Are more people leaving the church than joining?

[pk55847]

I heard the Lds was the fastest growing religion in the US but it seems like to members that more are leaving? Could someone clarify? Thanks

[prisonchaplain]

I've heard that it's both one of the fastest growing religious faith groups and one with high inactivity rates. Here is an Ensign article that hints at inactivity being a problem, and offers some sound advice that any Christian church could use to bring back "wandering sheep." https://www.lds.org/ensign/1975/10/inactivity-helping-starts-with-knowing-why?lang=eng

Edited May 6, 2013 by prisonchaplain

[pk55847]

I've heard that it's both one of the fastest growing religious faith groups and one with high inactivity rates. This article seems to confirm that:

Well I think that inactivity in the Church is common throughout most form of Christianity right now as a lot of people don't go to Church because of technology and stuff. Do you think a lot of people stop practicing all together though?

Edited May 6, 2013 by beefche

[selek]

This article seems to confirm that:

Just as a heads-up, PC;

That particular site is run by a "counter-cult" ministry which has previously endorsed "lying for Christ" and is known for it's Westboro Baptist style tactics.

It is neither credible nor trustworthy.

Even a cursory examination of the article you linked will show the active bias against the Church.

Their "statement of faith" page reveals their conflict with the teachings of the Church.

I don't doubt that you linked to them in good faith, but snake-oil is snake-oil, even if the placebo seems to work.

A better source for information can be found here.

An article linking more directly to the OP's concerns can be found here.

Edited May 6, 2013 by selek

[prisonchaplain]

Just as a heads-up, PC;

That particular site is run by a "counter-cult" ministry which has previously endorsed "lying for Christ" and is known for it's Westboro Baptist style tactics.

It is neither credible nor trustworthy.

Even a cursory examination of the article you linked will show the active bias against the Church.

Their "statement of faith" page reveals their conflict with the teachings of the Church.

I don't doubt that you linked to them in good faith, but snake-oil is snake-oil, even if the placebo seems to work.

A better source for information can be found here.

An article linking more directly to the OP's concerns can be found here.

I deleted the link. It was my understanding that mormonwiki was a pro-LDS form of wikipedia, but since it is not, I removed the reference.

[selek]

Thank you, PC.

[prisonchaplain]

Well I think that inactivity in the Church is common throughout most form of Christianity right now as a lot of people don't go to Church because of technology and stuff. Do you think a lot of people stop practicing all together though?

I have seen enough discussion at this site to believe that inactivity is a concern to many LDS. There are some Christian churches that keep any member on the rolls until an official removal is requested. So a 200-member church might see 70 on Sundays. On the other hand, some churches make membership a step of commitment. Since many people are slow to commit, we see a higher rate of "adherents" than members. In my own fellowship, for example, we have just short of 2 million members in the U.S., but close to 3 million who attend on a given Sunday. Our concern is not so much about inactive members, but about stirring spiritual hunger in the attenders, so they desire to become full members. Also, we are looking seriously at the problem of young people who graduate from high school, leave the church (often for college), but who do not return to the church.

So, yes, most Christian churches face some challenges in the area of inactivity, discipleship, or otherwise facilitating spiritual maturity in our people.

[selek]

I have seen enough discussion at this site to believe that inactivity is a concern to many LDS. There are some Christian churches that keep any member on the rolls until an official removal is requested. So a 200-member church might see 70 on Sundays. On the other hand, some churches make membership a step of commitment. Since many people are slow to commit, we see a higher rate of "adherents" than members. In my own fellowship, for example, we have just short of 2 million members in the U.S., but close to 3 million who attend on a given Sunday. Our concern is not so much about inactive members, but about stirring spiritual hunger in the attenders, so they desire to become full members. Also, we are looking seriously at the problem of young people who graduate from high school, leave the church (often for college), but who do not return to the church.

So, yes, most Christian churches face some challenges in the area of inactivity, discipleship, or otherwise facilitating spiritual maturity in our people.

Based on my own interactions here and elsewhere, PC- I am inclined to support your summary, and your evaluation.

"Hard" numbers on activity and inactivity are hard to come by for the very reasons you cite, but given the parable of the lost sheep, even one "inactive" should be a matter of concern.

The lure of Babylon, conventional "wisdom", and peer pressure are all potent attractions for any person of faith, and it takes a considerable strength of character to resist them temptation to take the easy path day-in and day-out...

Or as someone once said, "The only thing harder than dying for one's faith is living for it."

The most insidious, IMO, is the Sunday-morning pillow attack.

They will take hold of your head and suck you right down if you're not careful...

[prisonchaplain]

Thank you, PC.

No... thank you.

By the way, I found an official source and planted in the post. It's enough to say that the church knows inactivity is significant enough that it presents approaches that are refreshingly Spirit-driven to counter the problem: https://www.lds.org/ensign/1975/10/inactivity-helping-starts-with-knowing-why?lang=eng Ironically, the article is nearly 40 years old. Then again, that Prodigal Son story is nearly 2000 years old.

