A Solution To Illegal Mexican Immigrants

[Traveler]

I have been thinking about the illegal immigration problem. The biggest problem that we have is with Mexico. I have been thinking about this problem from some time. There are two things I have learned about Mexico that has me worried about this problem.

The first thing has to do with a Mexican company that ran a survey in Mexico and discovered that 80% of all Mexican citizens plan to come to live in the United States of America. I read this article at the Fox news web site. 80% is a very profound percentage. This 80% crosses all sectors of their society. This is not just about the poor this is all throughout Mexico and includes Doctors, businessmen, professionals, blue collar workers and whatever. I have wondered why so many want to come and live in the USA.

I think the answer to why is in two stories from my experiences in Mexico.

First story: I have a niece that was involved in a foreign exchange program with a young girl from Mexico. The Mexican girl came to live for a year with my brother’s family and go to school. In return my niece went to live for a summer in Mexico. The Mexican was well to do by Mexican standards – the father was a medical doctor. However, my niece discovered that as a high school girl doing baby sitting she made more babysitting in the USA than the Doctor made with his medical practice in Mexico.

Second story: I met a gentleman in Mexico that ran his own taxi business. He had 4 very old junky beat up taxi cars. I asked him why he did not expand his business and make more money. He could either get some more of the older cars or get some newer better looking cars and go after more of the lucrative tourist business. His answer was quite interesting. He said that if he got more cars or better cars the police would know he was successful and making pretty good money and that the police would steal his cars or extort money from him. He was better off making less and staying below the radar of success and avoiding the problems with the police.

Are you readers getting a picture here why Mexicans want to come to the USA?

Now my solution may sound stupid but I think it just might work. Since so many Mexicans want to come to the USA – Why not let them come? Why not open up the borders and let them all become citizens of the USA? Why not annex Mexico and add a few more states to the union? Even if it never happened – I am thinking that pursuing such a course could change the course of things. I am thinking the effort would be worth it even if it never really happened. And if it did – we could end our dependence on foreign oil.

The Traveler

[Fiannan]

Joseph Smith felt that the US should annex Mexico as well. However, had it been done in the early 1800s the country today would look more like Los Angeles in the cities and a lot like middle America elsewhere (immigration from Europe as well as investment and development would have been fostered). Today I fear that if we annex Mexico it will just lead to the opposite -- the US will look more like Tijuana Mexico -- everywhere.

[pushka]

Traveller, I think your solution sounds very good. It is a shame that so many people, highly skilled as well as lower skilled, are being forced to live under a corrupt system...if I was a U.S. citizen I would welcome the opportunity to help these people! :)

[shanstress70]

Traveller, I think your solution sounds very good. It is a shame that so many people, highly skilled as well as lower skilled, are being forced to live under a corrupt system...if I was a U.S. citizen I would welcome the opportunity to help these people! :)

Pushka,

Do you mean you would welcome them based on Traveler's idea? Or welcome them as it is now? Just let anyone come in who wants to?

I would have a huge problem with letting in any and all from Mexico, or any other country into the US. In my city, our schools are overcrowded with children not able to speak English. Children who are born here and live here legally are suffering because of it. Many illegals work and make money that is not taxed, while some of their counterparts live on the taxes that we citizens pay. It seems that I hear about more murders and other crime in my town that used to be relatively crime-free, and it may sound racist, but it seems like the majority of the time Mexicans are committing the crimes.

I agree that something needs to change for our neighbors in Mexico, and perhaps Traveler is on to something. But the answer is not to look the other way when it comes to illegals.

[pushka]

Hi Shanstress...I was basing my reply on Traveller's idea, yet I do have a problem generally with migration/immigration debates, as I'm very open to the idea that we should view the world as 1 big country, where all nations within it should be allowed to live togeether, freely, and take jobs according to their skills...

I know that this is idealism on my part, and would probably never work..due to differing religious/political views of the current leaders of the various countries in the world...so I don't expect this will ever happen...

I'm just a utopian I suppose.

