Why did God allow polygamy among early Mormons?

[KingintheNorth]

Seems odd to order something and then take it away again. Where did this idea come from? How did Joseph Smith explain it? How did his wives explain it?

[applepansy]

One reason was to build up the Kingdom of God on earth. Another very practical reason was to take care of widows and children. At the time polygamy was practiced the Mormons had been persecuted and killed, hounded from State to State, to the point there were many more women and children than men.

[estradling75]

Some of the relevant doctrine

Why the Lord commands polygamy (At least one of the reasons)...Jacob 2:30 

Cases in which the Lord might revoke a command

Doctrine and Covenants 58:32 

Doctrine and Covenants 56:4 

Doctrine and Covenants 124:49 

I've seen cases made for all three of those in the subject of polygamy

[Just_A_Guy]

It might also be helpful to look at D&C 132 (the record of the revelation Smith received instructing him to go ahead with polygamy), and Official Declaration 1 (the announcement by one of Smith's successors, Wilford Woodruff, that it was time to stop the practice of polygamy). With OD-1, be sure also to read the explanatory material after the declaration itself.

The popular explanation about polygamy being a means to care for the widows in the Church has some anecdotal merit (Smith and Brigham Young both married a couple of women who were over 20 years their senior); but my understanding is that demographically there was not an abnormal surfeit of widows and orphans in the early LDS Church. Child-rearing was a major consideration in polygamy, and (AFAIK) the only explanation specifically offered in the scriptures themselves.

Edited June 24, 2013 by Just_A_Guy

[annewandering]

Seems odd to order something and then take it away again. Where did this idea come from? How did Joseph Smith explain it? How did his wives explain it?

I dont think it was a case of allowing since He commanded Joseph Smith to practice it. Joseph Did NOT like the idea despite all the antimormon rhetoric about it. He fought against it for quite awhile till God told him to knock it off and quit stalling. I think Joseph was terrified to tell Emma. He knew darn well she was going to be ticked.

Many of the problems that cropped up later were directly attributable to the fact that Joseph fought the idea so long and when he finally did as he was told he hid it for a time leading to all sorts of weird and sick speculation.

I dont think most people bothered asking his wives. Emma was not thrilled though. Probably as much, in my opinion, because she was kept in the dark as the actual practice. Big mistake, husbands, to keep big secrets from wives.

As far as why God said do it then take it away, we can only speculate. Truth is He wanted it done and then He decided it was time to end the practice.

Edited June 24, 2013 by annewandering

[Finrock]

The idea comes from the Old Testament. Polygamy was practiced at various times anciently. The Book of Mormon provides the following regarding polygamy.

Background: Some of the Nephites had begun to practice polygamy without authorization justifying it by referencing King Solomon. Jacob, a prophet, reprimanded those Nephites by reminding them that polygamy requires authorization from God.

27 Wherefore, my brethren, hear me, and hearken to the word of the Lord: For there shall not any man among you have save it be one wife; and concubines he shall have none;

28 For I, the Lord God, delight in the chastity of women. And whoredoms are an abomination before me; thus saith the Lord of Hosts.

29 Wherefore, this people shall keep my commandments, saith the Lord of Hosts, or cursed be the land for their sakes.

30 For if I will, saith the Lord of Hosts, raise up seed unto me, I will command my people; otherwise they shall hearken unto these things.

The question of why did God allow polygamy among early Mormons is partially answered by Jacob. God wanted to raise up seed unto Himself.

"As non-Mormon church historian Ernst Benz wrote: 'Mormon polygamy...is tied to a strict patriarchal system of family order and demonstrates in the relationship of the husband to his individual wives all the ethical traits of a Christian, monogamous marriage. It is completely focused on bearing children and rearing them in the bosom of the family and the Mormon community. Actually, it exhibits a very great measure of selflessness, a willingness to sacrifice, and a sense of duty.'"

I don't know of a simple way to answer your other questions so I would direct you to do some research and reading in order to get a more complete picture and understanding:

Joseph Smith/Polygamy - FAIRMormon

Regards

Finrock

Edited June 24, 2013 by Finrock
Added quote by Ernst Benz

[Finrock]

For some reason I was struck by the Spirit when I read this so I wanted to share:

"Joseph displayed an astonishingly principled commitment to the doctrine [of plural marriage]. He had to overcome opposition from his brother Hyrum and the reluctance of some of his disciples. Reflecting years later on the conflicts and dangers brought by plural marriage, some church leaders were struck with the courage Joseph displayed in persisting with it. And when one recalls a poignant encounter like that between [counselor in the First Presidency] William Law and Joseph in early 1844, it is difficult not to agree. Law, putting his arms around the prophet’s neck, tearfully pleaded that he throw the entire business of plurality over. Joseph, also crying, replied that he could not, that God had commanded it, and he had no choice but to obey" (B. Carmon Hardy).

