Another question about mormon religion..adam and eve?

[cncnaw]

Can someone please explain to me how the mormon religion views the story of adam and eve?

[NeuroTypical]

We believe they were real, living people, who really did live in the Garden of Eden.

We have various theories and guesses that would explain the seeming discrepancies between that claim, and DNA and archaeological issues. Theories and guesses only - no official doctrine resolving the issues.

LM

[cgrantreed]

I JUST got done reading a bunch of stuff on that so let me try and refrain from writing a book...Doubt i am capable though:D This is from the gospel of ME, without footnotes...

Earth is a probationary test to see if we will follow the plans set forth by God. As part of the plan of salvation, you must get the chance to have a mortal body. To do this you obviously have to be born to mortal parents and Adam and Eve was the start of that process when the world began. Adam was created in the Garden of Eden and God commanded Jehovah (Jesus prior to his birth) to create a woman for him, a companion and helpmeet. A rib was taken from his side for that process. Adam fell into a deep sleep and Eve was created. They awoke to the Garden and and God and Jehovah met them and gave them some simple commands; Tend the garden and be stewards to everything in it, be fruitful and multiply, and NEVER eat of the fruit of the tree of good and evil. We believe this was a literal tree, not a metaphor. If they were to eat of the fruit, they would surely die... we believe this to not be a death in the way that we mortals think of it as at this time, they were still immortal. It was being cast out from the garden as immortal beings, made mortal and capable of a mortal death and a much shorter life than eternity. They had real bodies but were not capable of death at this time. They were living in the midst of God and were like little children, with little knowledge of anything. It was eternal bliss basically but there was a catch... They could not have children as commanded because they were immortal. They didn't understand this because they did not know the difference between good and evil or what even having children was about. The key is... they were like little children.

Satan was cast out of the preexistence and sent to earth because he was against Gods plans and he too had to go to earth as part of the plan of salvation. He wanted to take control over Adam and Eve and complicate the plans that God had...though we believe that this was calculated by God tpp as he knew what would happen from the beginning. So One fine day in th gaarden, he approached Eve with the fruit of the tree and told her that it was darn fine fruit and she needed to eat it and she said no, then he told her that if she didn't then she would never know good from evil and would not be able to follow Gods "rules". She decided that this was neccesary and so she ate. Satan handed her a fruit and told her to go to Adam.

Adam asked her why she ate of it and she told him that it was good stuff and that Satan made her eat it. He said he would not do so and she said that if he did not that She would die and he would be left alone in the Garden. If He wanted to do all the things that God asked then he needed to eat of it too. So he relented and did so. They both had the fog ( the innocence) cleared from their minds and the realized who Satan was... their brother from the preexistence that was against God and about that time, God came back calling upon Adam and Eve to see what was going on. They explained the fruit debacle and Satan was called forth. He was chastised and he threatened to take the souls of man for it and God cast him out of the garden without a body. Adam and Eve were commanded to build clothes to cover themselves and they were cast out of the garden. At this time they were made mortal and capable of decay and aging and were forced to leave the glory of the garden and head out into the mortal world that we now live in.

They didn't get to reside with God and had to learn and make choices on their own. They now had the knowledge and physical abilities to have children and they did so. Their time in the bible was somewhere around 800-1000 years and they had many children which had children... you get the picture.

So, They went from innocent, immortal and lived in perfect world and after the fruit incident became mortal and capable of death, also became capable of having children but were no longer in the direct presence of God. Satan was there in their mortal world to tempt them and try and take their souls as he is here for all of us in our times now.

I hope this helps... Hope I didn't mess taht up too much...

grant

[WANDERER]

CGrant, enjoyed reading your retelling : )

[Mahonri]

"A rib was taken from his side for that process. Adam fell into a deep sleep and Eve was created."

This sentence is why we are told in Holy Places that it is "simply figurative" as far as the man and the woman are concerned.

Eve was created just like Adam was.

[cgrantreed]

My mom has a poem about this that I think is pretty cool...

Woman was taken out of man.

Not out of his head to top him,

Not out of his feet to be trampled under foot;

But out of his side to be equal to him,

Under his arm to be protected

and near his heart to be loved.

