How easy is it ????

[Misshalfway]

We need to send out an all site bulletin!

[lostnfound]

I agree!

does this show up in pink

[Vanhin]

Dude, Lost is a sister, not a brother.

Oh crap!!

I am so sorry lostandfound! I'm going to go back and edit my posts so I don't confuse anyone.

[lostnfound]

no problem..

[Brother Dorsey]

i could not understand a reglion that says repentace is not important ethier. In fact remember our no lordship debate topic thread. I do not follow those guys..but they say repentance is not part of it..we both know God calls us to repent..but repentance over and over will not earn salvation..but that does not mean you should not repent. I repent but not to earn salvation. i repent because the holy spirit has convicted me that i am wrong and i need to be right with God.

Lost....I'm at a loss here to understand your reasoning. Are you saying that our salvation is guaranteed no matter what as long as we believe in Christ even if we don't repent of our sins? If repentance of your sins makes no difference in the long run then why repent at all? Kind of like a license to sin thing huh? "Hey, who cares if I steal...I'm saved." "Who cares if I commit adultery, I'm saved." "Who cares if I lie, cheat and sin....I'm saved...it's guaranteed!!! Whoopi!"

[lostnfound]

nope not at all. I know I answered this on another thread. Have you ever the gospel presented from a non lds person?

[Guest tomk]

I am cracking up!!!!! I AM A GIRL! GOLLY DARN IT! LONG HAIR..DRESSES, PINK BOWES,, CRIES AT GIRLY MOVIES...GIRL!

Wait -- you're a girl???

(sorry, couldn't resist)

[HizWife625]

[QUOTE=Brother Dorsey;193917]Lost....I'm at a loss here to understand your reasoning. Are you saying that our salvation is guaranteed no matter what as long as we believe in Christ even if we don't repent of our sins? If repentance of your sins makes no difference in the long run then why repent at all? Kind of like a license to sin thing huh? "Hey, who cares if I steal...I'm saved." "Who cares if I commit adultery, I'm saved." "Who cares if I lie, cheat and sin....I'm saved...it's guaranteed!!! Whoopi!"

Salvation is not a matter of believers trying to confess and repent from every sin they commit before they die. Salvation is not based on whether a Christian has confessed and repented of every sin. Yes, we should confess our sins to God as soon as we are aware that we have sinned. However, we do not always need to be asking God for forgiveness. When we place our faith in Jesus Christ for salvation, ALL of our sins are forgiven. That includes past, present, and future, big or small. Believers do not have to keep asking for forgiveness or repenting in order to have their sins forgiven. Jesus died to pay the penalty for all of our sins, and when they are forgiven, they are all forgiven (Colossians 1:14; Acts 10:43).

Colossians 1:14

14 in whom we have redemption through His blood,[a] the forgiveness of sins.

Acts 10:43

43 To Him all the prophets witness that, through His name, whoever believes in Him will receive remission of sins.”

What we are to do is confess our sins: “If we confess our sins, He is faithful and just and will forgive us our sins and purify us from all unrighteousness” (1 John 1:9).

Please note that this Scripture does not mention asking God for forgiveness. Scripture nowhere instructs believers in Christ to ask God for forgiveness.

What 1 John 1:9 tells us to do is “confess” our sins to God. The word “confess” means “to agree with.” When we confess our sins to God, we are agreeing with God that we were wrong, that we have sinned. God forgives us, through confession, on an ongoing basis because of the fact that He is “faithful and just.” How is God “faithful and just?” He is faithful by forgiving sins; that He has promised to do for all those who receive Christ as Savior. He is just by applying Christ’s payment for our sins, recognizing that the sins have indeed been atoned for.

When we sin, we are to humble ourself before His throne and admit our wrongdoings.....

