zil2

Twas not @mordorbund who thought that. You need to re-examine the clues in @Vort's puzzle.

(Though there are times when it seems clear that "soul" and "spirit" are used synonymously.)

Well, as I recall, that one time I met him (and other ThirdHour folk), he looked exactly like David James Elliott. (Or it might be that JAG is easier to type than Just_A_Guy.)

Yes. He's a teenager now and far more mischievous than Klaw ever dreamed of being.

IMO, the black mood was Satan's influence (consider that he is always the source of such feelings as you describe: anger, hatred, horrible, worse, meaningless, empty - those are all Satan's tools, not God's), and when you chose to return, you were in essence rejecting that influence (acting contrary to it) and he lost the power to force those feelings on you and thus the feelings stopped. I expect that had you gone into your home and stewed, the feelings would have gotten worse, at least for a time. They may have faded after a night's rest - or not... I expect any good thing - such as prayer or reading from scripture - would also have ended those feelings.

Meanwhile, regarding flying turkeys...

In my house, Smoke is the turkey. (It's possible you have to be as old as or older than I am to understand that. Or maybe you have to be a member of my extended family. Not sure. Regardless, Smoke's a turkey.)

FWIW, in at least one version of the handbook, it says that this should be avoided if possible, but of course, the Lord does what he does and works with whoever he has available to work with... I just did? I love teaching the gospel and giving talks, so it was no problem for me. I'm sure they gave me plenty of time to prepare, too.

I've seen husband and wife called as bishop and RS president, but never as many as this from one family. But then, I'm in Utah, we aren't exactly short of worthy members willing to fill callings (though it does seem like we're getting shorter). I once gave a talk in Sacrament meeting on the same day I taught RS. It was back when we did three hours and I joked that if only they'd asked me to teach Sunday School that week any visitors would have thought they were at the Church of Zil.

Oh, missed that one. The Caldwell they quote was one of my religion professors (on the D&C) at BYU. That was the year I cracked my head open and had to make up a few weeks of class work. Part of that was done in his office, one on one, and I remember thinking to myself, "This man knows Jesus Christ." Obviously I couldn't say whether he'd been physically in the Lord's presence, but I had the impression he knew the Lord just as well as if he had. (Of course, I was 20-ish, so what did I know?) He was later made a 70. No idea where / what he might be now.

This is scripture. There's also the story of his horse, but I don't know if that's legend or true. It's mentioned in this article. And March 2012 New Era article. And apparently ThirdHour has an article, too. More likely, you in your omniscience would understand the thoughts and feelings of your dog. (I prefer not to think about these things because every cat on the planet is nosy as all get-out and thinks you need bathroom and shower buddies ... 'nuff said.)

Yes, and all the bacteria we're made of (seriously, our bodies are made up to a large degree by bacteria, apparently) and viruses and weeds and on and on. One wonders whether some of that isn't because of the fall or what. One wonders whether every individual plant is its own "independent" spirit or whether perhaps plant life is simply part of the Earth's spirit. Or...? Scripture says all things were made spiritually before they were made physically. The Hiding Place by Corrie Ten Boom certainly gives a new perspective on pests. Whatever the case, I'm still confident that after the resurrection, things will be better (whatever "better" means). I think he was suggesting that not all spirits are the same in intelligence, in "value" (for lack of a better word), and perhaps even in their eternal nature. (We don't have anything solid on that question.) But we do have some stuff: Our spirits and bodies look more or less the same (one has to account for physical defects that will not be there after the resurrection, and aren't there in our spirits). And speaking of the Millennium, Isaiah said: Presumably even the enmity between dog and flea will one day end. And why this (bold below), unless at least some animals have an eternal existence? Perhaps it's for our sake rather than the animal's, but still. Anywho, like @estradling75 said, we don't have a ton revealed about animals and their spirits.

I am reminded of a story told by a BYU religion professor (I can't remember if it was in a devotional or what, but it was told outside his class). He told of an experience where he taught a class on subject A (presumably some topic from the scriptures the students were to read prior to class). After class, one of his students, a young woman, came forward and said something to the effect, "Thank you Brother so-n-so for that wonderful lesson on subject B. I've been struggling and your lesson answered my questions for me." But brother so-n-so hadn't said one thing remotely related to subject B. Whatever she learned was entirely from the Spirit, and yet, she believed it had been through the lecture. Whatever else the scriptures may be, they ought to be a conduit through which the Spirit can teach us on any and every topic, regardless of what the words themselves may say.

I doubt anything at all would make any sense to me without the restored gospel - it is a lens through which the universe has meaning and without which nothing has any meaning at all. The right course, I think. The pure love of Christ, trying to see her as God sees her, respecting her agency... I don't know what else to recommend. God can do that. I'm glad for you. I believe in the end we will be dumbfounded, left speechless and in awe of just how perfect that care was for each of us - you and me included. You and me, both.

Have you studied what FAIR has on the topic? I'm one of those people who doesn't understand why the source for Abraham (or Moses or the Bible or the Book of Mormon, etc.) matters so much as the content. I don't need to know or understand or see the source in order to gain a witness of the truthfulness of the content... And that's good enough for me. (If I were 18 and with the knowledge and inclination I have now, I might well have spent my college career studying ancient languages so that I could read the source materials for myself, but it's a bit late for that now.)

Well, obviously, there's no point in that. I'm simply pointing out that there are only two options - she's seeing them, or she's not. Within each option, there are additional possibilities to explain what's happening... I was definitely not proposing either as a point of discussion with her. And when a person believes this, the best things you can hope for are to be guided by the Spirit in your interactions with said person, and to create opportunities for them to feel the influence of the Spirit. The closer you are to Christ, the more able you will be to do that. I have no idea how to convince anyone of anything, but the problem here is believing that organized religion is all man-made. Believe that and of course none of them matters all that much and the possibility of there being "many spiritual forces" including good ones that don't have anything to do with "Christianity" (whatever that means) becomes much more real. Honestly, I don't know how anyone makes any sense of anything without the restored gospel of Jesus Christ, which is the only thing I know of that makes sense of everything.