This came from LDS Improvement Era, April 1965

:-)

[inthearmsofsleep]

Just wanted to add my two cents... this is some stuff I got out of "Jesus The Christ" by James E. Talmage on the subject of Adam & Eve:

"The principal of the Word of Wisdom was revealed unto Adam.... He was not told to treat his body as something to be tortured.... He was told that he must not take into that body certain things which were there at hand. He was warned that, if he did, his body would lose the power which it then held of living for ever, and that he would become subject to death."

"...I take this occasion to raise my voice against the false interpretation of scripture, which has been adopted by certain people, and is current in their minds, and is referred to in a hushed and half-secret way, that the fall of man consisted in some offense against the laws of chastity and virtue. Such a doctrine is an abomination. What right have we to turn the scriptures from their proper sense and meaning? .... The human race was not born of fornication."

I think it's important to note this because there are many people who see the fruit they took as something symbolic, when in fact it was a natural process that changed them from immortal to mortal.

[Doctor Steuss]

"A rib was taken from his side for that process. Adam fell into a deep sleep and Eve was created."

This sentence is why we are told in Holy Places that it is "simply figurative" as far as the man and the woman are concerned.

Eve was created just like Adam was.

No need to go to Holy Places. Brigham Young taught openly:

You believe Adam was made of the dust of this earth. This I do not believe, though it s supposed that it is so written in the Bible; but it is not, to my understanding. You can write that information to the States, if you please-that I have publicly declared that I do not believe that portion of the Bible as the Christian world do. I never did, and I never want to. What is the reason I do not? Because I have come to understanding, and banished from my mind all the baby stories my mother taught me when I was a child. (Journal of Discourses, vol.2, p.6)

My mom has a poem about this that I think is pretty cool...

Woman was taken out of man.

Not out of his head to top him,

Not out of his feet to be trampled under foot;

But out of his side to be equal to him,

Under his arm to be protected

and near his heart to be loved.

This came from LDS Improvement Era, April 1965

:-)

Here’s a poem my grandfather used to recite that I think is pretty cool.

Ever since the world began

Woman has tried to rule the man

She comitted the first offence

And she’s been after him ever since

G-d created the earth and He rested then

G-d created man and He rested again

Then G-d created woman for man’s defense

And neither G-d nor man have rested since

[Hemidakota]

"A rib was taken from his side for that process. Adam fell into a deep sleep and Eve was created."

This sentence is why we are told in Holy Places that it is "simply figurative" as far as the man and the woman are concerned.

Eve was created just like Adam was.

Yes indeed but there is a story being told here that gives a person "glance back into the beginning."

The question here, were Adam & Eve created on this earth or simply brought here.

[Hemidakota]

I JUST got done reading a bunch of stuff on that so let me try and refrain from writing a book...Doubt i am capable though:D This is from the gospel of ME, without footnotes...

Earth is a probationary test to see if we will follow the plans set forth by God. As part of the plan of salvation, you must get the chance to have a mortal body. To do this you obviously have to be born to mortal parents and Adam and Eve was the start of that process when the world began. Adam was created in the Garden of Eden and God commanded Jehovah (Jesus prior to his birth) to create a woman for him, a companion and helpmeet. A rib was taken from his side for that process. Adam fell into a deep sleep and Eve was created. They awoke to the Garden and and God and Jehovah met them and gave them some simple commands; Tend the garden and be stewards to everything in it, be fruitful and multiply, and NEVER eat of the fruit of the tree of good and evil. We believe this was a literal tree, not a metaphor. If they were to eat of the fruit, they would surely die... we believe this to not be a death in the way that we mortals think of it as at this time, they were still immortal. It was being cast out from the garden as immortal beings, made mortal and capable of a mortal death and a much shorter life than eternity. They had real bodies but were not capable of death at this time. They were living in the midst of God and were like little children, with little knowledge of anything. It was eternal bliss basically but there was a catch... They could not have children as commanded because they were immortal. They didn't understand this because they did not know the difference between good and evil or what even having children was about. The key is... they were like little children.

