What to do when your kid is excluded?

[RMConcernedDad]

I have a problem.  My kid was part of a good solid social circle.  A recent event occurred where incorrect information was shared by a person who was offended because the feelings were not mutual.
 Since that event occurred all of the rest of the youth group has literally turned and excluded my kid from all of their social activities the group of which he thought he was a part.

The offended party has told incorrect information to all of the youth leaders making it appear they were unjustly wronged.

 The reality is there was no interest in dating but because half truths have been shared the leaders are treating my kid differently.  

we have tried talking to the bishop in the past but he doesn’t listen as he only wants to talk about positive things or when repentance is needed.

We have tried talking to the young women’s president but she doesn’t do anything.

we tried to talk to the other persons mom but she didn’t want to let the kids talk it out and clear the air.

Even the  stake presidents wife says our kid needs to stop coming because of the falsehoods that were shared by the other person.

at the last church dance a couple of the girls came up to my kid and cussed him out for not dating her and several other items that were not true.

we are reserved and not part of any of the cliques within our ward.
 

I know we all, kids included need to go through healthy struggles and will grow but this is not a productive struggle.  We are hoping for a miracle to happen.  
 

Right now my child doesn’t believe members can be trusted, won’t stand by you and doesn’t want to be around Mormons anymore.   This is just not good.  Blessing have been requested and given several times due to overwhelming feeling of rejection, loneliness and knowing after hearing the other ward kids brag about getting together over the weekends.  To make matters worse these kids are all children of the ward leadership group.

I'm coming here for some ideas because  i don’t know what to do to help anymore.

sincerely an active full tithe paying Mormon parent who wants their child to stay active in spite of bad leadership.

Edited October 16, 2024 by RMConcernedDad

[zil2]

So sorry you and your child are going through this, @RMConcernedDad!  I cannot offer you advice - not a parent, don't recall being a child.  It sure sounds like the ward leaders are failing to do as Christ commanded - the Book of Mormon makes it quite clear that Christ does not want anyone sent away, but rather included (e.g. 3 Nephi 18:25).  Hopefully some of the parents here will have advice for you.

 

[Ironhold]

Under the circumstances, have you considered an appeal to Salt Lake City?

This might seem drastic, but if the stake president won't intervene then you may well need to go over his head on the matter. 

[RMConcernedDad]

What does this mean?  I’ve never heard of such a thing and what would it accomplish?

[pam]

4 hours ago, Ironhold said:

Under the circumstances, have you considered an appeal to Salt Lake City?

This might seem drastic, but if the stake president won't intervene then you may well need to go over his head on the matter. 

What exactly is there to appeal that you would suggest taking it to Salt Lake City? This is a ward or stake matter. 

[NeuroTypical]

22 hours ago, RMConcernedDad said:

My kid was part of a good solid social circle.  
...
Since that event occurred all of the rest of the youth group has literally turned and excluded my kid from all of their social activities

So, having two grown kids and also being a kid myself, I remember plenty of social drama.  That said, those two sentences really don't work together. 

You're telling us about the kids, the parents, the youth leaders, the bishop, and the stake parent's wife.  If all that is a true recounting of the events, why on earth would any parent want to teach his kid that this is how a "good solid social circle" acts?

Do you think all that has transpired, is how a "good solid social circle" acts when young drama shows up?

 

Edited October 17, 2024 by NeuroTypical

[RMConcernedDad]

10 hours ago, NeuroTypical said:

So, having two grown kids and also being a kid myself, I remember plenty of social drama.  That said, those two sentences really don't work together. 

You're telling us about the kids, the parents, the youth leaders, the bishop, and the stake parent's wife.  If all that is a true recounting of the events, why on earth would any parent want to teach his kid that this is how a "good solid social circle" acts?

Do you think all that has transpired, is how a "good solid social circle" acts when young drama shows up?

 

It’s not about getting back into the social circle, that ship has sailed.  The issue is that he is alone, feeling abandoned and no longer trusts members of the church or feels they live the gospel.  This is not a healthy struggle and is a heavy burden for a teenager to go through at such a young age.  I fear for him on many levels.  
 

Spiritually as this has shaken his spiritual foundation.

emotionally as he feels isolated, alone, and without hope.

physically as it is affecting his sleep and could lead to more

mentally as he finds it hard to focus at school

again I’m just looking for ideas to help him through this difficult stage in his life.

we are pushing him to participate in other religious youth groups as those kids appear to be living the gospel principles.  This could be good or bad but it’s something 

Edited October 17, 2024 by RMConcernedDad
Added a piece

[NeuroTypical]

Dad, I feel you.   I have been where your kid is.  Both of my children have been where your kid is.  