Edited May 6, 2013 by prisonchaplain

[Just_A_Guy]

I heard the Lds was the fastest growing religion in the US but it seems like to members that more are leaving? Could someone clarify? Thanks

A favorite canard of our critics is that members are leaving the Church--and actually having their names removed from the Church's rolls--in droves, that the Church is hiring extra staff at headquarters to handle all the removal requests, etc. But the thing is, the Church's published membership figures continue to grow. So whatever name-removal is going on is being offset by new baptisms, by a pretty hefty margin. Activity, as has been outlined above, is of course a perennial problem.

The underlying question, though, is: If the Church isn't growing as fast as we'd like for it to be, or is even diminishing in size--would it really matter, and in what way?

It's easy to get into a locked mindset of "it's growing because it's true" (or, even worse, "it's true because it's growing"). That mindset, IMHO, is counterproductive.

[estradling75]

The current plan to try to reach out and help those that have fallen into inactivity is being called the Rescue from what I am hearing. Its being pushed from the top

[Lakumi]

I wonder if its easier to recruit new members or bring back old ones?

[pk55847]

I wonder if its easier to recruit new members or bring back old ones?

Well I will be baptized soon so whatever the Church did to get the word out to me they did a good job of it.

[Lakumi]

Well I will be baptized soon so whatever the Church did to get the word out to me they did a good job of it.

and as I said to someone else I don't think I could walk into a church without having a panic attack:lol:

[dahlia]

I'm confused. I thought 'Mormon wiki' was OK. I never saw anything anti on it.

[selek]

I'm confused. I thought 'Mormon wiki' was OK. I never saw anything anti on it.

If you look closely, there are two: MormonWiki.com and MormonWiki.org.

The former is a reasonably good source- the latter is a deliberate and damnable fraud, designed to entrap, to sow seeds, of doubt.

As stated, check out their "Statement of Faith" and note the number of items which flatly and aggressively contradict Church doctrine.

They work very hard to present a facade of balance and open-mindedness, but check out any of their pages, and note their tone: mockery, cynicism, criticism, and half-truths designed to sow seeds of doubt.

Edited May 7, 2013 by selek

[estradling75]

I'm confused. I thought 'Mormon wiki' was OK. I never saw anything anti on it.

difference between .com and .org

[prisonchaplain]

difference between .com and .org

The reason I originally cited the link was I didn't realize there was a difference either. Once I was schooled, I switched to the always reliable lds.org (primary source, after all).

[selek]

Once I was schooled...

Not "schooled", "advised".

[pam]

Just another clarification. If you want to go to a mormonwiki site go to mormonwiki.com which is owned by More Good Foundation which owns this site. Mormon.wiki.org is not a good site and we have no control over them.

[bytebear]

I think you have to look at church growth in comparison to other US churches. Secularism is certainly shrinking churches generally.

USA Today did an article on this about a year ago.

Growth stalls, falls for largest U.S. churches - USATODAY.com

Here are the stats on the top 10 denominations.

1. The Catholic Church: 68.5 million, up 0.57%

2. Southern Baptist Convention: 16.1 million, down .42%

3. The United Methodist Church: 7.8 million, down 1%

4. The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints (Mormon): 6 million, up 1.42%

5. The Church of God in Christ: 5.5 million, no membership updates reported

6. National Baptist Convention, USA: 5 million, no membership updates reported

7. Evangelical Lutheran Church in America: 4.5 million, down 1.96%

8. National Baptist Convention of America: 3.5 million, no membership updates reported

9. Assemblies of God: 2.9 million, up .52%

10. Presbyterian Church (USA): 2.7 million, down 2.61%

Of the numbers we have, Mormons are growing the most, and many of the others are shrinking.

I do think the church was a victim of its own success in Latin America, where the growth was phenomenal in the 80s but lack of leadership led to a lot of inactivity. Even good local leaders were so overwhelmed by all the work that needed to be done, they just dropped out. Now in Africa, I see the church moving more slowly, making sure they have leadership in place before they expand too much. They are preparing for the harvest and if you know about the church history in Western Africa, you could say that the Lord was doing a lot of prep work too.

[Jeffmk]

The last time I went to Church, there were more people than were present a few years ago. This is despite another ward opening, and our members being split. It was incredibly crowded, so much in fact that the pews were all taken, then the regular chairs which normally no one sad in were taken, they actually had to place about four rows of folding chairs beyond the cushioned chairs.

In fact, I am accustomed to having Missionaries wit with me when I go to church, it seems as though their hands are full. Mind you, this is Florida.. perhaps it is different in other places, but it seems to me that at the very least here, it is growing significantly.

[mnn727]

USA Today did an article on this about a year ago.

4. The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints (Mormon): 6 million, up 1.42%

6 million? this had to be a couple decades back.

[Dravin]

6 million? this had to be a couple decades back.

The article is only counting US membership. Just look at the Catholic Church figure, there are way more than 68.5 million Catholics on record world wide. As far as the US figure of 6 million goes it's reasonable considering the article was last updated in early 2011. United States - LDS Statistics and Church Facts | Total Church Membership gives 6.3 million as of my check all of two minutes ago.

Edited May 7, 2013 by Dravin

[prisonchaplain]

Not "schooled", "advised".

I just did a teaching in which I highlighted how Jesus COUNSELED the Rich Young Man. In paraphrasing I suggested that in today's English we'd say Jesus schooled him.