wenglund

Perfectly stated. Thank you.
And thanks to all the other comments! He is currently in a mindset of having no desire to repent. Yet I know there is this underlying fear of this eternal damnation that he is fully aware of. But he uses these verses and others similar to rationalize away that if the gospel were true, it would not include such a "harsh" punishment (his words). Many underlying doubts/uncertainties/and lack of faith regarding certain principles of the gospel that are the root of these thoughts. 
Many prayers will consistently be going his way, as well as my firm testimony of what I know to be true. 

Not according to the narrative in Matt 2.  Bethlehem was not considered the ideal place of birth for the influential and powerful.    I can understand that they may have thought that the Messiah would grow up to be the legendary king and liberator - but they knew full well the birth would happen in an otherwise insignificant and lowly place despised and avoided by the ruling upper class.  If they had wanted - anyone could have found the Christ child just from the witness of the shepherds and what they had "spread abroad" - which means beyond natural boundaries. 
What I am trying to point out - is that their error was not a misunderstanding of scripture nor was it because of disbelief or doubt.  They knew full well the divine signs of heaven and the prophecies of scripture were being fulfilled - yet they were so filled with darkness - they took all their knowledge and understanding of scripture and sacred things with deliberate intention to thwart G-d and his promises.  For the first time in all my longings for understanding scripture I did not even consider that such darkness could dwell in the hearts and minds of religious leaders - especially those so connected to truth and divine revelation.  No wonder that as soon of Jesus opened his mouth and spoke - they immediately sought to kill him.
 
The Traveler

Thanks for the explanations! Not sure I'm convinced yet, but I understand what you meant a little better and this definitely is something I'll think about some more. 

It makes sense for your beliefs to follow the evidence.  
However, choice is still a factor, particularly in relation to the evidence. 
You choose what will or wont influence your view on the evidence, and in relation thereto: You choose which kind of evidence to which you are or aren't open. You choose how to interpret the evidence You choose how much weight to give this evidence or that And, you choose the extent to which your mind  can or can't be changed. Based on these choices, not a few people have moved from atheism to belief, or from belief to atheism, or back and forth in either direction, or sticking permanently with one or the other. 
In other words, it isn't as though "the evidence" disallows all but one reasonable conclusion, let alone valued conclusion.  
And, from my perspective, this is by design. God placed us in conditions where there is ample cause for doubt either way, though also the opportunity to come to a more sure knowledge of God's existence than were he always before our eyes.
As contradictory as it may seem, people can have reasonable cause to see the light better when placed in the dark.
If you are open to it, your disbelief can be changed. You get to choose.
Thanks, -Wade Englund-

It makes sense for your beliefs to follow the evidence.  
However, choice is still a factor, particularly in relation to the evidence. 
You choose what will or wont influence your view on the evidence, and in relation thereto: You choose which kind of evidence to which you are or aren't open. You choose how to interpret the evidence You choose how much weight to give this evidence or that And, you choose the extent to which your mind  can or can't be changed. Based on these choices, not a few people have moved from atheism to belief, or from belief to atheism, or back and forth in either direction, or sticking permanently with one or the other. 
In other words, it isn't as though "the evidence" disallows all but one reasonable conclusion, let alone valued conclusion.  
And, from my perspective, this is by design. God placed us in conditions where there is ample cause for doubt either way, though also the opportunity to come to a more sure knowledge of God's existence than were he always before our eyes.
As contradictory as it may seem, people can have reasonable cause to see the light better when placed in the dark.
If you are open to it, your disbelief can be changed. You get to choose.
Thanks, -Wade Englund-

We do know that all civilizations will fall with the return of Christ.  I believe that there is a chance that some of us alive today will have the privilege of witnessing the greatest fall of civilizations this world will know.
We should know what caused civilizations to fall - it is the rejection of G-d, his influences and protections.
 
The Traveler

It makes sense for your beliefs to follow the evidence.  
However, choice is still a factor, particularly in relation to the evidence. 
You choose what will or wont influence your view on the evidence, and in relation thereto: You choose which kind of evidence to which you are or aren't open. You choose how to interpret the evidence You choose how much weight to give this evidence or that And, you choose the extent to which your mind  can or can't be changed. Based on these choices, not a few people have moved from atheism to belief, or from belief to atheism, or back and forth in either direction, or sticking permanently with one or the other. 
In other words, it isn't as though "the evidence" disallows all but one reasonable conclusion, let alone valued conclusion.  
And, from my perspective, this is by design. God placed us in conditions where there is ample cause for doubt either way, though also the opportunity to come to a more sure knowledge of God's existence than were he always before our eyes.
As contradictory as it may seem, people can have reasonable cause to see the light better when placed in the dark.
If you are open to it, your disbelief can be changed. You get to choose.
Thanks, -Wade Englund-

