Young men's activities and violent video games

[momofmany100]

How do I handle the young men's and scout leaders in our ward having violent video games such as call to duty and modern warfare at so many of their activities. Tonight I picked up my 13 year old son from the assistant scout leaders house, who along with our new young men's president allowed the boys to play modern warfare when they were done with there scout activity. This isn't the first time - as a reward for merit badges the scouts have a troop night out that has evolved into video games, mainly Call to Duty, all night at the scout masters house. I kept my son home from the last one because I am tired of these games that are inappropriate for 12 and 13 year old boys. I have discussed it with the scout master and was told they have other games available to play. Tonight, my son immediately told me what happened when I picked him up and told me didn't play them. He's a great kid and knows how I feel about these games especially since his older sister and her husband are in the army and have both been deployed over seas. I am so upset right now - church activities should be a safe place for my son to be. I shouldn't have to worry about him there but it's to the point where I can't even send him to someones house for a mutual or scout activity. My instints are to scream at everyone, but after a long talk with my husband, we have decided to talk this over, once again, with the new young mens president. How do I approach this without making everyone angry because right now I am ready to yell at everyone and never send him to scouts again. Any suggestions on how not to alienate the whole ward?

[Bini]

No advice on this topic, just thoughts..

Call of Duty is definitely inappropriate for young boys. I believe it is geared towards adults and has a MATURE rating but I could be mistaken. At the very least, it seems that parents should be notified of such available content at these activities, and that they must provide consent for their minor to participate in it.

[Bini]

PS. I understand this isn't a school setting but I took a film study class in high school, and there were several films that were Rated R, and parents had to give written consent for their child to view the material. As a parent, I would want to know WHAT the material is, and then from there decide whether or not I want my child to be apart of it. Still, seems a bit inappropriate material in general, for an LDS activity.

[skippy740]

My next thoughts would be after talking to the Young Men's President, would be to talk to the Bishopric member over the BSA & Young Men. Share your concerns with him - specifically the age-appropriateness of such 'entertainment' (this is BSA speak) and how you and your son are not comfortable with such violent games (referencing the "For Strength of Youth" pamphlet).

You need to state that you will not feel comfortable with your son participating if the standards of the BSA and the Church cannot be upheld during these meetings.

If that doesn't get his attention... well, nothing probably would.

[ditd]

I would approachthe scout master again, calmly pointing out the appropriate section of the "For the Strength of Youth" booklet and how the Call of Duty Games are Cert 18 (or whatever the appropriate term is in the USA) and by playing them with such young men they are not only breaking Chirch guidelines but also the law

I would ensure he knows that you feel strongly about this and should they not desist that you will talk to the Bishopric.

If they don't stop seek counsel from the Bishopric...

[alucarD1975]

I wouldn't take it to the scoutmaster again, you mentioned it already and he did not respect your wishes, go straight to the bishop

[ditd]

I wouldn't take it to the scoutmaster again, you mentioned it already and he did not respect your wishes, go straight to the bishop

I think Bishops are very busy people and although yes they are there to protect those that need protecting, I think the Scoutmaster should be given a fair chance to do what is right as they both may learn some invaluable lessons about communication and working together...

[Dravin]

I would approachthe scout master again, calmly pointing out the appropriate section of the "For the Strength of Youth" booklet and how the Call of Duty Games are Cert 18 (or whatever the appropriate term is in the USA) and by playing them with such young men they are not only breaking Chirch guidelines but also the law

That may be the case in the UK, but it's not the case in the US.

Edited August 23, 2012 by Dravin

[MarginOfError]

First, if the scout meetings are ending early enough that they have time to play video games, they aren't planning their meetings well enough.

Second, they should know better than to expose boys to such material without parental permission.

Third, they shouldn't regularly be having meetings at someone's house (unless it is always at that person's house). Meetings should be held in a regular location that has access to the troop's gear and equipment.

Fourth (bias alert), you would probably be better off finding a well run troop and ditching the one you're in.

[momofmany100]

Thank you for the advise. Our bishop's son is the deacon's quorum pres. and as such is involved in these activities. I know the Bishop's wife doesn't approve of the games as my son was invited to spend the night at their house with several other boys. Knowing these other boys played Called to Duty all the time, I inquired what the plans were for that night. They were going to stay up all night playing C to D. I informed the bishops wife that my son wouldn't be there and why and she put a stop to them bringing the game into their home. The funny thing is, after that incident, my son and I explained to these friends of his why he doesn't play the games and from then on they respected that and didn't involve him in those activities.

