My Turn for Dating Advice

[JudoMinja]

Ok, I've talked with my best friend about this, but she didn't really have much advice to offer me other than "call him!" which I'm sure you will all understand after reading all of this... I consider a lot of you here my friends, and I'm getting rediculously worked up over something that I guess should be so simple, so I figured I'd write this out here to get some more feedback and also because writing is so very theraputic for me.

My divorce has been final for awhile now, and I was having a conversation with my mother about dating. The topic came up because of a funny experience in which my thirteen year old brother had been mistaken for an eighteen year old, and I mentioned that I felt like I was ready to start taking a stab at dating again. However, my perspective on it is totally different than most people my age for a few reasons-

1. My son is my first priority. If dating gets in the way of taking care of him, I'm not going to do it. I also don't want him emotionally exposed to a number of men that probably won't be "daddy" while I look for the right one. I'd rather have few to no dates with guys that I think could very well become "daddy" than a whole bunch of dates with guys that may create attachments that would be too heart-wrenching for a little boy.

2. I take dating very seriously now. I didn't date much when I was a teen, but those dates I did go on were really just fun outings to spend time with "friends". Now, I think it is more like going though an interview process for a husband/father. I have a hard time separating myself from my serious/analytical side to get emotionally involved and just "have a good time" like most of my peers expect out of dating, but I also feel that there isn't really any point in setting the stage for disappointment if I think the guy just isn't going to "cut it".

3. I am socially awkward and have a hard time in settings where I could get to know some guys as "friends" first before going on any dates. Part of that awkwardness is just natural- I've always had a hard time with social settings and tended to focus more on my studies than making friends in school. Part of it is because I have a hard time trusting and opening up to men after everything I went through with my ex.

4. I have very high expectations and as such have rather slim pickings. I don't set any expectations higher than I can hold myself to and so consider them fair, but they are still high nonetheless.

So, while I feel like I am "ready" to date, its really more like, "If I can find somebody I think would make a good father/husband and who meets all my expectations, I would like to start spending some time getting to know each other better. If not, I have no problems staying single." I didn't have it sorted out this clearly when talking to my mom, and I basically told her I thought I should probably be looking for an "older" guy, since guys my age are typically just looking for someone "fun" that they can have a "good time" with and not so serious. When we discussed that, she said "well what about John?" (name changed to protect confidentiality).

John's parents and my parents are friends. He came back to live with his parents about the same time I did. We'd never met each other before, as he had basically just graduated high school when we moved here and I was starting eighth grade- we never interacted. I know that he is divorced, has a daughter who is in the custody of her mother but visits him, and he had some problems with drug addiction that resulted in him getting in a car accident and moving back in with his parents. Since he's been here, he's been going through addiction recovery and the church 12 step program and fixing up his car. I don't really know what else he's been up to but know that he wants to seek drug counseling as a career.

Our interactions have been minimal. My first impression of him though was good, and before I ever even saw him in person- My family went over to his parents house for family home evening one night because his father was home with a foot injury. John was out, but we played Uno with his parents and had a good time. They had a little pomeranian dog that they said was John's- that John had saved it from an abusive home and recooperated it. I was very impressed with the dog's behavior and health and with John for pulling that off.

Since then, we've met but only had brief non-serious conversations. He's joined us for some family events and holidays and helped move me out of my parents house and into my apartment. I've been impressed that he's been good with my son, but only engaged with him if the little-guy initiated it. There is a different guy in my ward who's been giving me a lot of grief and was practically stalking me (he's finally leaving me alone), who kept trying to step in and act like he was already "daddy", so the fact that John keeps his distance but isn't afraid to engage when my son decides he wants to interact with him is nice.

Really, the only thing that turned me off this guy was that he didn't seem to care much about church. He came very sporadically and typically only when his parents pushed him to get out of bed and come. Once I moved into my apartment, I was put in the boundaries of a different ward, but I know he still skips out on church due to the connection between our families. So, when my mom brought him up in our little "dating" conversation, I said "Maybe... but he needs to get more serious about church".

Lo and behold, who shows up at church that Sunday? John. And what does my mom decide to do? She tells him exactly what I said- that I would be interested in dating him if he got more serious about church. I didn't find out about this until the following Sunday- He came to church again and handed a piece of paper to my mom with his number on it. He told her she could give it to me and tell me I could call "if I ever wanted to talk". That was when I found out what was going on, and now I don't really know what to do... He's been to church three weeks in a row now since mom told him what I said...