1 John 1:9 does, though, indicate that somehow forgiveness is dependant on our confessing our sins to God.

How does this work if all of our sins are forgiven the moment we receive Christ as Savior? It seems what the Apostle John is describing here is “relational” forgiveness. All of our sins are forgiven “positionally” the moment we receive Christ as Savior. This “positional” forgiveness guarantees our salvation and promise of an eternal home in Heaven. When we stand before God after death, God will not deny us entrance into Heaven because of our sins. That is “positional” forgiveness.

The concept of “relational” forgiveness is based on the fact that when we sin, we offend God and grieve His Spirit (Ephesians 4:30).

30 And do not grieve the Holy Spirit of God, by whom you were sealed for the day of redemption

While God has ultimately forgiven us of the sins we commit, they still result in a blocking or hindrance in our relationship with God. A young boy who sins against his father is not cast out of the family.

A godly father will forgive his children unconditionally. At the same time, a good relationship between father and son cannot be achieved until the relationship is restored. This can only occur when a child confesses his mistakes to his father, and apologizes. That is why we confess our sins to God…not to maintain our salvation, but to bring ourselves back into close fellowship with the God who loves us and has already forgiven us.

[HizWife625]

Now moving on to Acts 2:38, “And Peter said to them, ‘Repent, and let each of you be baptized in the name of Jesus Christ for the forgiveness of your sins; and you shall receive the gift of the Holy Spirit.’”

As with any single verse or passage, we discern what it teaches by first filtering it through what we know the Bible teaches on the subject at hand. In the case of baptism and salvation, the Bible is clear that salvation is by grace through faith in Jesus Christ, not by works of any kind, including baptism (Ephesians 2:8-9).

For by grace you have been saved through faith, and that not of yourselves; it is the gift of God, 9 not of works, lest anyone should boast.

So, any interpretation which comes to the conclusion that baptism, or any other act, is necessary for salvation, is a faulty interpretation

Those who hold to the belief that baptism is required for salvation are quick to point to this verse and the fact that it says “be baptized in the name of Jesus Christ for the forgiveness of your sins,” assuming that the word translated “for” in this verse means “in order to get.” However, in both Greek and English, there are many possible usages of the word “for.”

As an example, when one says “Take two aspirin for your headache,” it is obvious to everybody that it does not mean “take two aspirin in order to get your headache,”

We need to start by looking back to the original language and the meaning of the Greek word eis. This is a common Greek word (it is used 1774 times in the New Testament) that is translated many different ways. Like the English word “for” it can have several different meanings. So, again, we see at least two or three possible meanings of the passage, one that would seem to support that baptism is required for salvation and others that would not. While both the meanings of the Greek word eis are seen in different passages of Scripture, such noted Greek scholars as A.T. Robertson and J.R. Mantey have maintained that the Greek preposition eis in Acts 2:38 should be translated “because of” or “in view of,” and not “in order to,” or “for the purpose of.”

there are three other verses where the Greek word eis is used in conjunction with the word “baptize” or “baptism.” The first of these is Matthew 3:11, “baptize you with water for repentance.” Clearly the Greek word eis cannot mean “in order to get” in this passage. They were not baptized “in order to get repentance,” but were “baptized because they had repented.” The second passage is Romans 6:3 where we have the phrase “baptized into (eis) His death.” This again fits with the meaning “because of” or in "regard to." The third and final passage is 1 Corinthians 10:2 and the phrase “baptized into (eis) Moses in the cloud and in the sea.” Again, eis cannot mean “in order to get” in this passage because the Israelites were not baptized in order to get Moses to be their leader, but because he was their leader and had led them out of Egypt. If one is consistent with the way the preposition eis is used in conjunction with baptism, we must conclude that Acts 2:38 is indeed referring to their being baptized “because” they had received forgiveness of their sins. Some other verses where the Greek preposition eis does not mean “in order to obtain” are

Matthew 28:19;

9 Go therefore[a] and make disciples of all the nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father and of the Son and of the Holy Spirit,