Satan was cast out of the preexistence and sent to earth because he was against Gods plans and he too had to go to earth as part of the plan of salvation. He wanted to take control over Adam and Eve and complicate the plans that God had...though we believe that this was calculated by God tpp as he knew what would happen from the beginning. So One fine day in th gaarden, he approached Eve with the fruit of the tree and told her that it was darn fine fruit and she needed to eat it and she said no, then he told her that if she didn't then she would never know good from evil and would not be able to follow Gods "rules". She decided that this was neccesary and so she ate. Satan handed her a fruit and told her to go to Adam.

Adam asked her why she ate of it and she told him that it was good stuff and that Satan made her eat it. He said he would not do so and she said that if he did not that She would die and he would be left alone in the Garden. If He wanted to do all the things that God asked then he needed to eat of it too. So he relented and did so. They both had the fog ( the innocence) cleared from their minds and the realized who Satan was... their brother from the preexistence that was against God and about that time, God came back calling upon Adam and Eve to see what was going on. They explained the fruit debacle and Satan was called forth. He was chastised and he threatened to take the souls of man for it and God cast him out of the garden without a body. Adam and Eve were commanded to build clothes to cover themselves and they were cast out of the garden. At this time they were made mortal and capable of decay and aging and were forced to leave the glory of the garden and head out into the mortal world that we now live in.

They didn't get to reside with God and had to learn and make choices on their own. They now had the knowledge and physical abilities to have children and they did so. Their time in the bible was somewhere around 800-1000 years and they had many children which had children... you get the picture.

So, They went from innocent, immortal and lived in perfect world and after the fruit incident became mortal and capable of death, also became capable of having children but were no longer in the direct presence of God. Satan was there in their mortal world to tempt them and try and take their souls as he is here for all of us in our times now.

I hope this helps... Hope I didn't mess taht up too much...

grant

Beside Lucifer, there were others that tempted our first parents.

[WillowTheWhisp]

What Holy Places?

Doctor Steuss I don't quite understand what Brigham Young is saying there, do you? Is he saying that Adam was not created on the earth and that he was not caused to fall into a sleep and a rib taken from him from which Eve was made? If that part is not so then why are we taught it in the Temple? And if that part of what we are taught in the Temple is not true then how do we know at which point to start believing things to be true? If the creation is not factual then is the fruit factual? Is the tree factual? Is Eden factual or is it all a metaphor?

[Canuck Mormon]

Ever since the world began

Woman has tried to rule the man

She comitted the first offence

And she’s been after him ever since

G-d created man and He rested then

G-d created man and He rested again

Then G-d created woman for man’s defense

And neither G-d nor man have rested since

HAHAHAHAHAHA!!! Brilliant!!

[a-train]

What Holy Places?

Doctor Steuss I don't quite understand what Brigham Young is saying there, do you? Is he saying that Adam was not created on the earth and that he was not caused to fall into a sleep and a rib taken from him from which Eve was made? If that part is not so then why are we taught it in the Temple? And if that part of what we are taught in the Temple is not true then how do we know at which point to start believing things to be true? If the creation is not factual then is the fruit factual? Is the tree factual? Is Eden factual or is it all a metaphor?

Brigham openly taught that Adam and Eve had parents and were born and raised to adulthood on a different earth before coming to this one. Eden is/was factual. The creation was factual. The fruit was factual.

-a-train

[Hemidakota]

See Improvement Era, November 1909, page 80 - creation of Adam & Eve [Look closely at the Book of Moses 3:5 on how everything was created then placed on the earth -same pattern] Now why would GOD reveal this 'figurative story' to Moses? Think about it and ponder it. There is a key that was given that brings more enlightenment of the 'beginning'. :) Now, I can see how it can be misunderstood in our days, seeing our culture is based on literalism vice symbolical visions that was quite obvious in Moses time. Even our own personal visions are at times filled with the same symbolic undertones. Keep it simple, another key is to this understanding, is the creation of the Savior's mortal body.

Temple is filled with symbolic meaning....a classic example of temple symbolic teaching, even the priesthood is represented by the building architecture [design].

