How long is a typical disfellowship?

[YaYaYaYana]

Well, I understand that the costs are much less for church members who can keep their honor. Didn't apply eh? They can probably do with out you.

correction..." I can do better without Them... "

BYU is not that much more amazing than other universities or colleges... It's just a university, where some people have an amazing experience and others not so much...It's a learning institute full of classes students and teachers, Just like many other schools around the world just with less reasonable punishments for making mistakes...

In other schools if you mess up on something you can just write a letter and they would take the academic or whatever probation off and let you continue in BYU you can't just confess and sign a paper saying you will try harder not to mess up again and just continue from that point on .. you actually have to waste precious time..time you can actually spend learning while repenting for mistake

Despite the low tuition cost if you add the dorm fee/ meals/ plane tickets like twice a year like way over what I paid by walk 5 streets to my uni for the past two years ^^~

It's not the problem with keeping the Honor code... Nobody enters the school thinking.. OH YEAH.. I'm gonna get in there ans break this commandment and then that one... But people do slip up and the punishment is really unfair... they should just make the person stop attending church for a year and just do the schooling instead..

[YaYaYaYana]

So you say to heck with honor code? Is not honor also being truthful in all that you do? There is no separation when it's a private school owned by a church.

"There is no separation when it's a private school owned by a church."... I meant to say that I hope Religion doesn't take over all the schools... so there can still be a separation for those individuals who wish to keep those two areas of their life Education and religion apart...

Nope I do not say heck with code of Honor... He should definitely confess for his sins and mistakes and come clean.. But I'm saying in his case it would have been better to finish the 2 classes first.. that way he could have his degree ready to apply to another graduate school.... since BYU will not let him continue there for 1.5 years.. he could progress with his repentance progress at church .. while continuing his education else where....

In 1.5 years he could be done with both and get even farther in life... What's the use in stopping someones educational progress along with their spiritual one...

[Hala401]

But, it is our church, and our University, and those who run the university make the rules. If the young man had Sinned once and repented, I would be sympathetic. He sinned the second time, and does not sound repentant at all. You young boys miss the point entirely, and you know so little about life that you don't even know what you don't know.

Go in peace my child, but most certainly go.

[YaYaYaYana]

So you are promoting dishonesty in order to put one's personal gain over doing what is right? This may gain him a degree in the short term, but that will be far outweighed by the harm it does in the long term.

Separation of church and state does not apply to private schools. One knows what they are getting into when they choose to attend a private school, so this should not have come as any surprise. Neither should the fact that there are always consequences for one's actions.

...

Dishonesty would be to complete cover this up and pretend like it never happened or go to the bishop and tone some of the details down... so that it would sound like what he did is much less harmful than what really happened/// However I am not encouraging that... I do encourage the he comes clean at the end and says the full truth/// but education is also very important it's the second most important thing after the gospel///and what is the difference in repenting now or 4 months later when you graduate right? Either way he would go through the repentance process anyways.. but now he has two problems on his shoulder's repentance and finishing school...what's the point of that.....

stopping someones educational progress has nothing to do with their spiritual maturity when he prays and repents and comes clean of his sin.. it all has to do with his actions involving the people or situation around him... it has nothing to do with his grades or his studies// so what the point of making him suffer in that area..?

In usual schools...Usually academic probation is given to someone who is not pulling their grades well enough... and for other problems counseling is given...

so in this case his mistake would qualify as "other" he should do councelling with the bishop but not have his schooling suffer because of it

[pam]

No actually dishonesty would be to continue to attend a school where you know the honor code and the rules but fail to disclose said break of rule so that you can graduate.

That is dishonesty.

[YaYaYaYana]

and you know so little about life that you don't even know what you don't know.

-Might be true but.............. AH IT'S GREAT TO BE YOUNG

:DDDD Now I;ll get going ~

GOOD NITE TO YOU ^^

[Hala401]

Did you ever read that little blue book on the shelf, yes the one that has all the dust on it, that's the one. Right on the front, what does it say, Yes, The Book of Mormon. Hmmmmm

In that book and that other one, what's the name of it, yes, the Bible. Both foolishly advance the idea that principles and morality are the foundation of a society. Maybe in Canada it is OK to place educational advancement over morality and principles, but not in the USA.

[Vort]

If I were you... I would have kept it quiet.. Until I finished the 2 classes and had the Bachelors Degree (Diploma) In my hand... and right after that... I would go and confess...

Then you are supporting bald-face lying. That is dishonest.

I'm LDS and all... But I strongly disagree with having a church control a school...

You don't like BYU? Don't go there. But if you DO go there, you are expected to abide by the rules, including the rules about being honest. Don't want to abide by the rules? No problem. Again, just go somewhere else.

After reading this ... I now know why Church and State are Separate.... Church and School should be separate too....

THEN DON'T GO TO BYU.

