spamlds

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  1. Like
    spamlds got a reaction from Windseeker in a thought   
    In the centuries following the Great Apostasy, a false Gnostic teaching crept into Christianity that has been called the "Serpent Seed" doctrine. The doctrine taught that "Original Sin" as Catholics and Protestants refer to Adam and Eve's transgression, was sexual intercourse.  The eating of the forbidden fruit is a metaphor for sexual relations.  The "Serpent Seed" version of it goes so far as to say that Eve had intercourse with Satan and then seduced Adam.  Latter-day Saints have never taught such a doctrine.  
    Wikipedia gives some further info:
    The doctrine has been taught by fringe Christian movements even into the present day.  It has been used to justify racism, bigotry, and oppression of women.  One variation of the doctrine states that Cain was the offspring of Satan and that his seed is still present on the earth.  The racist "Christian Identity" movement still teaches this.  
    Catholics and Protestants avoid going into speculations on what "Original Sin" was, but because of the biblical passages mentioned earlier in the thread, there is a presumption that the Fall was Eve's fault.  The LDS understanding is far more generous to Eve, who is celebrated as Adam's eternal companion, help-mate, and forms a more liberal notion of the roles of men and women as equal partners in marriage.  We understand that we wouldn't be here unless they made the conscious choices they did.  We are blessed because of their transgression and our eyes are opened to the gift of redemption.
  2. Like
    spamlds got a reaction from Jane_Doe in Taking the sacrament with right hand   
    Culturally, Europeans and some other cultures regard the right side as the place of honor.  
    Military men salute with the right hand, a tradition that goes back to the times of chivalry.  The right hand was the most likely to bear a weapon, thus showing an open hand was a sign of peaceful intent.   It's customary for dignitaries to stand to the right of subordinates.   Americans put our right hand over our hearts when we say the Pledge of Allegiance or hear the national anthem played.   In Japanese martial arts, when one performs a kneeling bow, the left knee goes down first and the right knee leads when getting up. There are probably lots more cultural examples that people can mention.  These are a few that just came to mind.  
  3. Like
    spamlds got a reaction from Older/Wiser? in Second Coming, soooooooo many questions   
    Interesting questions!  Here are my opinions (not necessarily doctrine, but informed by years of study of Church history and doctrine).
    1.  I've never heard any authoritative source in the Church try to mark the year or even decade of the Second Coming using generations or any other event, save for the scriptural signs in Matthew 24 and the various sections of the D&C that describe the signs of the times.  The Old Testament does follow a pattern showing how many generations from Abraham to Moses, and from Moses to David, and David to Jesus.  Perhaps the Great Apostasy disrupted that pattern or perhaps it's just that we have lost the "place markers" that would identify which generation.  Anyhow, nothing I've ever read since the Restoration began identifies a generation in that manner.
    2.  Food storage: I wrote a book called "Building the Ark: Preparing Today to Live in the United Order."  I made the case, using many general authority quotes as well as scripture, that a time will come when we will enter into what Lorenzo Snow called "principles of union" whereby we will share what we can consecrate and survive a desperate time.  He said the United Order would be like Noah's Ark for us.  Food storage is a part of that prophetic plan.  We will have the privilege of sharing what we have in order to preserve our loved ones and neighbors.  It will be like our "loaves and fishes" whereby the Lord fed thousands.  
    In my own household, we maintain a pantry with our long-term storage and we shop to re-fill the pantry as we use what we have.  It's the way our grandparents used to live.  It's a prudent way to have plenty and keep it freshly stocked.  You have a buffer against need and can shop when things go on sale.  It's not a bad way to live.
    3.  Regarding the two witnesses or prophets that will be martyred in Jerusalem.  It's interesting to note that the area presidency over the Middle East has two co-presidents who are general authorities.  It's the only one in the Church structured that way.  Perhaps the two witnesses will be whoever is in that presidency when the prophecy is to be fulfilled.
    4.  The Lord has used significant days on the Hebrew calendar to bring about important events of the Restoration.  We know the Lord's crucifixion coincided with the Passover anciently.  The day that Joseph was given the plates in 1827 was the Feast of Trumpets that year.  It's significant that Moroni is depicted with a trumpet on our temples.  The coming forth of the Book of Mormon was the call to the whole world to repent and believe the gospel.  Likewise, the appearance of Moses, Elias, and Elijah in the Kirtland Temple was on April 3rd, 1836--Passover in that year.
    I think it's possible to make a case that the Lord appeared to the Nephites in the Book of Mormon on the Feast of Tabernacles.  That appearance is a type and shadow of things to come.  The Lord appeared after war, the collapse of government caused by secret combinations, and great natural disasters.  In the scriptures, it says the Lord will descend with a "shout."  The Feast of Tabernacles includes a shout, the Hallel, an invocation for God to come and save the people.  We sing a hymn at temple dedications where we "sing and shout" with the armies of heaven and we do the Hosanna shout, inviting the Lord to come suddenly to his temple.  Perhaps that ordinance is a rehearsal for how the Lord will return.  
    The Book of Mormon came forth on the Feast of Trumpets.  Perhaps there are key events that will coincide with Yom Kippur, the day of Atonement, where Israel humbles itself and repents.  Then the Feast of Tabernacles celebrates the return  of Jehovah to his temple (the cleansed earth and Zion), followed by Rosh Hashanna, the head of the new year (Millennium).  Like most symbolism in the gospel, it points to Christ and his glory.
  4. Like
    spamlds reacted to LeSellers in Are some apostatized truths of the gospel more important / weighty than others?   