We're too passive with how we regard spiritual matters. Many come to church with the mindset of, "Well, I'm here, now inspire me." We get constant reinforcement from the world. We need to counterbalance that with the  spiritual. I mean, the average person is awake for 112 hours in the span of a week. There's quite in an imbalance between the temporal and spiritual if 110 hours is devoted to work, chores, errands, recreation, etc - and just 2 hours is dedicated towards God. Two hours of church is not enough to sustain us through the week. 
Frequently you hear people say, "Well, I just don't have time to read my scriptures every day. Life is busy." Nonsense. Let's crossout, "I don't have time" and say what it really means: It's not a priority. I love watching my favorite sports team. Am I going to miss a single game they play? Absolutely not. I watch them because I make it a priority. Let's stop with the excuses and actually make gospel learning a priority.
Mosiah 5:13 "For how knoweth a man the master whom he has not served, and who is a stranger unto him, and is far from the thoughts and intents of his heart?"

I wonder why the Savior of the world didn't think of that when he established his 1st century church as well as his restored church in these latter days?
I suspect it has something to do with NDE's not being all that relevant, let alone authoritative, to the saving plan of God, regardless of how interesting and popular they may be--though podcast of gamers, like PewDiePie, number in the tens of millions, but that doesn't mean the Church should follow suit.
I suspect also that this post, as well as earlier posts, may be your round-about way of drumming up interest in your pet cause. If so,, it treads precariously close to violating board rules.
Thank,s -Wade Englund-

I view the seeming contradiction as a good thing. It suggest the possibility that your friend may be doubting his doubts. [thumbs up]
And, while fears about the prospects of the afterlife may be understandable and loom somewhat disquieting, it clearly isn't a motive for current change, and may even distract attention away from people's  current spiritual predicament.
To me, this is where your friends concerns may best be placed--not that you have much sway or say. It is like were a person to have fallen down a well worrying about whether in the distant future they would be prevented from ever getting out of the hole. 
Your friend is currently damning himself--i.e. he is now denying himself not only the blessings of heaven , but also the present opportunity to progress towards transcendent character and become like Christ. He is preventing, today, the light from shining into his darkness. He is keeping himself from climbing out of the spiritual hole.
In contrast, the messages of the Restored Gospel, as conveyed in this weeks Come Follow Me lesson, is that : "For God sent not his Son into the world to condemn the world; but that the world through him might be saved." (Jn 3:17-18)
Condemnation and denial of salvation, then, is essentially of our own making and our own choosing.
As @Barrett Maximus wisely counselled, pray for your friend, as we will as well.
Thanks, -Wade Englund-

Your friend is not beyond the reach of the atoning sacrifice of Jesus Christ, he can still repent. Speaking as someone who has committed many sins of grievous nature in the past and recently went to the temple to receive my endowment, there is hope, it's there for him if he chooses to accept it. Pray for your friend, it's the adversary who places thoughts of being a lost cause into our hearts.

One of the titles of G-d includes the term "eternal".  Thus the title "G-d the Eternal Father".  Mostly we think of eternal as meaning forever outside of time - or, in other words, never beginning or ending.  I am not sure that is actually the way we should understand eternal.  It is interesting to me that in ancient Egypt there was a different view of "eternal".  I will try to explain.  Ancently eternal was associated with perfection, holy, divine and complete.  In short, eternal damnation means G-d's damnation - which is just, perfect, holy, divine and complete.  It also meant that it could not be circumvented, prevented or diminished.  Though things eternal in this sense could last forever and throughout time is possible but not NECESSARY as we like to think of it in our modern English.  It is interesting to me that Joseph Smith quotes the ancient Egyptian term in the D&C in a few places rather than using the term "eternal".  I cannot remember the spelling and cannot find the quote but the term is spelled like "ignolum"
I believe the misery we suffer is the natural consequence of pure knowledge of what we have done wrong and that we remain so until we resolve to be better, humble ourselves and repent.
 