1

1 Peter 3:21;

21 There is also an antitype which now saves us—baptism (not the removal of the filth of the flesh, but the answer of a good conscience toward God), through the resurrection of Jesus Christ

Acts 19:3;

3 And he said to them, “Into what then were you baptized?”

So they said, “Into John’s baptism

1 Corinthians 1:15; and 12:13.

15 lest anyone should say that I had baptized in my own name

12:13 For by one Spirit we were all baptized into one body—whether Jews or Greeks, whether slaves or free—and have all been made to drink into[a] one Spirit

Another error that is made by those who believe Acts 2:38 teaches baptism is required for salvation is what is sometimes called the Negative Inference Fallacy. Simply put, this is the idea that just because a statement is true, we cannot assume all negations (or opposites) of that statement are true. In other words, just because Acts 2:38 says “repent and be baptized….for the forgiveness of sins…and the gift of the Holy Spirit,” it does not mean that if one repents and is not baptized, he will not receive forgiveness of sins or the gift of the Holy Spirit.

There is an important difference between a condition of salvation and a requirement for salvation. The Bible is clear that belief is both a condition and a requirement, but the same cannot be said for baptism. The Bible does not say that if a man is not baptized then he will not be saved. If that were true, Jesus would never have been able to assure the criminal crucified with Him that he would be with Him in paradise that very day (Luke 23:39-43). One can add any number of conditions to faith (which is required for salvation), and the person can still be saved. For example if a person believes, is baptized, goes to church, and gives to the poor he will be saved. Where the error in thinking occurs is if one assumes all these other conditions, “baptism, going to church, giving to the poor,” are required for one to be saved. While they might be the evidence of salvation, they are not a requirement for salvation.

Acts 10:43

43 To Him all the prophets witness that, through His name, whoever believes in Him will receive remission of sins

Peter tells Cornelius that “through His name everyone who believes in Him receives forgiveness of sins” (please note that nothing at this point has been mentioned about being baptized, yet Peter connects believing in Christ with the act of receiving forgiveness for sins). The next thing that happens is, having believed Peter’s message about Christ, the “Holy Spirit fell upon all those who were listening to the message” (Acts 10:44).

Acts 10:44 (

The Holy Spirit Falls on the Gentiles

44 While Peter was still speaking these words, the Holy Spirit fell upon all those who heard the word

It is only after they had believed, and therefore received forgiveness of their sins and the gift of the Holy Spirit, that Cornelius and his household were baptized (Acts 10:47-48).

47 “Can anyone forbid water, that these should not be baptized who have received the Holy Spirit just as we have?” 48 And he commanded them to be baptized in the name of the Lord. Then they asked him to stay a few days

The context and the passage are very clear; Cornelius and his household received both forgiveness of sins and the Holy Spirit before they were ever baptized. In fact, the reason Peter allowed them to be baptized was that they showed evidence of receiving the Holy Spirit “just as Peter and the Jewish believers” had.

Acts 2:38 does not teach that baptism is required for salvation. While baptism is important as the sign that one has been justified by faith and as the public declaration of one’s faith in Christ and membership in a local body of believers, it is not the means of remission or forgiveness of sins. The Bible is very clear that we are saved by grace alone through faith alone in Christ alone

John 1:12

12 But as many as received Him, to them He gave the right to become children of God, to those who believe in His name

John 3:16

16 For God so loved the world that He gave His only begotten Son, that whoever believes in Him should not perish but have everlasting life

Acts 16:31

31 So they said, “Believe on the Lord Jesus Christ, and you will be saved, you and your household.”

Romans 3:21-30

God’s Righteousness Through Faith

21 But now the righteousness of God apart from the law is revealed, being witnessed by the Law and the Prophets, 22 even the righteousness of God, through faith in Jesus Christ, to all and on all[a] who believe. For there is no difference; 23 for all have sinned and fall short of the glory of God, 24 being justified freely by His grace through the redemption that is in Christ Jesus, 25 whom God set forth as a propitiation by His blood, through faith, to demonstrate His righteousness, because in His forbearance God had passed over the sins that were previously committed, 26 to demonstrate at the present time His righteousness, that He might be just and the justifier of the one who has faith in Jesus.

