Marriage help

[Luvmikds]

I need help. My husband has problems. I've tried to have a good relationship with him despite things but I blew it Sunday. A lot of Sundays he will mutter not nice things under his breath about other people. He hates home teaching and complains when our home teacher wants to come. Something inside me snapped Sunday when he not only began the muttering but dodged out the door knowing the 1st counselor has been trying to talk to him for the past month for a calling. So I went to the counselor and asked him not to give my husband a calling or make him a home teacher. I also told him not to give us home teachers.

I get home, my husband acts like everything is alright so I tell him it won't be a problem anymore and explained what I did. He was very upset and said I had not right. It was not my place to say anything. He said he wasn't going to church anymore. Two days later, the problem is esclating to temper tantrums and braking things. This isn't the first time I've dealt with his temper but I'm feeling it may be the last. I can't live like this and it's hard on my youngest son as well.

Any suggestions on how I can fix this or should I just pack my bags and call it good?

thanks

[ryanh]

First, You asked for "suggestions on how I can fix this". Just be sure you understand you cannot fix this. He has to fix who he is, and what he is doing wrong. Talking to a member of the ward about him when he didn't want that is not such a huge mistake that it takes great steps to fix it. Shouldn't your husband be thinking about casting the beam out of his own eye first?

Have you tried counseling? If he is unwilling, that may be the sign that he is unwilling to work on the marriage. And, as I had to be reminded by a friend recently, any marriage takes two people desperately working to make it successful. If it is only you trying to make it work, it generally won't work.

I worry that given the nature of his actions, you are falling into the trap of the abused. Sure, talking to the first counselor might not have been the best of all possible choices, but you did not make a huge mistake that needs fixing, or justifies a temper tantrum.

My assignment for you: Visit You Are Not Crazy

[Guest mormonmusic]

I agree it was a mistake to go to the 1st Counselor unilaterally, without your husband's consent.

Marriage counselors call this "independent behavior" where you make important decisions that affect both of you, without consulting your spouse. He might think this affects his reputation in the Ward and now feels embarrassed to go or a host of other feelings that are distancing him from the Church. It sounds like his own temperament also has a lot to do with this as well, so I wouldn't blame yourself for the whole outcome.

First, I'd try to make that part of it right. I might apologize for going behind his back like that, citing your motive in the first place was to make him happy and resolve the situation; you didn't know or think it might upset him. Also, you might ask if there anything that you can do to fix the problem, or just to leave it alone -- let it be his decision what steps need to happen going forward, and accept it as his right to make that decision out of respect for him. He needs to move past the anger he's feeling about this issue so you can discuss your marriage as a whole, and I think this will help.

On his end, he's suffering from Angry Outburts, another love-busting feature of marriages that causes love to drain from a relationship. He needs to recognize that he suffers from this problem and to learn to manage his anger so he's not alienating you and your son. This suggests anger management coaching is necessary for him; consider getting him some professional help or books on the subject.

But over the long term -- whether you should just up and leave. Dallin H. Oakes gave a talk about marriage, and said that often the aftermath of divorce is worse than the original marriage was -- consider that.

So, if your physical safety isn't at risk (or your son's) and because this represents the major issue in your marriage, I suggest telling him how his outbursts are affecting you, and that you feel yourself withdrawing from the relationship; that things have to change because you can't live like this....often people just up and quit on relationships without letting their spouse know how far they've fallen out of the relationship. I hope this doesn't happen here if he's not fully aware of how withdrawn you're becoming from your relationship with him. Also, when one spouse learns the other is considering leaving, it often unfreezes reluctant attitudes and motivates them to change their behavior -- assuming they too haven't withdrawn from the relationship.

Also, go to Marriage Builders ® - Successful Marriage Advice and read over the 10 needs spouses have, and the 5 Love busters to stop if they are happening. Encourage him to read it too and let you know the marriage is in crisis -- give him a chance to know this and take steps to change.

