What is the most important verse in Section 89?

[JojoBag]

What do you think is the most important verse in Section 89? My darling and I talk about this and have concluded it is the following verse:

 

 

Behold, verily, thus saith the Lord unto you: In consequence of evils and designs which do and will exist in the hearts of conspiring men in the last days, I have warned you, and forewarn you, by giving unto you this word of wisdom by revelation—

(Doctrine and Covenants 89:4)

 

 

 

It looks like Heavenly Father is a conspiracy theorist. “In consequence of evils and designs which do and will exist in the hearts of conspiring men in the last days....” What is this conspiracy? I don't think it's necessarily all a Gadianton conspiracy, but mostly it's about money. It's about the food/agricultural industry doing whatever it can get away with to accumulate the almighty dollar.

 

Let's look at some of bad things produced by the food/agriculture industry. Raise your hand if you like cold cereal. I feel sorry for you if you eat it. Here's a Reader's Digest version about two rat experiments and extruded cereal. In 1942 and 1960, researchers conducted experiments by giving rats three or four different special diets: water and no food, grain or rat chow and water, sugar and water, boxed extruded cereal and water, and the box the cereal came in and water. Wanna know which group died first? The rats that ate the cereal died within two weeks. You can read about it here: http://www.westonaprice.org/health-topics/dirty-secrets-of-the-food-processing-industry/

 

Then there's the neurotoxins, aspartame, yeast extract, sodium caseinate, calcium caseinate, MSG, diacytl, aluminum, hydrolyzed vegetable protein, and sucralose to name only a few. All of these can damage the brain and cells throughout the body, and are an ingredient in many foods.

 

Next on the list are all the processed foods. I consider processed foods as anything that has nutrients taken from and/or added during preparation, and anything added (chemicals of any sort, bad oils and fats) that is not originally a part of that food. I am excluding things like good oils and fats used in cooking, or the cooking process itself, and legitimate spices. There probably are other things I've not included, but you get the idea. Basically, if the food is altered from its original form (not cooking), it's processed.

 

Next is the factory farming of animals. There is a major difference between eggs produced in an operation that confines chickens and true, free range-pastured chickens. Here is the visible difference: confined eggs are yellow and pastured eggs are orange because they contain lutein and zeaxanthin (antioxidents). Here is the nutrient difference: twice as much omega-3 fatty acids, three times more vitamin E, seven times more pro-vitamin A beta-carotene, a quarter less saturated fat, and a third less cholesterol.

 

The proper ratio of omega-3 to omega 6 is 1:3. In confined farming where hormones and antibiotics are added, animals that are ruminants are fed pastry waste and grains when they should have only grass. The differences in the nutrients in grass fed meat vs. confined, garbage fed meat is amazing. Grass fed beef, chicken, turkey, pork, etc., have lower fat, less cholesterol, and up to four times more omega-3 fatty acids.

 

Many of us drink caffeinated beverages or take OTC medicine with caffeine in it. Guess what? Researchers from BYU found a link between the spread of cancer and caffeine. Caffeine does not cause cancer but they “found that while caffeine does not damage healthy cells, it may protect cancer cells from death.” “...In preliminary tests, caffeine 'allowed damaged cells to continue to replicate and divide.' If the cell is not allowed to undergo apoptosis, then cancerous cells may be allowed to spread, and pre-cancerous cells may be allowed to progress.” (LDS Church News, 1998)

 

How about shortening? It was invented by Proctor and Gamble in 1910 and marketed as Crisco. Fifteen to twenty years later, doctors noted a massive increase in a disease that was not very common until then: heart disease. Increasingly, animal fats, palm oil and coconut oil, all saturated fats were demonized and other vegetable oils were pushed by big agriculture as being healthy. At the same, heart disease skyrocketed to become the leading cause of death. This past year, several studies have come out that demonstrated that saturated fats are not the cause of heart disease, but processed foods and unhealthy oils.

 

I'm overweight and about two months ago was given a physical. The doctor was all concerned about heart disease, specifically congestive heart failure. After a huge battery of tests, I came back to the doctor for the results. He said my heart was in good shape, but my cholesterol was a bit high. He lectured me a bit on that, then said, “Let's look at your LDL, the good cholesterol.” He scanned down the report and said, “Wow, your LDL is better than mine.” That is because I avoid processed foods. eat grass fed meats, whole grains only, drink grass fed raw milk, and eat lots of vegies. In my house, we make everything from scratch no matter how much time it takes. BTW, I make a mean whole wheat crust pizza.

