Congresswoman shot.

[ADoyle90815]

Don't give in to those Westboro clowns. They want confrontation. They want to fight. They want you to stop them so they can take you to court and try to win money. As dastardly as they are we can't play their game.

I agree, it's best to just ignore them.

[beefche]

Yay for biker groups!

Arizonans Rally to Prevent Westboro Church Disruption of Shooting Victims' Funerals - FoxNews.com

[lizzy16]

We had a moment of silence for those killed. What really irks me (Me and my friends ranted on and on about this at lunch) is that my school didn't have a moment of silence for 9/11...but when a famous govermental person is involved and gets wounded and 6 are killed the media hops on it and we have a moment of silence at school for it.

Did we have a moment of silence at school when a local teenager died? No.

I've talked to the prinicpal personally about this, and he says he'll try to improve on it.

if it was 6 random people at some random place with no one even slightly well known there wouldn't be any national media coverage.

[HEthePrimate]

Don't give in to those Westboro clowns. They want confrontation. They want to fight. They want you to stop them so they can take you to court and try to win money. As dastardly as they are we can't play their game.

You make a good point. I remember several years back the KKK decided to have a rally at the Statehouse. Of course, people wanted to organize counter-protests to let them know that racism is unacceptable. Only a dozen or so KKK members showed up, but thousands of counter-protesters were there, and many reporters and media vans, etc. The thought occurred to me that if we had simply ignored the KKK, their small group would have looked pretty stupid up there, dwarfed by the Statehouse, with no one listening to them, and that might have actually proven more discouraging to them.

Oh, well, what can you do? People love a fight!

[Guest]

if it was 6 random people at some random place with no one even slightly well known there wouldn't be any national media coverage.

Of course. It is not of national interest...

I would be willing to bet there's not much coverage of the congresswoman being shot in the Philippines. But, Michael Jackson's death... it's still being covered in the Philippines until today. Coz, that's of international interest.

[lizzy16]

Of course. It is not of national interest...

I would be willing to bet there's not much coverage of the congresswoman being shot in the Philippines. But, Michael Jackson's death... it's still being covered in the Philippines until today. Coz, that's of international interest.

Random US people I meant. There was a few deaths near my school (ones that deserved a moment of silence. One was a local boy being killed in a hit and run. I live in a small town. It should have been recognized. ) and we didn't do a moment of silence for them.

It just irks me.

I hate the media.

[NeuroTypical]

Just FYI, the BBC online news has been all over Hugh Heffner buying back Playboy. I haven't heard that anywhere in the states.

[Wingnut]

Just FYI, the BBC online news has been all over Hugh Heffner buying back Playboy. I haven't heard that anywhere in the states.

I didn't even know he didn't own it anymore.

[Elphaba]

I think it's important to clarify the bikers' intent. It is not to protest the Westboro Church's actions, nor to confront them. Their intent is to drown the Westboro people out so that mourners at the funerals do not have to listen to their histrionics.

By drowning them out, the biker's are making it possible for people to ignore the Westboro group. I think it's genius, and I wish I could join them.

Elphaba

[Elphaba]

I deleted my post because I hadn't read the story first, and I was wrong. Sorry about that.

Elphaba

[HoosierGuy]

One thing about Arizona passing laws keeping the protesters away. If all states do that, that may hurt other protesters protesting against other things in the future. It puts a restraint on our right to protest. So either way those crazy people seem to win in the end.

[beefche]

They aren't banning protesting. They are trying to pass a law which states they have to stay x feet away. So, they can still protest, just not in a grieving parent's face.

[pam]

I can really feel for the family of the man accused. What they must be going through.

Family of accused Arizona shooter expresses sorrow over 'heinous' events – This Just In - CNN.com Blogs

[TL10]

Yay for biker groups!

Arizonans Rally to Prevent Westboro Church Disruption of Shooting Victims' Funerals - FoxNews.com

Honesty, if I met one of these guys, I'd give them a big thank you.

Seriously, who in their right minds would protest at a nine year old's funeral?! It's just wrong, and it is almost as sickening as the shooting itself.

[dash77]

Pam:

I agree with yoo -- I have often thought about the famiyl of the accussed man. My paryers go out to them also.

[Saintmichaeldefendthem1]

One thing about Arizona passing laws keeping the protesters away. If all states do that, that may hurt other protesters protesting against other things in the future. It puts a restraint on our right to protest. So either way those crazy people seem to win in the end.

Arizona's law was based on a similar law in Ohio that was upheld in the appeals court. This isn't a carte blanche restriction on all protest, it's specific to protesting at obsequies.