    They are the worst, I believe, because they are the most difficult to repent from.
    Part of that is that repayment/restoration is the most difficult, even impossible in some cases.
    Lehi
  5. Like
    spamlds got a reaction from LeSellers in Why do you think God and Jesus have long hair and beards?   
    LeSellers makes a good point.  Long hair and beards are often seen as either acts of rebellion or as signs of elite status.  I live in a university town and many of the university profs and their students wear beards as a sign of class and status.
    When I was in the military, I knew several families where the wife was the service member and the husband was a civilian.  Very often, the husbands wore beards and longer hair to distinguish themselves from the other men on the base who were service members.  It was as if, since they didn't wear the outward signs of masculinity--viz., the uniform--they used the facial hair to project manliness.
    Working men, particularly in the social classes that enlist in our military, tend toward short hair and being clean shaven.  I'm a martial arts instructor.  Longer hair gives an adversary something with which to grab you.  Many of my teen students start out with long hair and they end up cutting it after they practice the art for a while.  It's just a practical thing.  
    Policemen, soldiers, sailors, airmen, and Marines wear short hair as a sign of conformity to a high standard of selflessness and discipline.  Our missionaries do likewise.  It's a cultural thing, to be sure, but there is a definite relation between class, conformity, and the wearing of long hair and facial hair.
  6. Like
    spamlds got a reaction from askandanswer in John 17:5 and Moses 4:1-2   
    5  And now, O Father, glorify thou me with thine own self with the glory which I had with thee before the world was.
    Consider that the answer is already in the verse cited above.  Jesus asked the Father to glorify him by restoring to him the glory that he had departed from--the glory he had from the Father's presence before he became mortal.  Jesus lived like the rest of us.  The weight of mortality was upon him.  He lived perfectly, but he was subject to all that we are subject to: fatigue, illness, stress, sadness, loneliness, and ultimately death.  He had overcome the veil and remembered being with the Father.  I'm sure that is something he pined for, to return to that state of glory and shed the burden of mortality.  
    This utterance is Jesus longing to be with his Father again, in his presence.  
  7. Like
    spamlds got a reaction from zil in John 17:5 and Moses 4:1-2   
    5  And now, O Father, glorify thou me with thine own self with the glory which I had with thee before the world was.
    Consider that the answer is already in the verse cited above.  Jesus asked the Father to glorify him by restoring to him the glory that he had departed from--the glory he had from the Father's presence before he became mortal.  Jesus lived like the rest of us.  The weight of mortality was upon him.  He lived perfectly, but he was subject to all that we are subject to: fatigue, illness, stress, sadness, loneliness, and ultimately death.  He had overcome the veil and remembered being with the Father.  I'm sure that is something he pined for, to return to that state of glory and shed the burden of mortality.  
    This utterance is Jesus longing to be with his Father again, in his presence.  
  8. Like
    spamlds got a reaction from Edspringer in John 17:5 and Moses 4:1-2   
    5  And now, O Father, glorify thou me with thine own self with the glory which I had with thee before the world was.
    Consider that the answer is already in the verse cited above.  Jesus asked the Father to glorify him by restoring to him the glory that he had departed from--the glory he had from the Father's presence before he became mortal.  Jesus lived like the rest of us.  The weight of mortality was upon him.  He lived perfectly, but he was subject to all that we are subject to: fatigue, illness, stress, sadness, loneliness, and ultimately death.  He had overcome the veil and remembered being with the Father.  I'm sure that is something he pined for, to return to that state of glory and shed the burden of mortality.  
    This utterance is Jesus longing to be with his Father again, in his presence.  
  9. Like
    spamlds reacted to kapikui in Why do you think God and Jesus have long hair and beards?   
    To be fair, it is vital that soldiers who may be hit by a gas attack be clean shaven because the mask doesn't seal quite right if there is hair in the way.  Having your nervous system turned to jelly because you wouldn't shave just isn't a good way to go. 
  10. Like
    spamlds reacted to LeSellers in Why do you think God and Jesus have long hair and beards?   
    The standard of clean shaving started in the 1920s, following the return of USAan doughboys from France.
    Prior to that period, most men had beards or mustaches, or sideburns (named for Ambrose Burnsides, federal Civil War general, whose sideburns were phenomenal). But the Roman army was clean shaven because a beard gave the enemy a handhold he could exploit: grab and pull. The invention of gunpowder and firearms made shaving unnecessary, so for the next three or four centuries beards were acceptable for soldiers. The British army even made mustaches mandatory for officers.
    On April 22, 1915, the Germans attacked French, Canadian and Algerian troops with chlorine gas. From that time forward, soldiers were clean shaven so their field protective masks would seal and allow them to live.
    The soldiers came home to cheering crowds and adoring women. They were heroes. And David O. McKay saw them and admired them — he and thousands of other Saints. And it stayed the same for a half century: men were clean-shaven because it was cool.
    Then came Vietnam, and the protests; and one form of rebellion was the beard and long hair.
    Rebellion is the original sin. Satan rebelled. We are not a rebellious people. So, with David O. McKay and his beardless chin from WWI until today with your bishop and his beardless chin, we demonstrate our obedience to even the mundane.
    Lehi
    God didn't rebel against His government. He can have any beard He chooses. LS
  11. Like
    spamlds got a reaction from LeSellers in Angels   
    Gosh I really hate these kinds of discussions.  Find a church in the last 2000 years that had real angels minister and appear to people as they did in the New Testament.  Catholics believe in angels and apparitions, but they only accept them after the people who were the recipients have long been dead.  After all, they don't want any living oracles who might expose their dogma to be false.
