Sealing

[Jccindy]

 I joined the church 3+ years ago.  My husband of over 16 years was inactive for 14 years but now we are both active.  His two children from a previous marriage are now active again as well.   I have went to the temple and received my endowments.  We recently went through the process of cancelling my husbands sealing to his ex-wife and gaining permission for us to be sealed.  I attended my first sealing of one of our former missionaries that served our area.  We are scheduled to get sealed in just under 4 weeks.

During the sealing ceremony I remember the officiant say you are now lawfully married for time and all eternity, do they change that if you are already married?  Because that will not be true in my case.  I have been lawfully married for lots of years.

Also, will they really say "be fruitful and multiply" to a 45 year old women?  I asked that question to a member yesterday and he looked at me and said, are you sure you won't?  I'm like yes...I mean really I've known since I was 20-21... That having children was not in the cards for me. Now I'm also helping my son(step-son) plan his wedding and I'm looking forward to being a grandma .   Sorry I got off on a tangent, do they really tell older couples to be fruitful and multiply?

i have not had the best experiences going to the temple.  I love my husband and have always known we will be together for ever, but want to have this be a positive experience.

cindy

[Guest LiterateParakeet]

Congratulations Cindy, I'm very happy for you.

I don't know for certa in about the wording, I believe in your case they simply say you are sealed. 

Don't worry about multiplying, it is generally accepted that pregnancy at 40 and over is risk for both mom and babe, so I don't think anyone would expect that of you.   I had my last child at 40, and it almost killed me, literally. So I'm with you...bring on the grandbabies!

Again, congratulations!

[Guest]

You can ask to speak with the sealer prior to the ceremony and go over details like that.  If it is not required wording, he should be happy to change the wording.  If it is required wording, I'd just consider it figurative in your case.

Edited March 21, 2016 by Guest

[Vort]

1 hour ago, Jccindy said:

During the sealing ceremony I remember the officiant say you are now lawfully married for time and all eternity, do they change that if you are already married?  Because that will not be true in my case.  I have been lawfully married for lots of years.

Also, will they really say "be fruitful and multiply" to a 45 year old women?  I asked that question to a member yesterday and he looked at me and said, are you sure you won't?  I'm like yes...I mean really I've known since I was 20-21... That having children was not in the cards for me. Now I'm also helping my son(step-son) plan his wedding and I'm looking forward to being a grandma .   Sorry I got off on a tangent, do they really tell older couples to be fruitful and multiply?

I have participated in many sealings, and I don't recall anything about "lawfully married". But if you get sealed in the temple, then it is a true statement that "you are now lawfully married for time and all eternity." Having been married previous to that doesn't change that it's still true. It's like if someone said, "You are now a woman sealed to her husband." You were a woman before, but it's still a true statement.

As for the "be fruitful and multiply" part -- yes, of course that will be said to you. It is a blessing upon you. Remember, this is an ordinance that will last throughout the eternities. We believe in eternal increase. Being fruitful and multiplying is one of the priceless, inestimable blessings of the Father to you. Whether you can (or should) have children at this point in your life is pretty much beside the point. If you were 86 years old, the wording would be identical.

[LeSellers]

My memory isn't what it used to be (and it never was), but I don't recall the sealing ceremony's including "be fruitful and multiply and replenish the earth".

Even if it does, please recall that the sealing is not for time only, but for eternity, and in the eternities, the exalted will be fruitful.

There are two parts of the ceremony: the first is informal, where the sealer will take a few (or many) minutes to talk about marriage, sealing and the universe (or whatever he feels impressed to share with you). The second part is like any other Temple ordinance: it's a word-for-word recitation of the text of the ceremony. If it includes "be fruitful, etc.", just be happy you are included in the citizenship of the Kingdom like any other Saint.

Lehi

[Just_A_Guy]

26 minutes ago, LeSellers said:

My memory isn't what it used to be (and it never was), but I don't recall the sealing ceremony's including "be fruitful and multiply and replenish the earth".

The admonition is only given in live sealings, not proxy ones.  As far as I know, it's given regardless of the age of the couple.  I consider it an ecclesiastical variant of the "fertile octogenarian" rule.  (Not to be confused with the "Unborn widow" rule or the "precocious toddler" rule--trust law is full of entertaining/horrifying hypotheticals.)

Edited March 21, 2016 by Just_A_Guy

[Jccindy]

    askdfja;sdk;

Edited March 22, 2016 by Jccindy

[estradling75]

13 minutes ago, Jccindy said:

So in other words - suck it up butter cup.  So much for heavenly father knowing us individually.  This totally blows my mind.  

 

I'm sorry - but them saying "NOW" you are legally married - is just not true and to me belittles the last 16 plus years of my marriage.

Being fruitful and multiplying - not happening - I don't understand how that can possibly be a blessing.