Fruit mystery - I do agree with -a-train. This was a factual. You find the answer in Moses 2:29. Though, immortal they both were, they still require a source of energy. Both Adam and Eve bodies, did not have blood flowing through their veins while in the Garden located in the Land called Eden. See Revelations also on the same subject - fruit bearing trees for those Saints that will live after the return of the Savior. Animal meat at this point will be done away with. Now the question is to all, where was this tree located in the garden?

However, not too steal anyone thunder, I came to this forum to search for an answer. :)

[WillowTheWhisp]

See Improvement Era, November 1909, page 80 - creation of Adam & Eve [Look closely at the Book of Moses 3:5 on how everything was created then placed on the earth -same pattern] Now why would GOD reveal this 'figurative story' to Moses? Think about it and ponder it. There is a key that was given that brings more enlightenment of the 'beginning'. :) Now, I can see how it can be misunderstood in our days, seeing our culture is based on literalism vice symbolical visions that was quite obvious in Moses time. Even our own personal visions are at times filled with the same symbolic undertones. Keep it simple, another key is to this understanding, is the creation of the Savior's mortal body.

Hang on a minute, putting Improvement Era November 1909 aside for a moment as I do not have access to a copy - lets look at the Book of Moses. Yes indeed it does say that everything was created before it was in the earth. It also goes on to explain that they were created spiritually before they were naturally upon the earth. In other words yes they did exist elsewhere before they existed on earth but that elsewhere was in spirit form in the spirit world. Aren't we told that Adam was Michael in the spirit world?

[JonboySquarepants]

i've always thought this was an interesting topic for discussion. as i see it, the lds and lds scriptures both teach that God pretty much commanded adam and eve to sin. of course, lds con't call it a sin, they call it a transgression. they directly violated a commandment of God, which they understood, and that's not a sin? it's all interesting.

[Hemidakota]

Both Adam and Eve bodies were engendered and placed in the Garden located in the Land of Eden...

Brigham Young, 9 Apr. 1852, in Journal of Discourses, 1:50; 23 Oct. 1853, in Journal of Discourses, 2:6; 20 Apr. 1856, in Journal of Discourses, 3:319; 9 Oct. 1859, in Journal of Discourses, 7:285;

Orson Pratt, 13 Apr. 1856, in Journal of Discourses, 3:344;

Joseph Fielding Smith, Doctrines of Salvation, 3 vols., comp. Bruce R. McConkie, Bookcraft, 1954-56, 1:97.

Temple Symbology:

Boyd K. Packer, The Holy Temple, Bookcraft, 1980, pp. 38-41, regarding the symbolic nature of temple instruction:

The reader may note here and in many following instances that teachings in the doctrine of the Church and the accounts given in the books of Moses, Abraham, and Genesis may seem to differ from the depiction of the Creation and the Fall in the temple ceremony. The intent of the temple ceremony seems to be much the same as the intent of the Genesis account: to present ideas through symbols and figurative language, which have many layers of meaning. It is perhaps appropriate that the Creation story in the temple is presented in a symbolic fashion, as the rest of the endowment is highly ritualistic and has numerous levels of meaning. To interpret the visual (film) depiction of the Creation and the Fall as only history rather than also as a figurative representation of underlying truths would deviate from the intent of the temple experience as a whole. One part cannot be interpreted as strictly symbolic and another as strictly historical.(/quote]See also: Packer, Holy Temple, pp. 191-94; John K. Edmunds, Through Temple Doors, Salt Lake City, Utah: Bookcraft, 1979, pp. 73-74.

Hyrum Andrus, noting the difference between the temple portrayal and the books of Abraham and Moses said: "A study of the problem suggests that the temple ceremony gives merely a general portrayal and not an actual account of the creation." reference - Hyrum Andrus, God, Man and the Universe, 2d ed., 4 vols.

[Hemidakota]

i've always thought this was an interesting topic for discussion. as i see it, the lds and lds scriptures both teach that God pretty much commanded adam and eve to sin. of course, lds con't call it a sin, they call it a transgression. they directly violated a commandment of God, which they understood, and that's not a sin? it's all interesting.