    Protestants went so far as to reject revelation, angelic ministrations, etc. as unnecessary since they have the Bible.  They went so far as to assign to a book almost God-like power.  Then they use the Bible to quarrel about the Bible among themselves.  The exclusive acceptance of the Bible and the rejection of revelation of any kind is the very source of Christian disunity and confusion.
    How ironic it is that churches and religionists, who would never believe a recipient of a true angelic ministration, use the Bible to reject the testimonies of those who testified of angelic ministrations.  Latter-day saints have had (and continue to have, I might add) living witnesses who have seen, spoken with, and communed with angels.  We have more experience with angels in the last two centuries than all of Christendom has had since the loss of the keys and the Great Apostasy took hold of the ancient Church.
    It is pointless to bicker over biblical interpretations, Greek translations, etc.  From Moroni's appearance to Joseph Smith to the present day, angels are not unknown to us.  Even some of us have, as Paul said, "entertained angels unawares" (Hebrews 13:2).  We haven't followed "cunningly devised fables" (2 Peter 1:16).  The book of Acts tells us that angels were actively involved with the 1st century Church.  They are just as active in today's restored Church.  The true Church is still connected to the "home office" in heaven.
  12. Like
    spamlds got a reaction from Edspringer in Eating of Blood   
    For what it's worth, when I was a young missionary in France in the 1980s, we were instructed to include blood products in the Word of Wisdom when we taught it.  The French had several traditional dishes that were made using animal blood as the main ingredient.  The basis of that instruction was the New Testament's admonitions against consuming blood.
    Interestingly, that New Testament prohibition was mentioned alongside a probition against eating things that were sacrificed to idols.  This was a practice of idolatrous feasts in Roman times and Christians were admonished to avoid even the trappings of idolatry.  In the end, the Church went into apostasy and idolatry took over the ancient Church in the form of the mass.  It's not often that it would happen, but if you have friends with some "New Age" beliefs, that's something tht you might encounter.  For example, people who practice Transcendental Meditation undergo a ceremony where a "sacrificial offering" is made to an image of Guru Dev.  In Asian cultures and in Africa, it is common to offer meals, plates of foods, etc, to dead ancestors as part of a meal. 
    Modern revelation doesn't address those situations specifically, but latter-day saints are bound to keep the commandments and counsel of the early apostles as well as the living ones.  We just dont run into those situations very often in our culture, but in other culture, additional guidance is often given by local leaders under the supervision of the General Authorities.
  13. Like
    spamlds got a reaction from letmeoff in Hope in God's Plan   
    Like many of you, my life has had lots of ups and downs.  We've had illnesses, layoffs, bad decisions, etc. that brought us into trials and unpleasant situations.  Several years ago, I was reading about Joseph Smith's early life and something really struck me.  Maybe it will be of help to someone who is currently undergoing trials right now.
    Joseph Smith's father, Joseph Smith, Senior, was a farmer in Vermont.  His only ambition was to be a simple farmer and provide for his family.  He was a man of meager means.  He struggled to pay for land and raise a crop.  Two years prior to 1816, Joseph Senior had experienced crop failures.  The weather in Vermont wasn't cooperating.  Trying to make payments on land was a challenge.  Then, 1816 came.  That was known in history as the "Year Without a Summer."  In 1815, Mount Tambora in Indonesia erupted.  The volcano threw so much ash into the atmosphere that it changed weather patterns in the Northern Hemisphere.  In the summer of 1816, it snowed in Vermont.
    Father Smith sold the property (or had his land repossessed--it doesn't say which) and went down to Palmyra in New York to look for a place to start fresh.  We've all heard the stories about young Joseph's leg surgery, which happened in 1815.  Joseph Senior had to leave his family behind and, once he found a property, he sent a hired man to pick them up and bring them to Palmyra.  The unpleasant fellow made Joseph Junior hobble along from Vermont to New York on the bad leg.  
    If you've been to the Smiith Farm in Palmyra, which has historical reproductions of the original cabin and the frame home in which the family lived, you'll see evidence of a time of prosperity.  The family began to prosper, but we learn that an unscrupulous lender swindled the nice frame house from the Smith family just as the sons finished building it for them.  It seems that bad financial luck followed the Smith family.
    Again, I reiterate that all Father Smith wanted was to be a farmer.  That was the extent of his ambitions.  We know in hindsight, the Lord had different plans.  
    Would Joseph Senior have moved from Vermont to New York if his farm had been successful?  Did God tell him that he needed to move his family there so his youngest son would be near some ancient gold plates buried near the town of Palmyra?  The Lord didn't tell him anything.  Instead, he let failure and pain be the impetus to get him to move to New York.  Likewise, had finances gone well at the Palmyra farm, how would things have gone when it came time to uproot and move to Kirtland, Missouri, and Nauvoo?  
    The Lord used hardships to direct Joseph Smith, Senior to his foreordained role--to become the first patriarch of this dispensation.  He was called to be a prophet in his own right, to declare the lineage of the saints and bless them.  Would that have ever come to pass if he had been a success at farming?
    Trials and hardships are never enjoyable.  However, we should look at them and ask, "Is the Lord directing me to a new path?"  Some trials are meant to be endured well.  Others are meant to cause us to act.  When we act, the Lord may be directing us onto a new path.  In that case, rest assured that he has you in the "palm of his hand."  He will not let you fail in any eternally important way.  He has placed a frame around you and the limits will not exceed his designs.  God has a plan.  Trust in him.  Remember Joseph Smith, Senior--the aspiring farmer who became the Patriarch of the Church in the latter-days.