[miztrniceguy]

My wife was angry about the people blaming Sarah Palin for this shooting. She tweeted about it, saying in essence that all the blaming was going to make Palin a target. Her tweet was put in with a bunch of hateful tweets about Palin and a you tube video was made. It made FOX News. FoxNews.com - Palin Targeted in Violence-Tinged Tweets Following Arizona Massacre

[Saintmichaeldefendthem1]

My wife was angry about the people blaming Sarah Palin for this shooting. She tweeted about it, saying in essence that all the blaming was going to make Palin a target. Her tweet was put in with a bunch of hateful tweets about Palin and a you tube video was made. It made FOX News. FoxNews.com - Palin Targeted in Violence-Tinged Tweets Following Arizona Massacre

My hope is that Democrats never clue in to how much they are hurting their image with this nonsense. At this rate, the GOP should have control of all three branches by January 2013.

As far as some (liberal) Jewish groups being offended by Palin using the term "blood libel", their game is more than a little transparent. Number one, these are leftist groups that would jump at the chance to be offended at anything Palin says. And number two, these groups do not represent all Jews any more than the RAINBOW/PUSH and NAACP represent all black people.

[Elphaba]

My hope is that Democrats never clue in to how much they are hurting their image with this nonsense. At this rate, the GOP should have control of all three branches by January 2013.

As far as some (liberal) Jewish groups being offended by Palin using the term "blood libel", their game is more than a little transparent. Number one, these are leftist groups that would jump at the chance to be offended at anything Palin says. And number two, these groups do not represent all Jews any more than the RAINBOW/PUSH and NAACP represent all black people.

The only person hurting Sarah Palin is Sarah Palin. While everyone else, finally, is waking up to the fact that when people use hateful, violent rhetoric, it has consequences, Palin is, typically, acting like the victim in all of this.

The most well-known victim of this tragedy is the one who, inadvertently, started this by having previously pointed out that Palin’s violent rhetoric has consequences. Of course everyone saw that video of Gifford and thought this kid was influenced by Palin's website. Of course everyone saw Limbaugh’s sign riddled with bullet holes on that Tucson street and thought that. Of course everyone has heard Sharron Angle’s rantings about Second Amendment remedies, and thought that.

Of course everyone thought that. It only made sense. You can’t continually spout violent rhetoric and then expect people not to think that.

It doesn’t matter whether this kid was influenced by the rhetoric, or not, because what he did laid this whole thing bare for everyone to see. All over the country, people are taking it down a notch, toning it down. Heck, even Schumer and Coburn are sitting together at the SOTUA.

What is Palin doing? Going on about how she’s an innocent victim in all of this, as if nothing she's done could have possibly contributed to this overreaction whatsoever. She talks about how the shooter is the only person responsible for what he did, which is true, but then goes on to blame everyone else, including, of course, the media and the left, for what people are doing to her. If the shooter is the only person responsible for his actions, these people are the only ones responsible for theirs--not the media, not the left, no one else, but themselves.

And that “blood libel” comment? It’s not just some, (not all) liberal Jews who are upset by it, some conservative ones are also. Yes, it has been used, many times, as a metaphor in other contexts. But this is a perfect example of how obtuse Palin is here. Any intelligent person would have realized that it was the last thing she should have said at this time, precisely because words have power. They have meaning. They have consequences. That is the point. Of course people were going to be upset that she used a metaphor with such a violent, racist, despicable origin.

Higher-minded people, from both the left and the right, have come out and said, “You know what? I might have contributed to this climate. I'm going to look at that, and if I have, I'm not going to do it anymore. Heck, even Glenn Beck praised Obama (I saw pigs outside my window and I'm on the second floor) for his speech in Tucson, where even Fox basically admitted an adult had stepped forward and talked about the responsibility we all have to go forward from this point on, and focus on what’s really important, to heal and learn.

What did Palin say? I was stunned when I saw her video. She bears no responsibility for the reaction to the shooting, yet she continues to blast Obama every chance she gets because he “pals around with terrorists.” Why? He didn’t blow anything up. Why should he be held responsible for that, but she bears absolutely none for the overwrought reaction to her? Her double standard would be laughable if she didn’t have the power to enrage so many.

I've tried to like her. I really have. But this clinched it for me. I can't. The only good thing I can say about the woman is that I sincerely, and fervently, hope she wins the Republican nomination for president in 2012.

Elphaba

[O2BNSD]

My brother was one of the bikers that went down to Tucson from Phoenix, specifically to shield the family & participants during the funeral. He & all the other biker participants received multiple thanks from the police, fire personnel, & Tucson residents for their assistance & support. Luckily, not many from this horrible group (I can't even call them a church) did not show up, but the few that did, the bikers would surround their vehicle & prevented them from getting anywhere near the funeral activities. When the hotel where these horrible people were staying, found out what they were up to, they were asked to leave. It was an incredible thing to see, miles & miles of biker groups lining the streets to protect the family & funeral goers.

I hope those biker dudes attend these funerals and run interference.

Or how about the whole LDS population in Tucson showing up and singing hymns at the top of their lungs while these haters picket....that would be awesome.

