Had hour long convo and priesthood blessing from Stake President on plural marriage obsession on Sunday

[yjacket]

On 4/18/2017 at 1:18 PM, anatess2 said:

This is the real answer - the definition of LOVE changed over time.

Really good comment.  +1.

[anatess2]

On 4/18/2017 at 1:38 PM, Mike said:

I can't speak to the question. But if it only became a main thing in the 20th century, I'm feeling glad I was born in the 20th century. Of course this doesn't mean I discount the possibility that people can fall in love after they marry. Moreover, I don't think marrying purely for love is a problem at all. I suspect the problems that arise are often a result of the parties *not* being in love and not knowing the difference between love and some other things. 

I really dislike the phrase "Fall in love".  It's like you're walking down the road, stumble on a rock, and fall in love.  You don't fall in love - this is the mistake of many divorced people, because of course, if you can fall into it, you can fall out of it.  YOU CHOOSE to love.

Edited April 19, 2017 by anatess2

[anatess2]

On 4/18/2017 at 1:17 PM, Zarahemla said:

 I pray I can find a girl and marry in this life.

I have wonderful cousins....

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who need visas.

[Mike]

3 hours ago, anatess2 said:

I really dislike the phrase "Fall in love".  It's like you're walking down the road, stumble on a rock, and fall in love.  You don't fall in love - this is the mistake of many divorced people, because of course, if you can fall into it, you can fall out of it.  YOU CHOOSE to love.

In the context we're discussing I think I share your opinion about choosing whom to love.  On the other hand I'm something of a romantic. In a romantic context I kind of like the feeling.

[Guest]

Is there such a thing as soulmates?

[zil]

10 minutes ago, Zarahemla said:

Is there such a thing as soulmates?

Sure - if you choose to be so committed to each other that you eventually obtain exaltation in the celestial kingdom together, I think that would qualify as soulmates.

Otherwise, no.

[Mike]

52 minutes ago, Zarahemla said:

Is there such a thing as soulmates?

It kinda seems to me that if for no other reason than the sheer number of souls any one of us ought to be able to love and be happy with at least a thousand different people--and thats without even trying that hard. 

[Guest]

I'm 6 years beyond menace to society age. I'm 31, overweight and still single.

[zil]

1 minute ago, Zarahemla said:

I'm 6 years beyond menace to society age. I'm 31, overweight and still single.

I thought that was only 1 year over menace to society age. :-/

[zil]

PS: I know a ridiculous number of overweight husbands (including many who are young and new-ish).  Which isn't to say that you shouldn't work on healthy habits as best you're able, only to say don't let that be overly discouraging.

[Guest]

3 minutes ago, zil said:

PS: I know a ridiculous number of overweight husbands (including many who are young and new-ish).  Which isn't to say that you shouldn't work on healthy habits as best you're able, only to say don't let that be overly discouraging.

Thanks! That gives me some hope.

[Guest]

I live in Utah County and would want to get married in the Payson temple because it's beautiful and can hold 80 chairs in the sealing room while the Mt Timpanogas holds 70 and provo city center temple far far less chairs and room only 35 chairs. I would want more family to be able to see the sealing.

Edited April 20, 2017 by Zarahemla

[JohnsonJones]

On ‎4‎/‎18‎/‎2017 at 7:48 AM, Zarahemla said:

Can anyone who knows answer this question? Did marrying purely for love become a main thing in the 20th century? Does anyone know the history?

It actually started around 300 years ago, but gained more and more influence until the mid 19th century.  At that point, it was mostly about love in western society and has continued to expand into other cultures and societies in the 20th century.  This change in the view of Marriage has also given rise that we are all allowed to marry whomever because of WHO or WHAT we love (hence why Gay Marriage is accepted in our modern world, where it would not have been a valid reason or valid idea in centuries prior to this).

[JohnsonJones]

16 hours ago, anatess2 said:

I really dislike the phrase "Fall in love".  It's like you're walking down the road, stumble on a rock, and fall in love.  You don't fall in love - this is the mistake of many divorced people, because of course, if you can fall into it, you can fall out of it.  YOU CHOOSE to love.

Isn't the opposite of fall...climb or ascend?

However, in regards to falling in love...

Depends on how deep the pit is.

If you fall deep enough, there is NO climbing out of that one. 

I fell pretty deep.  Glad of it too.  Just hope it's deep and steep enough that my wife can't climb out of it.

 

[anatess2]

16 hours ago, Mike said:

In the context we're discussing I think I share your opinion about choosing whom to love.  On the other hand I'm something of a romantic. In a romantic context I kind of like the feeling.

How is Fall in Love romantic?  Accidents are not romantic.

Choosing to love is, in itself, romantic.  Having somebody choose to love you back... now, that's the mother of all romantic.  Choosing to love somebody who chooses not to love you back... now, that's Shakespearean romantic.

Edited April 20, 2017 by anatess2

[wenglund]

On 4/18/2017 at 11:17 AM, Zarahemla said:

 I pray I can find a girl and marry in this life.

If I had to do it all over again, and I could go back to being 31, I would change my whole approach to getting married. Instead of looking for a great catch and to fall in love, I would focus on becoming a great catch--i.e. someone who can well provide temporal, emotional, and spiritual security.