Romans 4:5

David Celebrates the Same Truth

5 But to him who does not work but believes on Him who justifies the ungodly, his faith is accounted for righteousness,

Romans 10:9-10

9 that if you confess with your mouth the Lord Jesus and believe in your heart that God has raised Him from the dead, you will be saved. 10 For with the heart one believes unto righteousness, and with the mouth confession is made unto salvation.

Ephesians 2:8-10

8 For by grace you have been saved through faith, and that not of yourselves; it is the gift of God, 9 not of works, lest anyone should boast. 10 For we are His workmanship, created in Christ Jesus for good works, which God prepared beforehand that we should walk in them

Philippians 3:9

9 and be found in Him, not having my own righteousness, which is from the law, but that which is through faith in Christ, the righteousness which is from God by faith;

Galatians 2:16

16 knowing that a man is not justified by the works of the law but by faith in Jesus Christ, even we have believed in Christ Jesus, that we might be justified by faith in Christ and not by the works of the law; for by the works of the law no flesh shall be justified.

Be blessed y'all !!!!

[HizWife625]

So to answer the underlying question of having a permission slip to sin...... Absolutely NOT................ The Holu Spirit convicts me, and because of my Love for thr Lord and His nail scarred hands, I want to say I am sorry and ask Him to restore our relationship....Only He can restore it....And because He is faithful to His word, He does it.

Praisae God for his most precious son...... Praise Jesus !!!

[Guest tomk]

No man can go into that depth and not know. I believe Snuffen has indeed a witness of Him.

I concur.

[Hemidakota]

Article of Faith - 3 [Plan of Salvation]

"We believe that through the Atonement of Christ, all mankind may be saved, by obedience to the laws and ordinances of the Gospel."

[HizWife625]

And the Bible teaches salvation through grace, repentance of sins and faith in Jesus Christ......Just as was demonstrated by the thief on the cross...... The only thing he had time to do after he confessed his faith in Jesus Christ and asked him to remember him, was die.........

That theif is walking in the Golden city, hand in hand with Jesus Christ.....Jesus Christ presented that thief to His Father without spot/blame.....He was pure and white as snow.

[Hemidakota]

Incorrect statement concerning the thief.

[Jenamarie]

HizWife: your post is a wee bit too long for me to address each point but I find it a bit curious that you said "no where in the Bible does it say that Baptism is necessary for salvation".

John 3:5 Jesus answered, Verily, verily, I say unto thee, Except a man be born of water and of the Spirit, he cannot enter into the kingdom of God.

What is the "water" Christ is refering to here, if not baptism?

[HizWife625]

JenaMarie...... thanks for asking such a great question

Which water did Jesus talk about to the woman at the well ???????

Jesus uses "play on words" if you will.... He was referring to faith in Him being living water.....................Not phsyical water.......

[HizWife625]

5Jesus answered, "I tell you the truth, no one can enter the kingdom of God unless he is born of water and the Spirit. 6Flesh gives birth to flesh, but the Spirit gives birth to spirit. 7You should not be surprised at my saying, 'You[c] must be born again.'

See Jesus uses his play on words agan...." Born again ".................. Does that mean physical birth again ?????? No.

10"You are Israel's teacher," said Jesus, "and do you not understand these things? 11I tell you the truth, we speak of what we know, and we testify to what we have seen, but still you people do not accept our testimony. 12I have spoken to you of earthly things and you do not believe; how then will you believe if I speak of heavenly things? 13No one has ever gone into heaven except the one who came from heaven—the Son of Man.[d] 14Just as Moses lifted up the snake in the desert, so the Son of Man must be lifted up, 15that everyone who believes in him may have eternal life.[e]

Read verse 15 again !!!

