re: Last minute Halloween thread

[prisonchaplain]

When I was a kid only the Jehovah's Witneeses avoided Halloween. Now all my conservative evangelical friends are agin' it. Me too. Utlimately, it does seem to center on death, often encouraging curiosity about ghosts, communicating with the dead, etc. So, rather than get ugly and tell people their pagans for doing it, we developed our alternatives. Harvest Festivals, Hallelujah Nights, and giving out treats with little Bible verses included.

No condemnation for those who fully participate...but even if we think it's all secular, don't we kinda suggest that the Devil is a joke, when he's not? Enquiring minds want to know.

[Generally_Me]

Here PC, I read this earlier today and thought of it when I read your post.

The Danger of Celebrating Halloween: Spiritual Life in God

[prisonchaplain]

G_M...I just scanned through...seems our friends at the 700 Club put forth a pretty sensationalistic version of it. My thing is not so much the pagan origins, but that unlike Christmas and New Years, people do not think of Jesus or even past saints on this day. It's all about death, horror, and, for most in this country, thinking of demons, Satan and death as a big joke. That train of thought may be as delusional spiritually, as really trafficking in such things.

[Maureen]

I'm not sure it's all about death. This year some popular ideas for halloween costumes or characters/couples is Jon and Kate (from Jon and Kate plus 8) and Kanye West and Taylor Swift. :)

M.

[pam]

Actually one of my son's friends said they are going to dress up as Kanye West and hide in the bushes. Just as a kid says Trick or Treat he's going to jump out and take the candy while saying..."Christmas is better."

Edited October 31, 2009 by pam

[talisyn]

I don't see how my daughter dressing up as a kitten is a bad thing...Face it, Halloween like so many other things in this world has gone way beyond it's humble nature-pagan ways into capitalism.

From the Wiki (I can't stay away from it )

Samhain - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

A harvest festival with ancient roots in Celtic paganism, it was linked to festivals held around the same time in other Celtic cultures, and continued to be celebrated in late medieval times.

Samhain marked the end of the harvest, the end of the "lighter half" of the year and beginning of the "darker half". Many scholars believe that it was the beginning of the Celtic year.[2][3][4] It has some elements of a festival of the dead. The Gaels believed that the border between this world and the otherworld became thin on Samhain.

[Bini]

To be honest, I'm not very familiar with the traditional pagan Halloween, it's always just been harmless fun when celebrated with family and friends. So I couldn't tell ya what the original meaning of Halloween is or was. All I know, is that I spend waaay too much money on costumes every year and always buy waaay too much candy than trick-or-treaters show up.

[candyprpl]

I see your point PC. I thought I better post since I changed my avatar for the day, ha!

I have feelings for both sides of the issue. As a kid every year I went as a witch. Not because I thought about what a witch was about but because I like the store bought costume. I liked the hat and the dress,ha. When my kids were little we (meaning each child and I) would think of what they wanted to be and I would then design and make the costume. My son was the most creative. He never came up with anything goulish -- always something very unique. My favorite costume for my daughter was when she was three when the smurfs were popular I made a white dress and smurf hat and used blue eye shadow to put on her face. She looked adorable!!

I've noticed that since being a member of the LDS church and going to the 'trunk or treat' activities in the church parking lot that the kids seem to just have cute costumes -- some of the young men will have dracula teeth or something like that, just to get some candy. I don't know, confused, seems harmless to me, but I do get your point PC.

[Gwen]

maybe i'm missing something here but why does death have to be about satan? death is a part of life, part of the plan god created.... not sure i agree with making it something that is dark/evil.

as for halloween i think a lot of ppl do make it about monsters and dark/evil things. i don't like that. as a family i keep it less focused on that. the kids dress up in reasonable costumes, my 5 yr old is being a rodeo clown this yr, nothing evil/dark. we don't go to the houses that focus on those things.

one thing that i have noticed this yr that has bothered me. even though i keep halloween "good fun" for our family i can't stop what the world is doing (which would be the same if we canceled all together). the world i think is getting more dark in their vision of it. my kids seem to be responding negativly to the images they keep seeing. having trouble sleeping, asking questions about it, it's clear they are uncomfortable.... my 8 yr old has started pausing shows so he can fast forward the commercials so they don't scare everyone. not sure how to handle this one yet.

[ADoyle90815]

Halloween is just harmless fun for me, and as long as parents are directly involved by walking with their kids to doors or to cars in a church parking lot, it can be safe. There are plenty of costumes available that are not scary at all, so people can chose not to to wear something considered evil.

