bytor2112 Posted July 25, 2009 Report Share Posted July 25, 2009 I spent about an hour at CARM!!!! :eek: I had no idea, how much we (LDS) are hated. The anger is........unbelievable. I don't think I read a single thread with a polite poster. Talking about berating any LDS poster and with as much venom and vitriol as possible. And the shocker....these pious folks all claim to be Christians???? If I weren't LDS, I would be appalled at the nastiness on display. Shocking. Honestly, it has really started to reshape my thinking and trust toward members of other faiths. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
beefche Posted July 25, 2009 Report Share Posted July 25, 2009 Honestly, it has really started to reshape my thinking and trust toward members of other faiths.Why? Don't you have any friends of other faiths?Sure, I've been on some of those sites. I've met some people who hate Mormons. But my family and friends of other faiths arent' that hateful. They recognize our common beliefs and accept me. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bytor2112 Posted July 25, 2009 Author Report Share Posted July 25, 2009 I do have friends from other faiths...... it's the ones I don't know that bother me. I am sure I will feel differently when my skin stops crawling. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
James_Fryman Posted July 25, 2009 Report Share Posted July 25, 2009 (edited) yeah that was the responce I first had you shouldnt let this small group effect your opinion on the rest of different faiths Edited July 25, 2009 by James_Fryman Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
puf_the_majic_dragon Posted July 25, 2009 Report Share Posted July 25, 2009 The minority always has the loudest voice. Most non-LDS Christians are great people who most often have no opinion one way or the other regarding Mormons. But the small minority who absolutely hate us are never content to be quiet about it - they have to make themselves heard. It's like Islam. Most Muslims are the nicest people you'll ever meet (I know from experience - nicer than most Mormons too). But the small minority that hate us are the ones catching all the attention. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bytor2112 Posted July 25, 2009 Author Report Share Posted July 25, 2009 I feel a bit like a kid that went to a new neighborhood expecting to make some new friends and instead was ran out by a mob with pitch forks. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moksha Posted July 25, 2009 Report Share Posted July 25, 2009 Bytor, from past readings on the MAD forum, it would seem that a few fellow Mormons have preceded you there and may have muddied the waters. It seems so self-defeating and ironic when Christians of any stripe would attack rather than embrace one another. Attacking the non-creedal believer is something that Jesus definitely would not do. :) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
prisonchaplain Posted July 25, 2009 Report Share Posted July 25, 2009 You went to a neighborhood dedicated to protecting evangelical doctrine from the likes of you, and expected to make some new friends??? Once I visited Scofield Church, in Dallas, TX. Scofield (you might have heard of the Scofield Study Bible) was the developer of Dispensationalism. One of it's primary tenets is that spiritual gifts, such as prophecy, tongues and interpretation, even most healing, just doesn't happen anymore. That was for "the Apostolic Age." We're now in "The Church Age." So, needless to say, I was a bit timid, being a pentecostal seminary student at the time. Also, the church is crawling with Dallas Theological Seminary students. So, when my friend introduces me as a seminary student, and the church member says, "Oh, do you go to DTS?" I simply say, "No." Where do you go? "Oh, I go to a school up in Missouri." . . . Hey, we're all Christians, we'll be in heaven, and no, I didn't visit this church to stir up some theological fires...just came to visit a friend who happens to go here. Yes, websites remove a lot of our inhibitions. But, they also remove some very appropriate parameters of ettiquette. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Snow Posted July 25, 2009 Report Share Posted July 25, 2009 You went to a neighborhood dedicated to protecting evangelical doctrine from the likes of you, and expected to make some new friends???Except that is not what they do. They aren't interested in protecting doctrine (I'm fairly certain that love, charity, and honesty are evangelical doctrines). What they are interested in is pumping up their lack of self-worth by demeaning the good intentions of others... if others are lower than they, they think themselves relatively better off. