Need advice on how I should approach my grandson's father about my grandson getting baptized?

[classylady]

My grandson just turned 8 in April and he would like to get baptized, but he tells me his dad has said he doesn't want him baptized until he turns 14. I absolutely agree with church policy in parental permission for children getting baptized. But, I would like to at least bring the subject up with my grandson's father, and maybe come to a compromise, if possible, without alienating him.

Here's a little history about my grandson's life. My daughter, his mother, died in a car accident when he was two months old. She was an unwed mother. She and the baby were living with us at the time of the accident. After the accident, the baby's father moved in with us, so he could receive help in caring for the baby. He had every right to take the baby away to live with him, and I'm grateful that he chose to live with us. They lived with us for 18 months, until the father decided he could then care for his son on his own. After they moved out, my husband and I would pick up our grandson every Friday and have him with us for the weekend. So, we have taken our grandson to church with us every week. Also, whenever our grandson's father was having financial difficulties and didn't have a place to live, our grandson would come and live with us for months at a time, and also stay with us for extended periods of time whenever his dad had depression problems or health problems. And every vacation we have gone on, national and internationally, we have taken our grandson with us. He is almost like a son in some regards.

We have a good relationship with my grandson's father, and I want to keep it that way. He comes from an LDS home where his mother and step-father are active, but he is not at all active. He has even told me that he doesn't even know if he believes in God anymore, because he can't see how if there was a loving Father in Heaven, how He could allow my daughter to die.

I have been praying about this, and trying to decide how to approach my grandson's father. My thoughts on this has been to tell him that I think he's doing a wonderful job in raising my grandson. (Which I feel he really is doing a great job, because my grandson has aspergers, so there are difficulties and issues that are involved with that). And then, after that I was thinking of saying something like "___ tells me that you don't want him getting baptized until he is 14. You know, you and ____(my daughter) would probably not see-eye-to-eye on this, because I feel that she would want ____ baptized. Is there anyway that you would reconsider?"

I need advice on how to approach this. Does that seem like an okay way to bring it up? Any thoughts on this would be greatly appreciated. Thanks.

[prisonchaplain]

Different case...different church...but maybe some similar principles. I converted to an evangelical Christian faith when I was 10. The church I joined practices "believers' baptism," meaning they only baptize someone when they are old enough to make their own public confession of faith. This would be very similar to the LDS practice.

Although my parents were basically irreligious, out of respect for my father's mother, they had me baptized as an infant (Lutheran). So, here I was, a ten-year old boy, living with "inactive" parents, and wanting to get baptized. Yet, I also knew the fifth commandment--Honor thy mother and father . . .

So...I waited. At age 16 my father came to me and said, "Son, if you would like to get baptized, I would be honored to come and see you do so." The experience was very meaningful, and I believe the fruit of it came about 35 years later, when, just prior to my father's passing, i was able to share Communion (similar to Sacrament) with him.

So, my thought is to honor the father's role. He is at least open to the child's baptism. By respecting his role, is it not likely that when the child is a little older, and says, "Dad, I really want to get baptized. It would mean the world to me if you would come and see..." don't you imagine he'll agree? Push the issue too soon, and he'll likely believe his parenting is being challenged, and his spirituality condemned.

This is a sensitive, difficult matter...may Father guide you, so that you are received as a caring counselor.

[applepansy]

Be positive. I like your first sentence telling him he's a great father. I wouldn't talk about discussing the baptism with your grandson. That sort of feels like going behind his back.

It sounds like you have a good relationship with your grandson's father. Just be honest. "You're a great dad. We would like ______ to be baptized. Is that something we can plan together?" Then listen. He might say no. If he does explain that you want to understand. Then listen.

The bottom line is that he's the child's father. You are fortunate that you were able to play such a big role in this child's life. But if it appears that you are going to come between him and his son that could all stop....and rather abruptly. Right now he has consented to a baptism at age 14. It would be a shame if by pushing too hard to do it now you were then unable to see your grandson and continue love him, spend time with him and teach him.

My son has custody and we are helping him raise his son. I am my grandson's primary caregiver. I'm going to face this someday. Right now we are taking my grandson to church with us every Sunday. But I know if I push something too hard my very inactive son will move out and then I won't have the chance to teach my grandson about the things he should know or make sure he's safe and healthy. I'm putting up with a lot from my son because right now because this little boy's welfare comes first.

My heart is with you classylady. This is a tough situation for a grandparent to be.

Edited May 17, 2011 by applepansy

[Vort]

To PC's and applepansy's advice, I would add only this: Don't presume to speak for your late daughter. She and your grandson's father very well might not have seen eye to eye on this topic, but that's an unknowable thing.

If I were the child's father, I would feel like my girlfriend's mother was unfairly bringing her into the equation to push me to do what she (the mother) wants -- which would be exactly the case. Instead, tell him how important you think baptism is, both to you and to the child. And in the end, if the father says no, accept it.

[skippy740]

Instead, tell him how important you think baptism is, both to you and to the child. And in the end, if the father says no, accept it.