Or are you saying that you want to deprive everyone else of the right to form a PRIVATE school and apply their rules to it?

- This kind of discipline put me off of applying to BYU. I was worried that if I would make a... make a similar mistake and be punished like that ...

Agreed. Very wise of you. If you don't want to live the BYU lifestyle, then by all means, please do not go to BYU. Do yourself and every BYU student a huge favor and go somewhere else.

[YaYaYaYana]

Did you ever read that little blue book on the shelf, yes the one that has all the dust on it, that's the one. Right on the front, what does it say, Yes, The Book of Mormon. Hmmmmm

In that book and that other one, what's the name of it, yes, the Bible. Both foolishly advance the idea that principles and morality are the foundation of a society. Maybe in Canada it is OK to place educational advancement over morality and principles, but not in the USA.

By All means please enjoy you USA

The morality and principals and economic crisis

[cadeswenson]

Thanks for any responses. I in no way would have taken back my confession in order to graduate from BYU this December. Yes that would be dishonest. I had a good idea before I confessed what the consequences would be. I'm sad but grateful I have the chance to at least graduate from BYU in the long run. Obviously I wish I regret my mistakes but I know that disfellowship will be a blessing in the long run.

I'm going to call the BYU honor code office to see if I can possibly take a similar class at a nearby college and possibly graduate in April from BYU when my disfellowship is over.

[applepansy]

correction..." I can do better without Them... "

BYU is not that much more amazing than other universities or colleges... It's just a university, where some people have an amazing experience and others not so much...It's a learning institute full of classes students and teachers, Just like many other schools around the world just with less reasonable punishments for making mistakes...

In other schools if you mess up on something you can just write a letter and they would take the academic or whatever probation off and let you continue in BYU you can't just confess and sign a paper saying you will try harder not to mess up again and just continue from that point on .. you actually have to waste precious time..time you can actually spend learning while repenting for mistake

Despite the low tuition cost if you add the dorm fee/ meals/ plane tickets like twice a year like way over what I paid by walk 5 streets to my uni for the past two years ^^~

It's not the problem with keeping the Honor code... Nobody enters the school thinking.. OH YEAH.. I'm gonna get in there ans break this commandment and then that one... But people do slip up and the punishment is really unfair... they should just make the person stop attending church for a year and just do the schooling instead..

You think repentance is a waste of time?

[applepansy]

Thanks for any responses. I in no way would have taken back my confession in order to graduate from BYU this December. Yes that would be dishonest. I had a good idea before I confessed what the consequences would be. I'm sad but grateful I have the chance to at least graduate from BYU in the long run. Obviously I wish I regret my mistakes but I know that disfellowship will be a blessing in the long run.

I'm going to call the BYU honor code office to see if I can possibly take a similar class at a nearby college and possibly graduate in April from BYU when my disfellowship is over.

I talked to my husband about this discussion last night. He was in the Bishopric a few years ago. He said that there are time guidelines with a minimum of three months. He doubted that would have changed in the last 4-5 years since he had access to the handbook.

I wish you all the best and I admire your courage. Its often very hard to step up and do the right thing. Consequences for our sins often disrupt our lives. But in the long run we are blessed abundantly for being honest with God.

[john doe]

If I were you... I would have kept it quiet.. Until I finished the 2 classes and had the Bachelors Degree (Diploma) In my hand... and right after that... I would go and confess...

While on being dis fellowship just apply to a different school for Grad school...

I'm LDS and all... But I strongly disagree with having a church control a school... Just because of the position that you got yourself in.. People do make mistakes .. sometimes Big ones... It should only be required that you deal with those actions at church and should have no impact on your education...

I what does BYU gain in making someone delay their graduation and academic progression in life...

After reading this ... I now know why Church and State are Separate.... Church and School should be separate too.... I mean I understand that one needs to be disfellowshiped from the church in order to repent and get back on the spiritual path... but why does education need to suffer as well.... @__@

- I would suggest to switch schools and try to finish the two courses and apply to graduate school!!!!

There is no need to waste ... 1.5 years it is a huge amount of time in which you can accomplish much and get on with your life..

- This kind of discipline put me off of applying to BYU. I was worried that if I would make a... make a similar mistake and be punished like that ...

Yeah, it's not like we should make a big deal out of honesty and integrity. The commandments are just suggestions anyway. It's not like embracing righteousness is something we should openly be doing.

[norah63]

That part about " Ahhh being young", lost me. Where does that fit into this discussion?

The time limit of disfellowship and all that that costs, does not apply to age I hope.

[rameumptom]

Your situation is not one of graduating BYU, but of going through the repentance process. As an RM, you were endowed. Your actions could have resulted in an excommunication (and in past years, it would have been). Focus on your repentance over the next year, and then finish your schooling. Or, take those classes you need elsewhere (UofU) and see if BYU will later accept them for your graduation.