Eternal as defined in the dictionary: "Continuing forever or indefinitely"

16"For God so loved the world that he gave his one and only Son,[f] that whoever believes in him shall not perish but have eternal life. 17For God did not send his Son into the world to condemn the world, but to save the world through him. 18Whoever believes in him is not condemned, but whoever does not believe stands condemned already because he has not believed in the name of God's one and only Son.[g]

[HizWife625]

John 4:1-26 (New International Version)

New International Version (NIV)

Copyright © 1973, 1978, 1984 by International Bible Society

John 4

Jesus Talks With a Samaritan Woman

1The Pharisees heard that Jesus was gaining and baptizing more disciples than John, 2although in fact it was not Jesus who baptized, but his disciples. 3When the Lord learned of this, he left Judea and went back once more to Galilee.

4Now he had to go through Samaria. 5So he came to a town in Samaria called Sychar, near the plot of ground Jacob had given to his son Joseph. 6Jacob's well was there, and Jesus, tired as he was from the journey, sat down by the well. It was about the sixth hour.

7When a Samaritan woman came to draw water, Jesus said to her, "Will you give me a drink?" 8(His disciples had gone into the town to buy food.)

9The Samaritan woman said to him, "You are a Jew and I am a Samaritan woman. How can you ask me for a drink?" (For Jews do not associate with Samaritans.[a])

10Jesus answered her, "If you knew the gift of God and who it is that asks you for a drink, you would have asked him and he would have given you living water."

11"Sir," the woman said, "you have nothing to draw with and the well is deep. Where can you get this living water? 12Are you greater than our father Jacob, who gave us the well and drank from it himself, as did also his sons and his flocks and herds?"

13Jesus answered, "Everyone who drinks this water will be thirsty again, 14but whoever drinks the water I give him will never thirst. Indeed, the water I give him will become in him a spring of water welling up to eternal life."

15The woman said to him, "Sir, give me this water so that I won't get thirsty and have to keep coming here to draw water."

16He told her, "Go, call your husband and come back."

17"I have no husband," she replied.

Jesus said to her, "You are right when you say you have no husband. 18The fact is, you have had five husbands, and the man you now have is not your husband. What you have just said is quite true."

19"Sir," the woman said, "I can see that you are a prophet. 20Our fathers worshiped on this mountain, but you Jews claim that the place where we must worship is in Jerusalem."

21Jesus declared, "Believe me, woman, a time is coming when you will worship the Father neither on this mountain nor in Jerusalem. 22You Samaritans worship what you do not know; we worship what we do know, for salvation is from the Jews. 23Yet a time is coming and has now come when the true worshipers will worship the Father in spirit and truth, for they are the kind of worshipers the Father seeks. 24God is spirit, and his worshipers must worship in spirit and in truth."

25The woman said, "I know that Messiah" (called Christ) "is coming. When he comes, he will explain everything to us."

26Then Jesus declared, "I who speak to you am he."

And there Jesus goes agani....Declaring that He is God,,,,,,,They are one.....And God is the Holy Spirt.......Thus, three persons in one....They are not separate.....

[Hemidakota]

John 3:5 refers to baptism. The current Jewish leaders did not have a problem with that doctrine at all since they were baptizing themselves, as John the Baptist at the River Jordan. Also, included in that verse is the essential of receiving the Holy Ghost.

So, we need both ordinance in this life - of water [baptism] and of spirit [Holy Ghost].

[Hemidakota]

John 4:1-26 (New International Version)

New International Version (NIV)

Copyright © 1973, 1978, 1984 by International Bible Society

John 4

Jesus Talks With a Samaritan Woman

1The Pharisees heard that Jesus was gaining and baptizing more disciples than John, 2although in fact it was not Jesus who baptized, but his disciples. 3When the Lord learned of this, he left Judea and went back once more to Galilee.

