"Kool-Aid" isn't funny.

[Jenamarie]

Not sure where else to post this, or if it should even be posted at all, but I just need to get this off my chest.

I hate "kool-aid". Not the drink, but the use of the word in political threads. If you like a particular politician, it doesn't mean you "drank the kool-aid". It means you (shockingly) agree with what he or she stands for.

Many many innocent people died drinking the kool-aid offered up by Jim Jones' political organization/cult (the reason the term "kool-aid" is used in political discussions). Read up on what happened to them, and how the members' children were given the kool-aid first, to ensure that the adults would also drink it, and then see if you find it funny as a term used to disparage people of certain political leanings.

I will not follow any political ideologue (sp) to my death. I am a free-thinking individual who happens to disagree with many of the other free-thinking individuals on this board.

I drank no kool-aid

That is all.

[pam]

I wasn't aware that Jim Jones was the leader of a political cult. I thought he was the leader of a religious cult.

[Jenamarie]

I wasn't aware that Jim Jones was the leader of a political cult. I thought he was the leader of a religious cult.

It was a bit of both. Kind of a liberal-religious cult. He supported some liberal political candidates and helped them get elected.

[pam]

Actually Jena you are correct. For some reason I had it that it was religious but yes it was more political.

[pam]

Yes I think there was a bit of a mix there after searching and reading a little about him again.

[DigitalShadow]

I would have to agree that the Kool-aid references are in bad taste and the "joke" is certainly getting old. Aside from it being based on a tragedy, it is a cheap, disparaging quip that really adds nothing useful to the conversation.

I'm not really one for "political correctness" which I'm sure this thread will be accused of trying to enforce, I'm mostly just tired of seeing it in political conversations ad nauseum.

[Moksha]

I believe that red Kool-Aid is a staple item at Mormon weddings. Anyway, it is a colorful counterpoint to green Jell-O.

[bytor2112]

You should seriously lighten up. Everyone drinks a certain amount of koolaid...regardless of your political views. How else could any of us explain how we get a never ending stream of idiots in Congress and in the White House. Maybe we should start a thread about how "Pro-Choice isn't funny. You know the word that is used to disguise the act of terminating an inconvenient childbirth. Many innocent people continue to die for this alleged right of choice.

I post on a sports forum and as we dream of our rather sad football team possibly winning, it is common to say....pass me some more kool aid or post this happy looking fellow. And just for the record, Jim Jones used "Flavor aid" not kool aid.

Edited December 2, 2009 by bytor2112

[Just_A_Guy]

I agree it's not useful; but phrases that in context seem rather tasteless often become staples of political discourse ("rearranging deck chairs on the Titanic", being one example).

[NeuroTypical]

Read up on what happened to them, [...] and then see if you find it funny as a term used to disparage people of certain political leanings.

Knowing what you are actually saying when you speak, is always good advice. I wish more people would follow this advice, for all the 'loaded language' out there, from 'drinking kool-aid' to 'patriotism' to 'bigot' to 'racist'.

All that said, I do know the story and the origin of the term, and I use it occasionally to describe my own religious beliefs when talking to athiests. The phrase helps bridge gaps in understanding. And athiests often argue that there's a closer tie to the results of religious faith in general and the results of Jim Jones and his people, than we want to admit. (Jump in here if you like, Godless). I mean, I disagree with many elements of their argument, but understanding the term helps foster effective communication.

I will not follow any political ideologue (sp) to my death.

Me neither, but surely there are some noble ideologies worth following to my death. For example:

* Greater love hath no man than this, that a man lay down his life for his friends. - John 15:13, quoted by Joseph Smith

* Our military is full of people willing to die for our country

* Our police forces are full of people putting their lives on the line every day they go to work

LM

Edited December 2, 2009 by Loudmouth_Mormon

[john doe]

I have heard the phrase used against both sides of the political spectrum. To me it indicates that the person has 'bought in' to the rhetoric they support and have stopped thinking for themselves. It generally doesn't bother me.

[NeuroTypical]

I agree it's not useful; but phrases that in context seem rather tasteless often become staples of political discourse ("rearranging deck chairs on the Titanic", being one example).

I know of one message board where there's a "no references to Hitler until the 25th post in the thread" rule.

[Guest Godless]

All that said, I do know the story and the origin of the term, and I use it occasionally to describe my own religious beliefs when talking to athiests. The phrase helps bridge gaps in understanding. And athiests often argue that there's a closer tie to religious faith in general and the beliefs of Jim Jones and his people, than you'd think. (Jump in here if you like, Godless).

I agree to a very limited extent. While it's certainly true that some LDS would jump off a cliff if a prophet of God told them to do so, I'm not naive to think that most LDS, or theists in general, are that blinded by their faith. Religious faith and free-thinking are not mutually exclusive. However, it does seem that many theists are fairly easily swayed towards doing things in the name of religion that outsiders may view as odd and irrational, albeit not to the extreme of suicide cultism in most cases. I still get chills when I think of one of the last Sunday School lessons I attended as an "active" member, wherein the YSA teacher used the example of genocide in the Bible (1 Samuel 15) to illustrate a lesson of true obedience to the word of God. That was fairly unsettling.

As for the Kool-Aid thing, it's more of an annoyance to me than anything else. I see it as a cheap shot attack rather than an offensive reference, though I can certainly see why it would offend people.

Edited December 2, 2009 by Godless

[Jenamarie]

As for the Kool-Aid thing, it's more of an annoyance to me than anything else. I see it as a cheap shot attack rather than an offensive reference, though I can certainly see why it would offend people.

Exactly, and it's one that, almost without fail, shows up in every.single.Obama thread that is started on this forum, usually within the first 3-5 posts.

[bytor2112]

shows up in every.single.Obama thread that is started on this forum, usually within the first 3-5 posts.