I do understand the frustration of people who are native to a country, who see their jobs being taken by immigrants, illegal or otherwise...but I tend to think that there could be an ideal solution to that problem if only the governments of all countries would put their heads and powers together to help solve the world's problems...same with the crises in such countries as Ethiopia where many are starving...it is soo unfair that this should be occurring in the 21st century.

Sorry for that ramble/vent, it isn't aimed at anyone on this site, just at the world's governing bodies!!

[Jason]

Annexing Mexico would be a pretty tall order. Look at all the problems that West Germany has had reacquiring East Germany. And these were two Nations that were originally one less than fifty years earlier, speak the same language, and still have living family members in both states.

Germany doesn't have the debt the USA has, nor the global responsibilities the USA has. And they're struggling so bad that Neo-Nazism has literally turned old East Germany into a mini-Reich. You don't hear about it in the news, but there are literally towns that are "no-go" areas where anyone who's not an "Aryan" is not guaranteed safe passage through town by the police or the state.

Now imagine we take over even just the northern states of Mexico. Say down to Guadalaraja, but not the DF.

You've got to completely rebuild the infrastructure (sewer, roads, telephone, gas, electric) and then rebuild municipal buidings, schools, hospitals, etc.

We're talking trillions of dollars that we just don't have. Private business will want in, but only if the taxpayers are footing the bill. I don't want that bill. Do you?

If you think it's bad today paying for illegal immigrants in the USA, just imagine paying for everyone in Mexico!

We had our chance in the 1840's and we didn't take it. It is no longer feasible to consider union with Mexico.

[isaiah28]

FYI, too late.

http://www.spp.gov/

[prisonchaplain]

Traveller, I think your solution sounds very good. It is a shame that so many people, highly skilled as well as lower skilled, are being forced to live under a corrupt system...if I was a U.S. citizen I would welcome the opportunity to help these people! :)

Maybe we should steal Canada from the Brits while we're at it???

Seriously, we could become a legitimate USNA (United States of North America). Can you feel the . . . ?

[Maureen]

<div class='quotemain'>

Traveller, I think your solution sounds very good. It is a shame that so many people, highly skilled as well as lower skilled, are being forced to live under a corrupt system...if I was a U.S. citizen I would welcome the opportunity to help these people! :)

Maybe we should steal Canada from the Brits while we're at it???

As in the British Commonwealth?

Seriously, we could become a legitimate USNA (United States of North America). Can you feel the . . . ?

But then we would have to come to a mutual agreement regarding area naming. The USA has states, Canada has provinces and territories. We could of course keep the territories as they are, but states and provinces would have to be revised to please everyone. Suggestions would be: domain, zone, realm, region and one the LDS would love; ward. Couldn't you just picture it - the realm of New York, the zone of Ontario, the domain of Alberta, the ward of Utah.

M.

[shanstress70]

Traveler, at first glance your idea was something to think about. But after pondering it, I have to say that it would be a disaster. The corruption of the gov't and police in Mexico would not just go away if it was annexed by the US. And the poverty in Mexico is so great that we would basically be supporting the majority of them with our welfare system. We don't do such a great job taking care of impoverished Americans now! And think of the healthcare problems.

No, sorry Traveler, bad idea.

[Gwen]

i'm not saying that this is true accross the board, but we have some hispanics here, mexican and cuban, and they are hard workers. we also have a lot of ppl on welfare and projects, most are not hispanics. the sad thing i see here is that the dream is to come to america. once they get here they work themselves to death and have little to show for it. their dream was to come here, that is what they did. meanwhile one family i know is paying to much for rent on a house that is falling appart. they are here legaly and work hard, i try to get them to understand that they could be owning a home and making life even better. they are almost to content to just work hard, they haven't figured out how to work smart in this system. i know there are a lot of problems, but i'd sure love to see more americans with the work ethic of the hispanics arround here.

before anyone says anything, i do not agree with illegal immigration. there are ways to do things and they should be done that way. but when ppl follow the rules and contribute they shouldn't be harrassed or discriminated against or taken advantage of either.

