No Obamacare Repeal

[Guest]

So, the latest update is that the Republican plan will keep all the taxes from Obamacare and use those funds to provide subsidies for insurance.  But those without insurance will not receive the subsidy.

Uhmmm.  How is that any different than... nevermind.  

There will be no repeal.  It will be Obamacare's younger brother which will grow back into Obamacare.

Edited February 24, 2017 by Guest

[Guest MormonGator]

1 hour ago, Carborendum said:

 

There will be no repeal.  It will be Obamacare's younger brother which will grow back into Obamacare.

Trumpers-welcome to the real world of politics. 

[Blueskye2]

On 2/7/2017 at 0:20 PM, Godless said:

I've been following those proceedings very closely the last few days, and I have a feeling that several GOP Senators just voted away any chance of reelection (Ted Cruz and Orrin Hatch will be the most interesting ones to watch next year). DeVos is massively unpopular on both sides of the aisle. John Cornyn's social media (and email and phone lines, I'm sure) has been flooded by Republicans pleading with him to reject her. Educators on both sides of the political spectrum are dumbfounded by this appointment. Blind GOP loyalty to Trump at the expense of loyalty to constituents could prove very costly in the midterm elections.

Sorry, I know this was off-topic. I just really wanted to address it.

I would love to see UT finally vote Hatch out.  I think he'll retire or die before that happens. Alas, UT already has most of what is in School Choice. Families around here have their kids going to school all over the place.  UT state gov't tried to get out of Core, but the Feds wouldn't let them. Bye bye Core is happiness for Republican majority UT. The piece that some people around here would love, and most don't care one way or the other, are school vouchers. The Catholic private schools, and parents of students attending private schools, are all for it.

Edited February 24, 2017 by Blueskye2

[Blueskye2]

On 2/6/2017 at 2:47 PM, Carborendum said:

http://thehill.com/policy/healthcare/317998-trump-obamacare-plan-could-take-until-next-year

http://www.npr.org/sections/health-shots/2017/02/06/513718166/trump-congressional-gop-back-off-from-immediate-obamacare-repeal

http://www.cbsnews.com/news/trump-obamacare-replacement-plan-could-take-until-next-year/

https://www.washingtonpost.com/posteverything/wp/2016/11/12/heres-why-trump-is-already-waffling-on-obamacare/?utm_term=.b636cfa8507d

Well, well.  Like I said.  "No repeal without a replacement" = "NO REPEAL".

We're still going to have exchanges mandated by the feds.  We're still going to have the individual mandate.  We're still going to have insane insurance requirements for things we don't need.  We'll still have cumbersome requirements and additional fees/taxes for everything health and medical related.

Nope.  Sorry folks.  No repeal of Obamacare.

I could die from that surprise. /s

[Blueskye2]

On 2/7/2017 at 0:28 PM, anatess2 said:

 

 

 

In addition to that, Trump is addressing the impact to business through a holistic reduction of regulations that impact businesses - not just as it pertains to healthcare.  For the insurance market, he held meetings with various healthcare industry leadership to get some direction for Tom Price to run with.

 

Argh, here is the problem with the ACA, that it is heavily reliant on funding insurance companies, to their fiscal content.

Don't get me wrong, I am in favor of healthcare coverage for everyone. I am not in favor of my taxes being earmarked directly to corporations.

[NeuroTypical]

I've picked up seasonal tax work as a side source of income.  This year the max penalty for an individual with no health insurance is $695.  I've handed out this penalty to a handful of people.  They were all lower-income people.  It was like a punch in the gut to them.   

[Sunday21]

3 hours ago, NeuroTypical said:

I've picked up seasonal tax work as a side source of income.  This year the max penalty for an individual with no health insurance is $695.  I've handed out this penalty to a handful of people.  They were all lower-income people.  It was like a punch in the gut to them.   

Wow! We don't have this. If you are not working, you are meant to pay a fee but we wave it for low income.Actually if you are low income the government sends you money.

Edited February 25, 2017 by Sunday21

[mordorbund]

 

On 2/24/2017 at 9:05 PM, Sunday21 said:

On 2/24/2017 at 5:36 PM, NeuroTypical said:

I've picked up seasonal tax work as a side source of income.  This year the max penalty for an individual with no health insurance is $695.  I've handed out this penalty to a handful of people.  They were all lower-income people.  It was like a punch in the gut to them.   

Wow! We don't have this. If you are not working, you are meant to pay a fee but we wave it for low income.Actually if you are low income the government sends you money.