     
  14. Like
    spamlds got a reaction from NeedleinA in Help please. Doctrine concern & counsel needed...   
    We can't simplify the decision for her.  This is a personal test from God.  Which does she love more?  Show her Matthew 10:37.
    37 He that loveth father or mother more than me is not worthy of me: and he that loveth son or daughter more than me is not worthy of me.
    Ask her if she believes these words of Jesus.
    Ask her if she truly believes the Church is the Church of Jesus Christ.
    It doesn't make the decision any easier, but it defines the test.  Once she knows what the test is about, it's between her and God.  The outcome of her eternal life hangs in the balance.  Don't minimize or rationalize away the consequences.
     
  15. Like
    spamlds got a reaction from Jane_Doe in Hope in God's Plan   
    Like many of you, my life has had lots of ups and downs.  We've had illnesses, layoffs, bad decisions, etc. that brought us into trials and unpleasant situations.  Several years ago, I was reading about Joseph Smith's early life and something really struck me.  Maybe it will be of help to someone who is currently undergoing trials right now.
    Joseph Smith's father, Joseph Smith, Senior, was a farmer in Vermont.  His only ambition was to be a simple farmer and provide for his family.  He was a man of meager means.  He struggled to pay for land and raise a crop.  Two years prior to 1816, Joseph Senior had experienced crop failures.  The weather in Vermont wasn't cooperating.  Trying to make payments on land was a challenge.  Then, 1816 came.  That was known in history as the "Year Without a Summer."  In 1815, Mount Tambora in Indonesia erupted.  The volcano threw so much ash into the atmosphere that it changed weather patterns in the Northern Hemisphere.  In the summer of 1816, it snowed in Vermont.
    Father Smith sold the property (or had his land repossessed--it doesn't say which) and went down to Palmyra in New York to look for a place to start fresh.  We've all heard the stories about young Joseph's leg surgery, which happened in 1815.  Joseph Senior had to leave his family behind and, once he found a property, he sent a hired man to pick them up and bring them to Palmyra.  The unpleasant fellow made Joseph Junior hobble along from Vermont to New York on the bad leg.  
    If you've been to the Smiith Farm in Palmyra, which has historical reproductions of the original cabin and the frame home in which the family lived, you'll see evidence of a time of prosperity.  The family began to prosper, but we learn that an unscrupulous lender swindled the nice frame house from the Smith family just as the sons finished building it for them.  It seems that bad financial luck followed the Smith family.
    Again, I reiterate that all Father Smith wanted was to be a farmer.  That was the extent of his ambitions.  We know in hindsight, the Lord had different plans.  
    Would Joseph Senior have moved from Vermont to New York if his farm had been successful?  Did God tell him that he needed to move his family there so his youngest son would be near some ancient gold plates buried near the town of Palmyra?  The Lord didn't tell him anything.  Instead, he let failure and pain be the impetus to get him to move to New York.  Likewise, had finances gone well at the Palmyra farm, how would things have gone when it came time to uproot and move to Kirtland, Missouri, and Nauvoo?  
    The Lord used hardships to direct Joseph Smith, Senior to his foreordained role--to become the first patriarch of this dispensation.  He was called to be a prophet in his own right, to declare the lineage of the saints and bless them.  Would that have ever come to pass if he had been a success at farming?
    Trials and hardships are never enjoyable.  However, we should look at them and ask, "Is the Lord directing me to a new path?"  Some trials are meant to be endured well.  Others are meant to cause us to act.  When we act, the Lord may be directing us onto a new path.  In that case, rest assured that he has you in the "palm of his hand."  He will not let you fail in any eternally important way.  He has placed a frame around you and the limits will not exceed his designs.  God has a plan.  Trust in him.  Remember Joseph Smith, Senior--the aspiring farmer who became the Patriarch of the Church in the latter-days.
     
  16. Like
    spamlds got a reaction from zil in Hope in God's Plan   
    Like many of you, my life has had lots of ups and downs.  We've had illnesses, layoffs, bad decisions, etc. that brought us into trials and unpleasant situations.  Several years ago, I was reading about Joseph Smith's early life and something really struck me.  Maybe it will be of help to someone who is currently undergoing trials right now.
    Joseph Smith's father, Joseph Smith, Senior, was a farmer in Vermont.  His only ambition was to be a simple farmer and provide for his family.  He was a man of meager means.  He struggled to pay for land and raise a crop.  Two years prior to 1816, Joseph Senior had experienced crop failures.  The weather in Vermont wasn't cooperating.  Trying to make payments on land was a challenge.  Then, 1816 came.  That was known in history as the "Year Without a Summer."  In 1815, Mount Tambora in Indonesia erupted.  The volcano threw so much ash into the atmosphere that it changed weather patterns in the Northern Hemisphere.  In the summer of 1816, it snowed in Vermont.
    Father Smith sold the property (or had his land repossessed--it doesn't say which) and went down to Palmyra in New York to look for a place to start fresh.  We've all heard the stories about young Joseph's leg surgery, which happened in 1815.  Joseph Senior had to leave his family behind and, once he found a property, he sent a hired man to pick them up and bring them to Palmyra.  The unpleasant fellow made Joseph Junior hobble along from Vermont to New York on the bad leg.  