[Saintmichaeldefendthem1]

My brother was one of the bikers that went down to Tucson from Phoenix, specifically to shield the family & participants during the funeral. He & all the other biker participants received multiple thanks from the police, fire personnel, & Tucson residents for their assistance & support. Luckily, not many from this horrible group (I can't even call them a church) did not show up, but the few that did, the bikers would surround their vehicle & prevented them from getting anywhere near the funeral activities. When the hotel where these horrible people were staying, found out what they were up to, they were asked to leave. It was an incredible thing to see, miles & miles of biker groups lining the streets to protect the family & funeral goers.

Yes. The Patriot Guard. I know a biker who is a member. It refreshes my heart to see good people rise up like this to keep Satan in check.

[Saintmichaeldefendthem1]

The only person hurting Sarah Palin is Sarah Palin. While everyone else, finally, is waking up to the fact that when people use hateful, violent rhetoric, it has consequences, Palin is, typically, acting like the victim in all of this.

So Sarah Palin's to blame? Why are you on the Left so terrified of her?

The most well-known victim of this tragedy is the one who, inadvertently, started this by having previously pointed out that Palin’s violent rhetoric has consequences.

What violent rhetoric? Did she make a movie depicting the assassination of the president? Did she say that somebody should slit Dr. Laura's throat? Oh, wait. That's the left that does that.

You can’t continually spout violent rhetoric and then expect people not to think that.

What violent rhetoric? Like Obama saying "they bring a knife, we bring a gun"?

It doesn’t matter whether this kid was influenced by the rhetoric, or not,

Oh, but it does matter, doesn't it. The left wanted so badly for him to turn out to be a Rush Limbaugh Dittohead, just like New York Mayor Bloomberg said the Times Square bomber was likely a Tea Party activist....before he got all the facts.

What is Palin doing? Going on about how she’s an innocent victim in all of this, as if nothing she's done could have possibly contributed to this overreaction whatsoever.

Just what is it that you are indicting Palin with? How are you not, like so many other shameless Democrats, using this tragedy to assail political enemies and advance the liberal agenda?

She talks about how the shooter is the only person responsible for what he did, which is true, but then goes on to blame everyone else, including, of course, the media and the left, for what people are doing to her.

She's holding people responsible for lies and political opportunism. What a crime!

And that “blood libel” comment? It’s not just some, (not all) liberal Jews who are upset by it, some conservative ones are also.

Really? You base this on what poll? Since when do Jews own the term "blood libel" or any other euphenism?

Yes, it has been used, many times, as a metaphor in other contexts. But this is a perfect example of how obtuse Palin is here. Any intelligent person would have realized that it was the last thing she should have said at this time, precisely because words have power. They have meaning. They have consequences. That is the point. Of course people were going to be upset that she used a metaphor with such a violent, racist, despicable origin.

She used blood libel which is the crime of falsely and knowingly accusing someone of a crime which they didn't commit. The term is not only appropriate for what was being done to Palin, I can't think of any other that would better fit. BTW, how is this term violent or racist, or do you on the Left just throw out terms for good measure to stifle any opposition?

What did Palin say? I was stunned when I saw her video. She bears no responsibility for the reaction to the shooting, yet she continues to blast Obama every chance she gets because he “pals around with terrorists.”

Um..he does. Bill Ayers is a terrorist and a good friend of Obama's, and where were you when the Left was blasting Bush every chance they got? Did you decry the uncivility? Did you rebuke the violent rhetoric? I think not.

I've tried to like her. I really have. But this clinched it for me. I can't. The only good thing I can say about the woman is that I sincerely, and fervently, hope she wins the Republican nomination for president in 2012.

Elphaba

On that we agree. She doesn't fumble her words when unaided by a teleprompter.

Edited January 17, 2011 by Saintmichaeldefendthem1
spelling

[NeuroTypical]

Elphaba, if you're going to go hold the sins of someone on the other side of the fence to such a light, please don't get upset when we hold the sins of your side of the fence up to the same light.

This last post is good. But we can sit here and do this all day if you really want to. And no, the left really doesn't come out on top of this battle. Because when we peel away civility, the left is more violent, makes more uncharitable characterizations, uses bigoted and attack words more often, and makes more calls for blood and assasination and beatings and armed rebellion way more frequently, by many more people of public note, than the right does. SMDefendThem gave you some highlights. Want a gazillion more?

If you do, let's start with fired CNN reporter Susan Roesgen.

. Comparing Bush to Hitler and Satan is fine in her book. Edited January 17, 2011 by Loudmouth_Mormon

[Wingnut]

So Sarah Palin's to blame? Why are you on the Left so terrified of her?

Annoyed and entertained might be more accurate than saying that we're terrified of her.

[pam]

Annoyed and entertained might be more accurate than saying that we're terrified of her.

You want entertainment? It's rumored they will be performing together on Dancing with the Stars.