The Traveler

"Therefore if that man repenteth not, and remaineth and dieth an enemy to God, the demands of divine justice do awaken his immortal soul to a lively sense of his own guilt, which doth cause him to shrink from the presence of the Lord, and doth fill his breast with guilt, and pain, and anguish, which is like an unquenchable fire, whose flame ascendeth up forever and ever. And now I say unto you, that mercy hath no claim on that man; therefore his final doom is to endure a never-ending torment."
Your friend still has time to repent (see Alma 34:32-34). The scriptures and perhaps of more relevance, people he may know who have done as much or worse than he, are full of examples of people repenting of terrible things. The sooner the better, because even though the spirit prison affords some opportunity, he will still be that "same spirit."

This explains it rather well:  WiKi: Torah
Thanks, -Wade Englund-

I like Elder Renlund's talk about choice, consequence and the learning process when he said; "
Our Heavenly Father’s goal in parenting is not to have His children do what is right; it is to have His children choose to do what is right and ultimately become like Him. If He simply wanted us to be obedient, He would use immediate rewards and punishments to influence our behaviors.
But God is not interested in His children just becoming trained and obedient “pets” who will not chew on His slippers in the celestial living room.3 No, God wants His children to grow up spiritually and join Him in the family business."
I think there are many examples of things in our lives that require repentance but will have no immediate negative or positive consequences necessarily.  If I repent, for example, of not reading my scriptures every day, there won't be some painful effect that I would necessarily link up with that omission to "help us remember that we do not want to repeat the mistake."  

Ironically, this response gives evidence to @wenglund's responses, and why he isn't answering questions which have already been answered. I also wouldn't call people providing scripture and prophetic quotes (i.e. https://www.lds.org/topics/kingdoms-of-glory?lang=eng ) haphazardly thinking through something. That is odd even to define it in such a way.
But then again, seeing how many prophets would agree with what the majority of posters are specifying (as they are quoting and have quoted them), I don't think Russell M. Nelson is in a state of ignorance. That is simply my belief.

So, you can offer no logical explanation then why there will be wicked souls (unrighteous) saved from the eternal hell after resurrection and judgment. It's okay if you don't know, I just thought perhaps you had a logical explanation. That's all.

It is because they are using the wrong set of eyes and instruments. Physical eyes, even when enhanced by reading glasses or microscopes or telescopes, will not be able to see spiritual things even when they are abundantly right before them.
Christ explained this when visited by Nicodemus. (Jn 3)
I think you can guess my answer from what I said above.
Thanks, -Wade Englund-
 

Taking a somewhat different tack from  @Jane_Doe, I would say that it isn't our place to judge. That will be between you and the God you currently do'n't believe in. He will know your heart and deeds, and will judge you based on what light you have been given and whether you have chosen darkness  over that light. It is likely that you will receive in heaven or hell exactly like what you want on earth. If you want a godless and childless eternal existence, there is a kingdom prepared for you.
I don't know why you would want to settle for so little when there is so much possible to you, but that is the way of personal agency.
Thanks, -Wade Englund-

Of course it does. 
Harold B. Lee said;
“How do we measure whether or not one’s teachings are true or false? If anyone teaches beyond what the scriptures teach, we may put it down as speculation except one man who has the right to bring forth any new doctrine—that is the one man who holds the keys—the prophet, seer, and revelator who presides in that high place. And no one else. If anyone presumes to bring forth what he claims to be new doctrine you may know that it is purely his own opinion and you label it as such regardless of his position in the Church. If it contradicts something that is in the scriptures, you may label it immediately that it is false. That is why we call the scriptures our four Standard Church Works. They are the standards by which we measure all doctrine and if anything is taught which is contrary to that which is in the scriptures, it is false. It is just that simple” (“Viewpoint of a Giant,” 6).
“All that we teach in this Church ought to be couched in the scriptures. It ought to be found in the scriptures. We ought to choose our texts from the scriptures. If we want to measure truth, we should measure it by the four standard works, regardless of who writes it. If it is not in the standard works, we may well assume that it is speculation, man’s own personal opinion; and if it contradicts what is in the scriptures, it is not true. This is the standard by which we measure all truth” (“Using the Scriptures in Our Church Assignments,” Improvement Era, Jan. 1969, 13).
This how scripture is canonized 
In the Church, canon refers to the authoritative collection of sacred books of scripture, known as the standard works, formally adopted and accepted by the Church and considered binding upon members in matters of faith and doctrine.
The process is illustrated by the action taken in the April 1976 general conference under the direction of President N. Eldon Tanner, in which two revelations were added to the Pearl of Great Price. Conducting the business of the conference, President Tanner said:
“President Kimball has asked me to read a very important resolution for your sustaining vote.
“‘At a meeting of the Council of the First Presidency and the Quorum of the Twelve held in the Salt Lake Temple on March 25, 1976, approval was given to add to the Pearl of Great Price the following two revelations:
“‘First, a vision of the celestial kingdom given to Joseph Smith … ; and second, a vision given to President Joseph F. Smith … showing the visit of the Lord Jesus Christ in the spirit world. …’
“It is proposed that we sustain and approve this action and adopt these revelations as part of the standard works of The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints.
“All those in favor manifest it. Those opposed, if any, by the same sign” (in Conference Report, Apr. 1976, 29; or Ensign, May 1976, 19). In 1979 these two revelations were moved to the Doctrine and Covenants and became sections 137 and 138.
 

