls are few on the net...as in serious hobbyist trolls) a non-religious forum...depends on your perspective on things.

I may visit CARMS...perhaps.

Many are the forum lurkers and guests....I found it interesting that on one search I ended up trawling a conversation from as far back as 2002 for perspectives on something or other. There are some great conversations out there..and they are far more valid to read than FAIR or FARMS sometimes when you want a personal take on a belief.

[justamere10]

I can understand that. My family was a knocked family. But it's not the glamor game. It's the efficiency game.

Missionaries are taught in the MTC to avoid knocking doors like the plague. It's an activity for when there's absolutely NOTHING else that can be done. And if the missionaries begin thinking of knocking doors, they should explore every other option to avoid it. Because it's ineffective. It's marketing yuck.

Soooo, if the 'right' doors don't get knocked (e.g. failure to make a sale) it's because God is punishing the missionaries for not living 'right' enough?

Because the reality is that unworthy missionaries are baptizing in huge numbers anywhere south of the border and parts of Africa. Hundreds. And unworthy.

But even the worthiest of all righteous men/women come home with zero baptisms almost anywhere else.

Is it really all that great of a skill to be able to knock a door and pitch a sale? Is this what RM's have to look forward to when they get home? 'Welcome home, Elder. With your great door-knocking skills, you can tackle the world!' (Intentional dramatics.)

Seems to me your son was living right. He knocked on the 'right' doors during University to earn some money. :)

I don't think I said anything about God "punishing" missionaries.

Don't they teach the young missionaries at MTC's to be obedient to their mission president?

When mission presidents arrive at their new mission home they deliberately have very little if any time with the outgoing president. That is so each mission president relies on the Spirit. The Spirit may emphasize door knocking in some missions at some times.

Young men and women learn a great deal while serving missions that can transfer to useful knowledge for the rest of their lifetimes. That could include foreign language and culture, discipline, obedience, hard work, leadership, cooperation, personal revelation, charity...

Edited September 3, 2008 by justamere10

[ldsmissionary]

I don't think I said anything about God "punishing" missionaries.

It was, if missionaries live right, they're supposed to be guided to the 'right' doors.

What are we to derive from missionaries who knock their little fingers off but never make a sale? They weren't living right?

Don't they teach the young missionaries at MTC's to be obedient to their mission president?

Actually, missionaries at the MTC are taught to be obedient to the GOSPEL. Mission Presidents happen to have the great honor of hosting the missionaries during their time in the mission field.

Speaking back to the subject of door-knocking, mission presidents are being instructed to keep knocking to a minimum. It's a last resort of all of the possible mission activities that can be done.

When mission presidents arrive at their new mission home they deliberately have very little if any time with the outgoing president. That is so each mission president relies on the Spirit.

Deliberately? You have data to support this? My personal observation is that the new mission presidents are given adequate time with the outgoing mission presidents along with contact information to continue communication should anything come up down the road that needs clarification. The Area Authorities are also instructed to bend over backwards to make these transitions incredibly easy for the new mission presidents. If anything, the LDS church deliberately makes a tremendous effort to make new mission presidents' lives much easier than just 'drop 'em in the field and let the spirit guide.'

Young men and women learn a great deal while serving missions that can transfer to useful knowledge for the rest of their lifetimes. That could include foreign language and culture, discipline, obedience, hard work, leadership, cooperation, personal revelation, charity...

I completely agree. But we were talking about 'door-knocking' specifically, weren't we?