NeedleinA

Great point Lehi. Church/Church Programs, are to help aid in the teaching of our families, but not be a substitute/replacement for doing it ourselves first.

Squidster - I hope I didn't ruin anyone's day by my posts yesterday, give off the wrong impression, or lead anyone to think I'm opposed VT/HT. I'm not opposed to VT/HT at all and think it is a wonderful way to bless the lives of all involved. Perhaps a little clarification on two minor points: 1. I don't believe the Sister that Sunday is assigned to should be dropped from being contacted again by the RS. If all else fails, "The other sister can be put on a letter route." The Sister still receives contact (upbeat message) from the RS/Ward, and when she is ready to engage, perhaps she will reach out - similar to your Mother and your brother. The only difference is it is a letter vs. a phone message. 2. Mormon Guilt - This is actually a term from one of our High Priests, a Police Detective and 30 year convert to the church. He loves the church and everything about it, but one thing that drives him nuts is what he calls, us having needless "Mormon Guilt" all the time. Beating ourselves up when we don't have OR live our lives at a perfect level all the time. With Visiting Teaching, how does one gauge (good, better, best)? I would submit there is no limit to what is "best". No matter what one does they could have always done an even better version of that. At what point do you stop beating yourself up on doing a better version of your last best version? If someone is not attempting VT/HT at all that is different, I would expect the Spirit to add a little guilt and help nudge the Teacher along. If someone is making continual sincere efforts to make contact, though unsuccessful, and "if" they are feeling like a "bad" VT, perhaps we are more in the Mormon Guilt arena at this point. This is simply my observation. Like others have said before, you get what you paid for with my free advice.

Wonderful information so far everyone. I could have just shared my own single thoughts with her, but felt it best to involve everyone else for a wider range of help. Everyone has given some really good ideas/perspectives/thoughts. Through it all so far, there is one obvious consensus about what the "little birds" were trying to feed her:

Hello All, Looking for some thoughts/ideas/counsel for a lovely Sister I know. She presented a concern to me and we both would REALLY appreciate your help addressing it and providing correct doctrine. I have my own personal insight, but would appreciate to hear from you first please. I realize that there are Brothers and Sister on this very forum in the same boat and I know we would appreciate your thoughts as well. Actual Scenario: Sister (soon to be baptized) and married to a non-member spouse, who is devote in his other religion. Non-member spouse is supportive/happy for her and their kids being raised in the LDS Church. Her concern: She is concerned that her husband may never accept LDS temple ordinances, either here in this life as a member or in the spirit world. If he elects to not accept these ordinances, what ultimately will become of her and the kids? To compound her concern, little birds have told her that: "My husband probably won't accept them (ordinances in the spirit world) then I get the choice of being a servant to people who did have a temple marriage or I can be some ones 50th wife or something." Because of this concern, she is hesitant to proceed with baptism. Thank you all in advance for your thoughts. I will have the Sister actually read the forum once enough posts have accumulated. - Needle

Dang, no audio for me on the video, and my lip reading skills lead me to believe that Americans are miserable because the lines at Disneyland are ridiculous?

"How spicy/hot would you like that Sir, 1-10?"

Bingo. All of this could be done without further calls,emails & visits. If the other sister won't "let" more happen, then Sunday should not be beating herself up over it.

Yes, the OP did say the woman requested Sunday as her contact. Requesting a specific person is not an indicator that they have genuine interest. It could be as simple as her saying, "If the RS is going to pester me, I prefer it be Sunday21 that does the pestering". If a person were to appear out of nowhere and request visiting teachers, and she didn't have them previously, that might be a sign of genuine interest. Simply requesting a switch in visiting teachers happens all the time. Perhaps the person didn't like their previous VT and in an effort to accept any visiting teaching, she conceded to Sunday21's efforts instead. Honestly we don't know the specifics of the request, but as one who formulates HT (my wife RS VT) routes, lets just say...um... requests happen all the time and there are plenty of non-genuine selfish reasons for it. The idea of setting up a scheduled appointment is not a novel idea, in fact it is fairly common in the wards I've been in and I'm surprised no else suggested it. It is not a final ultimatum, but at some point Sunday21 has a life too, "With my heavy work load, I can't keep up with visiting teaching people." If contact after contact is repeatedly ignored and ignored... well I for one would take that as an answer. Even missionaries, the greatest of sabotage visitors, get the idea after a while and move on to interested parties. If Sunday21 is ignored and ignored and the RS Pres. realizes it, then perhaps: 1. The other sister can be put on a letter route. 2. Sunday21 can be reassigned to someone who actually wants contact and visits. This isn't meant to sound harsh, it is simply meant to sound realistic. It sounds like Sunday has been trying for over 4 months without success or even a courtesy acknowledgement by the other Sister. If Sunday21 follows the suggestion I offered, it could be 2-3 more months of still no answers/missed appointments. Despite the idea of rescuing the one lost sheep, we still live in a world of limited human/time/energy resources. Who knows, maybe during the next 2-3 months of appointments, it all works out, that would be nice!

