Average Joe

I got this (and much, much more) for two years in south Alabama and the Florida panhandle and I still get it on a fairly regular basis in the NW.
If an honestly inquisitive line of questioning had preceded this, then I would think that the questions he was asking were genuine.  However, having heard nearly every anti-question known to man, I would say that this guy has gotten coached by someone or something.
I would ask him if he knows the story of Thomas, give testimony, encourage him to read selected passages in the Book of Mormon, and ask him to pray about it, referencing James about getting answers.
 
I understand how frustrating it is.  I have people tell me what I believe and most of it is completely wrong.  I tell them that they misunderstand, and sometimes they will flat out tell me that I am wrong.  I usually get grumpy then say something like, "You sure know a lot about Mormons.  How long have you been a member?", or, "You know, everything about Mormons on the internet is true.", or, "You're an idiot."  Then the Spirit leaves and I have to repent.
 
I hate it when I do that.

This has gone on for a while. in his church the LDS are a cult...the Book of Mormon bugs him, but that I can show our faith from the bible bugs him even more

Good to have but redundant if the clerk is doing his job

DnC 131:

 1 In the celestial glory there are three heavens or degrees;

 2 And in order to obtain the highest, a man must enter into this order of the priesthood [meaning the new and everlasting covenant of marriage];

 3 And if he does not, he cannot obtain it.

 4 He may enter into the other, but that is the end of his kingdom; he cannot have an increase.

 

ya I think you have to be in the HIGHEST to have eternal increase. That's just my understanding from this passage.

Ah yes, I know how it can be down here. :)

AverageJoe, what city are you in? The "heart" of the bible belt. I served my mission in tulsa oklahoma and was around a lot of those environments.

I never got that at work.  In my neck-of-the-woods (Utah), I'll occasionally get the snarky comments from those who have left the church.

I don't know how many of you live or have lived in the deep south but today was another one of those "defend the faith" days...
 
A guy I know at work asked me if I was still LDS so naturally I said yes (Although I thought about telling him "no, I'm a Snuffer-ite now"), and waited for the test to begin.
 
Round one (outside the men's room) -
 
Him: "Do you still have the seer stone Smith used to translate the Book of Mormon?"
 
Me: "I believe the angel Moroni took those back when Joseph had finished translating."
 
Him: "Do you still have the plates the Book of Mormon was written from?"
 
Me: "The angel Moroni took those back too when Joseph had finished translating."
 
Him: "So you don't have anything?"
 
Me: "We have the Book of Mormon, and in a future day the plates will be revealed again and the sealed portion will be translated."
 
Him: "So no one else saw the plates but Smith?"
 
Me: "The testimonies of eleven witnesses who saw the plates is in the front of the Book of Mormon"
 
Him: "But no one saw the plates while he was translating?" 
 
Me: "Not that I'm aware of although several people took turns writing while he translated."
 
Round two -
 
Me (in a note we work in different parts of the plant): "You believe in the bible, and if so, is there an original version of any of the books or epistles of the bible in existence?
 
What happened to the original versions - each one specifically?
 
Do we still have the breastplate the Jewish high priest wore or the Urim and Thummin he used?
 
Do we have the Ark of the covenant, the menorah, the altar of incense or the table of shewbread from the tabernacle in the wilderness or the temple in Jerusalem?
 
 
So we don't have the original version of any of the books or epistles of the bible, we don't know what happened to them.
 
We don't have the breastplate the Jewish high priest wore or the Urim and Thummin he used and we don't know what happened to them.
 
We don't have the Ark of the covenant, the menorah, the altar of incense or the table of shewbread from the tabernacle in the wilderness or the temple in Jerusalem and we don't know what happened to them.
 
 
That's OK, I believe the Book of Mormon is the word of God even the I don't have the gold plates or the Urim and Thummin, and I believe the bible is the word of God as far as its translated correctly."
 
*
 
Round three tomorrow (hopefully it will be something new and exciting for once)...you get this stuff much where you are?

Good come back. This person and I are on decent terms but every now and then my being LDS seems to drive him a little crazy for some reason, and its time to defend the faith again.   

This is not entirely accurate. The church has one of the seer stones, as I understand it, in their archives. The Urim and Thummin was taken back.

I don't really get that. well from the conversation it still looks positive.
i'd probably have said somehting to the tune of " this is where God has sent me, and since then i've seen things people have said absolutely don't exist"
 

I once had a conversation like that with someone and I became somewhat frustrated and said ..... Not sure what your seeing the plates or anyone else for that matter would do .....I mean after all the Saviour was on the earth and no one believed him. They person stared at me and walked away. Never had another conversation again about religion.

Rednecks ain't PC they say what they think

In 1968 [then] Apostle Monson prophesied of the building of the [then] communist East Germany temple.in Freiberg. [see article here]

Greetings Average Joe,
 
According to your source the second degree of the Celestial Kingdom does have a continuation of the seed.
 
 
http://ldsmag.com/article-1-11255/
 
-Finrock

There has not been much comment and sometimes I think my comments may be interpreted in ways I did not intend.  I find the temple a most interesting place - unlike any other place on earth.  Besides being sacred the temple is a means for man to draw closer to G-d unlike any other means or place.  In short there are things that can be learned through temple worship that cannot be learned by any other means.
 
Part of temple worship is the study of ancient temples and the symbolism used - but I believe such study and worship is incomplete without the study and attendance of modern or contemporary temples.  I find the story of Jesus as a 12 year old boy involved in discussions at the temple most interesting.  And I wonder if perhaps it may be a good idea to visit the temple grounds for learning and discussion.

This is pretty interesting. Just to clarify, you are saying if you attain the middle degree of the Celestial kingdom, you still have posterity after this life?? I think that was only in the highest degree of the C K

lol, my mind gets hung up on quirky things but they mean something to me :)

lol, split the royalties with me

I might be sharing this. I'll even attribute it to "Average Joe" 

I love this time of day

when the sky is faintest blue

and the sun lies a pale

yellow-white glow

above the distant trees

 

with shadows fading with the sun

into the coming dusk

and the air lies still 

save barest breeze

which stirs not bough but leaves

 

and its quiet now

when most have gathered in

from the hot, humid of the day

and the rise and fall of insect hums

is all of day's remains 

I love this time of day

when the sky is faintest blue

and the sun lies a pale

yellow-white glow

above the distant trees

 

with shadows fading with the sun

into the coming dusk

and the air lies still 

save barest breeze

which stirs not bough but leaves

 

and its quiet now

when most have gathered in

from the hot, humid of the day

and the rise and fall of insect hums

is all of day's remains 

thanks, just trying to put into words what nature does for me :)

Very nice ... Good job

Thank you very much. I may not be much for city life but I truly love nature.