[prisonchaplain]

But then we would have to come to a mutual agreement regarding area naming. The USA has states, Canada has provinces and territories. We could of course keep the territories as they are, but states and provinces would have to be revised to please everyone. Suggestions would be: domain, zone, realm, region and one the LDS would love; ward. Couldn't you just picture it - the realm of New York, the zone of Ontario, the domain of Alberta, the ward of Utah.

M.

I respectfully withdraw my suggestion.

[Dr T]

Well said ALmom. Often, money is sent to the hard workers family in their home country and therefore they don't work for "nothing." :)

[Guest Monica]

The economy in Mexico is very bad. The majority of illegals send money back home to sustain extended families. What would happen if their ecomomy collapsed completely? Would more flood the borders? Or would USA offer an annex or a territory status? Mexico the next common wealth?

[Traveler]

I wanted to respond a little bit about this idea. This idea first came to me as I thought about the problem. I thought that maybe we ought to take a different look and attitude. Instead of moaning all the time about what a problem it is; maybe we ought to think about a way to exploit the situation and gain an advantage in it. There is a tremendous workforce that can be used at great advantage.

Mexico is the most resource rich country in the Americas. Not only is Mexico rich in oil, minerals, precious mettles and other such resources (including farmable land) – Mexico is also home of a very large and capable (though currently under used) workforce. Unlike East Germany there is one of the world’s greatest stores of resources in Mexico.

I do not think we need to hide our intensions. We can openly admit that we intend to put every able body in Mexico to work, provide them with incomes vastly greater than they are currently receiving and make a profit at it.

I know that to some this sounds silly and not workable but – judging from efforts in our own country to end poverty over the last 50 years – we have only made poverty worse. We know giving handouts don’t work – maybe giving out work will work. We can do this as a great economical and social experiment (if you want to call it that) to end the poverty in Mexico by exploiting the poor for profit and giving them a decent salary. Since they worked for their salary there would not be the stigma or incentive that results from not working. Everybody wins - big business, little business, middle class, upper class and even the bottom poor class. Economies boom all over the world as workers in Mexico buy stuff and everybody is happy.

The only problem currently stopping the progress of such an idea is corruption and greed in both countries that not only want more for themselves but are so greedy they do not want the poor to have anything and they want political power over the poor thus they keep them under utilized and under worked.

One thing for sure – nothing that has happened in either country in the last 50 to 100 years has helped at all. Let’s start a movement to annex Mexico – who knows when an idea like this is started – what other ideas may emerge.

The Traveler

[john doe]

On a semi-related note, I saw this. According to the article, Illegal aliens kill more Americans than the War on Terror. I don't know how true the assertion is, but it is something to think about.

[Brother Dorsey]

Now you got me started! I live in a town that is 30% Hispanic....of those it is estimated that 60% are here illegally, that's around 3000 people.....trust me when I say that illegal aliens from Mexico don't care one iota about the laws here in the U.S.. They drive without licenses and insurance which means you pray you don't get into an accident with them, they know they can commit petty crimes, cheat the welfare system etc. because if they are caught they just get deported and they re-enter the U.S. again. Most use fake names and stolen SS numbers to obtain jobs. It is not uncommon for 3 families to live in one house and all collect welfare. They have numerous children who are considered U.S. citizens and therefore receive welfare all the while their parents are working under the childs SS number. Our local elementary schools have to teach in Spanish AND English which was a huge disability for my 5 year old...so bad in fact I switched him to a different school district and drive him 15 miles to and from school everyday. They get free medical, dental, education, job training, low cost housing, they get free child care with the Head Start program and we have to train and hire b-lingual people to work in the welfare offices....and guess who is footing the bill for all this? The U.S. citizen! You and me....heck I'm a U.S. citizen and I can't afford medical and dental for my family or free child care...I can't get it free like they can because I won't lie about who I am like they do. Don't get me wrong....I'm NOT talking about the legal aliens, the legitimate green card holders....these are illegal aliens....they are breaking the U.S. immigration law not to mention many other U.S. laws, but they don't care because they will never be locked up, just deported.....and the Democrats are talking about amnesty for illegals again? I say round them up, deport them all and build a huge wall from Southern California to Texas!