Personally for me, Anti stuff usually comes from three main sources. 1. Complete fabrication, 100% lie. 2. Actual truth/event, but taken out of context and spun/twisted, becoming half truth. 3. Actual truth/event, so far advanced that they are intentionally giving meat to a baby versus milk in an effort to confuse. Similar to dropping a Calculus book in the lap of a child and saying "See, you don't get it do you!". If Anti stuff leads you to confusion/darkness/doubt/sadness, well, those are opposite to the fruits of the spirit: clear direction/brightness/faith/joy. I would obviously suggest, stop reading it. "IF" you have something stuck in your head, that you just can't shake, like LP said, fairmormon.org is a great start AND we are happy to hear about it too. When it comes to Anti-Mormon techniques #2 & #3, there really isn't that much new out there. They rehash arguments that have been around for decades acting like it is something new and revealing. When it comes to #1, well... anyone can make up any lie they like. This is wonderful and this is the main point..."And I feel much better already"!

"I feel that I need to do more". For me personally, this feeling comes from two sources. The first, is the "spirit" prompting me to "do more", OR second, I simply am suffering from "Mormon Guilt"? Mormon Guilt, meaning, the times we beat ourselves up for no reason for not living life at a constant "best" level in every aspect (good, better, best). Some people don't want to be visit/home taught, despite our efforts to try to visit them. There are times when VT/HT is helpful, but there are other times when our "helpfulness" is taken as "pushy/unwanted" and inside they are saying "I'm inactive for a reason, leave me alone already, I don't want to be bothered". VT/HT has successes, but it also has failures when our persistent nagging can actually hurt instead. If she is not returning multiple calls/emails perhaps it is not important to her. If the lottery called her to tell her she had won big money, would she call them back? If the answer is yes, then she has "time", just not time for VT. If I were you, I would drop by her house unannounced. I would explain that you would love to be her VT. Say, in softer words, "Because calling and emailing is so hard, can I come by your house on the 2nd Tuesday of each month at 5:00pm (you make up the schedule with her). This is a standing appointment, every month like clockwork. If you can not make the appointment, please call me and reschedule for that month, otherwise I will be standing at your door at 5:00pm like promised." This removes the constant calling/emailing. This allows you to honestly gauge from her if you are a "help" or a "pest" to her. If she misses a couple of your appointments without letting you know, well you unfortunately have your answer from her. If phone calls/emails/standing appointment fails, I would stop with the Mormon Guilt. I personally would stop contacting her all together except for one last mailed note. A note that said something like: "Sorry we keep missing each other at our appointments. I would love to be of service to you when you are ready. Here is my phone number when that day comes. Have a great day and may Heavenly Father bless you and your family". This would be the end of my contact with said inactive. When she is ready, she can let me know. Until said day, or the Spirit prompts me otherwise, no more Mormon Guilt.

Sorry. It was for creating color and pattern mutations on ball python's scales using recessive, co-dominant, dominant genes. Felt like mad scientist type stuff. Hatching eggs was like Christmas, fun times.

Related to the first confederate female spy to be imprisoned. Family members in Tennessee had slaves, learned the gospel, freed their slaves and all of them, freed slaves included all moved to Utah. Family members founded pleasant grove utah.

Was heavy into breeding ball python mutations. Love display gardening, plants and flowers, not the eating kind. Collecting bootleg and foreign star wars figures from the 70-90s.

Do you play it on your console or on your phone like Candy Crush? One version is "video gaming" but the other is just "video gaming".