 

Now, let me tell you another story with a bad ending. My dad had his first heart attack about age 50, followed by open heart surgery. My dad religiously followed the “heart healthy diet” prescribed by the doctor. He ate no beef, only chicken, turkey, and rabbit (yuck). He had only “good” vegetable oils and such, low fat cheese and milk, no butter, etc. The processed foods he ate were of the “healthy” variety. In spite of this, he had two more heart attacks, each followed by open heart surgery. During his forth open heart surgery that was replacing a defective pacemaker/defibrillator, the doctor killed him by tugging on the wrong wire.

 

The closer we get to the end times, the worse all of this will get.

[Guest]

Heavenly Father can't really be a "theorist", since He knows all things. 

 

We know that there are modern-day Gadianton robbers. We know there is much corruption in the world. He knows exactly where it is and who perpetuates it. "Theories" lie with those of us who don't know but guess, and sometimes go overboard. 

[james12]

I've been eating cereal for 35 years, and for some reason I'm still alive and going strong. I don't think processed foods are the major issue in the word of wisdom.

[Vort]

What do you think is the most important verse in Section 89?

 

The last verse.

[The Folk Prophet]

[Guest]

To answer the question, I'd second Vort's response.  And I believe it can intertwine with Jojo's list of conspiracies.

 

I believe the "conspiring men" that are being referred to are two-fold.

 

1) I believe it's a past reference back to Section 27.

2) I believe it is a future reference to many evils of modern society which are often associated with alcohol, tobacco, and illegal drugs.

 

Where do people go to drink?  Bars.  What happens at bars?  Lots of bad stuff.

How many people do many bad things while drunk?  Lots.

How much money is made for organized crime through the smuggling of tobacco products?  Lots.

How many people commit crime for the drug trade or while under the influence of drugs?  Lots.

How many people are willing to do "a little crime" for the drug trade and allow a Pandora's box into their lives?  Lots.

 

I'd echo Eowyn's words by saying that we all know there are real conspiracies all around us.  But that doesn't mean we have to believe any and all conspiracy theories we hear.  We need to find sufficient proof to believe it.  And we also need a sufficient amount of faith to believe that the Lord will give us specific warning about some bigger issues.

 

Let's say for instance that all those conspiracy theories that Jojo says are true.  How easy is it for an average person with average income to avoid all of them completely?  I'd argue it is nigh impossible without sending yourself to the poor house or to end up with imbalanced nutrition in some way.  

 

But I'd argue that the word of wisdom (per the last verse of section 89) is a promise that if we follow these simple rules (for the weak and weakest of the Saints) that the Lord will help mitigate such effects possibly in a miraculous way.  And it will keep us unspotted from the world so that many evils of the world will not destroy us.

Edited December 30, 2015 by Guest

[Vort]

Agreed. Section 89 certainly refers to what we would call "conspiracies", but they aren't the evil conspiracies of refined sugar and processed food.

 

We should be cautious of looking beyond the mark.

[Guest MormonGator]

 if we follow these simple rules (for the weak and weakest of the Saints) 

 Your post was great. 

They aren't simple rules though, in particular if you struggle with addiction. In fact,they are incredibly difficult to follow. 

Edited December 30, 2015 by MormonGator

[The Folk Prophet]

Agreed. Section 89 certainly refers to what we would call "conspiracies", but they aren't the evil conspiracies of refined sugar and processed food.

 

I don't know if that's entirely true. I would dare say there is a smidgen of truth to the OPs thinking (except that it does, indeed, IMO, look well beyond the mark).

[LeSellers]

Lots of good ideas here.

It may not be "the most important verse", but I think the words "3 Given for a principle with promise, adapted to the capacity of the weak and the weakest of all saints, who are or can be called saints" is important. Not part of the revelation itself, it is still telling that the Prophet would note that those who refuse to follow it are not "[able] to be called saints".

It's a simple commandment. It's a commandment with promise. It's the most widely known mark of distinction that make us "saints", however weak any of us may be.

Lehi

Edited December 30, 2015 by LeSellers

[Just_A_Guy]

On the one hand:  I remember, in the aftermath of the raid on the FLDS compound at the YFZ ranch, hearing that all those FLDS kids in state custody were having major digestive problems; because they had been raised on food the FLDS had grown themselves and weren't used to the processed stuff they were now getting from their foster families.

 

On the other hand:  Life expectancies today are longer than ever, even with all this ostensibly inferior food we've been getting.  It may be that in individual cases, this stuff can have a significant amount on one's lifespan in conjunction with certain genetic propensities or eating habits or what-have-you; and people should certainly be careful what they eat.  But if/when someone starts citing the WoW to justify a broad socio-political movement against Monsanto or whatever . . . I'm out.