My wife and I had some extraordinary circumstances in our marriage, not really of our own choosing at first, and we both had periods of withdrawal like you're feeling. Discussing it, while it wasn't always pretty, helped us both make steps to change because ultimately, we still wanted the marriage to work. The Marriage Builders ® - Successful Marriage Advice site really helped us out a lot. We are happy now, and I believe this possible for many couples who want to work at it.

Edited December 1, 2009 by mormonmusic

[Misshalfway]

Frankly, I don't know what exactly is the problem here. Is this a man who has a violent temper and this is just the final straw? Or is this a man who is going through a crisis of faith with a wife who doesn't understand and who is overly controlling things? Frankly, I would have been a little bent had my H called the bishop like you did. That would have been my call to make and my struggle to rectify. Not that you don't have right to have concerns about his behaviors but according to this post, I see that perhaps you aren't communicating or listening or diagnosing the problem correctly. I am reading taht you are only impatient because your husband isn't doing the expected "mormon" life the way you think he should. When was the last time you sat down and asked him his feelings and learned what his needs were? Are you afraid that he isn't being righteous? Is there a place in your mind that could open up to make a place for him to safely work thru some concerns without needing him to follow the mormon program?

I guess I need more info before I say anything specific. Until then, I would say that it appears as if both of you are contributing to you own marital unhappiness and it might be good to take an honest and kind inventory of the HOW and the WHY behind the breakdowns. I think often marriages fail because the people involved dont' have the emotional/relational tools to help things work better and they get too exasperated and impatient instead of getting educated to find a better way. Not that I don't understand exasperation in marriage........

[BenRaines]

In all fairness is there one like this for men?

Ben Raines

[Misshalfway]

Excellent post, Mormonmusic. You said it better than I did.

[thekabalist]

Excuse my intrusion as I'm not LDS but I am a married man. It sounds like your husband didn't like church activity in the first place. Your attitude simply gave him the excuse for him to do what he wanted and couldn't because he couldn't find a good and convincing reason not to like church activity.

I would recommend paying attention to whether his anger outbursts are his way of getting out of what he considers a dead-end. It certainly is in this particular situation but could it be that he does this often? If so then you should consider pointing this out to him as he may not have realized it. Or if you think that'll be bad then you could work on the dialogue. Anger bursts also conceal guilt and it could be that he feels lost as to how to make this marriage work and his anger bursts are just a way to externalize this inner pressure while at the same time taking the focus off his own difficulties. After all if you are the problem then he is not incapable of dealing with this. These are good places to start.

b'shalom!

[Gwen]

It sounds like your husband didn't like church activity in the first place. Your attitude simply gave him the excuse for him to do what he wanted and couldn't because he couldn't find a good and convincing reason not to like church activity.

about the specific situation mentioned this was my first thought. it's an excuse to do what he wanted to do anyway, blame it on you.

as for if the marriage is over or not.. only you will know where that line is or when that time comes. sorry, i know not very helpful.

[NeuroTypical]

Yep - in my marriage, the most stressful things we've had to overcome have been the unilateral decisions one of us has made without consulting the other. Those don't make things better, they make things worse.

Sounds like you and your husband will never get anywhere together, until you both can view the other as someone who is basically good and wants good things, but are having problems. Y'all are supposed to be each other's helpmeet. You can't change him, you can just work on your end of things.

LM

[RachelleDrew]

Your husband certainly needs to get help for his temper if he's having outbursts.....But was going to the bishop really necessary? The only two outcomes of you going behind his back are;

1. He's happy that you did it because it means he doesn't have to accept responsibility for his callings or learn how to say "no" when he feels he can not or should not perform something that is asked of him. He has to learn how to do this for HIMSELF.

or

2. He's not happy because you undermined him and went behind his back to make a decision for him. This leads him to believe that you don't respect him.

Either way, the result of your actions would not have been positive. I think you owe him an apology....I would agree that he needs professional help, but you sound like you could BOTH benefit from marriage counseling as you seem to have a bit of a communication problem.

