Abandon your child here

[ZionWoman]

Your opinion and I respect that. I guess I can see the need but I really wish that we weren't at a place where this was needed. I'm not even sure what Canada's policy is on this. I know that with universal health care and patient confidentiality and teen pregnancy and crisis centers, we almost never hear of abandonment issues.

There was an incident last year where a drunk father left his house late at night in the middles of a deep freeze (and I mean deep, -50 to -60 C, that's -58 to -78 F for y'all) and his half naked infant daughters followed him out and froze to death. Could we have helped them? I don't think you can catch everything.

This isn't helping my blue mood so I'm out fro awhile. I think I'll look at some funny cats...

[TeancumsSword]

These girls aren't being treated for their prenatal care, much less their postpartum care. In all the debate on this site about abortion, I am surprised to see disdain for a Safe Haven Law that provides women (YOUNG women, girls even) a safe alternative to abortion.

Disdain? Most of the posts have been supportive of it.

[ZionWoman]

I think she's reffering to me but I'm not sure

[Wingnut]

YThere was an incident last year where a drunk father left his house late at night in the middles of a deep freeze (and I mean deep, -50 to -60 C, that's -58 to -78 F for y'all) and his half naked infant daughters followed him out and froze to death. Could we have helped them? I don't think you can catch everything.

I guess I don't see what this has to do with a Safe Haven Law, other than that if this father had had the opportunity to leave his daughters at a hospital when they were newborns, this might not have happened. Also, if this father was such a terrible person, as the anecdote would indicate, why weren't these girls with their mother? Wouldn't that have been a better alternative?

And just to be petty, if they followed him, they weren't infants anymore.

[pam]

Your opinion and I respect that. I guess I can see the need but I really wish that we weren't at a place where this was needed. I'm not even sure what Canada's policy is on this. I know that with universal health care and patient confidentiality and teen pregnancy and crisis centers, we almost never hear of abandonment issues.

There was an incident last year where a drunk father left his house late at night in the middles of a deep freeze (and I mean deep, -50 to -60 C, that's -58 to -78 F for y'all) and his half naked infant daughters followed him out and froze to death. Could we have helped them? I don't think you can catch everything.

This isn't helping my blue mood so I'm out fro awhile. I think I'll look at some funny cats...

Not knowing the entire story on this father....it could be he was a very loving father but in the moment of being drunk did something extremely stupid. Quite different scenario if that were the case. Though before anyone says anything...no he shouldn't have been drunk with young children in his care.

[WANDERER]

The concept that doing certain things for people will encourage laziness

is paradoxical...

committing laziness by morally justified inaction?

Although the saying about stones and glass houses seems to occur to me LOL. (I'm not altogether without my own problems).

I like the idea of the safe shelters to look after kids for a time...I think there are quite a few who don't have a social support system in place and may need to access it without going to the lengths of abandonment. It's a good idea.

Edited November 22, 2008 by WANDERER

[ZionWoman]

Okay, Just one more before, I leave.

I guess what I want to know is what is being done for the PARENT and the rest of the family? It's good to save the child, I'll concede but would you just turn your back on the child's mom?

Do we not believe that Heavenly Father sent this child to this parent for a reason? Would this child not be an influence for good in the life of the parent? Some of you have overcome some appalling childhoods. Would you feel better if you were abandoned? Really?

By all means. Throw away your problems. Give them to the State to deal with. Why should you have to deal with it yourself? :rant:

[Guest SisterofJared]

Maybe HF didn't sent the child to those parents... perhaps he sent that child to the adoptive parents, and this is the route for them to get there.

SoJ

[Guest Alana]

I know that cases of abuse and neglect, even extreme ones, aren't that uncommon. In my mind (not sure if this is reality) the parents that are abandoning their children are the ones that turn to, or would soon turn to, abuse or neglect. If it saves a child from that, then I am all for this law going to age 18. It isn't as though bad parents call up child protective service and say 'hey, I'm going to beat my kid if they don't shut it, will you come get him, and then take me to jail?'

[Jenamarie]

Okay, Just one more before, I leave.