Regards,

Finrock

[skippy740]

JAG reference this, but I want to point this out specifically:

D&C 132 - Section Heading

Revelation given through Joseph Smith the Prophet, at Nauvoo, Illinois, recorded July 12, 1843, relating to the new and everlasting covenant, including the eternity of the marriage covenant and the principle of plural marriage. Although the revelation was recorded in 1843, evidence indicates that some of the principles involved in this revelation were known by the Prophet as early as 1831.

It took the Prophet Joseph Smith 12 years to reveal this doctrine to the saints.

In addition, we should take a look at women's rights back then.

Could women vote? No.

Could women own property? No.

This is an interesting link:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Timeline_of_Womens_Rights_(other_than_voting)

This was before the United States really had a lot of federal power. Most states were very different in regards to their laws.

When men were being killed, women became widows. Now what happens to their support? They couldn't legally own property or work for hire.

It was a means of supporting these women at the same time of establishing and growing the faith through having children.

I also personally believe that it was a way for the early saints to "give up something" in order to establish the state of Utah.

We are a law abiding people. When laws came to define marriage between only one man and one woman, polygamy became a violation of the law. So, Church leaders prayed and received guidance to end the practice and to get the rest of the members to sustain this. (This is in Official Declaration 2.)

Now, getting the rest of the members to sustain this action was what took more doing. These men were willing to go to prison for their beliefs and the rights to practice their religion and protect their families. It was also the first time (I think) that a modern day revelation was given to stop doing a certain practice that the Lord gave originally.

This was a time when having faith that the Prophet of God was truly doing the Lord's will for His people. It must've been pretty tough.

[Finrock]

We are a law abiding people. When laws came to define marriage between only one man and one woman, polygamy became a violation of the law. So, Church leaders prayed and received guidance to end the practice and to get the rest of the members to sustain this. (This is in Official Declaration 2.)

This isn't exactly true. There is no doubt that early church members practiced a form of civil disobedience when they practiced polygamy while the Church still authorized it.

"Polygamy was certainly declared illegal during the Utah-era anti-polygamy crusade, and was arguably illegal under the Illinois anti-bigamy statutes. This is hardly new information, and Church members and their critics knew it. Modern members of the Church generally miss the significance of this fact, however: the practice of polygamy was a clear case of civil disobedience.

The decision to defy the [anti-polygamy laws] was a painful exception to an otherwise firm commitment to the rule of law and order. Significantly, however, in choosing to defy the law, the Latter-day Saints were actually following in an American tradition of civil disobedience. On various previous occasions, including the years before the Revolutionary War, Americans had found certain laws offensive to their fundamental values and had decided openly to violate them.…Even though declared constitutional, the law was still repugnant to all [the Saints’] values, and they were willing to face harassment, exile, or imprisonment rather than bow to its demands.[1]

Elder James E. Talmage taught that members should obey the law, unless God commanded an exception:

A question has many times been asked of the Church and of its individual members, to this effect: In the case of a conflict between the requirements made by the revealed word of God, and those imposed by the secular law, which of these authorities would the members of the Church be bound to obey?…Pending the overruling by Providence in favor of religious liberty, it is the duty of the saints to submit themselves to the laws of their country" (Source).

Regards,

Finrock

[skippy740]

I'm not going to disagree with that. However, it was an additional reason to move west to the Utah territory. No state law to violate and to get away from the persecution.

[Maureen]

...The question of why did God allow polygamy among early Mormons is partially answered by Jacob. God wanted to raise up seed unto Himself...

...It was a means of supporting these women at the same time of establishing and growing the faith through having children...

If raising up seed or having children was the main reason why do so many members argue that Joseph Smith only had children with Emma. Why have 33 wives if you're only having children with one wife?

M.

[skippy740]

I'll admit something: I don't know about Joseph Smith and his many wives & children. I do know about my great-great-great-great-Uncle Brigham... but not enough about Joseph. (And if I start doing a google-search, I'll find a lot of inaccurate information, I'm sure.)

One thing about Joseph is that the RLDS/COC was started with the idea that the rights to lead the church went from father to son. If Joseph had a lot of children, which one would've led the RLDS/COC?

Recently, the RLDS/COC doesn't have a male successor that is in the direct lineage of Joseph. Couldn't one of Joseph's polygamous sons (if there are any) do it?

Personally, I think Joseph Smith may have been a historical exception (as opposed to being commanded not to) to having children with all his wives. I don't have anything to support that, nor am I anxious to start looking it up.

I do know that Emma conceived many times and many of them died. I would wonder how Emma might've felt if Joseph was having children with other wives other than her?

It's complex, and I admit to not having the answers, or the desire to even look them up right now. I'm sure someone else may have other accurate information to share.