    If you've been to the Smiith Farm in Palmyra, which has historical reproductions of the original cabin and the frame home in which the family lived, you'll see evidence of a time of prosperity.  The family began to prosper, but we learn that an unscrupulous lender swindled the nice frame house from the Smith family just as the sons finished building it for them.  It seems that bad financial luck followed the Smith family.
    Again, I reiterate that all Father Smith wanted was to be a farmer.  That was the extent of his ambitions.  We know in hindsight, the Lord had different plans.  
    Would Joseph Senior have moved from Vermont to New York if his farm had been successful?  Did God tell him that he needed to move his family there so his youngest son would be near some ancient gold plates buried near the town of Palmyra?  The Lord didn't tell him anything.  Instead, he let failure and pain be the impetus to get him to move to New York.  Likewise, had finances gone well at the Palmyra farm, how would things have gone when it came time to uproot and move to Kirtland, Missouri, and Nauvoo?  
    The Lord used hardships to direct Joseph Smith, Senior to his foreordained role--to become the first patriarch of this dispensation.  He was called to be a prophet in his own right, to declare the lineage of the saints and bless them.  Would that have ever come to pass if he had been a success at farming?
    Trials and hardships are never enjoyable.  However, we should look at them and ask, "Is the Lord directing me to a new path?"  Some trials are meant to be endured well.  Others are meant to cause us to act.  When we act, the Lord may be directing us onto a new path.  In that case, rest assured that he has you in the "palm of his hand."  He will not let you fail in any eternally important way.  He has placed a frame around you and the limits will not exceed his designs.  God has a plan.  Trust in him.  Remember Joseph Smith, Senior--the aspiring farmer who became the Patriarch of the Church in the latter-days.
     
  17. Like
    spamlds reacted to Vort in Praying to Jesus   
    https://speeches.byu.edu/talks/bruce-r-mcconkie_relationship-lord/
    This address includes these insights by Elder McConkie:
    We worship the Father and him only and no one else. We do not worship the Son, and we do not worship the Holy Ghost. I know perfectly well what the scriptures say about worshipping Christ and Jehovah, but they are speaking in an entirely different sense—the sense of standing in awe and being reverentially grateful to him who has redeemed us. Worship in the true and saving sense is reserved for God the first, the Creator.
    [...]
    There are yet others who have an excessive zeal which causes them to go beyond the mark. Their desire for excellence is inordinate. In an effort to be truer than true they devote themselves to gaining a special, personal relationship with Christ that is both improper and perilous.
    I say perilous because this course, particularly in the lives of some who are spiritually immature, is a gospel hobby which creates an unwholesome holier-than-thou attitude. In other instances it leads to despondency because the seeker after perfection knows he is not living the way he supposes he should.
    Another peril is that those so involved often begin to pray directly to Christ because of some special friendship they feel has been developed. In this connection a current and unwise book, which advocates gaining a special relationship with Jesus, contains this sentence:
    "Because the Savior is our mediator, our prayers go through Christ to the Father, and the Father answers our prayers through his Son."
    This is plain sectarian nonsense. Our prayers are addressed to the Father, and to him only. They do not go through Christ, or the Blessed Virgin, or St. Genevieve or along the beads of a rosary. We are entitled to “come boldly unto the throne of grace, that we may obtain mercy, and find grace to help in time of need” (Hebrews 4:16).
    And I rather suppose that he who sitteth upon the throne will choose his own ways to answer his children, and that they are numerous. Perfect prayer is addressed to the Father, in the name of the Son; and it is uttered by the power of the Holy Ghost; and it is answered in whatever way seems proper by him whose ear is attuned to the needs of his children.
  18. Like
    spamlds reacted to Sadliers in The wrong way to study scriptures...   
    In John chapter 7 we see some interesting examples of how not to study scriptures. The example is from the religious leaders of the day. They were devoted to studying and understanding the scriptures but their method was obviously failing them because it led them away from Jesus Christ. After hearing Jesus teach some said:
    "Howbeit we know this man whence he is: but when Christ cometh, no man knoweth whence he is." (John 7:27)
    What made them think that they would not know from where the Christ would come? Because they read the scriptures and used their own wisdom to interpret the scriptures. Thus they came to the conclusion that nobody will know from where the Christ will come, and since they knew from where Jesus came then He could not be the Christ. Just how wrong could their interpretations of scripture be? But the misunderstanding of the scriptures didn't end there:
    "Others said, This is the Christ. But some said, Shall Christ come out of Galilee? Hath not the scripture said, That Christ cometh of the seed of David, and out of the town of Bethlehem, where David was?" (John 7:41-42)
    They were not ignorant of the scriptures - they studied them well and knew what the prophecies said. But, again, they relied on their own wisdom for interpretations rather than God. There was one verse in the Old Testament that they formulated that belief from. It says:
    "But thou, Beth-lehem Ephratah, though thou be little among the thousands of Judah, yet out of thee shall he come forth unto me that is to be ruler in Israel; whose goings forth have been from of old, from everlasting." (Micah 5:2)
    Hindsight is 20/20 but they didn't have that advantage. They ended up interpreting the scripture to mean that the Messiah would be born and raised in Bethlehem. Once again, the interpretation was based on their own wisdom which came from their studies. We now know that the Christ would only be born in Bethlehem, not reared there, but they would not believe it because they believed they interpreted the scriptures correctly. Because of that misinterpretation of prophecy, which was a result of relying on their own wisdom in interpreting scriptures, they ended up failing to recognize the Messiah as He actually stood before them and preached. 