[JojoBag]

It isn't just the food industry.  I picked it because everyone eats and heart disease is the number one killer in America.  However, there is also the pharmaceutical and tobacco industries.  Medical mistakes are the No. 3 leading cause of death and a part of that are drugs.  Look at the price of prescription drugs!  It's criminal what is allowed. 

[LeSellers]

Look at the price of prescription drugs!  It's criminal what is allowed.

That's a function of supply'n'demand. As long as people are willing to pay $X for a pill, the companies will charge $X.

The conspiracy comes in when the government dictates who can make drugs, who can sell them, and who can "prescribe" them. It's the AMA monopoly that makes drugs expensive. I am willing to concede that Big Pharma is in cahoots with the AMA by bribing congress and other politicians and bureaucrats to keep their profits, but that's a different issue.

Lehi

[MrShorty]

It is an interesting topic -- perhaps this is the direction you wanted the "spirit of the law/letter of the law" discussion to go.

 

There is not question that our modern, Western diets could be better, overall. Sometimes I wonder about trying to make a "moral right/wrong connection" through the WoW. I'm not quite sure how to explain my thinking -- perhaps this way?

 

1) To be worthy of a temple recommend, the TR question only asks if I abstain (100%) from coffee, tea, tobacco, and alcohol. This kind of becomes the minimum "letter of the law" that I think God expects.

2) D&C 89 is full of dietary recommendations (meat sparingly, wheat for humans (though all grains are permissible), fruits, herbs). However, the Church has not seen fit to reduce these verses to a detailed "approved" diet. The "spirit of the law", as I understand it, is to eat a balanced, healthy diet, and the Church leaves it up to individual members to decide what a balanced, healthy diet consists of. This is where Vort's concern about "looking beyond the mark" (post #7) might be important. It is one thing to say that "I think that XYZ is part of a healthy diet" and quite another to say "God thinks that XYZ is an essential part of a healthy diet". I think there is a difference between "prudence and wisdom" and "moral right and wrong" in these discussions.

3) I also think there can be questions around "complete abstinence" and "in moderation". For example, I love me some donuts, but, clearly, donuts have little to no nutritive value. They might even possible by hazardous to health. Shall we adopt a strict "thou shalt not eat donuts" stance and call it a command from God (or at least it is in keeping with the "spirit of the law" of the WoW)? The OP mentions research into processed cold cereals -- shall we put these in the TR interview and expect "righteous" people to abstain 100% from cold cereals?

4) I hate to pick a "most important" verse from D&C 89, but perhaps, as it applies to this line of thinking, one key phrase that I see is in verse 11 "...to be used with prudence and thanksgiving". Based on how I see our GA's talk, I take this to mean that, as far as the temporal/spiritual commandment that is the word of wisdom there are a few things that we are expected to completely abstain from. Outside of those things, we are expected to use our best judgement -- which can include medical and dietary science and research -- in incorporating other things into our diet.

[The Folk Prophet]

That's a function of supply'n'demand. As long as people are willing to pay $X for a pill, the companies will charge $X.

 

I find this statement to be false when it comes to prescription drugs.

[The Folk Prophet]

It is an interesting topic -- perhaps this is the direction you wanted the "spirit of the law/letter of the law" discussion to go.

 

There is not question that our modern, Western diets could be better, overall. Sometimes I wonder about trying to make a "moral right/wrong connection" through the WoW. I'm not quite sure how to explain my thinking -- perhaps this way?

 

1) To be worthy of a temple recommend, the TR question only asks if I abstain (100%) from coffee, tea, tobacco, and alcohol. This kind of becomes the minimum "letter of the law" that I think God expects.

2) D&C 89 is full of dietary recommendations (meat sparingly, wheat for humans (though all grains are permissible), fruits, herbs). However, the Church has not seen fit to reduce these verses to a detailed "approved" diet. The "spirit of the law", as I understand it, is to eat a balanced, healthy diet, and the Church leaves it up to individual members to decide what a balanced, healthy diet consists of. This is where Vort's concern about "looking beyond the mark" (post #7) might be important. It is one thing to say that "I think that XYZ is part of a healthy diet" and quite another to say "God thinks that XYZ is an essential part of a healthy diet". I think there is a difference between "prudence and wisdom" and "moral right and wrong" in these discussions.

3) I also think there can be questions around "complete abstinence" and "in moderation". For example, I love me some donuts, but, clearly, donuts have little to no nutritive value. They might even possible by hazardous to health. Shall we adopt a strict "thou shalt not eat donuts" stance and call it a command from God (or at least it is in keeping with the "spirit of the law" of the WoW)? The OP mentions research into processed cold cereals -- shall we put these in the TR interview and expect "righteous" people to abstain 100% from cold cereals?