The other part of the statement is GOD the creator of chaos?

[WillowTheWhisp]

Temple Symbology:

Boyd K. Packer, The Holy Temple, Bookcraft, 1980, pp. 38-41, regarding the symbolic nature of temple instruction:

To interpret the visual (film) depiction of the Creation and the Fall as only history rather than also as a figurative representation of underlying truths would deviate from the intent of the temple experience as a whole. One part cannot be interpreted as strictly symbolic and another as strictly historical.

One thing I notice there is that he says "Not only.........but also........." He does not say "Not....but...."

In other words it is history and it is symbolism. It does not have to be one at the expense of the other.

I can look up the reference in Doctrines of Salvation but not the others - I do feel it is necessary to look at the original as often when people refer to something they may well have misunderstood what they are referring to.

[Hemidakota]

I understand.

At times, I only wish that GOD would give us dreams, visions, or when conversing, everything literally vice sombology. It may take years to receive an answer to a symbol. Even the Savior spoke at times, with those individuals during His mortal ministry [especially the Jewish priests] in parables.

Sidenote...have you noticed how paired ribs there of in the human body? lol

[WillowTheWhisp]

Do you mean we aren't missing an odd rib? Well we wouldn't be would we? We don't have to have one removed to create another human being.

This makes me think of that age-old question about whether or not Adam and Eve had a navel. Why would they? They were not born so would not have had an umbilical cord - but then again we don't know that they weren't created with one just for the sake of continuity.

[Hemidakota]

Late edit: Another random thought. I forgot to add to the last statement, what I was trying to bring to the ‘table’ here, have you ponder over, there is a deeper meaning to the 'rib' and the 'forbidden fruit'. If we had the Book of Adam vice the Book of Moses, we would all have a clearer picture of the creation, what transpired in the garden, and what happened there after.

[Hemidakota]

Do you mean we aren't missing an odd rib? Well we wouldn't be would we? We don't have to have one removed to create another human being.

This makes me think of that age-old question about whether or not Adam and Eve had a navel. Why would they? They were not born so would not have had an umbilical cord - but then again we don't know that they weren't created with one just for the sake of continuity.

twelve...

Late edit: Read Genesis 3:16, let me know your interuptation.

[WillowTheWhisp]

I don't know except that it's hard being a mother and bringing children into the world and bringing them up with all the heartaches that go along with that. From personal experience at the moment I can say my sorrow is greatly multiplied.

[Hemidakota]

For others: Genesis 3:16 "Unto the woman he said, I will greatly multiply thy sorrow and thy conception; in sorrow thou shalt bring forth children; and thy desire shall be to thy husband, and he shall rule over thee."

When Eve decided to partake of the fruit from the Tree of Knowledge to further gain knowledge, GOD place a curse on her for taking that initiative; Eve had a inquisitive mindset. You will also noticed in Genesis 3:17, there is an identical curse that was placed on Adam.

And unto Adam he said, Because thou hast hearkened unto the voice of thy wife, and hast eaten of the tree, of which I commanded thee, saying, Thou shalt not eat of it: cursed is the ground for thy sake; in sorrow shalt thou eat of it all the days of thy life;

The key here is the word 'sorrow' or 'atasy', means to labour, to sweat, to toil, to make hard. The other key is the word 'multiply' or 'plethynormai' [see the Septuagint], make it simply to understand, means to repeat over and over again.

Now, both terms, conception and labour of Eve will be multiply; according to the curse. Both curses have the same word 'sorrow' as you already see. If I look at the root meaning here, both Adam and Eve must sorrow and labour [work hard]. Look at the Septuagint word 'lype'! It means bodily or mental strain, affliction, or discomfort. It doesn't mean to be sorry, but to be very hard [to bear children for Eve and farm the earth for Adam].

The pattern of this world comes from where? GOD's own Celestial world. If that is a fact and excepted by you, then what about child bearing? What was the curse again for Eve? Did Eve even know how to have children; being adult with a child like mind?

Hopefully that helps somewhat...

Tree of Knowledge...perhaps the fruit has a significant meaning now.