[annewandering]

If raising up seed or having children was the main reason why do so many members argue that Joseph Smith only had children with Emma. Why have 33 wives if you're only having children with one wife?

M.

Good question. I actually suspect much of the reason was to separate out the LDS people from the general population. It drew them together in a way that would not have been possible most any other way. It also got them out to Utah where the church could grow and mature with little outside influence. When we were strong, gone through the fire as it were, then it was no longer so important to be separate.

Of course that is pure speculation on my part.

[Anddenex]

If raising up seed or having children was the main reason why do so many members argue that Joseph Smith only had children with Emma. Why have 33 wives if you're only having children with one wife?

M.

They argue he only had children with Emma due to the slander Joseph Smith receives from misinformed preachers.

Who knows how many children he might have had if he wasn't martyred. There are other parameters which are interesting regarding his wives.

[Just_A_Guy]

If raising up seed or having children was the main reason why do so many members argue that Joseph Smith only had children with Emma. Why have 33 wives if you're only having children with one wife?

M.

Because while we're pretty good about acknowledging our polygamous past, a lot of us haven't yet been able to muster the nerve to embrace it and/or its full implications.

[Finrock]

Good afternoon Maureen. I hope you have been well! It is not often that I get to address you directly. :)

If raising up seed or having children was the main reason why do so many members argue that Joseph Smith only had children with Emma. Why have 33 wives if you're only having children with one wife?

M.

I never said it was the main reason. I said the question in the OP is partially answered by Jacob 2.

Are you trying to goad me?

But, even had I said it was the main reason, I have no idea why so many members say what they might say, if they say what you say they say.

The answer to your question as to why have 33 wives? Because God commanded Joseph to do it. Simple as that.

Rather than a mark, Joseph Smith's practice of polygamy is a testament to his prophetic call and to his greatness as one of God's elect. What made Joseph Smith special (and this is what makes anyone special, btw) is that he was willing to Hear and to Obey God's voice at all cost. Joseph paid a steep price to practice polygamy and I love the man for it. Joseph was humble. That is what made Joseph Smith great. And I want to add that if the world were full of Joseph's, then God's power would be poured out unrestrained.

Regards,

Finrock

Edited June 24, 2013 by Finrock
wanted to add more praise to the man who communed with Jehovah!

[Blackmarch]

Seems odd to order something and then take it away again. Where did this idea come from? How did Joseph Smith explain it? How did his wives explain it?

God giveth and God taketh away... I'm just glad he didn't order us to clear out an area of Land as he did the ancient Israelites.

God never gave a specific reason why he commanded polygamy... however when we look back on the time that it was given several things were going on, the saints were being tested greatly before they were given the command to leave and head west. Another is that the church needed to grow, another was that there were widows and women that needed caring and protection. Polygamy tended to fill all those shoes.

[Maureen]

...I never said it was the main reason. I said the question in the OP is partially answered by Jacob 2.

Are you trying to goad me? ...

Well, maybe not the main reason but to "raisie up seed" has been mentioned before as a reason. It is in your scriptures after all.

But, even had I said it was the main reason, I have no idea why so many members say what they might say, if they say what you say they say.

They have. If you're ambitious enough, you could do a search on this forum or other places on the internet. Even DNA testing has been done in search for possible descendants other than those with Emma.

DNA tests rule out 2 as Smith descendants | Deseret News

The answer to your question as to why have 33 wives? Because God commanded Joseph to do it. Simple as that.

There is one other reason that is even simpler.

Rather than a mark, Joseph Smith's practice of polygamy is a testament to his prophetic call and to his greatness as one of God's elect. What made Joseph Smith special (and this is what makes anyone special, btw) is that he was willing to Hear and to Obey God's voice at all cost. Joseph paid a steep price to practice polygamy and I love the man for it. Joseph was humble. That is what made Joseph Smith great. And I want to add that if the world were full of Joseph's, then God's power would be poured out unrestrained.

This is surprising. I'm not sure even many LDS members would use Joseph Smith practicing polygamy as a valid test for believing in his prophetic calling. Is it possible that God never asked him to practice it in the first place, that it was his own idea?

M.

[Finrock]

Well, maybe not the main reason but to "raisie up seed" has been mentioned before as a reason. It is in your scriptures after all.

Well, yeah, that is why I mentioned it.

They have. If you're ambitious enough, you could do a search on this forum or other places on the internet. Even DNA testing has been done in search for possible descendants other than those with Emma.

I didn't mean to imply that they hadn't. I was simply saying I can't speak for others.

I have zero problems/issues with Joseph Smith and him practicing polygamy.

There is one other reason that is even simpler.

Maureen, God commanded Joseph to do it. That is truth. You do with that knowledge what you want.