They were at the home for scout meeting because they are working on their home repairs merit badge and were learning how to set tile.

Thanks again - you all have given me some things to think about.

[Wingnut]

I think Bishops are very busy people and although yes they are there to protect those that need protecting, I think the Scoutmaster should be given a fair chance to do what is right as they both may learn some invaluable lessons about communication and working together...

The Scoutmaster and YM president have both been given opportunities. It's true that the bishop is a busy man, but his top priority in the ward is the youth, and specifically the young men. Having already spoken with the Scoutmaster and YM president, I would absolutely not keep this off his desk.

[NeuroTypical]

Any suggestions on how not to alienate the whole ward?

Here - print this out:

Then take it to the bishop. "Excuse me, bishop? Do you see that label in the lower-left corner? The one that says M - Mature - for ages 17+? I already approached the scout master, and defended this game by saying "there are other games available to play". Can you tell me why my 13 yr old boy is being exposed to this game at a church-sponsored scouting function?"

Then get a clear, appropriate answer out of him. If you don't get one, approach the Stake President, and add the Bishop's response to what you tell him.

[ditd]

The Scoutmaster and YM president have both been given opportunities. It's true that the bishop is a busy man, but his top priority in the ward is the youth, and specifically the young men. Having already spoken with the Scoutmaster and YM president, I would absolutely not keep this off his desk.

I agree, however I think often when I am at work or serving in my calling sometimes an issue escapes my full attention and I will gloss over it because at that particular time I have other priorities that a customer or brother/sister aren't aware of. It is not that I do not care, I am only human.

I think he should be given the chance to realize the gravity of the situation if he has not already, maybe I am a little soft but I'd like to think that if I dropped the ball on something, somebody would do me a favour and tell me rather than my superiors...

[NeuroTypical]

maybe I am a little soft but I'd like to think that if I dropped the ball on something, somebody would do me a favour and tell me rather than my superiors...

Momofmany100 did bring it to the Scoutmaster's attention...

I have discussed it with the scout master and was told they have other games available to play.

It doesn't seem to be about dropping the ball, it seems to be about innapropriate stuff happening on church sponsored scouting activities, and nobody wants to own up and do anything about it.

[ditd]

Momofmany100 did bring it to the Scoutmaster's attention...

It doesn't seem to be about dropping the ball, it seems to be about innapropriate stuff happening on church sponsored scouting activities, and nobody wants to own up and do anything about it.

I don't doubt or disagree with your points there for a second, I know none of the people involved and don't have a crystal picture of the event leading up to this including those conversations.

They might have been along the lines of

"Hey Brother Scoutmaster, I'm not really happy with my son playing these games and feel he really should be playing something else"

Brother Scoutmaster is hosting an event at his house and his mind is elsewhere and probably because of his inexperience may not think that these sorts of games are a bad thing.

I was merely proposing having a conversation to one side which is more along the lines of

"Hey Brother Scoutmaster, the games that Youth under your supervision are playing are wholly inappropriate, and although you may not realize it but they contravene church guidelines and a lot of families' moral principles. Please could you ensure this is not the sort of games Youth are playing otherwise I will have to raise my concerns with the Bishop

[annewandering]

The game I play, Final Fantasy, is only for 13 and up. FF is pretty low on the blood and gore factor and no killing people at all. Call to Duty has to be more objectionable and have at least an age 13 rating. The TOS no doubt tells the subscribers they have to be 13.

On FF if they find out they will cancel your subscription, and all connected subscriptions without warning.

When our boys were in scouts they went on day trips and overnighters out in the deserts and mountains. One thing they loved to do was go explore old mines. This is not only trespassing it is extremely dangerous. My father always blasted his mine shut when it wasnt being worked to keep stupid people out. Unfortunately others do not.

So we found out and went to the bishop about it. He dismissed my concerns completely. He was a rancher and liked to explore them too. Well I was a miner's daughter and knew he was wrong and was allowing those kids to be taken into dangerous territory. All we could do was not allow our sons to go.

I am still upset about it and I have no answers when the leaders wont listen. I had to keep reminding my self that the church is true but some leaders are just stupid.

