New and Struggling

[IamMormonHewastoo]

I have had reservations about joining a site like this. I think because I didn't want to come to terms with my Husbands disaffection. We've only been married 8 months. We didn't realize how polarized our views are, but now I'm just scared.

I love him. I'm trying to be supportive. I feel I am doing the best I can.

I am just scared. I'm scared I won't have the eternal family I hoped for. How am I supposed to raise our kids in the Church alone? Should we even have kids? Am I supposed to get divorced?

I would just really appreciate some words of wisdom and comfort. I just want so badly to do what is right.

Post Edit:

I apologize, I didn't even explain what the main issue is! We have different views regarding the Church. He doesn't feel like he can truly believe in it, and to me it is completely who I am. I didn't understand to what extent his frustrations and anger toward the Church are until after we were married.

Edited April 12, 2011 by IamMormonHewastoo

[Backroads]

I see no reason according to this why you should divorce him. As long as you two can respect and love each other, there shouldn't be a problem.

I'm hoping others can maybe guide you to some support sites for members in your situation?

[estradling75]

Prayer, and you personally doing the right things is the best step I can see based off what I can see from your post.

The questions you need to find answers for are, "What does the Lord want you to do."

Then "Can you build and maintain a respectful relationship with each other even with your differences."

The rest will follow from finding those answers

[Suzie]

You didn't really tell us what is happening, maybe if you do I can give you a better answer.

However, I think is fair to say that the first year of marriage could be challenging. You are learning to live with someone, learn the way they do things, see their flaws more clearly, their differences, etc and things can get a little difficult but this too shall pass. :)

[IamMormonHewastoo]

The thing that scares me the most is how much anger he has towards the Church. I have a very strong testimony and I can't imagine myself without the Gospel, but he has a lot of issues with church history and it seems he just gets more and more angry every Sunday and during conference. I'm feeling very scared that we have such different views and my heart just aches.

[NeuroTypical]

Is he mad at the church (doctrine, God, etc), or has he encountered a jerk or hypocrite or evil person who happens to be mormon?

Why is he mad?

[Suzie]

Well, Church history can get really interesting.

However, how do you feel about his concerns?

[a1000tears]

President Hinkley said it best -- He admonished to cultivate “a spirit of affirmative gratitude” for those of differing religious, political, and philosophical persuasions, adding that “we do not in any way have to compromise our theology” in the process. He gave this counsel: “Be respectful of the opinions and feelings of other people. Recognize their virtues; don’t look for their faults. Look for their strengths and their virtues, and you will find strength and virtues that will be helpful in your own life.”

I think this is the best advise when dealing with your husband. If he has anger, the best way to help him through that anger is to be compassionate about his feelings. There could be reasons he's not telling you..he could be fearful he could lose you. Try to see the pain beneath the anger and you may find the answers to better understand him.

The first year of marriage is the most difficult because you both grew up with different traditions/ideas, the key is to find a way to be accepting of each other's beliefs and traditions. Learn about his traditions (usually the holidays bring them out) and try to understand them.

I wish you the best in your study and in your marriage. :)

[rameumptom]

Our prayers are with you. Just remember that God is a very loving and caring Father. You do your best, keep relying on the loving care of God and Christ, and He will ensure you receive all the blessings of exaltation.

[Guest]

You know, I've heard it a lot here... "my husband is messing up, I'm not going to go to the celestial kingdom"... Says who???

Your eternal progression is not yoked by your husband's journey. Your eternal progression is completely your choice alone. Plus... God promised you blessings if you remain faithful to your covenants. That may include softening your husband's heart.

So, fear not sister! Do your best and God will do the rest!

Respect your husband's situation and ask him to respect yours. Let love remain.

[IamMormonHewastoo]

Thank you for all the replies, this has certainly been a source of comfort. As I've been reading, studying, praying, and searching, I am feeling that staying committed to my marriage is the right thing to do. I know it will take time and patience, but I feel that I will be judged for my choices - including the choice of deciding to stay when the going gets tough.

I truly appreciate your thoughts and advice, it has helped more than you know.

[IamMormonHewastoo]

@ Suzie-

I feel that some of his concerns are valid. I also feel that our perspectives are so different. I tend to shrug off the things I don't understand and believe that people in the church are generally good and just trying to do the right thing. I think for him he is just so angry that anyone could profess to be in the "true" church or that it's not OK to be a "cafeteria Mormon." I understand what he is saying, it is just hard for me to understand why he would allow himself to get so angry over it. Maybe I'm just not being sensitive enough...?