    The Jewish leaders were the ones that set the example in using their own wisdom to interpret the scriptures. They believed that knowledge was gained by study and that if one failed to study then they didn't have "knowledge". And, of course, the ones that spent a good deal of time studying were the scribes and Pharisees. That was why it boggled their mind that Jesus, who was neither a scribe nor Pharisee, would have knowledge:
    "And the Jews marvelled, saying, How knoweth this man letters, having never learned?" (John 7:15)
     
    Remember that when Jesus was only 12 they were surprised that He would have such a great understanding of the scriptures when He obviously didn't have decades of study under His belt:
    "And it came to pass, that after three days they found him in the temple, sitting in the midst of the doctors, and they were hearing him, and asking him questions." (JST Luke 2:46)
    This pridefulness among the leaders, which was a result of their believing that they knew more than others, is plainly observed when they sent officers to arrest Jesus. But as they came to arrest Him they heard Him speaking and was drawn in to what He was saying. When the officers didn't return the rulers went to find the officers. They found them and asked why they didn't arrest Jesus. They admitted that they were taken in by His teachings. That didn't set well with the rulers!
    "Then answered them the Pharisees, Are ye also deceived? Have any of the rulers or of the Pharisees believed on him? But this people who knoweth not the law are cursed." (John 7:47-49)
    This is so revealing! The Pharisees believed that they couldn't be deceived because they relied upon their own wisdom as they studied the scriptures therefore they are wiser and smarter. Notice how their wisdom was foolishness (2 Nephi 9:28 ). But their own "wisdom" which came from relying on their own interpretations of scriptures actually caused them to be the most deceived among them. They were blind yet thought they could see better than the rest.
    Ever hear of safety in numbers? Notice that the leaders relied on that as part of their proof that Jesus was not the Christ. "Have any of the rulers or Pharisees believed in Him?" In essence they were stating that if one uses their own wisdom to misinterpret scriptures it is ok as long as they do a lot of studying and can somehow back up their misinterpretations. And if most the leaders are misinterpreting scriptures the same way then that is no longer a misinterpretation but rather "proof" that they are right. Security in numbers - nope, even large numbers can be wrong. 
    Also notice that the rulers and Pharisees, in their pride, proclaimed that the people that failed to study as they did, and failed to devote their lives as they did, just simply did not understand the scriptures and, therefore, they are cursed. But how wrong was that?!? The Savior was the one teaching them truth and bringing salvation to the lost yet the Parisees and rulers declared His followers to be cursed. That misjudgment was a direct result from their misinterpretation of the scriptures. How twisted is that?
    There was one ruler that did believe in Jesus. He was Nicodemus. He pointed out that perhaps the rulers are misjudging because they never brought Jesus before them and heard Him out. It was the custom that they had to directly hear what one was saying, not by rumor, before judgment could be passed yet here they were passing judgment without first hearing Jesus. In defense of themselves they then took Nicodemus to challenge by pointing out that the evidence is so obvious that they don't need to hold a hearing before passing judgment:
    "They answered and said unto him, Art thou also of Galilee? Search, and look: for out of Galilee ariseth no prophet." (John 7:52)
    Once again their "wisdom" was based on their interpretation of scriptures. They had the scripture which they believed said the Christ would be raised in Bethlehem and they had no other scriptures to say otherwise (which actually wasn't totally correct, either). So they challenged Nicodemus to prove otherwise by the scriptures. He couldn't thus their challenge stood. In reality, even though nobody was able to disprove their challenge it didn't mean their interpretation of the scriptures were correct.
    If there's one thing that the chapter brings out is how one can be totally wrong in their interpretation of scriptures yet be firmly convinced that they are right. It happens when we rely on our own wisdom and understanding to interpret scriptures. But in that same chapter Jesus told us how we can, and should, learn truth:
    "If any man will do his will, he shall know of the doctrine, whether it be of God, or whether I speak of myself." (John 7:17)
    Jesus left it totally open on the conclusion. Either His doctrine is of God or it is of His opinion. They viewed Him as a mere man thus the intention was to let them know that they can distinguish whether it was of man or of God by being obedient to God. Undoubtedly the rulers and Pharisees believed they were already doing God's will and certainly no Jesus would convince them otherwise! But the people weren't so steeped in pride and they could discover it! 
    Notice that Jesus said that one "shall know" the doctrine. He didn't exaggerate and didn't say "might know". When one is doing "His will" they are obeying all of His will, not just some or most. What is "His will"? Jesus actually reveals that answer while He was finishing His 40 day fast and was being tempted by the devil. Notice the challenge and response:
    "And when the tempter came to him, he said, If thou be the Son of God, command that these stones be made bread. But he answered and said, It is written, Man shall not live by bread alone, but by every word that proceedeth out of the mouth of God." (Matthew 4:3-4)
    We are to obey every word from God, not just the convenient ones and not just the commandments. Once we do that we will have the Spirit with us and it is by the Spirit that we will know the doctrine. Until it comes from the Spirit it is only a belief. Once it comes from the Spirit then we know it. The rulers of that day and the Pharisees thought they knew because of their studies. In reality they not only failed to know - their "knowledge" was only a belief - but they were also seriously incorrect in some key elements and it worked to their condemnation.
    This principle still applies today. If we think we know something because we studied it from the scriptures, prophets, or apostles, then we are mistaken. It is only a belief, not knowledge, until the Spirit testifies. And in order for that to happen we must be devoted to obeying every word from God and then we will finally be able to move from belief to knowing.
  19. Like
    spamlds got a reaction from Backroads in Food Storage - diminished emphasis?   