I am thinking I will add another observation.  Recently I was involved in a little accident - It was a little almost harmless neglect on my part - but the result was 7 stitches.  I believe I have learned something about repentance from this lesson of life of receiving a wound, needing help and going through the process of recovery.
To be honest the wound was not that big of a deal (or so I thought at first).  There was not much pain but there was blood.  I knew what to do - I stopped the bleeding and immediately recognized that I was going to need help.  I got some help and tried to take care of the wound - but such efforts failed and I realized that I needed an expert and someone assigned to help with such things.  So it was off to an emergency center.
At the emergency center a tourniquet was applied so that the wound could be treated without blood flowing.  After the tourniquet I was given two shots for pain and the shots were more painful than the wound.  But then the doctor began to clean out the wound - this part was likely painful but I was not feeling it.  It was deep and we could see bone.  And then came the stitches - not a lot, just 7.  After that the wound was dressed - mostly to protect the wound while it healed.  I was also given an antibiotic to help prevent infection and sent home to resume my life.
The first night and day after was very painful and inconvenient but I was resolved to not allow anything to make the wound worse.  I changed the dressing daily and changed my habits to accommodate any possibility of making the wound worse.  And then I waited for the healing to take place.  From time to time I have bumped my wound and there is an instant reminder that I am still healing but I am confident that soon the stitches will be removed and life will be back to normal - already I am back on the slopes skiing - but even skiing I am extra careful not to fall and hurt the wound - each day I am able to act more normal.
I think there are similarities to repentance and caring for my wound.  Sometimes we can take care of things on our own but sometimes we need to go to emergency (bishop) for help the get the healing process on track.  We need to protect and make special sure that we allow healing to take place.  There will be pain but pain can be helpful in letting us know what is tender and needs protection.  And just because we took care of the wound does not mean that repentance is over - we need to heal.  We need to continue care until the healing is done.  I am convinced that one reason repentance is so painful - is to help us remember that we do not want to repeat the mistake - I know I won't make the same mistake again.  It is not that the healing does not work - but because healing is a hassle but it is better than an infected wound.
 
The Traveler

Taking a somewhat different tack from  @Jane_Doe, I would say that it isn't our place to judge. That will be between you and the God you currently do'n't believe in. He will know your heart and deeds, and will judge you based on what light you have been given and whether you have chosen darkness  over that light. It is likely that you will receive in heaven or hell exactly like what you want on earth. If you want a godless and childless eternal existence, there is a kingdom prepared for you.
I don't know why you would want to settle for so little when there is so much possible to you, but that is the way of personal agency.
Thanks, -Wade Englund-

Taking a somewhat different tack from  @Jane_Doe, I would say that it isn't our place to judge. That will be between you and the God you currently do'n't believe in. He will know your heart and deeds, and will judge you based on what light you have been given and whether you have chosen darkness  over that light. It is likely that you will receive in heaven or hell exactly like what you want on earth. If you want a godless and childless eternal existence, there is a kingdom prepared for you.
I don't know why you would want to settle for so little when there is so much possible to you, but that is the way of personal agency.
Thanks, -Wade Englund-

Just wondering - how can we conclude that someone is tempted when they were not tempted to indulge?  
I like to think I am a super Saint that can resist anything but temptation.
 
The Traveler

I thought that this thread would prompt more ideas about repentance - since it has not; perhaps I can add another of my own thoughts.  As we often think of repentance we think of justifying ourselves before others.  With the idea that we have paid the price or taken the steps to move us past our mistakes.  But I wonder if the first step does not involve justifying ourselves externally - but rather justifying ourselves internally to ourselves.  In essence I am suggesting that no one can even start a repentance process without first becoming humble.  In short, not only is pride a sin all by itself - but pride prevents any possibility of repentance.
I have more thoughts about repentance and I do wonder about other's thoughts and willingness to discuss this - but then if there is no interest then there is no point.
 
The Traveler