[HiJolly]

@ Suzie-

I feel that some of his concerns are valid. I also feel that our perspectives are so different. I tend to shrug off the things I don't understand and believe that people in the church are generally good and just trying to do the right thing. I think for him he is just so angry that anyone could profess to be in the "true" church or that it's not OK to be a "cafeteria Mormon." I understand what he is saying, it is just hard for me to understand why he would allow himself to get so angry over it. Maybe I'm just not being sensitive enough...?

It is hard to appreciate how angry one can be when one feels betrayed, lied to and deceived. Hard to empathize, when those same things are not what *we* feel.

Has he been to the StayLDS.com forums? The people there know exactly what he's going through, and try to keep a positive feel about the site. Much better than some of the other forums!

And you might like visiting faceseast.org for your own benefit.

HiJolly

[Backroads]

Sometimes I worry about the StayLDS movement. I think for the most part the people are sincere, but from what I've seen it looks like "Your loved ones are idiots, so show your love for them by pitying and patronizing them".

[Guest mormonmusic]

Sometimes I worry about the StayLDS movement. I think for the most part the people are sincere, but from what I've seen it looks like "Your loved ones are idiots, so show your love for them by pitying and patronizing them".

I'm not so sure about this one Backroads. I spent quite a bit of time lurking at StayLDS when I went through a real commitment crisis some time ago. I ended up putting my heart and soul into LDS.net, and registering here, but I got familiar with the people over there by reading their posts. Many of them have families in the Church, but have run into problems with doctrine, the Church-as-corporation, cultural values, history and sometimes, perceptions of undue sacrifices required, and just plain lack of testimony after sincere trying. They want to keep their families together, see positive aspects of the Church, and are seeking alternative ways of staying in the Chuch without necessarily believing everything the Church teaches literally. I see most of them as people who are trying to find a way of staying after losing their faith. Many are well-educated intellectuals, so there is a strong intelligence over there too.

I actually have some compassion for them, because I had similar problems after some negative experiences in the Church that made me doubt my testimony. Three such experiences in my life time actually -- heart-wrenching, near depression-inducing experiences that floored me. I had to go through periods where I reconcile my testimony with my experiences. It was very hard, particularly having created a web of Mormon family around me.

In fact, the StayLDS people acknowledge that being a traditional believer in the Church is not a bad thing -- if people are comfortable in that kind of belief, that's OK. In fact, some even wish they could go back, but find it's hard after they have allowed themselves to seriously consider the doctrinal and other questions that beset them. On other sites that attract people with commitment and faith issues, I've seen more arrogance toward family and spouses like the kind you describe, but I don't think it typifies StayLDS.

But to the opening poster -- does your husband spend time on these sites that are not populated with traditional believers? The reason I ask is they actually advocate cafeteria Mormonism as an alternative to leaving altogether. And many were angry about Elder Nelson's comment that we shouldn't be cafeteria Mormons. I personally would not advocate moving the OP's husband over to StayLDS.com, because along with strategies for StayingLDS, there are a lot of discussions that could hurt his commitment or faith even further. I see it as a place for people on the verge of leaving altogether, and as a near last resort.

Edited April 13, 2011 by mormonmusic

[Backroads]

Perhaps it's just the staylds.org site, then, which pretty much states "you're right, they're wrong, and someday they'll join you.". While it did mention working to preserve relationships, it was also a very black/white site. Through observations of others, it's often the inability to respect your loved one and accept they have legitimate reasons for their beliefs that leads to the biggest problems. The forums, I'm sure, are full of good people, but the site I mentioned just had a bad attitude.

If such sites can help maintain a balance of church activity or true respect, it's good and helpful. I've seen quite a few mixed-faith marriages, and the ones that succeed are those where neither is "wrong".

[pam]

Sometimes I worry about the StayLDS movement. I think for the most part the people are sincere, but from what I've seen it looks like "Your loved ones are idiots, so show your love for them by pitying and patronizing them".

I, personally, have never been a fan of the StayLDS site or movement.

[grandshahi]

My advice, as I have been (and still being somewhat) in your husband's situation is that you should never convey an attitude that all is lost, that you should never have kids, etc. My opinion is that people who have never had a faith crisis can't understand how it feels.