That's a bit of an exaggeration....don't you think?

[Jenamarie]

Go to the Current Event Forums, click on Search Forum, and put in "Obama Kool Aid"

Many many threads pop up.

Perhaps I misspoke when I said when the Kool Aid posts usually appear, but they do eventually appear.

[Jenamarie]

Better yet, just put in "Kool Aid" into the search.

[bytor2112]

Go to the Current Event Forums, click on Search Forum, and put in "Obama Kool Aid"

Many many threads pop up.

Perhaps I misspoke when I said when the Kool Aid posts usually appear, but they do eventually appear.

I am sure they do....I am fairly sure I have referenced kool aid....I am fairly sure that I am not the only one and I am fairly sure that it isn't frequent....oh and I am fairly sure that when I do it I am being sarcastic. (just my nature....)

Edited December 2, 2009 by bytor2112

[Maxel]

While insensitive, the phrase says so much. When someone hits their 1,000th attempt to defend [enter issue here] because "[enter sophistic reason here]", there's no case to be made that said person actually does any research or real thinking on the subject, instead being lead by another's actions.

This is analagous to the ignorant lifestyle lead by Jim Jones' followers, who were so blinded by his sophistry that it lead to their willing death. To that end, I would like to point out that if someone is in danger of 'drinking the kool-aid', the acceptance of the lethal drug comes only after a long time of delusion and blindness. No one- no matter how strong intellectually or spiritually- is above the effects and ramifications of purposely listening to lies (self-delusion). Along the way, they convince themselves that the lies are actually the truth. Therefore, if a person is human, one must admit that if (s)he listens to the wrong people, and gives up the God-given mandate to heed all the words of Christ, then said person is in very well danger of ingesting spiritual kool-aid laced with spiritual poisons.

The phrase reflects the gravity of the situation, methinks, and isn't funny at all- even if some of us use it in a joking manner.

[Jenamarie]

While insensitive, the phrase says so much. When someone hits their 1,000th attempt to defend [enter issue here] because "[enter sophistic reason here]", there's no case to be made that said person actually does any research or real thinking on the subject, instead being lead by another's actions.

This is analagous to the ignorant lifestyle lead by Jim Jones' followers, who were so blinded by his sophistry that it lead to their willing death. To that end, I would like to point out that if someone is in danger of 'drinking the kool-aid', the acceptance of the lethal drug comes only after a long time of delusion and blindness. No one- no matter how strong intellectually or spiritually- is above the effects and ramifications of purposely listening to lies (self-delusion). Along the way, they convince themselves that the lies are actually the truth. Therefore, if a person is human, one must admit that if (s)he listens to the wrong people, and gives up the God-given mandate to heed all the words of Christ, then said person is in very well danger of ingesting spiritual kool-aid laced with spiritual poisons.

The phrase reflects the gravity of the situation, methinks, and isn't funny at all- even if some of us use it in a joking manner.

I can understand that it can be appropriately used, in that context, but I disslike it's constant use against people who agree with some of the actions of our current President. Any discussion here about Health Care, or any other thing that the President is backing, and "It's time to pass around the kool-aid!" comes out in some form or another.

It is extremely tiresome. It's not discussing why you disagree with someone, it's putting them down with a "Well obviously anybody who agrees with this isn't thinknig for themselves" pot shot.

People look at the same body of evidence every day and come to very different conclusions. It isn't a sign of dillusion or a forfeture (sp) of free-thinking.

[bytor2112]

It seems that what set you off, or perhaps the proverbial straw, was Pale's kool aid comment directed at Jadams. Jadams is the perfect example of kool aid drinker. His posts are NEVER substantiated and do little more than spout meaningless programmed dribble. Oh and he rarely offers a rebuttal to other posters when they challenge his post.

Often the term is used in frustration when evidence that thoroughly debunks someones posts is completely ignored. I would not use the comment....other than sarcastically....if it was just a post from a different perspective. All free thinkers are welcome.....I do often wonder how much free thinking really goes on.

As I have stated before: party politics is like rooting for your favorite football team, regardless of how stupid the players are......

Edited December 2, 2009 by bytor2112

[Maxel]

I can understand that it can be appropriately used, in that context, but I disslike it's constant use against people who agree with some of the actions of our current President. Any discussion here about Health Care, or any other thing that the President is backing, and "It's time to pass around the kool-aid!" comes out in some form or another.

Okay, I see your point- and I think it's a valid one. I know there are some posters who use the phrase proficiently- in my experience, however, it's reserved for one special recipient... I refer you to bytor for the explanation.

[Palerider]

Lets see....since I use the phrase I will change it.....I will now use ice cream or green jello......:)

[Traveler]

Not sure where else to post this, or if it should even be posted at all, but I just need to get this off my chest.

I hate "kool-aid". Not the drink, but the use of the word in political threads. If you like a particular politician, it doesn't mean you "drank the kool-aid". It means you (shockingly) agree with what he or she stands for.

Many many innocent people died drinking the kool-aid offered up by Jim Jones' political organization/cult (the reason the term "kool-aid" is used in political discussions). Read up on what happened to them, and how the members' children were given the kool-aid first, to ensure that the adults would also drink it, and then see if you find it funny as a term used to disparage people of certain political leanings.

I will not follow any political ideologue (sp) to my death. I am a free-thinking individual who happens to disagree with many of the other free-thinking individuals on this board.

I drank no kool-aid

That is all.

I am assuming that you do not understand that in politics the end justifies the means. And the good or evil of the means only depends on if you agree with the end or not.

The Traveler

[pam]

Okay so no one is allowed to use the term Kool Aid from this moment forward. Instead you must say that powdered mix that has the big walking pitcher on the front of the package.

Okay not really...but just saying.