I guess what I want to know is what is being done for the PARENT and the rest of the family? It's good to save the child, I'll concede but would you just turn your back on the child's mom?

Do we not believe that Heavenly Father sent this child to this parent for a reason? Would this child not be an influence for good in the life of the parent? Some of you have overcome some appalling childhoods. Would you feel better if you were abandoned? Really?

By all means. Throw away your problems. Give them to the State to deal with. Why should you have to deal with it yourself? :rant:

But when these people decide that their children are "problems", it's the children who suffer. You can't force people to "deal with it".

In my DH's extended family, there is most deffinately one example of someone who wishes her parents had just abdoned her. They did not want a daughter (they raised three older sons just fine, with no issues) and took out their dislike of her by keeping food from her and sexually assaulting her for years. As an adult she spent months as an in-patient at a mental institution, and several years as an out-patient to work through the baggage they left her with. The parents didn't WANT to deal with their disdain of having a daughter (at least not in a positive way), and back when this happened there weren't the social services there are now to help protect children in these kinds of situations.

Sure, she's an absolutely wonderful person now, and lives a wonderful life, but that's IN SPITE of what she had to overcome, not because of it.

(but then I'm also not one to believe that everything happens for a reason. sometimes things happen because people make horrible decisions)

[pam]

Would you feel better if you were abandoned?

If I were an abused child, had to deal with being sexually abused, had no food to eat, had dirty clothes, had parents who obviously didn't love me...then yes...abandonment might actually be a relief. At least then I might have the chance to go to a family that would treat me otherwise.

[countrygirl66]

Okay, Just one more before, I leave.

I guess what I want to know is what is being done for the PARENT and the rest of the family? It's good to save the child, I'll concede but would you just turn your back on the child's mom?

Do we not believe that Heavenly Father sent this child to this parent for a reason? Would this child not be an influence for good in the life of the parent? Some of you have overcome some appalling childhoods. Would you feel better if you were abandoned? Really?

By all means. Throw away your problems. Give them to the State to deal with. Why should you have to deal with it yourself? :rant:

I understand your frustration. In a perfect world we would be able to work with the mom and the dad. Unfortunately you can't make someone be responsible, you can't make someone use birth control, and you can't make someone realize the gift they have been given. I have often wondered why 8 of us came through the birth mom we did. She was not an effective parent for any of us. I have thought a lot about the fact that we come here to get bodies. Sexual sin does produce children. If heavenly father only sent children to those willing to love and raise them, then sexual sin would have no consequences. So I think we just do the best we can. If at all possible even if they abandon the baby, the state tries to work with the parent. I think there was a reason that I received my body through my birth mom. Not sure what it is, but that is what feels right to me. It is sad though that so much in tax dollars to to take care of these kinds of problems. And it is a lot of money. I think in the preexistance that i loved my bio mom and heavenly father had a pretty good idea of what would happen here. But I did get my body and wasn't aborted.

[Wingnut]

I understand your frustration. In a perfect world we would be able to work with the mom and the dad. Unfortunately you can't make someone be responsible, you can't make someone use birth control, and you can't make someone realize the gift they have been given.

That's why I vote for sterilization of stupid people.

I have often wondered why 8 of us came through the birth mom we did. She was not an effective parent for any of us. I have thought a lot about the fact that we come here to get bodies. Sexual sin does produce children. If heavenly father only sent children to those willing to love and raise them, then sexual sin would have no consequences. So I think we just do the best we can. If at all possible even if they abandon the baby, the state tries to work with the parent. I think there was a reason that I received my body through my birth mom. Not sure what it is, but that is what feels right to me. It is sad though that so much in tax dollars to to take care of these kinds of problems. And it is a lot of money. I think in the preexistance that i loved my bio mom and heavenly father had a pretty good idea of what would happen here. But I did get my body and wasn't aborted.

Wow...thanks for sharing your experiences and feelings. I think you make an excellent point about sexual sin and its consequences.

One of my lifelong best friends (I've known her since I was 7) is adopted. She was born to a 16-year-old LDS girl who hoped to straighten her life out. She was adopted into a loving LDS family. I never asked her until about two years ago if she was interested in finding her birth mother at all. She told me that she really wasn't. She didn't see any reason to. She knew who her family was, she loved them, they loved her, she never felt unwanted, and she had been sealed to her adoptive family. That was the important part for her.