For me, I came to terms with history. For example, if I was feeling like the church had a racist past, I would put it into the context of the entire USA having a racist past. If I was worried that Joseph Smith was a freemason, I realized that to make it in society back then, being a freemason was a big part of that.

This is certainly a difficult thing. There are many good websites that may possibly shock you (stay lds comes to mind), but may be helpful for your husband. Continue loving him and things may turn around. Judgement, anger, frustration, "sky is falling", etc. will do the opposite.

[Guest mormonmusic]

Perhaps it's just the staylds.org site, then, which pretty much states "you're right, they're wrong, and someday they'll join you.". While it did mention working to preserve relationships, it was also a very black/white site. Through observations of others, it's often the inability to respect your loved one and accept they have legitimate reasons for their beliefs that leads to the biggest problems. The forums, I'm sure, are full of good people, but the site I mentioned just had a bad attitude.

If such sites can help maintain a balance of church activity or true respect, it's good and helpful. I've seen quite a few mixed-faith marriages, and the ones that succeed are those where neither is "wrong".

Backroads -- I think you may have been looking at the cybersquatting/fake site for StayLDS. There is staylds.COM]Stay LDS / Mormon, which is the site I'm talking about. Then, there is staylds.ORG. The *.ORG site's domain name has been purchased by a group of anti-Mormons who are pretending to be StayLDS.com, and are using it to hasten the dissaffection of Mormons with a faith crisis.

Here is what the StayLDS.COM site says about StayLDS.org:

"January 4th, 2010: Someone has decided to engage in a form of cybersquatting by putting up an anti-mormon site using the .ORG extension of the same domain name we use for our site. “StayLDS. ORG” is not affiliated with or produced by us. The owner of that domain name is trying to confuse people who might type in the wrong URL."

Maybe that's the source of your perceptions about them. I do concede however, that in going to the bona fide StayLDS.com site, you do get exposed to a lot of non-faith promoting stuff -- the moderators try to keep it positive, but faithless ideas is what you get when you're talking to people strugging with a faith crisis. So, for some people, they might even get worse by going to StayLDS.COM. That's why I wouldn't send the OP husband there. And that was why I was wondering if he's already frequenting such sites.

There are times when I wish we had some kind of counselling toll-free number for people in a faith-crisis. You can go to your Bishop, but as both counselor and Judge in Israel, he has power ot deny recommends as well as limit your involvement in callings, or do other things that can make the faith-crisis worse, so often, people don't go to their Bishop. But if there was some impartial third party, friendly to the Church, that could keep the conversation positive and uplifting, while providing a safe environment in which to share sincere doubts without fear of negative consequences, I think that would be better.

Too often we only find out about the faith-crisis after the person has left. And it's a lot harder to get people back than it is to keep them, or prevent the less-activity. Less-activity is one area I never quite figured out when I was a HPGL.

Edited April 13, 2011 by mormonmusic

[Guest mormonmusic]

My advice, as I have been (and still being somewhat) in your husband's situation is that you should never convey an attitude that all is lost, that you should never have kids, etc. My opinion is that people who have never had a faith crisis can't understand how it feels.

For me, I came to terms with history. For example, if I was feeling like the church had a racist past, I would put it into the context of the entire USA having a racist past. If I was worried that Joseph Smith was a freemason, I realized that to make it in society back then, being a freemason was a big part of that.

This is certainly a difficult thing. There are many good websites that may possibly shock you (stay lds comes to mind), but may be helpful for your husband. Continue loving him and things may turn around. Judgement, anger, frustration, "sky is falling", etc. will do the opposite.

I have mixed feelings. Using the Marriage Builders ® - Successful Marriage Advice philosophy, Church commitment from a spouse borders on what we call "Family Commitment". And if you have a high need in that department, and your spouse doesn't meet that need for the long-term, it can lead to unhappiness and maybe even divorce, in my view. But if that need of family commitment (which I think is like Church commitment) is lower in your heirarchy of needs, and he meets your other more important needs very well (like Affection, Conversation, Financial Support, Recreational Companionship -- whatever is important to you) then I think your marriage could be very successful.

Also, the creator of the marriagebuilder's philosophy, Willard Harley Junior, has written books where he addreses conflicts over religion in marriages in a chapter or so. I can't quote which book, but if you go to his site it wouldn't surprise me if he's answered the OP question better than I can.

Also, if you're committed to staying with your marriage, I wouldn't ever threaten to leave over his Church commitment, or deny priviledges because of his less-active mindset. That will only fuel his anger toward the Church.