No worries Sunday. Our Supreme Court determine that we are not charging any fees for not buying insurance. We are levying a tax. Completely different (doesn't invoke the commerce clause).

[Sunday21]

@mordorbund strange system!

[Still_Small_Voice]

After we paid for our health insurance (which was likely at least $5,000) our out of pocket medical costs were over $6,400 dollars in 2016 because my wife had some surgeries done.  My wife and I made about $60,000 last year supporting a family of six.  The affordable care act has been horrid for us.  Health care is unaffordable now.  

Those who cannot afford health care are now adding to the national debt (19 trillion and counting).  Republican heads will roll in two years if the tax for not having health insurance is not repealed. 

[NeuroTypical]

On 2/24/2017 at 7:05 PM, Sunday21 said:

Wow! We don't have this. If you are not working, you are meant to pay a fee but we wave it for low income.Actually if you are low income the government sends you money.

There are many ways to get exceptions or reductions to the penalty (technically, it's a 'shared responsibility payment' or some such terminology).  The closer you are to the poverty line, the more of a reduction you can get.  You can claim hardship exemptions if horrible things happened - you don't need insurance for any month you were a victim of domestic violence, or in prison, or had a close family member die, or had utilities cut off, or were evicted, or homeless (a dozen others are available).

And yet I'm still handing out penalties.  I handed out one just yesterday to a mom and her son - a bit over $1000.  I listened to her talk about how she knew people on welfare, housing paid by the state, who work just enough to get a huge refund check from the IRS.  And yet here she is, keeps her nose clean, works her butt off to make something for herself, and she's penalized for it.  

Yeah, these experiences have made me really not a fan of the Affordable Care Act.  

[Guest]

19 hours ago, NeuroTypical said:

And yet I'm still handing out penalties.  I handed out one just yesterday to a mom and her son - a bit over $1000.  

Penalties?  Do you work for the IRS?

[NeuroTypical]

1 hour ago, Carborendum said:

Penalties?  Do you work for the IRS?

Nope, I'm just doing taxes through H&R Block.  Yes indeed it's part of doing taxes, to figure out if you owe a penalty for not having enough health insurance, assess it to yourself, and pay it.  Or I can do it for ya.

[Guest]

Just now, NeuroTypical said:

Nope, I'm just doing taxes through H&R Block.  Yes indeed it's part of doing taxes, to figure out if you owe a penalty for not having enough health insurance, assess it to yourself, and pay it.  Or I can do it for ya.

I'm confused about your comment that "you" are handing out penalties.

[NeuroTypical]

Well, here's what it looks like.  When I do someone's taxes, and they didn't have qualifying healthcare for some or all of 2016, it's my job to calculate the amount they owe because of it.  Call it a penalty, a tax, a fee, whatever you want.  The official name is the "individual shared responsibility", you can read all about it on the IRS website here.  Here's what it looks like on line 38 of the 1040A:

In this example, whatever this person owed before, they now owe $695 more.  Whatever they were getting as a refund, they will now get $695 less.  (to create this example, I just went to the IRS website, opened their blank 1095a form, and typed in 695.  It's not anyone's actual taxes.)

If you're doing your own taxes, it's your job to figure out your own "individual shared responsibility".  You can go here for info on how to do that.

 

Edited February 27, 2017 by NeuroTypical

[Guest]

56 minutes ago, NeuroTypical said:

When I do someone's taxes...

OK.  That was what I did not know about you.  You do people's taxes.  Is that your profession or a side job or just as a favor to some who need it?

[NeuroTypical]

Side job - actually my first year doing it.  I'm thinking it might be a nice retirement gig - work a few months of the year, retired LDS pony dubstep party the rest of the year.  

[Guest]

6 minutes ago, NeuroTypical said:

Side job - actually my first year doing it.  I'm thinking it might be a nice retirement gig - work a few months of the year, retired LDS pony dubstep party the rest of the year.  

So, what do you think about the IRS announcement about line 61? (line 38 in your example).

Edited February 27, 2017 by Guest

[yjacket]

You mean

"This year, the IRS put in place system changes that would reject tax returns during processing in instances where the taxpayer didn’t provide information related to health coverage.

However, the Jan. 20, 2017, executive order directed federal agencies to exercise authority and discretion available to them to reduce potential burden.‎ Consistent with that, the IRS has decided to make changes that would continue to allow electronic and paper returns to be accepted for processing in instances where a taxpayer doesn’t indicate their coverage status.