Precisely!

I would bring it up as a way to help nurture child-like faith in God. To help your grandson grow closer to God while he is young and not 'jaded' by the world. That the gift of the Holy Ghost can help him make good decisions as he is growing up.

[Jennarator]

I agree with those opinions above. Bring it up, but listen and respect his wishes.

You never know what could happen if you push too hard.

[classylady]

I really appreciate everyones advice. As of yet, I haven't felt like the time is right to approach my grandson's father about his baptism. I've been doing a lot of praying to be guided and led by the Spirit in this. One of the reasons I asked for advice, is because what I had going in my mind on how to approach him just didn't seem quite right. Now I can see where I probably shouldn't bring my daughter into the equation. That's good advice. And if he doesn't want my grandson baptized, we will of course respect his wishes. And I don't want to alienate him. I want to always have a good, respectful relationship between us. If he should decide to cut off all visitation with us, we as grandparents would have very little say in the matter. In our particular circumstance we would have no money to fight it in court. Plus, I have no wish to ever have bad feelings between us. My grandson loves his father. I also love and respect his father. I want to keep it that way.

As for discussing this behind his back, that was never our intention. We were just assuming that he wouldn't have any problem with his son being baptized, because he is also a member (albeit, not active). And I never got the feeling from him that he was anti, just inactive and questioning. So, we had discussed baptism with our grandson, just assuming it was going to happen. Asking him questions like "Who do you want to baptize you, etc.?" My grandson had picked out who he wanted to baptize him--his uncle (my 17 year old son).

If anyone else has any other ideas on how to approach this, advice would still be appreciated.

[applepansy]

As for discussing this behind his back, that was never our intention. We were just assuming that he wouldn't have any problem with his son being baptized, because he is also a member (albeit, not active). And I never got the feeling from him that he was anti, just inactive and questioning. So, we had discussed baptism with our grandson, just assuming it was going to happen. Asking him questions like "Who do you want to baptize you, etc.?" My grandson had picked out who he wanted to baptize him--his uncle (my 17 year old son).

I'm certain you weren't "going behind his back." I understand and probably would do the same thing under the same circumstances. As an outsider looking in, and having been in a situation where I assumed something was ok and then later found out it wasn't, I was pointing out a potential pitfall.

You have a good relationship with him now. That's a great place to start from.

[Gwen]

I would respect the father and preserve that relationship above all else. Keep in mind it's not uncommon for children with disabilities to wait till they are a bit older for things (baptism, moving up to teen/adult classes, missions if able, etc), sometimes those decisions are based on development not physical age.

I'm guessing he wants his son to wait because he wants to know it's totally his decision. If that is the case then he won't likely be persuaded by you. Wait till the son is old enough and understands enough to go to his dad on his own and say "dad, can I get baptized?". Right now maintaining a positive relationship with dad is what will allow you to keep taking him to church and teaching him so he will want to get baptized one day.

Also remember for now he can do everything the other kids can do, he can start his faith in god book when he turns 8, he can live the standards and do the projects like any other kid (there is no requirement of baptism), he can do scouts, etc. When he gets older he will be restricted on the priesthood but he can continue scouts and the duty to god and such with all the other boys. If there are requirements in the duty to god book that have to do with administering in the priesthood the bishop should be more than capable of rewriting and approving an alternate (modified) requirement to allow him to continue to progress. He can attend seminary as a non baptized member.

Teach your grandson to focus on what he can do and honor his father. Pray and leave it to god to prompt him to talk to his dad, let father and son work this out. Also keep in mind your daughter isn't totally out of the picture, she still has influence from the other side.

[beefche]

classylady, I don't have any advice. What has been said is great. I would like to share a bit from my life.

I gained a testimony of the church at age 8. My mom was inactive (I didn't even know she was a member) and my dad was a non-member. My dad was very anti and refused to let me even go to church. I wanted to get baptized, but dad said no. I remember, even at that young age, that I could still live the commandments and that I could be baptized when I became of age.

So, the advice to still encourage your grandson in his church activities and testimony is a good one. And what a great, GREAT opportunity to help him understand about honoring parents, obedience, and how that ties into the Gospel. He is in a unique position to strive for the light of Christ (which in my opinion is very strong and can stay with him quite frequently) and be an example to his father.

[outcast]

"Grandpa, your grandson is getting baptized. Could you bring a plate of those cookies for the social after? Thanks"

[skippy740]

Yeah... that'll go over well. [smacks back of outcast's head]

[classylady]

Here's an update. My grandson was baptized this past weekend. His father gave permission for the baptism! Yeah! Since my grandson just turned 9 years old a month ago, he was considered a convert baptism. The missionaries taught him, and I'm sure the missionary lessons were good for my grandson's father too. The Spirit was so strong and sweet at the baptism. My 18 year old son baptized him, and my husband confirmed him. I gave a talk, and two of my older sons gave the opening and closing prayer. There was a wonderful turn-out from our ward, considering the baptism was in SLC, and we live about 35 minutes south.

I'm so grateful our prayers were answered.