Do I call and set up a date? Do I just hold on to his number and, as he said, "call if I want to talk"? Do I do nothing with the number and wait for one of the times we end up physically interacting to talk to him in person? I just feel really awkward about this whole thing, because my mom really embarrassed me telling him what I said, and I've also never really done much dating to begin with... The ball is in my court, which is actually kinda nice, as it seems to show that he is being respectful of the distance I prefer after the ordeal with the other guy at church, but it also means if I really am interested in doing something about this I have to be the one to take the initiative... which I'm not good at doing.

[RipplecutBuddha]

No one ever learned how to walk without falling down a lot first. I think this applies to dating in a perfect way. You might find out John is the one, then again he might not be. Dating can be filled with anxieties for any number of reasons.

I think as long as you keep your eyes open and head level, your heart will tell you the rest you need to know.

Speaking as a divorcee of almost four years, get out there and date!! It took me a year to emotionally recover from the divorce, and I've had some decent dates since then. None of them were remotely serious, but they were quite fun all the same. They served the purpose of reminding me there are a lot of excellent women out there.

Stay positive, and lean on HF for your needs. He'll make you happier than you could possibly imagine, and that includes finding an eternal companion.

[beefche]

Ok, a few thoughts come to mind.

First, in general, I don't think you should be exposing your son to your dates. There is no reason to introduce them to him unless you see real potential with them. I realize the situation with John is different--he's a family friend. But, in general, find a babysitter and don't introduce the dates to your son.

Second, the situation with John can be a difficult one. On the one hand, he needs to get serious about church for himself, not for you. However, sometimes, people need motivation to get serious and you could be that motivation. I truly, honestly, don't see anything wrong with going out and getting to know John at this point. But, be careful. It's just as easy to fall in love with someone not serious about the church as it is to fall in love with someone in the church. As you probably know, you cannot change him, so if he isn't in the church and you are getting serious with him, you need to accept that and not try to change him.

Finally, something I learned the past year or so when I was on a dating frenzy. There is nothing, absolutely nothing, wrong with dating. I think members of the church get so caught up in finding "the one" that we forget that dating is a chance to find out what you want and don't want. A date does not equal a committment. Having said that, of course you should have standards. But beware if your standards are too high (even for yourself). No one is perfect. We all have issues, baggage, failings, habits, etc. It's a matter of finding someone with whom you can tolerate and love despite those as well as he feeling the same about you.

[JudoMinja]

Ok, a few thoughts come to mind.

First, in general, I don't think you should be exposing your son to your dates. There is no reason to introduce them to him unless you see real potential with them. I realize the situation with John is different--he's a family friend. But, in general, find a babysitter and don't introduce the dates to your son.

That's the basic plan already. I figure he doesn't need the guys I date to be introduced to him at all because he might start forming attachments that just get broken since, of course, dating is a process and not a commitment. It is difficult for a child to understand that and I don't want to put him through that. However, I also understand that even if he's not getting introduced to the guys I date, if I'm doing a lot of dating it is going to have an affect on him. I'd rather be very selective and limited in my dating (and maybe even not date at all) than put him through the emotional turmoil that a kid just shouldn't have to face.

Second, the situation with John can be a difficult one. On the one hand, he needs to get serious about church for himself, not for you. However, sometimes, people need motivation to get serious and you could be that motivation. I truly, honestly, don't see anything wrong with going out and getting to know John at this point. But, be careful. It's just as easy to fall in love with someone not serious about the church as it is to fall in love with someone in the church. As you probably know, you cannot change him, so if he isn't in the church and you are getting serious with him, you need to accept that and not try to change him.

That's one thing I'm concerned about... Is he really getting serious about church for himself and for his own testimony? Only way to find out for sure is to get to know him better... Although. We did both attend the same temple prep class a while back, and that could be an indication that he really wants to be serious about his church attendance.

Finally, something I learned the past year or so when I was on a dating frenzy. There is nothing, absolutely nothing, wrong with dating. I think members of the church get so caught up in finding "the one" that we forget that dating is a chance to find out what you want and don't want. A date does not equal a committment. Having said that, of course you should have standards. But beware if your standards are too high (even for yourself). No one is perfect. We all have issues, baggage, failings, habits, etc. It's a matter of finding someone with whom you can tolerate and love despite those as well as he feeling the same about you.