Good luck, I feel for you. I too got married and then learned in the first year there was a whole set of personality characteristics I never knew existed. It was VERY HARD. But we have learned what we must do in our marriage to make it successful. So, it's possible, even though our issues were different, and focused on different needs like domestic support, and family commitment, but in a different way.

Edited April 13, 2011 by mormonmusic

[Backroads]

Backroads -- I think you may have been looking at the cybersquatting/fake site for StayLDS. There is staylds.COM]Stay LDS / Mormon, which is the site I'm talking about. Then, there is staylds.ORG. The *.ORG site's domain name has been purchased by a group of anti-Mormons who are pretending to be StayLDS.com, and are using it to hasten the dissaffection of Mormons with a faith crisis.

Here is what the StayLDS.COM site says about StayLDS.org:

Maybe that's the source of your perceptions about them. I do concede however, that in going to the bona fide StayLDS.com site, you do get exposed to a lot of non-faith promoting stuff -- the moderators try to keep it positive, but faithless ideas is what you get when you're talking to people strugging with a faith crisis. So, for some people, they might even get worse by going to StayLDS.COM. That's why I wouldn't send the OP husband there. And that was why I was wondering if he's already frequenting such sites.

There are times when I wish we had some kind of counselling toll-free number for people in a faith-crisis. You can go to your Bishop, but as both counselor and Judge in Israel, he has power ot deny recommends as well as limit your involvement in callings, or do other things that can make the faith-crisis worse, so often, people don't go to their Bishop. But if there was some impartial third party, friendly to the Church, that could keep the conversation positive and uplifting, while providing a safe environment in which to share sincere doubts without fear of negative consequences, I think that would be better.

Too often we only find out about the faith-crisis after the person has left. And it's a lot harder to get people back than it is to keep them, or prevent the less-activity. Less-activity is one area I never quite figured out when I was a HPGL.

That makes a lot of sense, thank-you. To me, that message just seemed to go backwards from improving a relationship. Nobody wants to feel bad about their beliefs.

A religion-neutral yet positive counseling would be wonderful.

[Backroads]

I have mixed feelings. Using the Marriage Builders ® - Successful Marriage Advice philosophy, Church commitment from a spouse borders on what we call "Family Commitment". And if you have a high need in that department, and your spouse doesn't meet that need for the long-term, it can lead to unhappiness and maybe even divorce, in my view. But if that need of family commitment (which I think is like Church commitment) is lower in your heirarchy of needs, and he meets your other more important needs very well (like Affection, Conversation, Financial Support, Recreational Companionship -- whatever is important to you) then I think your marriage could be very successful.

Also, the creator of the marriagebuilder's philosophy, Willard Harley Junior, has written books where he addreses conflicts over religion in marriages in a chapter or so. I can't quote which book, but if you go to his site it wouldn't surprise me if he's answered the OP question better than I can.

Also, if you're committed to staying with your marriage, I wouldn't ever threaten to leave over his Church commitment, or deny priviledges because of his less-active mindset. That will only fuel his anger toward the Church.

Good luck, I feel for you. I too got married and then learned in the first year there was a whole set of personality characteristics I never knew existed. It was VERY HARD. But we have learned what we must do in our marriage to make it successful. So, it's possible, even though our issues were different, and focused on different needs like domestic support, and family commitment, but in a different way.

Excellent point about the committment thing. In my marriage, it seems I am the more "spiritual" one while my husband is more "religious". It's weird. I'm more into praying and whatnot than he is, but he's more into church doctrine and beliefs than I am. Before we married, we had a conversation on what would make one or both of us want to end the marriage, and LDS church membership came up. For me, I felt that if my beliefs were respected and not looked down upon if he became disaffected and all my other needs were met, I could probably make the marriage work. But for him, church membership was make-or-break.

[jobsitejobs]

Prayer, and you personally doing the right things is the best step I can see based off what I can see from your post.

The questions you need to find answers for are, "What does the Lord want you to do."

Then "Can you build and maintain a respectful relationship with each other even with your differences."

The rest will follow from finding those answers

jobsite

[UrbanFool]

My best friend in the church went to church by herself for nearly 10 years before her husband decided to join. I also know many women who are active in the church while their spouse is a non-member or inactive. Sometimes these men become active or join.

I think you should live according to the gospel, and perhaps your husband will follow along later.