[Backroads]

I vagually recall my little brothers playing Halo for some Scouting activities. While I have grown to enjoy the Halo games, I just find video gaming to be a strange and inappropriate choice for regular activities, be it filler or not.

As for the Call of Duty and all that stuff, my husband has such games. He loves them (I think they're boring stupid shooting army games with no point) and frankly, I find them inappropriate--especially for a church-sponsored activity.

Like anne said, some leaders will disagree on the exact legalities of things, but I still think parent concern is a valid thing that should be addressed and acknowledged.

Do any other parents feel the same way? Numbers work wonders.

[skippy740]

I'm glad that my ward does nearly all youth/BSA activities at the church building. It becomes HIGHLY unlikely that there would be a video game console to play such games.

In fact, why is it that youth activities are NOT at the church building? Might as well move everything to the building - no video games, central location for the ward (typically), and safer for the youth advisors - particularly when thinking about "Youth Protection" and 2-deep leadership.

[momofmany100]

Thank you so much for all your advise. We did have the YM president come over to talk today and he was very receptive to our concerns. We approached it as advised, from the "for Strength of Youth" and also the BSA's age appropriate activites rule. They are having a presidency meeting tomorrow morning and he said he would discuss it from these points. We let him know that if it continued we would be forced to take our son only to activities that were held at the church. Fingers crossed that this will solve the issue. If not, we will go to the councilor in our bishopric who has a son turning 12 in a few months and would be appalled at this happening. Thanks again!

[slowey]

It sounds as though you've (hopefully) got this sorted, but if not, I would direct the necessary people to the Handbook of Instructions which says that

“Activities should be uplifting and emphasize things that are “virtuous, lovely, or of good report or praiseworthy” (Articles of Faith 1:13)...Leaders ensure that any entertainment is in keeping with the teachings of the Savior”

To my mind at least, it's pretty clear that games like Call of Duty, whilst some members may choose to play them, aren't acceptable for a church activity.

[Blackmarch]

How do I handle the young men's and scout leaders in our ward having violent video games such as call to duty and modern warfare at so many of their activities. Tonight I picked up my 13 year old son from the assistant scout leaders house, who along with our new young men's president allowed the boys to play modern warfare when they were done with there scout activity. This isn't the first time - as a reward for merit badges the scouts have a troop night out that has evolved into video games, mainly Call to Duty, all night at the scout masters house. I kept my son home from the last one because I am tired of these games that are inappropriate for 12 and 13 year old boys. I have discussed it with the scout master and was told they have other games available to play. Tonight, my son immediately told me what happened when I picked him up and told me didn't play them. He's a great kid and knows how I feel about these games especially since his older sister and her husband are in the army and have both been deployed over seas. I am so upset right now - church activities should be a safe place for my son to be. I shouldn't have to worry about him there but it's to the point where I can't even send him to someones house for a mutual or scout activity. My instints are to scream at everyone, but after a long talk with my husband, we have decided to talk this over, once again, with the new young mens president. How do I approach this without making everyone angry because right now I am ready to yell at everyone and never send him to scouts again. Any suggestions on how not to alienate the whole ward?

Well you do need to stand by your standards the first priority should be for your son. See if you can work something out where he can be dropped off at home before after-activities start, or something like that. If that can't be accomodated pull him out of it, with sending a letter to whoevers in charge of the scouting program of exactly why you are pulling your son out of it.

As for the scouts who go to these after-activities things they should get permission from their parents, who should be notified what will be going on... I don't have any clear ideas on how to address this easily. I think a letter to whoevers in charge of the scouting program, (or the bishop if its more than just the scout activities, or if the scouting program is being supported by the church) saying something along the lines that kids are being allowed to view rated R/ mature entertainment after most activities without the parents knkowledge and you don't know what to do about it, and your worried about whats going on. i'd also include saying that if it continues that you will be pulling your boy out from the program(s) and will not be allowed to attend such activities.

[Drpepper]

Tonight, my son immediately told me what happened when I picked him up and told me didn't play them. He's a great kid and knows how I feel about these games especially since his older sister and her husband are in the army and have both been deployed over seas.

I'm impressed with your son being so open with you and standing up for himself. There would have been alot of boys who would of just joined in to fit in with the crowd.

Your obviously doing a great job....