However, legislative provisions of the ACA law are still in force until changed by the Congress, and taxpayers remain required to follow the law and pay what they may owe‎. 

Processing silent returns means that taxpayer returns are not systemically rejected by the IRS at the time of filing, allowing the returns to be processed and minimizing burden on taxpayers, including those expecting a refund. When the IRS has questions about a tax return, taxpayers may receive follow-up questions and correspondence at a future date, after the filing process is completed‎. This is similar to how we handled this in previous years, and this reflects the normal IRS post-filing compliance procedures that we follow"

To me this means, if you feel lucky you can not pay the tax and we can't immediately verify if you should or shouldn't pay the tax but we might find out you should pay the tax and then we might audit you. 

[yjacket]

http://www.cnbc.com/2017/03/02/gop-obamacare-replacement-bill-hidden-in-congress-basement.html

Ah, I've got to love the Republicrats in office.  They are no better than the Democons.  The more things change the more things stay the same.  Amazing how conservative the country actually is-yet TPTB are all big government.  Rand Paul has the right idea, one of the few small government congresscritters.

[Guest MormonGator]

4 hours ago, yjacket said:

 Rand Paul has the right idea, one of the few small government congresscritters.

Amen to that. He's the reason why I'm still a registered republican. 

[askandanswer]

On 28/02/2017 at 2:44 AM, NeuroTypical said:

Well, here's what it looks like.  When I do someone's taxes, and they didn't have qualifying healthcare for some or all of 2016, it's my job to calculate the amount they owe because of it.  Call it a penalty, a tax, a fee, whatever you want.  The official name is the "individual shared responsibility", you can read all about it on the IRS website here.  Here's what it looks like on line 38 of the 1040A:

In this example, whatever this person owed before, they now owe $695 more.  Whatever they were getting as a refund, they will now get $695 less.  (to create this example, I just went to the IRS website, opened their blank 1095a form, and typed in 695.  It's not anyone's actual taxes.)

If you're doing your own taxes, it's your job to figure out your own "individual shared responsibility".  You can go here for info on how to do that.

 

I'm truly amazed at what I'm looking at here, although I must confess I don't fully understand it. Is this a fair and representative example of the complexity of US tax return forms? If so, it's truly absurd!

[Guest LiterateParakeet]

1 hour ago, askandanswer said:

I'm truly amazed at what I'm looking at here, although I must confess I don't fully understand it. Is this a fair and representative example of the complexity of US tax return forms? If so, it's truly absurd!

Yes, that is fair and representative, and that is just a tiny portion of it   It's much more complex than that.  

[Backroads]

On 2/26/2017 at 8:01 AM, Still_Small_Voice said:

After we paid for our health insurance (which was likely at least $5,000) our out of pocket medical costs were over $6,400 dollars in 2016 because my wife had some surgeries done.  My wife and I made about $60,000 last year supporting a family of six.  The affordable care act has been horrid for us.  Health care is unaffordable now.  

Those who cannot afford health care are now adding to the national debt (19 trillion and counting).  Republican heads will roll in two years if the tax for not having health insurance is not repealed. 

The employers of Husband and yours truly were awesome at getting us affordable and good insurance, but we seem to be alone in this. 

The flat-out worst thing about the ACA is how expensive it has made insurance for the middle class. If I hear one more word about how "it's so nice for poor people and the middle class should just suck it up", I will lose my mind.

[yjacket]

9 hours ago, askandanswer said:

I'm truly amazed at what I'm looking at here, although I must confess I don't fully understand it. Is this a fair and representative example of the complexity of US tax return forms? If so, it's truly absurd!

Oh it's much worse than this. My tax return is generally on the order of ~15-20 pages of this crap . . .and that's just the Federal; State income is another 5-7 pages.  There is a reason why no one wants to simplify the tax code, too many people make money off of helping people fill out this crap.  Big businesses have an army of accountants to fill out taxes, add an army of lawyers to ensure they are compliant with regulations.  

You can literally fill out your tax return 3-4 different ways and each of them can be correct!!

Here in the US we really do not realize at how incredibly bad is actually is, people have just adapted to it-but it is really, really bad.  It's amazing at how good we are doing with all the regulations, taxes, etc.

And to think when the income tax was first passed it was a 1% tax on income over 10k (i.e. about 1million today)!  Man, it would be nice to have lived in a time period when pretty much nothing was touched by the Federal Government.

Edited March 4, 2017 by yjacket