Suzie
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Everything posted by Suzie
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No, you did not. I am not sure why I wrote that (senior moment). I got confused because I read Orson Hyde's view about it (mainly related to the wedding at Cana) and then compared it to the explanation given by Talmage. In my view, Jesus and the Father fulfill the same laws they require of us to fulfill, they are our leading examples. They do not approach it as: "Do as I say and not as I do". The scriptures seem to be very clear about what the Lord desires of us with regards to marriage and frankly it would be odd to me to find out that he wasn't, not only from the point of view of him being our Savior but also from the cultural standpoint of him as Jewish man. In the scriptures we have a few examples of his disciples being married as well. When Jesus started his Ministry, he was 30 years old, if he was single, it would have been an oddity and I can only assume if that was the case, the rest of the religious groups would have criticize him openly about it.They called him "rabbi" which I recall studying was a title given mostly to married men. Then we have the relationship Jesus had with Martha and Mary but I think I am going offtopic.
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Hi garryw, In Doctrine and Covenants 132:19-22 states: It is clear to me that a Temple marriage is a condition for Godhood because in order to obtain Godhood, one has to reach the highest level in the Celestial Kingdom and we already know the requirements for that. Of course it is not the only one, it is not a "free-pass" lol. I also believe Jesus was married and Talmage shared some compelling analysis in Jesus The Christ. I like your questions :) I will think about it more. Thanks for sharing!
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Please, do not think this way because if you do, it will be even harder to fix it or what is worse..stay in a marriage that might lead to abuse. I would kindly suggest that you seek the help of a professional therapist, you won't believe how much it can help you regardless of your marital status.
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I am very sorry you are going through hard times but let me ask you, what is that *you* want? Do you want to work on your marriage or you feel it is a little too late? Is your husband willing to work to save the marriage or he wants a divorce?
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LDS letter addresses online criticisms about women
Suzie replied to pam's topic in Church News and Events
This reminds me of something funny I do and I try very hard not to lol. When I say hi to people, I always smile and wink. Women, men or children. I don't think about it, it comes natural until I started realizing that a few people look at me funny when I do it (it took me a while to figure it out). You know, the look like "why in the world are you winking at me?". -
I don't think anyone would tell you "Yes, I do" but if you want to ask, perhaps you should ask directly if he watches porn. Most addicts do not believe they have an addiction and they think they have it under "control" until they hit rock bottom. So he might be watching porn but not necessarily believe he is struggling with it so he will answer accordingly.
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I was thinking in that wonderful talk by Elder Uchtdorf, he is one of my favorite speakers. :) One of the things I recall in that talk was first of all, the acknowledgment he gave with regards to mistakes that were not in harmony with LDS values, principles or doctrine from members and church leaders: The other part I recall is: The whole talk is amazing :)
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But that's the point, nobody is saying that and I think is a misinterpretation.One can believe in the Prophet and at the same time, perfectly reconcile the fact that he is also a man, I don't think there is anything wrong with that. In my view, confirmation of his words through the Holy Spirit is something we have been taught repeatedly as I stated in earlier quotes provided. As I stated many times before, it does not mean I would be praying for every single counsel received but at the same time, I do not see the harm for those who do need to do that and most of all, I do not see them as not seeing the Prophet as a Prophet. It is prayer, and is a wonderful tool. Thanks for the explanation, I think I understand now your position. We agree on some things and in others we disagree. Thanks for the discussion.
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I'm sorry, I might be slow today because honestly I don't understand this reasoning (not trying to be difficult but trying to understand). If you are not saying the prophet could not err, then the dialogue contradicts itself. In the scenario in question, God confirmed in the dialogue that the man is a Prophet. Full point. Then when questions were asked to Him about the counsel giving by the same Prophet, the Lord keeps answering that they are all '"correct". And finally, he sighs and asks : ""Did you not believe me when I answered you the first time? I confirmed it repeatedly". He is implying: "I told you already he is my Prophet and his counsels are always correct". Isn't that what the dialogue is about? Which means: "If someone is called as a Prophet, he is unable to err in counsel". You said you never said that (that Prophets cannot err) then I don't understand your point at all. Please expand more on this point, thanks.
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Less Active Member - Thinking about coming back
Suzie replied to teacherluke's topic in Introduce Yourself
Hi welcome! :) -
So your point of view is: It all boils down to whether or not we believe in the Prophet and because he is a Prophet of God he cannot err with counsel? At least that's what I understand from the dialogue... In your first dialogue, God answers in the affirmative when is asked if "this man" is His prophet and then when other questions are asked based on the Prophet's counsels, God keeps saying they are correct and then finally sighs and tells the person "did you not believe me when I answered you the first time?" implying in my understanding that God is stating that because this man is a Prophet, he is always correct with counsel. Is that what you are saying or am I misunderstanding you?