[sunny_surfer]

Now you got me started! I live in a town that is 30% Hispanic....of those it is estimated that 60% are here illegally, that's around 3000 people.....trust me when I say that illegal aliens from Mexico don't care one iota about the laws here in the U.S.. They drive without licenses and insurance which means you pray you don't get into an accident with them, they know they can commit petty crimes, cheat the welfare system etc. because if they are caught they just get deported and they re-enter the U.S. again. Most use fake names and stolen SS numbers to obtain jobs. It is not uncommon for 3 families to live in one house and all collect welfare. They have numerous children who are considered U.S. citizens and therefore receive welfare all the while their parents are working under the childs SS number. Our local elementary schools have to teach in Spanish AND English which was a huge disability for my 5 year old...so bad in fact I switched him to a different school district and drive him 15 miles to and from school everyday. They get free medical, dental, education, job training, low cost housing, they get free child care with the Head Start program and we have to train and hire b-lingual people to work in the welfare offices....and guess who is footing the bill for all this? The U.S. citizen! You and me....heck I'm a U.S. citizen and I can't afford medical and dental for my family or free child care...I can't get it free like they can because I won't lie about who I am like they do. Don't get me wrong....I'm NOT talking about the legal aliens, the legitimate green card holders....these are illegal aliens....they are breaking the U.S. immigration law not to mention many other U.S. laws, but they don't care because they will never be locked up, just deported.....and the Democrats are talking about amnesty for illegals again? I say round them up, deport them all and build a huge wall from Southern California to Texas!

OKay i swore to myself i would not return to this forum but gosh darn it one boring night and a little sneak peek at this subject got my blood boiling. first of all I am completely insulted by the fact that YOU brother Darsy are calling legal citizens ALIENS which they are not they are citizens that just points out your ignorance as a human being who thinks that you have to be born in the country to become a full blooded citizen. Now I the first to admit that i am a total jerk and say the first thing that comes to my head as far as matters that i believe strick the very heart of me so if anyone wants to bash my ideas feel free to since frankly i dont really care :)

Secondly I dont know what the big deal is with Americans and the whole english being number one and have to shove it in everyones face. NOw i have always seen americans to be kinda ignorant towards the idea of integrating culture with in the country, keep in mind i living in california. now as a kid who grew up in canada we have never seen the problem of incorporating different languages or culture together not so much in that we had to or were thinking of making english a primary language. Now i seriously think that the foundation of the USA somewhere got lost and it is no longer the same country that stands for truth justice and all people equal under God. IT is the very perspective of most americans as far as culture and diversity goes that is the very reason why the country is thriving so much on prejudice and racism. I mean for crying out load Boston university is offering scholorships to one white people...and arabs who get on plans are atomatically labeled tourists cause the color of there skin. Mexicans who are legal in the country and born here are being called illegals and being shout at to go back to where they came from. I mean this is rediculous, I agree that something should be done to patrol the border of both canada and mexico but for crying out loud to all the ignorant bastards out there who are prejudice and believe they hold a high standing over another person get a friggin life. I cant tell you how many fist fights i wanted to get into when someone bashed a racial slur at me so to those thinking about any negative tone towards your neighbor i say take that though and shuff it up your *&*&*&*.

[Brother Dorsey]

<div class='quotemain'>

Now you got me started! I live in a town that is 30% Hispanic....of those it is estimated that 60% are here illegally, that's around 3000 people.....trust me when I say that illegal aliens from Mexico don't care one iota about the laws here in the U.S.. They drive without licenses and insurance which means you pray you don't get into an accident with them, they know they can commit petty crimes, cheat the welfare system etc. because if they are caught they just get deported and they re-enter the U.S. again. Most use fake names and stolen SS numbers to obtain jobs. It is not uncommon for 3 families to live in one house and all collect welfare. They have numerous children who are considered U.S. citizens and therefore receive welfare all the while their parents are working under the childs SS number. Our local elementary schools have to teach in Spanish AND English which was a huge disability for my 5 year old...so bad in fact I switched him to a different school district and drive him 15 miles to and from school everyday. They get free medical, dental, education, job training, low cost housing, they get free child care with the Head Start program and we have to train and hire b-lingual people to work in the welfare offices....and guess who is footing the bill for all this? The U.S. citizen! You and me....heck I'm a U.S. citizen and I can't afford medical and dental for my family or free child care...I can't get it free like they can because I won't lie about who I am like they do. Don't get me wrong....I'm NOT talking about the legal aliens, the legitimate green card holders....these are illegal aliens....they are breaking the U.S. immigration law not to mention many other U.S. laws, but they don't care because they will never be locked up, just deported.....and the Democrats are talking about amnesty for illegals again? I say round them up, deport them all and build a huge wall from Southern California to Texas!