This is surprising. I'm not sure even many LDS members would use Joseph Smith practicing polygamy as a valid test for believing in his prophetic calling. Is it possible that God never asked him to practice it in the first place, that it was his own idea?

When you aren't in the business of casting doubt on one of God's elect it isn't surprising at all. Joseph Smith is an exalted man. He passed his test. You and I are still in the midst of ours. You and I can both look to brother Joseph as an example of humble obedience.

Regards,

Finrock

[Maureen]

...You and I can both look to brother Joseph as an example of humble obedience....

I see Joseph Smith as an interesting man. He had good and bad qualities. But I don't believe personally that he was a prophet of God.

M.

[Finrock]

But I don't believe personally that he was a prophet of God.

M.

Respect :)

Sincerely,

Finrock

[KingintheNorth]

This thread has raised more issues than answers. With the black issue, it was pretty evident that the scriptures were against it from the beginning, and that everything is all better now.

But with this, there is no clear doctrine or explanation. JS kept various marriages secret, its not clear why he got married at all. Several of the marriages were with married women. The easiest explanation is that he made up the doctrine simply to rationalize his lustful behavior. There just isn't enough information about his wives either. You'd think we be able to get some first hand accounts of the practice, of what reasons JS gave them.

After all if he said "I want to marry you because you don't have a husband, and God has revealed that having a husband is necessary for exaltation." But then we see evidence that he married married women.

[annewandering]

This thread has raised more issues than answers. With the black issue, it was pretty evident that the scriptures were against it from the beginning, and that everything is all better now.

It was?

But with this, there is no clear doctrine or explanation. JS kept various marriages secret, its not clear why he got married at all. Several of the marriages were with married women. The easiest explanation is that he made up the doctrine simply to rationalize his lustful behavior. There just isn't enough information about his wives either. You'd think we be able to get some first hand accounts of the practice, of what reasons JS gave them.

It is very clear why he married. God told him to.

After all if he said "I want to marry you because you don't have a husband, and God has revealed that having a husband is necessary for exaltation." But then we see evidence that he married married women.

This is a curious thing and I dont know why but it seems to me that Joseph was learning a LOT of gospel principles in a very short period of time. He may not have understood what was to be done, exactly. Or he might have known something we dont. I can think of a number of possible reasons but I guess we will just have to trust God that if it is important we will learn why. Is it important?

Most things in doctrine we end up boiling down to faith. Even the simple things. Explanations and deep discussion can be interesting but in the end it is a matter of faith.

[Just_A_Guy]

But with this, there is no clear doctrine or explanation. JS kept various marriages secret, its not clear why he got married at all.

Yeah, other than the idea of child-rearing and the idea of strict obedience to God's commandments. I've seen others point out that polygamy generally tended to bond the Church together during the succession crisis after Smith's death--lots of the Church leaders and members were related to each other through (polygamous) marriages. (This concept has been referred to as "dynastic sealings".)

Several of the marriages were with married women.

True; though we have first-hand evidence of only one of those married women claiming that her marriage to Smith was ever consummated. That woman was Sylvia Sessions. Her husband had been recently excommunicated and the two of them were apparently not cohabiting at the time of her relationship with Smith. Smith had officiated at the Sessions wedding and may have considered the pair divorced. (See http://www.crlayton.com/familyweb/HALES-final.pdf).

I guess the takeaway from all this is: it's dangerous to generalize about Joseph Smith's polygamy. You really do need to dig into it on a case-by-case basis; and we've admittedly done a poor job of that here.

The easiest explanation is that he made up the doctrine simply to rationalize his lustful behavior.

The trouble is, there were easier ways to get sexual gratification, even in 1840. There were brothels all over the west. There was even one in Nauvoo--much to Smith's and the city council's chagrin.

Moreover, as has been hinted at in this thread: Smith suffered greatly for polygamy. It was probably the root cause in most of Smith's problems post-1842, and ultimately is what gave traction to the Expositor and thus is the underlying factor in Smith's death.

Even though much of it hadn't been publicly unveiled prior to his death, Smith was developing an advanced theology in the late Nauvoo period; and polygamy was an integral part of that.

There just isn't enough information about his wives either. You'd think we be able to get some first hand accounts of the practice, of what reasons JS gave them.

There are; it's just that (as I previously admitted) we probably could have done a little better at pointing you to those sources. My apologies for that. Hopefully the bycommonconsent.com link I provided above, in conjunction with some of the scriptural cites provided earlier, give you a decent springboard for additional investigation.

[KingintheNorth]

I guess the ultimate question is what is the purpose of plural marriage on earth. For marriage one could say its to build strong families and faithful children. But then Joseph smith never had any children in the plural marriages. So the strengthening families and go forth and multiply angles are not too convincing. Perhaps each of these women had children from a previous marriage, and that's the reason. I'm not sure.