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jorsen Posted July 25, 2009 Report Share Posted July 25, 2009 I spent about an hour at CARM!!!! :eek: I had no idea, how much we (LDS) are hated. The anger is........unbelievable. I don't think I read a single thread with a polite poster. Talking about berating any LDS poster and with as much venom and vitriol as possible. And the shocker....these pious folks all claim to be Christians???? If I weren't LDS, I would be appalled at the nastiness on display. Shocking. Honestly, it has really started to reshape my thinking and trust toward members of other faiths.I understand what you mean...I've been investigating the church heavily...I would often read as much anti-Mormon material as possible and then turn around and read the opposite. I would read and compare and in general I found that the positive messages of the church were much more compelling than the negative 'spirit' if you will coming from anti websites.In the end, I had to make a choice with my spirit guiding my final decision. Looking at both sides with compelling arguments, it was a difficult decision to decide what was truth or not.The funny thing is, even while I was an investigator (I'll be getting baptized tonight at 8:30pm EST) I found myself defending the church when I would hear in regular conversation blatant lies and half truths. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bytebear Posted July 25, 2009 Report Share Posted July 25, 2009 It's funny, you can actually feel the spirit very strongly on anti-Mormon websites. It is that sick feeling in the pit of your stomach that tells you that the people spewing hate are not of God. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Seanette Posted July 25, 2009 Report Share Posted July 25, 2009 The funny thing is, even while I was an investigator (I'll be getting baptized tonight at 8:30pm EST) I found myself defending the church when I would hear in regular conversation blatant lies and half truths.Congratulations and welcome, Brother! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
James_Fryman Posted July 26, 2009 Report Share Posted July 26, 2009 The funny thing is, even while I was an investigator (I'll be getting baptized tonight at 8:30pm EST) I found myself defending the church when I would hear in regular conversation blatant lies and half truths.Yay a new member!!!!! And thank you for defending the church :) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StallionMcBeastly Posted July 26, 2009 Report Share Posted July 26, 2009 Dude, Bytor, I know exactly what you mean. They don't respectfully disagree with LDS over at CARM, they tear you and your beliefs down and mock you. Their arrogance and condescension is incredible. Sometimes it's a good laugh at just HOW far they will go to say anything they can to bash mormon people. On the CARM forum, the website won't let you make only a few worded post, so I added a few "... .... ... .. .. .. ." after so I could still post it. They jumped on me and said I was being dishonest and a cheater, and that that was typical for someone from my church. It can get pretty crazy lol Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
prisonchaplain Posted July 26, 2009 Report Share Posted July 26, 2009 Except that is not what they do. They aren't interested in protecting doctrine (I'm fairly certain that love, charity, and honesty are evangelical doctrines). What they are interested in is pumping up their lack of self-worth by demeaning the good intentions of others... if others are lower than they, they think themselves relatively better off. Well, you might be a more insightful psychologist than I. But, I'll meet you 1/10th of the way, and edit my post to say that they aim to defend CERTAIN evangelical doctrines... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Snow Posted July 26, 2009 Report Share Posted July 26, 2009 Well, you might be a more insightful psychologist than I. But, I'll meet you 1/10th of the way, and edit my post to say that they aim to defend CERTAIN evangelical doctrines... If by defending doctrine, you mean boundary maintenance, I'll agree.I think that it is easily demonstrated that they do NOT defend correct evangelical doctrines. It goes something like this:1. Salvation by faith only (in Christ as the Savior) is an evangelical doctrine.2. I am LDS.3. I have faith in Christ as the Savior.4. I, according to posters at Carms, not saved - thus disproving their belief in item #1.or you can go this route:1. Sola scriptura is an evangelical belief.2. It is not acceptable to them that I accept the Bible. They require that I interpret the Bible according to their belief system, thus negating number 1 by required something outside the Bible to dictate what I believe of the Bible.3. Their most foundational belief is the trinity - a non-Biblical concept - thus contradicting number 1. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest missingsomething Posted July 26, 2009 Report Share Posted July 26, 2009 I spent about an hour at CARM!!!! :eek: I had no idea, how much we (LDS) are hated. The anger is........unbelievable. I don't think I read a single thread with a polite poster. Talking about berating any LDS poster and with as much venom and vitriol as possible. And the shocker....these pious folks all claim to be Christians???? If I weren't LDS, I would be appalled at the nastiness on display. Shocking. Honestly, it has really started to reshape my thinking and trust toward members of other faiths.By...In many ways, we all have some kind of misdirected righteousness. Even within our church this happens... with the new member who doesnt meet standards right away... or the family who barely makes it... or the member who still smokes.... Just most of the time there is not the venom as there is with other people.Remember, most of them get this way from one of two reasons: they were raised this way and are essentially numb to the spirit, or they are here to content with us as the prophets have warned us would be around and to avoid interaction with them.You are sampling a select few. You wouldnt want others judging our religion on the few whack jobs (a few come to mind hehe) who are members. I posted in another thread that just because you are a member (now of any religion) does not mean you adhere to those standards, teachings, etc.Piece of advice - (even with this site, though much more milder there are those who wish to stir people up here too).... AVOID THEM. No sense getting upset with them. Remember, spirit of contention... not worth it.BTW- Hi buddy - long time no see. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
prisonchaplain Posted July 26, 2009 Report Share Posted July 26, 2009 If by defending doctrine, you mean boundary maintenance, I'll agree.1. Salvation by faith only (in Christ as the Savior) is an evangelical doctrine. 2. I am LDS. 3. I have faith in Christ as the Savior. 4. I, according to posters at Carms, not saved - thus disproving their belief in item #1. or you can go this route:1. Sola scriptura is an evangelical belief. 2. It is not acceptable to them that I accept the Bible. They require that I interpret the Bible according to their belief system, thus negating number 1 by required something outside the Bible to dictate what I believe of the Bible. 3. Their most foundational belief is the trinity - a non-Biblical concept - thus contradicting number 1. Or, this route: Evangelicals believe that you are saved by grace, through faith alone. Can you really submit to God's unmerited grace, if you believe you are worthy because you've done all you can? (Note, this is a question, not a conclusion) If you believe in a Bible that is submitted to other, non-canonical writings, than can you truly say you believe only in the Bible as your souce of truth? Finally, if you do not believe the Trinity is biblical, and CARM does, is it surprising that they suggest you don't share "like precious faith?" Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Heavenguard Posted July 26, 2009 Report Share Posted July 26, 2009 (edited) I'm not surprised; I was raised Baptist. I'd never really heard anything particularly anti-Mormon my entire life, but there was always the attitude that the LDS were bad people that threatened the Gospel, but I never knew what was so bad about them Mormon folk. So I decided to find out for myself. (Cue LDS.net's entry here.) And now I can see it from both sides. But you know what? It's not just the LDS. It's a general thing that the Church does not get along with differing ideas. I look at the way the church (or at least the part of the church that's vocal enough to get their agenda out) treats people of differing sexuality. My personal opinion is that we need to approach it with love, but instead, I do see the angry mob with pitchforks that Bytor saw at CARM - and this whether Evangelical Christians or LDS. Really, the single most important thing in any relationship between any two people or two groups of people is recognizing the other person, or other group, as individual person/s. When we fail to recognize there's a whole, individual person there that is not defined by that one difference, it is impossible to understand, and so also impossible to love, that person. Edited July 26, 2009 by Heavenguard Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bytor2112 Posted July 26, 2009 Author Report Share Posted July 26, 2009 Bytor, from past readings on the MAD forum, it would seem that a few fellow Mormons have preceded you there and may have muddied the waters. It seems so self-defeating and ironic when Christians of any stripe would attack rather than embrace one another. Attacking the non-creedal believer is something that Jesus definitely would not do.:)I recently started posting at MADB and I gathered that as well.....actually, that's where I learned about CARM. That being said, I assumed that most forums were moderated to be civil to another....particularly religious forums. I have already realized that MADB is a bit more edgy than lds.net and CARM is......well, a bit shocking, really contentious. But, yeah, I second your thought in bold. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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