[Leah]

...

Dishonesty would be to complete cover this up and pretend like it never happened or go to the bishop and tone some of the details down... so that it would sound like what he did is much less harmful than what really happened/// However I am not encouraging that... I do encourage the he comes clean at the end and says the full truth/// but education is also very important it's the second most important thing after the gospel///and what is the difference in repenting now or 4 months later when you graduate right? Either way he would go through the repentance process anyways.. but now he has two problems on his shoulder's repentance and finishing school...what's the point of that.....

stopping someones educational progress has nothing to do with their spiritual maturity when he prays and repents and comes clean of his sin.. it all has to do with his actions involving the people or situation around him... it has nothing to do with his grades or his studies// so what the point of making him suffer in that area..?

In usual schools...Usually academic probation is given to someone who is not pulling their grades well enough... and for other problems counseling is given...

so in this case his mistake would qualify as "other" he should do councelling with the bishop but not have his schooling suffer because of it

Those are quite some mental gymnastics.

What you are proposing IS dishonest. You are encouraging lying in order to avoid the consequences of one's actions. You are encouraging lying long enough to get something you want. Just because the truth comes out later, does not change the fact that a lie is being told now.

You keep talking about other schools. What other schools do or don't do is completely irrelevant in this situation.

The rules were known going in. The OP has free agency. He could have chosen a different school with different (lower) standards. He did not. Then he made another choice in breaking the (known and agreed to) rules. It is baffling to me that anyone would then advocate lying on top of already haven broken the rules.

[Guest]

Not to mention what the scriptures say about procrastinating the day of your repentance.

[norah63]

This came in my daily e-mail. Good to remember at any age .

I am a senior citizen and need to hear these good words every day.

"For the world offers only a craving for physical pleasure, a craving

for everything we see, and pride in our achievements and possessions.

These are not from the Father, but are from this world. 1 John 2:16"

(New Living Translation)

________________________

[Maureen]

...I'm an endowed RM...

...You know, this gives you a break in college. Perhaps you could go serve a mission? People seem to do a lot of growing up on missions.

Hala, I know you are new to the LDS community but if by breaking the Honor Code at BYU got the OP suspended from attending classes, the LDS church would definitely not allow him to go on a mission after confessing to the same sin. And the OP has already stated that he is an RM (returned missionary), so he's been there and done that. He's already grown up but people still make mistakes even after serving a mission.

I agree with others and think the OP should try to attend the same classes at a different University and see if BYU would accept the classes for the OP to graduate.

M.

[Hala401]

Hala, I know you are new to the LDS community but if by breaking the Honor Code at BYU got the OP suspended from attending classes, the LDS church would definitely not allow him to go on a mission after confessing to the same sin. And the OP has already stated that he is an RM (returned missionary), so he's been there and done that. He's already grown up but people still make mistakes even after serving a mission.

I agree with others and think the OP should try to attend the same classes at a different University and see if BYU would accept the classes for the OP to graduate.

M.

Thank you for your informative post. I have much to learn about the LDS sub culture. It is surprising to me that he did the same thing with the same girl twice. He did not mention wanting to marry her. He just needs to face things with the College, and it does seem he is trying.

As far as him finishing his degree in another College, it appears that is one option open to him. He may view what has happened in his life as a great disaster, but maybe he will learn from it, and in a few years it will all be in the past.

I'm not coming at this from a sanctimonious position. I doubt that anyone here has destroyed their life as much as I did in 2004. Heavenly Father has forgiven me, though there is still the remembrance at times.

[slamjet]

The answer to the OP is very simple... You do what you need to do and you let the church do what it needs to do. It's faith, repentance and hope. Not crime, punishment and sentencing.

And as for BYU, don't like it, don't go. If enough people don't go then it will shut down for lack of students. But I seriously doubt that will happen.

[JesusParadox]

YaYa, don't sweat what people on these forums say. I have seen most of them be dishonest repeatedly on these forums. Along with other offenses that are clearly not what the Lord would want. It is regular routine for them to do the opposite of what they say. I am also chief among them in making mistakes on the forums though.

[Guest]

YaYa, don't sweat what people on these forums say. I have seen most of them be dishonest repeatedly on these forums. Along with other offenses that are clearly not what the Lord would want. It is regular routine for them to do the opposite of what they say. I am also chief among them in making mistakes on the forums though.

Can you back that up? That's quite a claim, that most of us are dishonest repeatedly and do the opposite of what we say.

[Vort]

Can you back that up? That's quite a claim, that most of us are dishonest repeatedly and do the opposite of what we say.

You forget, Eowyn: He has seen it. The gig is up. We are exposed.

[Guest]

You forget, Eowyn: He has seen it. The gig is up. We are exposed.

And by that of course you mean that I remember, he hasn't seen it. The gig is not up. We are not exposed.

Have a terrible day.