I agree. My only problem is that I've never been much of a "dater" period. I'm not a naturally social person. I'm very introverted and like to keep myself for the most part. I'm not against dating in general, but I'm very inexperienced in it. As a teen, I only went on maybe three "dates" and those were more just friendly outings. And in college when I started really getting interested in dating, the only person who seemed even remotely interested in doing so with me was my now ex... So, yeah.. Inexperience and social ineptitude are my reasons for not dating much thus far.

[girlygirl]

Judo, I know it is wrong to write someone off for their mistakes, but to me it sounds like this John guy might not be the right one for you. If you were single and you wanted a bit of a challenge, by all means I would say try your luck and see if you can help aid him to work out his kinks and see if you guys can make a great relationship for yourselves. However you have a child and you need someone without those problems who will be ready to contribute to your and your sons well being- not the other way around. You don't want to end up looking after two people! And it really sounds to me like this may be the case with John.

I watched this British show once about this lady who was a tv reporter, mid thirties, who had never married and decided she wanted to get a husband in 12 weeks! It was so funny and so much fun watching her and the advice people gave her. Two things stick out in my mind from the show that I can pass along to you- first off- because she was a tv reporter she would treat every date like an interview! When she watched how she was back she was flabbergasted at how intimidating and prying she seemed to the men! So make sure you get to know the person.. However make sure that there is alot of fun element involved also.

The second thing she was told that I liked was that every 112th man you meet on a day to day basis will really click with you, will have the same likes and dislikes, which could lead to them under the right conditions being a great partner. The point? Meet as many guys as you can! Don't just hang onto 'the family friends son' when there are so many more fish in the sea. She was told to go to clubs or activities you enjoy and not only could you meet that 112th man but you will also have something in common :)

Lastly I would like to say don't sell yourself too short, it is better to have your expectations a bit too high and find someone who is right for you and compromise rather then set the bar low, find someone, then compromise yourself lower

[girlygirl]

As well some warning from my previous experience: I dated a guy who was inactive, as soon as I started dating him we started going to church, he became the ysa activities leader, went to institute, became bishops secretary, did everything by the book! It felt great to me that I had brought him back, his family was really thankful to me too. When I decided to move away and had to break off the relationship because we were on different continents, he stopped going. Completely. Now years later he only goes back occasionally when there is something to do with his family happening at church like a baby blessing. What I thought was a rebirth of his testimony was actually just him piggybacking off my own

Please push yourself when it comes to dates- it is soo important and isn't as big of a deal as people make it! There are so many things you can do that don't have to be a big deal. Ask if the guy wants to go meet up for an ice cream at dairy queen, say you want to see a movie in the theater but no one wants to see it and ask if he will take you? Go check out a free event like a play or something in a park and ask him if he is free that night and wants something to do? Say you want to try a new recipe out and its too much for you to eat by yourself so your wondering if he wanted to join you for dinner too ;)

Its really easy once you get into the swing of it and really fun too :)

[mrmarklin]

Dr Laura Schessinger counsels that a single parent should not date until his/her child is 18 and on their own.

Since you have such ambivalent feelings about dating right now, I would take that as very good advice.

[beefche]

I agree. My only problem is that I've never been much of a "dater" period. I'm not a naturally social person. I'm very introverted and like to keep myself for the most part. I'm not against dating in general, but I'm very inexperienced in it. As a teen, I only went on maybe three "dates" and those were more just friendly outings. And in college when I started really getting interested in dating, the only person who seemed even remotely interested in doing so with me was my now ex... So, yeah.. Inexperience and social ineptitude are my reasons for not dating much thus far.

Inexperience and social ineptitude are easy to fix, actually. Takes work and time, but overall it's easy.

Get some books from the library on dating. Go to msn.com and look up articles on dating. Read about how to flirt, how to have good conversations, how to have chit chat type of conversations, how to attract someone, etc. Honestly, some stuff you will read is crap, but you're smart enough to discern crap from the gems of knowledge.

Then practice. If simply looking someone in the eye and saying hello is difficult, then make goals to do that with the next person you come across, male or female. If having conversations with strangers is difficult, then make a goal to talk about how to pick out good peaches with the person at the store. Even if you decide to not date or limit your dating, these social skills will give you more confidence and help you in general. You will have to decide on the steps to take to give you more confidence.

[Suzie]

JudoMinja, first of all get rid off your mother. lol Second, is this guy someone you are REALLY REALLY REALLY REALLY REALLY interested? Not sure if pursuing a relationship with a guy who is recovering from drugs is ideal in your situation and the things you went through before. Nope, I don't think so. Sorry if I disappoint you with my answer.