Welcome back

I'll have to leave that debate between the Pew Research Center/Washington Post vs. Georgina Young

1. Appears you'll have to speak to CHQ about that one. 2. Simply because the judicial system might be involved, how does that in any way negate the need for a church record down the road? Is the judicial system following each convicted person around for the rest of their life and informing/alerting all their future Bishops? If that person moves, or moves to a different country, who is watching out for the flock then and how, if not for the member's church record? There are many aspects of the Church that members in general might find "new", however, I hope that no one tries to give off the impression/infers that these matters are some how secret. Perhaps the "bureaucracy back in Salt Lake" (CHQ) is not common knowledge, however, disciplinary councils and the fact that records are kept is open to any person on planet earth with internet access, assuming they care to read it. I share the following quote, not directed at anyone in particular, just an observation I tend to agree with: ”It is a paradox that men will gladly devote time every day for many years to learn a science or an art; yet will expect to win a knowledge of the gospel, which comprehends all sciences and arts, through perfunctory glances at books or occasional listening to sermons. The gospel should be studied more intensively than any school or college subject. They who pass opinion on the gospel (insert: policies) without having given it intimate and careful study are not lovers of truth, and their opinions are worthless“ - John A. Widtsoe Here are some starter links, open to anyone interested: Church Disciplinary Councils and the Restoration of Blessings - Elder Ballard, lds.org Handbook 2: 17.1.7 - "disciplinary councils...including the requirements for submitting reports" tech.lds.org - Run a search on "disciplinary" in the forums

Appears Kelli was not only told, but was told prior to a council.

Thank you Lehi, great find! This clearly looks like, yes, the Church is defending the name "Mormon". Where is JAG when you need him? As best I can tell: 1. The LDS church both "does" and "doesn't" own/right to the word "Mormon". 2. The Church holds trademarks etc. through a division/company called: Intellectual Reserve, Inc. 3. It appears we (LDS Church) have the rights to "Mormon" when it comes to Educational Classes/Institutions. 4. It appears we do not have the rights to "Mormon" when it comes to Religious Services.

Where does the "church" say this?

I'm in the middle of getting ready for church, listening to MoTab Choir on Pandora. I was thinking about this thread, and grateful that Kelli posted here about her concern. I believe all the answers and thoughts here are also beneficial for anyone who has ever wondered, "Am I being passed up for callings because of my record". Perhaps an Elder, who thinks he will never become a High Priest or a Sister who feels she is only good enough to be a primary teacher. (PTs are wonderful by the way). Thank you to everyone for sharing your thoughts. As I listened to MoTab, on came the song: Be Still My Soul. I thought instantly about Kelli or anyone else worried about confession and these words stood out to me: "Be still, my soul: The Lord is on thy side; ... Thur thorny ways leads to a joyful end... When disappointment, grief, and fear are gone, Sorrow forgot, love's purest joys restored. Meeting with your Bishop to repent is simply helping an individual to have love's purest joys restored.

At least there isn't a story about 5 Nephi repenting, otherwise we would all be lost.

I enjoy video games, comics and Star Wars too. Pew Research Center: " A majority of American adults (60%) believe that most people who play video games are men – a view that is shared by 57% of women who themselves play video games. But the data illustrates that in some ways this assumption is wrong: A nearly identical share of men and women report ever playing video games (50% of men and 48% of women). " interesting bit that might help explain part of why the assumption is wrong... The Washington Post: " About 70 percent of female gamers said they played as male characters online in hopes of sidestepping sexual harassment,"

Missionary work is hard in our area of the country. We have discussed this at length in various settings...why? The only thing we could collectively agree upon is that people in our area all basically live good, normal, wholesome lives...no real "need" to look upwards or change. The missionaries here have the best success with those that have passed through some experience to either humble/try/test them. Glad the officer is in the "fully active" area now.

1. Soon as I saw your picture, it reminded me of my Grandparents Buick (something?). They called it the "Boat". It was used as a starter/drivers ED car for many kids and grand kids, for it's "protection" value of being massive, "The Boat". 2. So, even though your car was totaled, how were the three of you? 3. Ahhh, leave it to Vort to not only have a story about a blessing, BUT an actual volcano was involved! Perfect!!