OKay i swore to myself i would not return to this forum but gosh darn it one boring night and a little sneak peek at this subject got my blood boiling. first of all I am completely insulted by the fact that YOU brother Darsy are calling legal citizens ALIENS which they are not they are citizens that just points out your ignorance as a human being who thinks that you have to be born in the country to become a full blooded citizen. Now I the first to admit that i am a total jerk and say the first thing that comes to my head as far as matters that i believe strick the very heart of me so if anyone wants to bash my ideas feel free to since frankly i dont really care :)

Secondly I dont know what the big deal is with Americans and the whole english being number one and have to shove it in everyones face. NOw i have always seen americans to be kinda ignorant towards the idea of integrating culture with in the country, keep in mind i living in california. now as a kid who grew up in canada we have never seen the problem of incorporating different languages or culture together not so much in that we had to or were thinking of making english a primary language. Now i seriously think that the foundation of the USA somewhere got lost and it is no longer the same country that stands for truth justice and all people equal under God. IT is the very perspective of most americans as far as culture and diversity goes that is the very reason why the country is thriving so much on prejudice and racism. I mean for crying out load Boston university is offering scholorships to one white people...and arabs who get on plans are atomatically labeled tourists cause the color of there skin. Mexicans who are legal in the country and born here are being called illegals and being shout at to go back to where they came from. I mean this is rediculous, I agree that something should be done to patrol the border of both canada and mexico but for crying out loud to all the ignorant bastards out there who are prejudice and believe they hold a high standing over another person get a friggin life. I cant tell you how many fist fights i wanted to get into when someone bashed a racial slur at me so to those thinking about any negative tone towards your neighbor i say take that though and shuff it up your *&*&*&*.

Ahhhh...please show me where in my post I was calling legal citizens of the U.S. aliens? If you read my post again I am sure you will see as everyone else does I am referring to illegal aliens or people from other countries who are in the U.S. illegally. You said....."that just points out your ignorance as a human being who thinks that you have to be born in the country to become a full blooded citizen." I am confused here...please tell me where in my post I said anything of the sort? I specifically said "I'm NOT talking about the legal aliens, the legitimate green card holders". Please if you are going to call me ignorant, please have a reason.

Then you said,"Secondly I don't know what the big deal is with Americans and the whole english being number one and have to shove it in everyones face." Who is shoving anything in anyones face...all I said was my son was in a school that had to teach in Spanish and English because of all the Mexican children of illegals in the class....it was confusing to my 5 year old who doesn't speak Spanish so I had to move him to a different school....Because the majority (approx. 280 million) of people in this nation speak English, because this nation is basically English speaking it is number one regardless of what you think...if you are going to come here legally or illegally...for goodness sake learn the language! As far as Canada goes....it's about 60/40 English/French....of course Canada wouldn't make one language official...but here in the U.S. it more like 99/1 English/Spanish.....so tell me why should the 99 foot the bill for the 1 when the 1 won't even try to learn the language? I certianly hope you were not calling me a racist ignorant ###### just because I'm tired of footing the bill for illegal aliens from Mexico....But you are right about one thing....I am an American who holds a high standing over someone who breaks the law regardless if you condone it or not! My God bless America and anyone who enters the country legally! Everyone else can stay the heck out!

[shanstress70]

I'm with ya Bro. Dorsey! Sunnysurfer, what makes you think you can call someone an 'ignorant ######'? Call me names if you want, but if someone wants to live in this country, THEY CAN LEARN THE LANGUAGE.