4 hours ago, RMConcernedDad said:

The issue is that he is alone, feeling abandoned and no longer trusts members of the church or feels they live the gospel.  This is not a healthy struggle and is a heavy burden for a teenager to go through at such a young age.  I fear for him on many levels.  

So, honest question: Were those members of that social circle living the gospel?  Your kid has lost trust in these people, and from what you are telling us, he is right to do so.   People who gossip and spread untruths?  People who refuse to find out the truth of people within their stewardship, and just go with the story of some kid playing the victim?

Of course this is a totally healthy struggle for a teenager.  The teenage years seem designed by God to be the years where we begin to struggle with such weighty matters. Peer pressure, and the desire to find a place to belong, a brain developing long-term planning ability and growing in the ability to grapple with complex social and moral issues: All of this ramps up in the teenage years.  

I totally get the list of how this experience is impacting him.  I feel it deeply.  I had similar things happen to me.  I've watched my kids go through similar struggles.  I've spent my share of nights fearing for my kids.  I get it, and I'm not brushing it aside.   

 

4 hours ago, RMConcernedDad said:

again I’m just looking for ideas to help him through this difficult stage in his life.

we are pushing him to participate in other religious youth groups as those kids appear to be living the gospel principles.  This could be good or bad but it’s something 

Ideas: 
- Love him as best you can. You might try expressing a little pride in him.  Dude is hurt because people who were supposed to be the good people and role models passed untruths about him, and nobody seems to want his side of the story.  Dude is reacting with pain and hurt and stress and loss of sleep.  You know how other kids react?  They turn mean.  They get manipulative or vengeful or angry or even.  They look for approval in bad places.   May God continue to bless your kid with a strong moral foundation that allows him to see wrong and say wrong. 

- Empathize with him if you can.  How were things when you were a teen?  Do you remember how you reacted to such things?

- Walk this road with him, not for him.  This can be a harder thing for a parent to do.  Teenagers are moving from needing constant protection and guidance, to moving out and exploring the world.  The parent has the impossible task of letting them stumble so they can grow, but keeping them from going off the cliff.   I don't think there's a loving parent out there that doesn't wrestle mightily with this.

- I note that you seem rather invested in signaling adherence to church things.  Your screen name indicates you're an RM.  You signed your first post as an active full tithe paying Mormon.  You get that your kid doesn't care, right?  You're telling us he just got betrayed by a bunch of active tithing RM's.   Your kid doesn't need to know you do/are these things, he needs to know why you do/are these things.   Assuming you're giving an accurate account, he needs to know why you are a good example while the kids, the parents, the bishop, the youth leaders, and the stake president's wife are all being a bad example.  What's the difference between you and them?  Figure it out, and talk to your kid about it.  

That's my attempt to help, assuming you're giving a complete and clear picture.  If there's more to the story you're not sharing, please consider sharing it.  I mean, if your kid actually did something that warrants such a reaction, and you're protecting him instead of helping him repent, then the situation is totally different than how you are portraying it.  I'm not saying that's what is happening.  It's just out of the last 50 times I've heard a story like yours, maybe 20 of them it turned out the parent was doing their own share of lying and making their own kid look like the victim while hiding the kid's actions and protecting the kid from just consequences.  Again, not saying that's you.  But not everyone with an "my kid is the only good one and everyone else is being bad" story is being fully honest.  Are you being fully honest with us?

Edited October 17, 2024 by NeuroTypical

[zil2]

36 minutes ago, NeuroTypical said:

he needs to know why you are a good example while the kids, the parents, the bishop, the youth leaders, and the stake president's wife are all being a bad example.

This.  I went through teenage years in low-density Zion.  I knew long before any of the other kids (outside the Church) came along with temptations or just bad ideas that we (my family, members of the Church) don't do those kinds of things.  And I knew when other girls in the Church chose to do things I'd been taught not to that in my family, we don't do those things, even if a member of the Church does.  It made living the gospel so much easier, knowing in advance that we were going to live the gospel no matter what anyone else, in or out of the Church did, and if that made us different, good for us (hard though it may be).