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I don't think the film was intended to be literal in that aspect. In the past, a lot of people commented how the actors of previous films were "robotic" in nature (except the actor playing Satan). I haven't seen the film but looks like there was some good acting taking place. Emotions play a big role in most people's lives and in religion particularly. One could argue if adding such emotions to a Temple film could distract the audience from understanding what really took place (and yes, we are constantly bombarded with the idea that Mormons only prey with the "emotions" of people rather than using logic) but I haven't seen the film. Now with regards to your second question about Adam and Eve in the Garden of Eve, personally I believe they did not know the kind of mortal emotions we feel but until after the Fall.
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I was reading an old thread earlier on and just realized who you are. lol
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I am very surprised by your reply. I just asked a question and you did not answer it. No offense but I really dislike your style of discussion, you take things too personal and most times, the discussions turn a little too dramatic for my liking so I will put you on my "ignore" list to avoid a similar situation (since this is not the first time). I apologize if you felt offended in any way. Take Care and wish you all the best.
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If someone needs to pray to Heavenly Father for every single counsel they receive, and have it confirmed through the Holy Spirit, what exactly makes it unwise? I want to believe you are not suggesting praying and seeking the Holy Spirit is unwise. I am trying hard to understand here where the assumption comes from that someone who prays to the Lord and seeks confirmation from the Holy Spirit, they might do it with the wrong attitude, it puzzles me really. SpiriDragon: That's one of the things that concern me about idolatry to Church leaders. Yes, they are great men, yes they try their best to do their callings, yes we all love them but we need to learn to draw a certain line and not fall victims of idolatry.
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I recall having this discussion with you and I recall stating that we are probably not going to pray for every single counsel we receive however, if someone needs to do so as many times as they want, it is their right. And you actually agreed. Wow, how come? And why you don't see a problem with others doing it as suggested by Young himself but if you do it it would be an attitude of faithlessness and ungratefulness? I read your replies but still do not fully understand your position. But let me ask: Are you suggesting that someone who prays for example about the principle of Tithing or the WOW is because they do not have a testimony of the Savior and the Prophet? Because in your line of reasoning if they did have a testimony of Christ they would automatically know He leads this Church and the Prophet is his mouthpiece? Is that what you are saying or am I totally off? A couple of other quotes with regards to some of the things that have been discussed here with regards to Prophets speaking outside the Church: Not sure how praying to receive confirmation through the Holy Spirit about a particular principle equals mistrusting our leaders and being faithless and ungrateful. Your reply puzzles me. And yes, you connected both when you stated "I do not, of course, see any problem with praying about principles they teach, but for myself, I know that going to ask God if a specific principle they give is true and correct would, in general, be faithless and ungrateful.
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Congratulations guys!
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One of my favorite quotes of Brigham Young: I always like to emphasize this: Pray, pray, pray...ask and receive confirmation from the Holy Spirit.
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The Church believes the Great Apostasy started right after all the Apostles died and until the 1800's when Smith restored it, is that quick for you? lol You might say, perhaps it is for God and if that's the case, then what Jennamarie is saying is spot on.
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I think the problem lies on the definition of "Creed". Even though I agree that the definition you gave is the most popular and modern one, it seems to me that Smith was talking about creeds that limit progression and define religion. Since Latter-Day Saints believe in continuous Revelation, having a set of creeds that encompasses all truth of our religion (such as the Nicene Creed followed by most Christian denominations) isn't plausible. You mentioned our Articles of Faith but if you check, there is nothing that states that these articles of Faith couldn't be modified. It goes further and states in AF #9:
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When you state that someone is unable to bear the pain, you are not labeling them, you are describing how they feel (they are hurt). When you state that someone lacks faith, you are making an indirect or direct accusation towards that person's spiritual journey which in the end, it is frankly not helpful and a silly thing to do because you do not know all the details about that person's spiritual life. I do not understand the need we have as Latter-Day Saints to be labeling those who doubt or go less active as "lacking faith". What is the purpose of that? There is so much more in the picture. We should listen more and talk less. In the end, as a disciple of Christ your job is to reach out to that individual, be there, help and overall, listen. And frankly, I am quite sure those who have these doubts will open up more to someone who can understand them and empathize with their feelings rather than opening up with someone who believes their faith is weak or that they don't have any at all.
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This is perhaps one of the most misunderstood quotes of Smith. Noticed he said "their creeds" which is different from "All Churches that are not LDS are an abomination in his sight". https://www.lds.org/manual/teachings-joseph-smith/chapter-22?lang=eng Hinckley: https://www.lds.org/general-conference/2002/10/the-marvelous-foundation-of-our-faith?lang=eng
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It is interesting to note that Smith himself had doubts about the things he heard and learned with regards to other religions when he was just a young boy and that culminated with the Restoration of Christ's Church. There are dozens of examples in the Bible and the BOM about great Prophets and people who had doubts. We have Nephi, Thomas, Moses, Abraham, Peter and the list goes on. How can anyone test their faith without a grain of doubt? How can anyone make the right choice if there is not a grain of doubt to begin with? Doubt isn't the opposite of Faith but part of it.
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So perhaps the issue is not with the doubt itself but how we handle such doubts.