    I wrote a book several years ago titled, "Building the Ark: Preparing Today to Live in the United Order."  I was interested in a quote I read by Pres. Lorenzo Snow, who said that living in that inspired economic system would be as necessary to our survival one day as the Ark was for Noah and his family.  As I did research on that book, I found a lot of information about food storage and preparedness.  It made me think of food storage differently.
    Consider that Noah and his family spent slightly over a year on the ark--they had to have a year's supply of food, not only for themselves, but the animals, too.  Regardless of however literal of figurative the Ark story is, there is a clear message that obedience to principles of temporal salvation helped Noah survive and deliver his family into a new dispensation.
    In our family, the first time we had our "year's supply" of food, we built it up gradually using the "pantry" concept.  Like our great-grandparents had done, we set up a pantry and, when we went to the store, we stocked it up over time.  After a while, we ate what we stored and restocked the pantry when we shopped.  Adding just a little extra each time, we had a nice reserve built up with very little effort.  We ordered some wheat from the storehouse, learned how to grind it and use it.  Additionally, we learned how to garden and cultivate fruit trees.  
    In short, we learned to live like regular people did almost a century ago.  If there was a crisis of some kind, like a hurricane, loss of a job, or a civil emergency, we were prepared.  It gave us a lot of peace.  Some time later, we relocated to a different state for a job change.  We knew we'd be living in an apartment and we wouldn't have room for everything.  We gave away most of what we had and downsized to a smaller pantry.  A few years later, we bought a new home and now we're building up the pantry again.  We are on track to have most of of a year's worth of staple items by year's end.  
    This mode of having a year's supply doesn't make you feel like you're preparing for the end of the world.  It's just a provident way of living so you can be secure when life's challenges pop up from time to time.  If you're prepared, you don't fear (as much).  Instead of preparing for the end of the world, I think the Lord wants us to live in a way that will help us have as much security and peace as possible.  
  20. Like
    spamlds got a reaction from Jane_Doe in The Worship of God   
    To Evangelicals and other creed-based Christians, this whole topic is akin to blasphemy because, as the Pharisees said of Jesus, we think to make ourselves God's equal (in some future time).  The belief in the Trinity came about to resolve controversies over God's nature.  Was there one God or three?  They chose (with some degree of intrigue) to go for the answer that there could only be one God who necessarily must possess all power and none other.
    Latter-day saints know from modern revelation that the Trinity is a false doctrine and that there are indeed three Gods who are organized into one Godhead.  Thus, the example for us regarding our eternal relationship with God is Jesus Christ.  We follow his path.  He lived before he was born into mortality.  
    Jesus prayed to his Father. He did the Father's will in submission.  He honored the Father's authority.  He was baptized.  He submitted himself to the Father in all things and received ALL that the Father hath.  
    Was there any power or authority that God did not confer upon his Beloved Son?  Was there any good thing he withheld from Jesus that he alone might be Sovereign?  In all things, the Son glorifies the Father and the Father glorified him.  We cannot imagine that they would ever be contrary to one another.  
    For what my opinion is worth, if God can do that with one of his children, he can do it with all those who follow Jesus.  Therein is the "abomination" that is contained in the creeds--that God's nature is obscured and prevents mankind from learning its true potential in God's purposes.  The heavens are filled with more infinite light and glory that we can possibly imagine from an entire race of glorified, exalted beings, who call God their Father.
  21. Like
    spamlds got a reaction from LeSellers in The Worship of God   
    To Evangelicals and other creed-based Christians, this whole topic is akin to blasphemy because, as the Pharisees said of Jesus, we think to make ourselves God's equal (in some future time).  The belief in the Trinity came about to resolve controversies over God's nature.  Was there one God or three?  They chose (with some degree of intrigue) to go for the answer that there could only be one God who necessarily must possess all power and none other.
    Latter-day saints know from modern revelation that the Trinity is a false doctrine and that there are indeed three Gods who are organized into one Godhead.  Thus, the example for us regarding our eternal relationship with God is Jesus Christ.  We follow his path.  He lived before he was born into mortality.  
    Jesus prayed to his Father. He did the Father's will in submission.  He honored the Father's authority.  He was baptized.  He submitted himself to the Father in all things and received ALL that the Father hath.  
    Was there any power or authority that God did not confer upon his Beloved Son?  Was there any good thing he withheld from Jesus that he alone might be Sovereign?  In all things, the Son glorifies the Father and the Father glorified him.  We cannot imagine that they would ever be contrary to one another.  
    For what my opinion is worth, if God can do that with one of his children, he can do it with all those who follow Jesus.  Therein is the "abomination" that is contained in the creeds--that God's nature is obscured and prevents mankind from learning its true potential in God's purposes.  The heavens are filled with more infinite light and glory that we can possibly imagine from an entire race of glorified, exalted beings, who call God their Father.
  22. Like
    spamlds got a reaction from LeSellers in The Worship of God   
    This OP's question gives each of us a little reason to squirm.  We know ourselves, with all our shortcomings and personal failings, and we rely upon Christ's grace to save us.  I've never known a serious latter-day saint who walks around saying, "When I become a god, I'm going to do things like this and this."  We don't really think about what exaltation will be like, except perhaps having our family relations forever.
    We don't tend to dwell upon what our relationship with future spirit children and what our knowledge, power, and character will be like in a million years or a billion years into eternal life.  We anticipate that we will be like our Heavenly Parents, but it seems unimaginable that our mortal spirit children will look up to us worshipfully.  Nevertheless, that's how it may be.