[Moksha]

I believe Nebraska's law allows for the abandonment of 16 and 17 year olds. I imagine this thought of "what if", might cross the mind of all Nebraska parents of teens that age.

30 days on the new law? Nevermind.

[Guest SisterofJared]

I don't get it... why do people say these things about teenagers?

I LOVE teenagers! That is such a rewarding time as a parent.... you see kids developing and using good judgement, that is an exciting time!

I taught seminary for years and the most exciting thing on earth is a 15 year old saying, "Can you explain that scripture to me?!

You don't have to change their diapers, you don't have to spoon feed them, you don't have to stop them from swinging on the curtains on the stage at church, at church dinners you don't have to fill their plates.

Instead you pick them up after school, and say How was your day? And then listen while they tell you about their day, their friend's day, the crisis in their friends lives, the stupidity of some teachers, the good things they want to do for others.... etc etc etc. Teenagers are the BEST!

People say "Teenagers!" then shudder as if a teenager was a nasty beast. I think the teens are AWESOME years! Especially rewarding as a parents!

Sister of Jared

[sanguine]

Okay, Just one more before, I leave.

I guess what I want to know is what is being done for the PARENT and the rest of the family? It's good to save the child, I'll concede but would you just turn your back on the child's mom?

Do we not believe that Heavenly Father sent this child to this parent for a reason? Would this child not be an influence for good in the life of the parent? Some of you have overcome some appalling childhoods. Would you feel better if you were abandoned? Really?

By all means. Throw away your problems. Give them to the State to deal with. Why should you have to deal with it yourself? :rant:

Do you believe every child goes to a chosen parent. I'm sure my adoptive mother (also a blood relative) should NOT have adopted me. I wish she'd dumped me. It's better than dealing with someone who beats, plays planned mind games, constantly belittles and makes attempts on a child's life. It's not worse than being abandoned.

'Throwing away their problems? who's? Iif they don't dump, it's the child problem. It's the child who, can often be abused, never found out by social services, never protected.

If the child is not dumped, the 'problem' can go on for generations to generation, unless a child is able to over come. Many do, many don't.

[skippy740]

The safe haven law is about the parent and the child.

If the parent feels trapped (no matter how true or untrue it may really be), then what is the new mother to do? The responsible ones research their options and go with what's best for their baby. The irresponsible ones end up putting the baby at a great risk - one way or another. Dumpsters have been mentioned before.

I can't believe how a feeling human being can put a gift from our Heavenly Father such like a newborn child to wrap them up in a trash bag and leave them with stinky, smelly garbage. I don't get it.

But I don't have to. I simply want there to be an alternative for these young people who made stupid decisions and are about to make one of their most foolish decisions they can make.

At least they didn't ABORT the baby by this time. But sticking the baby in a dumpster is not only abandonment, but is many times considered attempted murder.

The child deserves more than that - simply because the child cannot make any decisions for themselves.

Now, is the safe haven law perfect? No. No law can be perfect unless we had perfect people who know about the laws and will follow them. As was stated before - you cannot legislate people into perfection. Laws are guidelines of following life. Ethics and morals are the only way for people to live a more perfect life.

In California, we had a proposition regarding the requirement for unwed teenage expectant mothers to require that their parents are notified that they are expecting a child. This was voted against because of other family issues. Not all families are loving. Many have child molesters, beatings and other things that (I would guess) a semi-responsible teenage mother wouldn't want for their own child - let alone letting a family like that know about this pregnancy and opening up a new can of worms in the family.

Bottom line: The famly is at risk. If there is no love in a family, sometimes the best love a mother can give is to give the child up to a family where there is love. There are too many families that are completely dis-functional out there.

Just watch some episodes of "COPS" or the "Maury Povich show" sometime and you'll get a sense of the kinds of families that the Safe Haven law was designed for. It wasn't meant for families like "The Huxtables". Let's give the unprepared mothers a way out from their foolish decision and give the child a chance at a much better life.