Personally, I think the "sexy" costume trend is even worse than scary costumes, especially for girls and women so I refuse to wear anything like that.

[prisonchaplain]

I'm not sure it's all about death. This year some popular ideas for halloween costumes or characters/couples is Jon and Kate (from Jon and Kate plus 8) and Kanye West and Taylor Swift. :)

M.

Scarier than death, eh?

[prisonchaplain]

To be honest, I'm not very familiar with the traditional pagan Halloween, it's always just been harmless fun when celebrated with family and friends. So I couldn't tell ya what the original meaning of Halloween is or was. All I know, is that I spend waaay too much money on costumes every year and always buy waaay too much candy than trick-or-treaters show up.

The central purpose of Samhain was channeling spirits--communing with the dead. Such efforts are still made today. This intermixing of death and life, and the general belief survive. Thus the prolific skulls and skeletons. Even Jack O Lattern, represents a soul caught between heaven and hell, wandering the earth. Sure, the details and the paganism have washed out over history. But the holiday remains "dark," "death-oriented," and again, the fact that so many consider it "secular fun," suggests the subtle message that death, Satan, evil, perhaps even life, are all trivial...that it's all a joke.

Rather than condeming the culture though, better to build some bridges and offer better messages. So, rather than a wet blanket, I'd suggest some "innocent as lambs, wise as serpents" thinking. How might we redeem this opportunity for gospel, without being ridiculous?

[prisonchaplain]

maybe i'm missing something here but why does death have to be about satan? death is a part of life, part of the plan god created.... not sure i agree with making it something that is dark/evil.

as for halloween i think a lot of ppl do make it about monsters and dark/evil things. i don't like that. as a family i keep it less focused on that. the kids dress up in reasonable costumes, my 5 yr old is being a rodeo clown this yr, nothing evil/dark. we don't go to the houses that focus on those things.

one thing that i have noticed this yr that has bothered me. even though i keep halloween "good fun" for our family i can't stop what the world is doing (which would be the same if we canceled all together). the world i think is getting more dark in their vision of it. my kids seem to be responding negativly to the images they keep seeing. having trouble sleeping, asking questions about it, it's clear they are uncomfortable.... my 8 yr old has started pausing shows so he can fast forward the commercials so they don't scare everyone. not sure how to handle this one yet.

You answer your own questions about why death, which should be passage for us, is neverthless dark and scary. That's Halloween's message. Sounds like you handle it pretty well...

BTW Somebody mentioned "trunk or treat." That's one of the more common responses of churches...make the gospel message sweet. As for my house, we'll hand out candy bags with a slip of paper containing John 3:16 on it.

[Gwen]

i don't think my kids see death as part of halloween. they see the monsters and such. we talk about death at all different times of the year and though yes it's sad and scary not the same kind of scary that the evil dark is (like halloween or even other times of the yr).

i guess my issue was the phrasing of the question... i understand the question of why does halloween have to move toward so much focus on evil and dark things and how do you feel about/handle it... but the throwing death in that.... to me death seemed out of place... lol maybe just me. however, i don't like the trend toward murder for halloween like most of the movies do. to me murder and death are different.

but anyway.

i think the trunk-or-treat is a good idea but our small branch it's just not practicle. we have a good and friendly neighborhood. we walk the kids around, it's used as an odd chance to catch up with the neighbors, we stop and chat at many of the houses. lol benefit of a small town?

here is something i don't get, another halloween trend, is not dressing up. we get a lot of kids that just run through the neighborhoods with an empty walmart bag to collect candy in... they don't even try to dress up. i hate all the poorly made expensive store bought costumes... whatever happened to using some creativity and making your own costume?

[bcguy]

Once I dressed in a gorilla suit and hid inside the bushes just outside the front door, as soon as the kids recived the candy, I would growl, move the bushes about and come out. Well alot of kids ran screaming hehe :) But one kid, stood there petrified. I though ohh this is funny, I played my part, and he was litterly, frozen stiff in fear. He did not flinch or move, for a good solid minite. I was now, a little concerned. mom was yelling at him to come, and he did not budge. Finally, he broke out of his zombie like state and ran like the wind.

That was a good nigh

I want to try and really make a eleaborate holloween setup some time with computer controled animatronics and pnumatics :)

[Bini]

Thanks for that, prisonchaplain.

But Halloween has and always will be just for fun. At least to me. I don't even think about all the other stuff, that other stuff being anything other than, costume and candy.. And anymore it's just a commercialised holiday like anything else. I don't think many kids (young ones anyway) even know where Halloween originated from and I don't think many parents do either. It's just a tradition of costume parties and lots and lots of sweets!