    I imagine that my earthly relationship with my own father could be a likeness.  I looked up to my father when I was a child and eventually he treated me like I was his peer when I became an adult.  Nevertheless, my admiration and devotion to him never diminished, even when I was grown up.  I suppose, a zillion years from now, our Father will regard us as "adult" children who can do everything he can do now, but I expect that our devotion and worship of him will be even greater and more perfect than now.  
    It's just too overwhelmingly glorious to contemplate for long.  The celestial heavens are likely filled with exalted beings that are bound in eternal families, working together to exalt us lower beings.  It's a more glorious heaven than we can imagine.  It makes heaven all the more personal and connected.  Meanwhile, we tend to focus on the day-to-day challenges of living life in faith, seeking grace, and trying to love one another.  
  23. Like
    spamlds got a reaction from NeedleinA in The Worship of God   
    This OP's question gives each of us a little reason to squirm.  We know ourselves, with all our shortcomings and personal failings, and we rely upon Christ's grace to save us.  I've never known a serious latter-day saint who walks around saying, "When I become a god, I'm going to do things like this and this."  We don't really think about what exaltation will be like, except perhaps having our family relations forever.
    We don't tend to dwell upon what our relationship with future spirit children and what our knowledge, power, and character will be like in a million years or a billion years into eternal life.  We anticipate that we will be like our Heavenly Parents, but it seems unimaginable that our mortal spirit children will look up to us worshipfully.  Nevertheless, that's how it may be.
    I imagine that my earthly relationship with my own father could be a likeness.  I looked up to my father when I was a child and eventually he treated me like I was his peer when I became an adult.  Nevertheless, my admiration and devotion to him never diminished, even when I was grown up.  I suppose, a zillion years from now, our Father will regard us as "adult" children who can do everything he can do now, but I expect that our devotion and worship of him will be even greater and more perfect than now.  
    It's just too overwhelmingly glorious to contemplate for long.  The celestial heavens are likely filled with exalted beings that are bound in eternal families, working together to exalt us lower beings.  It's a more glorious heaven than we can imagine.  It makes heaven all the more personal and connected.  Meanwhile, we tend to focus on the day-to-day challenges of living life in faith, seeking grace, and trying to love one another.  
  24. Like
    spamlds got a reaction from NeedleinA in Food Storage - diminished emphasis?   
    I wrote a book several years ago titled, "Building the Ark: Preparing Today to Live in the United Order."  I was interested in a quote I read by Pres. Lorenzo Snow, who said that living in that inspired economic system would be as necessary to our survival one day as the Ark was for Noah and his family.  As I did research on that book, I found a lot of information about food storage and preparedness.  It made me think of food storage differently.
    Consider that Noah and his family spent slightly over a year on the ark--they had to have a year's supply of food, not only for themselves, but the animals, too.  Regardless of however literal of figurative the Ark story is, there is a clear message that obedience to principles of temporal salvation helped Noah survive and deliver his family into a new dispensation.
    In our family, the first time we had our "year's supply" of food, we built it up gradually using the "pantry" concept.  Like our great-grandparents had done, we set up a pantry and, when we went to the store, we stocked it up over time.  After a while, we ate what we stored and restocked the pantry when we shopped.  Adding just a little extra each time, we had a nice reserve built up with very little effort.  We ordered some wheat from the storehouse, learned how to grind it and use it.  Additionally, we learned how to garden and cultivate fruit trees.  
    In short, we learned to live like regular people did almost a century ago.  If there was a crisis of some kind, like a hurricane, loss of a job, or a civil emergency, we were prepared.  It gave us a lot of peace.  Some time later, we relocated to a different state for a job change.  We knew we'd be living in an apartment and we wouldn't have room for everything.  We gave away most of what we had and downsized to a smaller pantry.  A few years later, we bought a new home and now we're building up the pantry again.  We are on track to have most of of a year's worth of staple items by year's end.  
    This mode of having a year's supply doesn't make you feel like you're preparing for the end of the world.  It's just a provident way of living so you can be secure when life's challenges pop up from time to time.  If you're prepared, you don't fear (as much).  Instead of preparing for the end of the world, I think the Lord wants us to live in a way that will help us have as much security and peace as possible.  
  25. Like
    spamlds got a reaction from prisonchaplain in The Worship of God   
    This OP's question gives each of us a little reason to squirm.  We know ourselves, with all our shortcomings and personal failings, and we rely upon Christ's grace to save us.  I've never known a serious latter-day saint who walks around saying, "When I become a god, I'm going to do things like this and this."  We don't really think about what exaltation will be like, except perhaps having our family relations forever.
    We don't tend to dwell upon what our relationship with future spirit children and what our knowledge, power, and character will be like in a million years or a billion years into eternal life.  We anticipate that we will be like our Heavenly Parents, but it seems unimaginable that our mortal spirit children will look up to us worshipfully.  Nevertheless, that's how it may be.
    I imagine that my earthly relationship with my own father could be a likeness.  I looked up to my father when I was a child and eventually he treated me like I was his peer when I became an adult.  Nevertheless, my admiration and devotion to him never diminished, even when I was grown up.  I suppose, a zillion years from now, our Father will regard us as "adult" children who can do everything he can do now, but I expect that our devotion and worship of him will be even greater and more perfect than now.  
    It's just too overwhelmingly glorious to contemplate for long.  The celestial heavens are likely filled with exalted beings that are bound in eternal families, working together to exalt us lower beings.  It's a more glorious heaven than we can imagine.  It makes heaven all the more personal and connected.  Meanwhile, we tend to focus on the day-to-day challenges of living life in faith, seeking grace, and trying to love one another.