4Now he had to go through Samaria. 5So he came to a town in Samaria called Sychar, near the plot of ground Jacob had given to his son Joseph. 6Jacob's well was there, and Jesus, tired as he was from the journey, sat down by the well. It was about the sixth hour.

7When a Samaritan woman came to draw water, Jesus said to her, "Will you give me a drink?" 8(His disciples had gone into the town to buy food.)

9The Samaritan woman said to him, "You are a Jew and I am a Samaritan woman. How can you ask me for a drink?" (For Jews do not associate with Samaritans.[a])

10Jesus answered her, "If you knew the gift of God and who it is that asks you for a drink, you would have asked him and he would have given you living water."

11"Sir," the woman said, "you have nothing to draw with and the well is deep. Where can you get this living water? 12Are you greater than our father Jacob, who gave us the well and drank from it himself, as did also his sons and his flocks and herds?"

13Jesus answered, "Everyone who drinks this water will be thirsty again, 14but whoever drinks the water I give him will never thirst. Indeed, the water I give him will become in him a spring of water welling up to eternal life."

15The woman said to him, "Sir, give me this water so that I won't get thirsty and have to keep coming here to draw water."

16He told her, "Go, call your husband and come back."

17"I have no husband," she replied.

Jesus said to her, "You are right when you say you have no husband. 18The fact is, you have had five husbands, and the man you now have is not your husband. What you have just said is quite true."

19"Sir," the woman said, "I can see that you are a prophet. 20Our fathers worshiped on this mountain, but you Jews claim that the place where we must worship is in Jerusalem."

21Jesus declared, "Believe me, woman, a time is coming when you will worship the Father neither on this mountain nor in Jerusalem. 22You Samaritans worship what you do not know; we worship what we do know, for salvation is from the Jews. 23Yet a time is coming and has now come when the true worshipers will worship the Father in spirit and truth, for they are the kind of worshipers the Father seeks. 24God is spirit, and his worshipers must worship in spirit and in truth."

25The woman said, "I know that Messiah" (called Christ) "is coming. When he comes, he will explain everything to us."

26Then Jesus declared, "I who speak to you am he."

And there Jesus goes agani....Declaring that He is God,,,,,,,They are one.....And God is the Holy Spirt.......Thus, three persons in one....They are not separate.....

Yes, we know that Jesus Christ is that same Jehovah of the OT. Not unique here sister. But He is the Son of the Father or GOD. He reside the right of GOD as to pertaining to the Godhead and authority. The third member, who does not have a corporeal body, is the Holy Spirit.

Now, I do see, you do not really understand the corporeal of the Godhead. I am assuming this since you are posting the god of your belief, is three personalities into one body? Correct?

[HizWife625]

You are placing conditional requirements upon something freely given, again.

So, if Jesus told the woman at the well do drink of the water, was he telling her that if she drank of the water at the well, she would be saved?

Jesus all throughout his walk and teaching spoke in parallets and symbolisms.....

So I guess you are saying that in order to know Christ, we mush be physically reborn again......He said we ahd to be "re-born" did He not?

[HizWife625]

Jesus Christ IS....... You choose to live by OT law, and I choose to live by NT law...... I love living in peace.......

[Hemidakota]

We are talking about John 3:5 and not about He is the water of life to the gentile woman. Two different content topic sister. The water of life is Jesus the Christ. However, that is not baptism; that is a requirement and necessary ordinance.

Sister, are you not baptized in your own church? Why would the Savior be baptized if He was perfect and sinless?

[Hemidakota]

Jesus Christ IS....... You choose to live by OT law, and I choose to live by NT law...... I love living in peace.......

Did you understand that is the same person?

[Jenamarie]

LDS don't sacrifice lambs or keep Kosher. We keep the commandments given by Jesus Christ, the Living Son of God, because we LOVE him. "If ye love me, KEEP MY COMMANDMENTS".

And I am very much living in peace. I love my Savior with all my heart, and that makes all the difference in the world.