[JudoMinja]

Judo, I know it is wrong to write someone off for their mistakes, but to me it sounds like this John guy might not be the right one for you. If you were single and you wanted a bit of a challenge, by all means I would say try your luck and see if you can help aid him to work out his kinks and see if you guys can make a great relationship for yourselves. However you have a child and you need someone without those problems who will be ready to contribute to your and your sons well being- not the other way around. You don't want to end up looking after two people! And it really sounds to me like this may be the case with John.

His past certainly is a concern, but then I don't really have the cleanest past myself, which is part of why I'm willing to be understanding about it. Why would I say "no way" to someone who's divorced with a kid and been dealing with an addiction when all of those things apply to me as well? It is definitely something to be careful about, but there is no way I can know for sure if these will be debilitating problems or if it is something he's learned from if I don't get to know him better at this point. Sometimes, a difficult past makes someone stronger, and our similarities would give us something to connect on. Basically, I don't know much of anything about him at this point. Just a few facts about his past and the general impresssion I've gotten of him through interactions with our families.

From what I have seen, it seems a relationship could possibly work with this guy, which is saying something from my perspective. There are very few guys I would give that "passing" mark to and even offer a chance at a date. I can think of only two other guys that I know right now that I'd consider so far, and I don't even know if either of them would be interested.. This is the only one that I now know has a mutual interest in possibly going on a few dates.

The second thing she was told that I liked was that every 112th man you meet on a day to day basis will really click with you, will have the same likes and dislikes, which could lead to them under the right conditions being a great partner. The point? Meet as many guys as you can! Don't just hang onto 'the family friends son' when there are so many more fish in the sea. She was told to go to clubs or activities you enjoy and not only could you meet that 112th man but you will also have something in common :)

I do need to get on more familiar terms with more guys so I can get a better idea for what my options are. I've been thinking I'm going to start going to the YSA activities. I just haven't put much thought into it before, because that means finding a babysitter and finding someone who can give me the information on those activities. It's not readily available in my ward as we recently formed a singles branch that I cannot attend because they don't provide nursery/primary.

I don't like the idea of cutting back on the time I spend with my son, but I've been starting to feel lonely and I'd like to have somebody I can talk to about "adult" things other than my parents and coworkers. I've always been the kind of person to have a few close friends (right now I've just got the one) and avoid crowds, but to get those few close friends I have to first delve into the crowds.

Dr Laura Schessinger counsels that a single parent should not date until his/her child is 18 and on their own.

Since you have such ambivalent feelings about dating right now, I would take that as very good advice.

At that point I'd be 40... While I am rather ambivalent toward dating, I'd like to be married and have more kids before then. And while I can't know for sure since he's only two, I think my son would enjoy having siblings. He's a much bigger social bug than I am, and I think he gets bored when its just him and "mommy" at home.

JudoMinja, first of all get rid off your mother. lol Second, is this guy someone you are REALLY REALLY REALLY REALLY REALLY interested? Not sure if pursuing a relationship with a guy who is recovering from drugs is ideal in your situation and the things you went through before. Nope, I don't think so. Sorry if I disappoint you with my answer.

Not disappointed at all. :) In fact, that's part of why I decided to come here for advice. I wanted to make sure I got a good rounded non-biased vew about both this guy John and the idea to start dating in general. I've had several thoughts back and forth about whether or not I should even consider him a possibility, and the thing is if I didn't even know about his past I would be VERY interested. That knowledge and his previous lack of interest in church were the only things making me cautious.

[Gwen]

If your son were already 16 I might say wait until he's 18. That was the case when my father remarried. All the kids in my family were grown and my stepmom had one son who was 16 still at home. He didn't get along well with my dad at all. For his sake I wish they would have waited a couple of years to get married. But anyway.

One thing I read a lot about raising kids is one of the best things you can do for them is have a healthy relationship with your spouse. It teaches them so many things as well as what a good relationship looks like. If you never date and never have a healthy relationship he won't learn those things. His only point of reference will be your past with his father and I fear that would not set him up to have a good future of his own. So while I agree with all your reservations and the boundries you have I think you also need to make that time for you. Teach him that personal development time is important, teach him what a healthy relationship looks like, what responsible dating looks like (within reason, keep the boundries you have talked about). Teach him that a healthy relationship is worth waiting for and is more imporant than not being alone.