Just happened to read this http://www.wral.com/news/10431233/detail.html before looking at the forum. Fuel to the fire!

[Maureen]

...first of all I am completely insulted by the fact that YOU brother Darsy are calling legal citizens ALIENS....

sunny, maybe you're confused as to the meaning of "alien". Here's what dictionary.com says:

alien

–noun 1. a resident born in or belonging to another country who has not acquired citizenship by naturalization (distinguished from citizen).

2. a foreigner.

–adjective 5. residing under a government or in a country other than that of one's birth without having or obtaining the status of citizenship there.

M. :)

[Jason]

Then you said,"Secondly I don't know what the big deal is with Americans and the whole english being number one and have to shove it in everyones face." Who is shoving anything in anyones face...all I said was my son was in a school that had to teach in Spanish and English because of all the Mexican children of illegals in the class....it was confusing to my 5 year old who doesn't speak Spanish so I had to move him to a different school....

Funny. There are no Latinos in my daughter's First grade class, but they still teach them Spanish and she's picking it up quite easily. I guess my daughter either tries harder or is just smarter than your son.

As far as Canada goes....it's about 60/40 English/French....of course Canada wouldn't make one language official...but here in the U.S. it more like 99/1 English/Spanish.....so tell me why should the 99 foot the bill for the 1 when the 1 won't even try to learn the language?

To be more accurate it's 89/11 English/Spanish. And while Canada largely remains stagnant, Spanish will continue to rise as Latinos become the dominant population in the USA. I assume that my grandchildren will be bilingual, and Im lucky to already speak Spanish fluently.

I suggest that all Americans stop being lazy and learn Spanish before they're left behind.

I certianly hope you were not calling me a racist ignorant ###### just because I'm tired of footing the bill for illegal aliens from Mexico....But you are right about one thing....I am an American who holds a high standing over someone who breaks the law regardless if you condone it or not! My God bless America and anyone who enters the country legally! Everyone else can stay the heck out!

I don't mind helping PEOPLE from any country. As far as government waste is concerned, illegal citizen welfare hardly makes the top TEN.

Tenga un buen dia.

[shanstress70]

I suggest that all Americans stop being lazy and learn Spanish before they're left behind.

Jason, I totally disagree that Americans will be left behind if they don't learn Spanish. The more educated Latinos are all about learning English, as they know that is the official language. The ones that refuse to learn are the illegals who probably won't be much of a threat to anyone.

The language I would rather my child learn is Chinese, if I don't want him to be left behind.

[sunny_surfer]

<div class='quotemain'>

I suggest that all Americans stop being lazy and learn Spanish before they're left behind.

Jason, I totally disagree that Americans will be left behind if they don't learn Spanish. The more educated Latinos are all about learning English, as they know that is the official language. The ones that refuse to learn are the illegals who probably won't be much of a threat to anyone.

The language I would rather my child learn is Chinese, if I don't want him to be left behind.

well that in itself is a pretty ignorant way of looking at things...since it seems u are already judging a whole culture based on your prejudice and lack of views. IF it looks like a duck walk like a duck chances are its a duck. The reality is that most people who are white have a serious problem that all of a sudden they are no longer going to be the majority on this country and since the USA has for so long been a largely white populated country it seems everyone is freaking out because they are no longer going to be the majoriyt but the minority and ohh let hell brake lose if that were to happen if for once you would put yourself in the shoes of the other majorities in this country.

[Ray]

Let me try to take a non-partisan approach to these thoughts and see if I can see any good.

1: Allow Mexicans (or people who now currently reside in a country called Mexico) to become American citizens?

Sure, I'd vote for allowing that.

2: Allow America to annex (legally declare) Mexico as part of the United States of America?

Wars have been fought for much less... if you're talking about taking their land away from them.

Allow people from Mexico to become American citizens without having to pass some sort of test?

Nope... I won't vote for that... although I am for making the test a lot easier.

Just ask them if they will say "Yes" to our laws... raising their hands... and making an oath... to obey them.

It really doesn't matter what they "know" about America, as long as they obey all the laws they know about.

The questions like: "Who was the first President of America" does nothing to make good American citizens.