I'm not blaming you for his anger issues, but you aren't blameless in this particular situation.

[mrmarklin]

Two days later, the problem is esclating to temper tantrums and braking things. This isn't the first time I've dealt with his temper but I'm feeling it may be the last. I can't live like this and it's hard on my youngest son as well.

Any suggestions on how I can fix this or should I just pack my bags and call it good?

thanks

You shouldn't have gone behind his back, that was wrong.

But the temper tantrums are certainly not normal, and are unacceptable in an adult.

Your problems cut deep, and the only way that this can be resolved is through marraige counseling. If unsolvable, then you'll know to get a divorce.

[Luvmikds]

I appreciate all the comments which were very helpful. Yes, I did apologize to him. It was not my intent to hurt him. I realized after the fact that I shouldn't have talked to the counselor, not Bishop. The problem is his and I have been very supportive of him for years hoping things would be different. I will endure this as I have many times in the past and when the opportunity presents itself, we will try to communicate better. Thanks to everyone.

[applepansy]

I agree with just about everything said here. There has been wonderful advice. Do not let yourself get sucked into "battered-wife syndrome". Abuse is not always physical, but then you know that. (My sister just got out of a marriage to a man who was doing exactly what you describe. It took her realizing that his angry, narcissitic behavior was teaching their sons that it was ok to be disrespectful to their mother and women in general. That was the last straw for her.)

I think you did the right thing by speaking to someone in the bishopric about the situation you're facing at home. The ideal thing would have been for your husband to be honest with his priesthood leaders about his feelings, but he wasn't doing that and it was affecting everyone badly. The situation was getting worse. The stress in your home was getting worse. Your husband wasn't being honest with anyone, including himself. The Bishop is there for exactly these types of situations. Each of us has the right to seek help from our Bishop. That's what he's there for.

The only thing I would have done differently is I would have gone to the Bishop about it (not the counselor), and I would have told him beforehand that I was going and invite him to come along. And while I was there I would ask for a counseling referral. If your husband won't go, you go... by yourself if necessary. You need support and ideas for handling his temper.

Change is hard. Change for someone who is already angry is even harder. You need support while your husband decides how or even IF he's going to change his life and be the husband/father you expected when you married him. I suspect he's made some serious mistakes and he isn't willing to be honest or repent. Of course he's not happy you "told" ... he wanted to hide his feelings from his priesthood leaders.

I truly believe that helping someone continue to hide from the truth only makes things worse. Problems can only be fixed by the person who is causing the problem and only if there is open dialogue and honesty with everyone affected by the behaviors causing the problem. The problem needs to be a problem for the person causing it.

Call the closest temple and get both your names on the prayer roll.

The references to GA talks and books are really good. Use all the resources you can find to help you.

[talisyn]

My assignment for you: Visit You Are Not Crazy

I went to that site, wasn't tooooo impressed....and then I got about 1/2 through the recorded discussion and realized it sounded a lot like stuff my ex would say to me which just about always brought me to tears about 30 minutes later. It's a really good site, ty. I'm going to send the link to a few sisters I know

[FairChild]

Throwing tantrums and breaking things. I see those as controlling, manipulative behaviors. They are huge red flags that terrify me. If he lays a hand on you or your children, run to the nearest shelter and press charges after calling the cops. Be safe.

[because1]

Sorry - it sounds like a difficult environment to be happy in. Has he always been like this?

I find that those who usually complain, whine, have temper issues, etc. do so for one or more of the following reasons...

1. Lack enough sleep/tired

2. Out of habit

3. Have a disposition for it/genetic

4. Are unhappy with themselves/low self-esteem

5. Are highly stressed

6. Are out of tune with the Spirit/Spiritually weak

7. Pride

8. Feel a lack of control in their lives

You may look to see if you have the same traits that need rectifying as well. If so, you can both work it out together.