Draw the line - they do what they do, but no matter what they do, we live the gospel.  And yeah, explain the why.  Bear and build testimony. The gospel should be ever-present in your home.  It may be too late to prepare your kid in advance that members of the Church aren't always good examples of gospel living, but it's not too late to use this experience to teach faith and humility.

Personally, I'd be worried that involvement in other religions would convince my kid that the Church isn't true at all...

(Reminder: all that was written by a non-parent who barely remembers her teen years.)

[Ironhold]

15 hours ago, pam said:

What exactly is there to appeal that you would suggest taking it to Salt Lake City? This is a ward or stake matter. 

It's rare, but a stake president can stumble to a degree that it negatively affects the entire stake. 

For example, when I was a teenager, the stake presidency was so obsessed with getting all young men to go on missions that they spent just about every 5th Sunday and stake priesthood meeting declaring that all young men *must* serve missions and all young women *must* consider any man who doesn't serve a mission as ineligible for marriage, no exceptions, not even for valid health or other such concerns; I was actually literally told that my having a heart condition wasn't a disqualifier as I'd just be sent to a mission that included a good hospital, a promise that the priesthood leader who said this didn't have the authority to promise. For a young man to not serve was to essentially mean that they were abandoning their duties and were thus of no further value to the church. 

We lost a *lot* of young men over this, and a lot of the young women who were coming up during this period wound up looking well outside of the stake for partners. It disrupted the stake for an entire generation. 

If someone had actually contacted Salt Lake over the matter back then, I imagine that things would have been quite different. 

[RMConcernedDad]

4 hours ago, NeuroTypical said:

Dad, I feel you.   I have been where your kid is.  Both of my children have been where your kid is.  

So, honest question: Were those members of that social circle living the gospel?  Your kid has lost trust in these people, and from what you are telling us, he is right to do so.   People who gossip and spread untruths?  People who refuse to find out the truth of people within their stewardship, and just go with the story of some kid playing the victim?

Of course this is a totally healthy struggle for a teenager.  The teenage years seem designed by God to be the years where we begin to struggle with such weighty matters. Peer pressure, and the desire to find a place to belong, a brain developing long-term planning ability and growing in the ability to grapple with complex social and moral issues: All of this ramps up in the teenage years.  

I totally get the list of how this experience is impacting him.  I feel it deeply.  I had similar things happen to me.  I've watched my kids go through similar struggles.  I've spent my share of nights fearing for my kids.  I get it, and I'm not brushing it aside.   

 

Ideas: 
- Love him as best you can. You might try expressing a little pride in him.  Dude is hurt because people who were supposed to be the good people and role models passed untruths about him, and nobody seems to want his side of the story.  Dude is reacting with pain and hurt and stress and loss of sleep.  You know how other kids react?  They turn mean.  They get manipulative or vengeful or angry or even.  They look for approval in bad places.   May God continue to bless your kid with a strong moral foundation that allows him to see wrong and say wrong. 

- Empathize with him if you can.  How were things when you were a teen?  Do you remember how you reacted to such things?

- Walk this road with him, not for him.  This can be a harder thing for a parent to do.  Teenagers are moving from needing constant protection and guidance, to moving out and exploring the world.  The parent has the impossible task of letting them stumble so they can grow, but keeping them from going off the cliff.   I don't think there's a loving parent out there that doesn't wrestle mightily with this.

- I note that you seem rather invested in signaling adherence to church things.  Your screen name indicates you're an RM.  You signed your first post as an active full tithe paying Mormon.  You get that your kid doesn't care, right?  You're telling us he just got betrayed by a bunch of active tithing RM's.   Your kid doesn't need to know you do/are these things, he needs to know why you do/are these things.   Assuming you're giving an accurate account, he needs to know why you are a good example while the kids, the parents, the bishop, the youth leaders, and the stake president's wife are all being a bad example.  What's the difference between you and them?  Figure it out, and talk to your kid about it.  

That's my attempt to help, assuming you're giving a complete and clear picture.  If there's more to the story you're not sharing, please consider sharing it.  I mean, if your kid actually did something that warrants such a reaction, and you're protecting him instead of helping him repent, then the situation is totally different than how you are portraying it.  I'm not saying that's what is happening.  It's just out of the last 50 times I've heard a story like yours, maybe 20 of them it turned out the parent was doing their own share of lying and making their own kid look like the victim while hiding the kid's actions and protecting the kid from just consequences.  Again, not saying that's you.  But not everyone with an "my kid is the only good one and everyone else is being bad" story is being fully honest.  Are you being fully honest with us?