4) I hate to pick a "most important" verse from D&C 89, but perhaps, as it applies to this line of thinking, one key phrase that I see is in verse 11 "...to be used with prudence and thanksgiving". Based on how I see our GA's talk, I take this to mean that, as far as the temporal/spiritual commandment that is the word of wisdom there are a few things that we are expected to completely abstain from. Outside of those things, we are expected to use our best judgement -- which can include medical and dietary science and research -- in incorporating other things into our diet.

 

I like this post. When it speaks of prudence, it strikes me that it means we are to be wise and practical in the matters. Declaring that cold cereal is of the devil and a tool of conspiring men to keep us held down by the man is hardly wise or practical. Eating too much sugary cold cereal is also not wise or practical.

 

Sadly one can no longer suggest the usage of common sense where sense is no longer common.

[LeSellers]

I find this statement to be false when it comes to prescription drugs.

Nonetheless, it is true.

Supply'n'demand dictate every price, no matter what the producer wants, he is forced to take the price the market offers. That said, we must recognize that the market is often rigged, as in this case, precisely by those who stand the greatest chance to exact excess profits through bribery to government officials.

That's why big government is so dangerous: it controls so much that it is profitable to buy politicians and require people to buy the monopolistic product, rather than a true free market (not attained in the real world for this reason) where all prices would reflect only the costs involved in producing the products or service.

Competition in both productions and distribution would make drugs prices fall, but government steps in to save those who contribute to campaigns and personal wealth.

Lehi

Edited December 30, 2015 by LeSellers

[The Folk Prophet]

Nonetheless, it is true.

 

No it's not.

 

How many times do you want to go back and forth on this?

 

Yes it is. No it's not. Yes it is. No it's not.

 

Does whoever get's the last one in win?

[LeSellers]

No it's not.

And your evidence is … ?

Lehi

[Guest]

Supply and demand in this scenario is skewed. We're not talking about LCD TV's or brands of bacon. We're talking about medicine that sometimes means life or death, and certainly dictates the state of our health. While I do think that a stand needs to be taken on a bigger scale (government, insurance companies, etc) on what drug companies can charge, Joe Consumer has little power to affect change in this case.

[estradling75]

Supply and demand in this scenario is skewed. We're not talking about LCD TV's or brands of bacon. We're talking about medicine that sometimes means life or death, and certainly dictates the state of our health. While I do think that a stand needs to be taken on a bigger scale (government, insurance companies, etc) on what drug companies can charge, Joe Consumer has little power to affect change in this case.

 

That is one way it is skewed...  Another way is when talking medical coverage the consumer is more interested in "does my insurance cover it"  then what does it cost.  It doesn't matter if it is cheaper elsewhere because they don't pay for it (directly at least)

[NightSG]

I'm overweight and about two months ago was given a physical. The doctor was all concerned about heart disease, specifically congestive heart failure. After a huge battery of tests, I came back to the doctor for the results. He said my heart was in good shape, but my cholesterol was a bit high. He lectured me a bit on that, then said, “Let's look at your LDL, the good cholesterol.” He scanned down the report and said, “Wow, your LDL is better than mine.”

 

After grandma died, granddad would get up in the morning, fry a half pound of bacon, scramble 3-4 eggs in the bacon grease, then make toast in the skillet to soak up the rest of the grease.  He'd use about a quarter stick of butter on the 2-3 slices of toast.  

 

After the doctor told him his HDL was unusually low, he started doubling up to make bacon and egg on toast sandwiches for lunch.

 

He also ate a lot of pecans, (still several acres of pecan orchards on the family land) and knew most of the beef he ate personally, since the primary source was the 10-20 cattle kept mainly to justify an ag exemption for the pastureland.  The bacon was from the same butcher that handle the beef, usually by trading beef for it.  Eggs generally came from the flock of chickens in the back yard.  Chicken was processed the old fashioned way on the back porch.

[The Folk Prophet]

And your evidence is … ?

 

Um...Hitler...  

 

And yours?

[Guest LiterateParakeet]

Jojo, "you can change a man's religion, but you can't change his diet."

You would have an easier time talking to people about the merits of any other religion, than what you are trying to do here. :)

I know I'm one of the offenders..my beliefs and goals about diet and about the Word of Wisdom are not in line...what can I say? The Spirit is willing but the flesh is weak. It's not that I'm ignoring this weakness. It's more about triage...I have more urgent and dangerous weaknesses to be taken care of first.

[The Folk Prophet]

On a side note as pertaining to LitPara's post, one of the best ways I learned discipline, sacrifice, etc., as applied to my entire life, was by taking control of my physical fitness life.