Should anyone wish to ensure that Mr. or Miss Turtelephaffe appears in my story, help me out by suggesting names - once a character has a name, it's pretty much guaranteed to make an appearance. Note that the name doesn't have to be like our own names (I mean, we have characters named Makhabesh and Essri), and there's no guarantee I'll use the name you suggest, but a name will help. Also, if the character is meant to be, I'll recognize the name as soon as I see it. Also, feel free to add anything else that would bring this character to life - their reason for surfing, or perhaps paddling upstream after having finished surfing - their personality, history, goal, blah blah blah. The character could be a bad guy, if you prefer... (Sorry, @Jamie123 - once my brain gets started on this kind of thing, the real world gets kicked to the curb... )

I need to go back and read the thread. [done] You're right. You were making general statements and Carb appeared to take them as directed specifically at him, perhaps because of what you quoted - or I'm misunderstanding the interaction. While I get that you're using this to make a point, and I get the point, I don't think it's a good comparison to spiritual experiences or knowledge - the one using natural senses, the other not. Meanwhile, The Adventures of Quin and Makhabesh may well need a surfing turtelephaffe (turteleraffe?). The back of my brain is now working on it. The question is, is this a gigantic turtle, or are the elephant and giraffe parts shrunken accordingly? (SPOILER ALERT: Unless something unexpected happens, the impending stage of their adventure will in fact take them near to the ocean, so why not?) For us (LDS), evil spirits are just as real as the angels of God. If one invites evil spirits into one's life, they'll be perfectly happy to deceive and play the part of "good angel"1. We (LDS) believe that there is an order and purpose to all things and that God does not just let folks see spirits for any old reason, nor through things of the occult, about which scripture is quite clear. Therefore, my conclusion would be that if your wife is seeing spirits, unless they are telling her to shun the occult things you mentioned and come to Christ, they are evil spirits. If your wife is not really seeing spirits, then clearly something else is going on (imagination, delusion, lies, whatever). 1Examples: Sherem (Jacob 7) and more pointedly, Korihor (Alma 30:53, 60 - though the whole chapter tells the full story - in particular, this points out how one can come to believe one's own lies) So, are these spirits your wife sees testifying of Christ, calling her to repent and come unto him, and telling her things consistent with scripture? Or are they telling her things "pleasing unto the carnal mind"?

Problems will almost always arise from telling another person what they know, feel, or whatever one wants to call statements like the above. Unless by some miracle the Spirit reveals to us what is in the heart and mind of another, we cannot know what another person feels, thinks, wants, etc. And while it may seem "obvious" to us, that does not mean we are right. Since recognizing how much this behavior offends and annoys me, I have tried hard to be aware and not do it to other people. I recommend all take that route. Asking what another thinks, feels, wants, intends, etc. will lead to discussion and understanding, usually without offense. Telling another person what they think, feel, want, intend is just arrogance and offensive, even if the other person is humble and patient enough not to take offense. (In other words, Jamie, you ought not to tell @Carborendum that perhaps he doesn't really know some truth that he has claimed to know; and Carb ought not to tell you you're closed to anything more - because neither of you can know that, you only assume or suppose or believe it.) Do you believe that God (usually via the Holy Ghost (Spirit, Holy Spirit)) can give a person knowledge in such a way that the person thereafter knows with as much or more certainty than they know what they see around them? If not, I'm not sure there's much further to go, because I have experienced this and if you haven't, there is no way for me to communicate to you the certainty, firmness, or conviction of having gained knowledge in this way - in other words, I don't know how to communicate these things and I don't think they can be understood without having experienced it ("you had to be there" sort of thing). If you do believe this (which means you have experienced it), then we can understand each other as we talk about the difference between belief, faith, and this knowledge from God (as well as other types of knowledge).

I'm not, but see my next reply, the one I'm in the middle of writing. But I'll add here, if you are going to discuss these things here, you should expect each individual to respond based on their own convictions and faith, unless you explicitly ask them to make assumptions about humanity in general (again, see my as yet unfinished reply).

Joseph Smith taught that they too have spirits (this much is in scripture) and live on (that they have spirits leaves no other option) and we will see them again (and the first two make this seem a "no brainer"). I do find it interesting that I have yet to hear of visions or visits to the spirit world that make mention of animals, though. I expect you're right on all counts. But you're not among most, or even many. You are among the few of the few. My observation is that the majority of LDS on this board are firm in their faith - active in their faith, where perhaps half (or more?) of those baptized LDS aren't. I suppose that depends on what "embracing doubt" entails. I'll just quote then President Uchtdorf ("Come, Join with Us"): Embracing doubts can easily prevent faith from functioning at all. Doubt is far easier than faith, IMO. I disagree with the bold parts, though I can understand why someone might perceive it that way. Another response pending.

I think inherent in polytheism ("the belief in or worship of more than one god.") is the idea that each of these gods is available for worship and you can pick which one(s) you want to worship (and rotate between them based on need as the gods in such belief systems often "specialize"). While technically each of us is free to worship however and whatever(s) we will, the reality is that there is only one true God: And I think this is why @Vort said that: ...the "in any meaningful sense" being the key qualifier.

No.

Incorrect answer. Also not part of the song. Also, dude does not "wear it well". :SMH:

Exactly. But don't worry, you'll find out the truth no later than the day you die.