Thank you so much for your helpful words and ideas!!!  I am sorry you had to experience similar situations and your kids as well.  Clearly it has made you a better person, I can only hope it does the same for my son!  Again thank you for your insights and sharing your experiences!!!

[RMConcernedDad]

3 hours ago, Ironhold said:

It's rare, but a stake president can stumble to a degree that it negatively affects the entire stake. 

For example, when I was a teenager, the stake presidency was so obsessed with getting all young men to go on missions that they spent just about every 5th Sunday and stake priesthood meeting declaring that all young men *must* serve missions and all young women *must* consider any man who doesn't serve a mission as ineligible for marriage, no exceptions, not even for valid health or other such concerns; I was actually literally told that my having a heart condition wasn't a disqualifier as I'd just be sent to a mission that included a good hospital, a promise that the priesthood leader who said this didn't have the authority to promise. For a young man to not serve was to essentially mean that they were abandoning their duties and were thus of no further value to the church. 

We lost a *lot* of young men over this, and a lot of the young women who were coming up during this period wound up looking well outside of the stake for partners. It disrupted the stake for an entire generation. 

If someone had actually contacted Salt Lake over the matter back then, I imagine that things would have been quite different. 

Wow!  What an awful thing to experience as a child or parent.  It’s unfortunate many people as president Faust told elder utchdorf … don’t inhale.  To many people get caught up in callings instead of serving the church.  I’m sure the stake president didn’t intend for the negative affects but there were negative affects as a result of what he did for your youth.   Simply put my brothers wouldn’t have served in that environment.  Interesting I never knew such a thing existed.

[RMConcernedDad]

4 hours ago, zil2 said:

This.  I went through teenage years in low-density Zion.  I knew long before any of the other kids (outside the Church) came along with temptations or just bad ideas that we (my family, members of the Church) don't do those kinds of things.  And I knew when other girls in the Church chose to do things I'd been taught not to that in my family, we don't do those things, even if a member of the Church does.  It made living the gospel so much easier, knowing in advance that we were going to live the gospel no matter what anyone else, in or out of the Church did, and if that made us different, good for us (hard though it may be).

Draw the line - they do what they do, but no matter what they do, we live the gospel.  And yeah, explain the why.  Bear and build testimony. The gospel should be ever-present in your home.  It may be too late to prepare your kid in advance that members of the Church aren't always good examples of gospel living, but it's not too late to use this experience to teach faith and humility.

Personally, I'd be worried that involvement in other religions would convince my kid that the Church isn't true at all...

(Reminder: all that was written by a non-parent who barely remembers her teen years.)

Thank you for your kind advice.  You were clearly taught well.  We are trying to do those things.  Being prepared helps to prepare but it’s doesn’t help the natural emotions we all experience in life.  
 

Thanks for the reminder that what we do in the home is the most important thing to do!  

[zil2]

13 minutes ago, RMConcernedDad said:

Being prepared helps to prepare but it’s doesn’t help the natural emotions we all experience in life.  

Nope.  But the goal is that he knows to turn to and trust his parents when he can't trust others.  Love your son.  Love the Lord.  Teach your son to love and trust the Lord.

[zil2]

PS: Might be too soon, but what an opportunity you have to teach about humility and forgiving others regardless of whether they've asked for it.

[pam]

6 hours ago, Ironhold said:

It's rare, but a stake president can stumble to a degree that it negatively affects the entire stake. 

For example, when I was a teenager, the stake presidency was so obsessed with getting all young men to go on missions that they spent just about every 5th Sunday and stake priesthood meeting declaring that all young men *must* serve missions and all young women *must* consider any man who doesn't serve a mission as ineligible for marriage, no exceptions, not even for valid health or other such concerns; I was actually literally told that my having a heart condition wasn't a disqualifier as I'd just be sent to a mission that included a good hospital, a promise that the priesthood leader who said this didn't have the authority to promise. For a young man to not serve was to essentially mean that they were abandoning their duties and were thus of no further value to the church. 

We lost a *lot* of young men over this, and a lot of the young women who were coming up during this period wound up looking well outside of the stake for partners. It disrupted the stake for an entire generation. 

If someone had actually contacted Salt Lake over the matter back then, I imagine that things would have been quite different. 

The next step is to take it to their area 70 but only if no satisfaction is gained from the Bishop or Stake level. Not directly to Salt Lake. And no offense to the OP but we are only getting one side of the story.