 

I guess it is better to know now that I will dislike this ceremony as much as I dislike the endowment session.   Someday hopefully I will see what the joy is in going to the temple..but I guess not any time soon.

Wow... bitter much?   With that attitude I would agree you will not be seeing the joy anytime soon

 

 

Edited March 22, 2016 by estradling75

[Guest LiterateParakeet]

Cindy, I'm not quite understanding where you are coming from, but if you want I'd be happy to talk to you about it and try to help.  I also sent you a private message since you deleted your message.  

[zil]

Even though the comment is now deleted, I want to address the idea of Heavenly Father knowing us individually, versus the sealing ordinance having fixed words.  Here are some thoughts to keep in the background:

1. I'm not sure we've established the formal text of the sealing ceremony, nor should we in this setting.  That text belongs in the temple, not out here.

2. A bunch of people on a forum don't know everything your temple sealing ceremony might include, and even if they do, they can't talk about it all out here. Please let go of the worries and fears and confusion that grip you out here, and consider the suggestion of talking to the temple sealer - he can give you facts, and address your personal questions.

3. Think of all the ordinances we do (Sacrament, baptism, receiving the gift of the Holy Ghost, etc., etc.) none change based on those present.  Not one has its wording changed for the specific individual - not even baptism and confirmation* which are done for just 1 person.  That's not because Heavenly Father doesn't know us, but because each of us needs the same ordinances, whether we're baptized at 8 or 80.  The ordinance is the ordinance.  It is meant to teach and guide us as much as bless us, and is a ritual to that effect.  We should think of the words in those terms.  (And despite using the exact same text for each person, they can be very personal, if you let the Spirit speak the personal portion to your heart.)

  * The personal blessing spoken after the ordinance of confirmation is not the ordinance, it's a blessing:

4. Demonstration of Heavenly Father's knowledge of each of us personally comes in personal revelations, blessings given on an individual basis, promptings, and in similar personal experiences.  Seek for His guidance as you struggle with these questions, be humble, acknowledge your testimony and fears, then let Him  speak personally to you.

Satan doesn't want you to be sealed.  He will do everything he can to make you doubt, or feel fear or anger.  He wants to keep you from ever entering the temple again.  He doesn't want you doing your own work, or work for the dead, he doesn't want you sealed to your spouse, children, or grandchildren.  And he'll do anything to stop these things, including continual reminding of how the things you've heard don't make sense to you right now, telling you they mean things that they don't mean.  Reject his efforts, and seek divine help to do so.

[Vort]

1 hour ago, Jccindy said:

So in other words - suck it up butter cup.  So much for heavenly father knowing us individually.  This totally blows my mind.

We are sorry for your pain and we commiserate with you, but we disagree with your wrong ideas. Telling you so is a kindness. Please don't choose to interpret it otherwise.

1 hour ago, Jccindy said:

 I'm sorry - but them saying "NOW" you are legally married - is just not true

Of course it's true. You will be "NOW" legally married. Any implication otherwise exists solely in your own mind.

It's a small point, Cindy. Let it go. If you can't understand it now, let it lie, and in the future you will gain perspective on it.

1 hour ago, Jccindy said:

and to me belittles the last 16 plus years of my marriage.

Then perhaps you need to change your viewpoint.

1 hour ago, Jccindy said:

Being fruitful and multiplying - not happening - I don't understand how that can possibly be a blessing.

Read up on the blessings of Abraham and the doctrine of eternal increase. Being fruitful and multiplying is our exaltation. That is what exaltation means -- the continuation of the seeds. That is what exalts us.

1 hour ago, Jccindy said:

I guess it is better to know now that I will dislike this ceremony as much as I dislike the endowment session.   Someday hopefully I will see what the joy is in going to the temple..but I guess not any time soon.

I, too, hope that you will eventually (maybe even soon) get to a point where you can see the beauty of these things. I'm sure temple ceremonies must seem strange and even frightening to those who lack any insight into them. Please accept the word of a brother: They are indeed things of profound beauty and importance, once you develop eyes to see and ears to hear. Don't give up or give into your fear and cynicism.

[thoughts]

The eternal blessings are not necessarily applicable to just this life.

And I doubt they will use you are "now married for time and eternity" because they are not doing the actually legal marriage that require those words (if someone here is from a country that doesn't allow temple workers to conduct the civil marriage, they could probably say how it is different).

But I would note two things --- one is that no matter what is the common or expected form, sealers sometimes mess it all up because they just do.  The second is that you can speak to the sealer or the temple pres before your sealing and ask if they could do it the way you would like them to.  Or ask why they have to do it the way you don't like.

The fact that it is done uniformly has nothing whatever to do with not knowing you personally.  If you let Him, He and your Heavenly Mother and Savior will be with you in comfort during the entire proceedings.