Unfortunately, they tend to take it out on others and/or don't become pro-active to change their situation. As the saying goes, "Misery loves company". I think when he is able to identify the cause(s) behind the behavior then he can work to rectify it. If you have communication issues and/or he is unreasonable, you will need to seek help using a mediator (counselor, mutually trusted friend, etc.). If he is violent and this is a domestic issue, you should not hesitate to call the police (not out of vengence but out of protection). That can and is the best thing to do in domestic issues and can be the first step in them getting the help they need. NEVER tolerate him hitting you, if that is what happens.

Finally...Are you having regular scripture study and family prayer? Do you pray together? My guess is that this is not happening. Perhaps it is that he refuses. If so, there is no reason that you cannot do it without him with your children. Invite him to join you but don't pester him. In time, I think you will find he might. Pray for him in your personal prayers and out loud. If you need spiritual help for yourself, seek the Bishop's help. Be sure that you subscribe to the Ensign and other church magazines. The influence in your home just having these around may provide additional opportunities that he will actually pick them up and read them. A letter was sent out from the First Presidency advising this very thing. And...ironically enough...you need Home Teachers for you if your husband is not fulfilling his responsibilities as a priesthood leader.

Best of all...pray that you will receive the guidance to do the right thing. Sometimes something as simple as apologizing can do wonders. Although I find it kind of funny what you did and understandable that you asked them not to give your husband a calling or have Home Teachers, it probably was embarrassing for your husband. It might be as easy as saying, "Honey, I am sorry. I did it because.....but realize that this may be embarrassing for you and am truly sorry for embarrassing you. I just get so tired of it when you complain about....I am sorry." Someone else might be able to word it better. Don't let pride get in your way of apologizing.

Good luck. I am sorry. This sounds like a very uncomfortable marriage right now...at least in the current situation. Just remember, if there are domestic problems (abuse), you must not tolerate it and need to get immediate help outside of your home situation. Take care.

[JudoMinja]

The problem is his and I have been very supportive of him for years hoping things would be different.

It is fairly common for women to enter a marriage expecting their husbands to change, and for men to enter a marriage expecting their wives to stay the same. Both are usually disappointed. This comment, however, raised a red flag for me.

Do you mean that you have been hoping his behavior toward church would change or that his temper would change? If you are speaking of his behavior toward church, I would say you need to get over it. Yes, our faith is a very important and central part of our lives, but if you love this man enough to marry him despite this important difference, then you should stop trying to change him and just accept him as the man he is. If you are speaking of his temper, I think there is a lot you aren't saying. I have lived through an abusive relationship, and I can tell you that it is of no help to you or your son to stick around in an abusive situation. The sooner you leave the better. That way, you can start getting yourself on the path that will lead to an eternal family with someone else.

Unfortuantely, you are not really giving enough information to determine whether this is really the case. (Understandably so. If you are not in an abusive home then there is nothing more to tell and I'm just speaking out of over-caution due to my own experience. If you are in an abusive home, you will hardly be in a mindset to share details with strangers.)

If your husband is simply having problems that you are not doing your part to help with, I would definitely suggest counseling. Seek as much outside help as possible. Help never hurts, and it is not a sign of weakness or inability on your part. In fact, asking for help can be a sign of strength. No one was expected to work out a marriage on their own, and it is going to take time for you to learn to really get along with each other. Do not let petty differences separate you. You loved him enough to marry him, do everything in your power to do YOUR PART to make it work, and be willing to understand that his part is on him. Marriage is sacred, and should not be broken lightly.

If he is being abusive- no matter how much you want to make it work, it is not going to. Get yourself and your son somewhere safe before it is too late.

I will endure this as I have many times in the past .

You should never subject yourself to simply enduring something you have a power to change. While you are not able to change your husband (that is up to him) and should not really expect him to change, you should do what you can to communicate with him your unhappiness so that he knows there is something that needs working on, and if your situation is unfixable, get out.