If you are insecure and somewhat needy or dependent (emotionally or otherwise) and vocationally challenged, it would be very difficult to attract a non-codependent woman regardless how much you weigh (I was fit and had less than 5% body fat when I was 31). Whereas, if you genuinely feel and exude confidence and capability, and have a strong sense of self and direction, and you are kind and emotionally available,  body weight isn't that big of a factor--except in how it raises some security questions in terms of strength, will power, and longevity. 

I hope this helps.

Thanks, -Wade Englund-.   

 

[runewell]

On 4/17/2017 at 8:21 PM, Zarahemla said:

Thanks. Basically also a big message I got is if I have these feelings for it about the next life only which I only feel positive about it for me for the next life then don't worry about it for the rest of this life unless the Lord and prophet command it.

Feelings are no guarantee of truth, so tread carefully.

Edited April 20, 2017 by runewell

[mordorbund]

55 minutes ago, runewell said:

Feelings are no guarantee of truth, so tread carefully.

Since this is in the LDS Gospel Discussion, how well do you think this sentiment aligns with LDS thought?

[Guest]

1 hour ago, wenglund said:

If I had to do it all over again, and I could go back to being 31, I would change my whole approach to getting married. Instead of looking for a great catch and to fall in love, I would focus on becoming a great catch--i.e. someone who can well provide temporal, emotional, and spiritual security.

If you are insecure and somewhat needy or dependent (emotionally or otherwise) and vocationally challenged, it would be very difficult to attract a non-codependent woman regardless how much you weigh (I was fit and had less than 5% body fat when I was 31). Whereas, if you genuinely feel and exude confidence and capability, and have a strong sense of self and direction, and you are kind and emotionally available,  body weight isn't that big of a factor--except in how it raises some security questions in terms of strength, will power, and longevity. 

I hope this helps.

Thanks, -Wade Englund-.   

 

I love the advice you give to work on being a better catch myself. I will take that advice and I appreciate it.

[Mike]

4 hours ago, anatess2 said:

How is Fall in Love romantic?  Accidents are not romantic.

Choosing to love is, in itself, romantic.  Having somebody choose to love you back... now, that's the mother of all romantic.  Choosing to love somebody who chooses not to love you back... now, that's Shakespearean romantic.

Hahaha. I'm not even talking about unrequited love as you are in the context of Shakespeare. For me so much that's joyful in this life, especially love, is an accident as in unexpected at the time of its arrival. I'm talking, my dear, about a wonderful feeling, a sensation, a delight in every good and wholesome sense of those words. I understand that the connotation (of falling) you're dwelling on is negative, but I choose a happy one like falling into a feather bed, or falling into a clean, cold mountain lake on a hot summer day. Or falling back into tall grass in a field of wild flowers with their aromas delighting me, and looking back at the shapes of clouds in the blue sky with the sounds of bees and songs of birds all around me. And that (for me) only scratches the surface in my feeble effort to describe it. Since God apparently made me a physical being in a physical world, I laughingly took all those physical sensations and came up smiling--that's how it was for me anyways not caring whether it sounds corny to anyone else.  

 

[anatess2]

23 minutes ago, Mike said:

Hahaha. I'm not even talking about unrequited love as you are in the context of Shakespeare. For me so much that's joyful in this life, especially love, is an accident as in unexpected at the time of its arrival. I'm talking, my dear, about a wonderful feeling, a sensation, a delight in every good and wholesome sense of those words. I understand that the connotation (of falling) you're dwelling on is negative, but I choose a happy one like falling into a feather bed, or falling into a clean, cold mountain lake on a hot summer day. Or falling back into tall grass in a field of wild flowers with their aromas delighting me, and looking back at the shapes of clouds in the blue sky with the sounds of bees and songs of birds all around me. And that (for me) only scratches the surface in my feeble effort to describe it. Since God apparently made me a physical being in a physical world, I laughingly took all those physical sensations and came up smiling--that's how it was for me anyways not caring whether it sounds corny to anyone else.  

 

Well, this is how it happened for me.  I was in a club - yes, that club with the loud music and dancing and alcohol and smoke and men trying to pick up women and women trying to pick up men, most likely for one-night-stands... that club.  I was with a friend from the Philippines who loves dancing and the only dancing place in town is... that kind of club.  So, I took him there.

Then these twin towers walk into the club.  I was in the middle of the dance floor and I happened to look up and I see this blond guy who was head and shoulders above everybody else whose hair glowed under the black light.  His companion who was just as tall as he was had black hair so he disappeared under the black light.  I shouted over the loud music to my friend who I was dancing with - "I just saw the guy I am going to marry".  That's not what I call "falling in love".  That's what I call "choosing to love".  I chose it.  Because of some spiritual connection that I cannot quite explain.  It's not something uncontrollable.  It's not something I had no choice over.  It's not something I felt because... biology.  No.  I saw a guy.  I felt a spiritual connection.  I decided to love him.  Instantaneously.  Of course, if that tall blonde dude happen to be some satanic ritualist who eats babies for breakfast after I got to know him better, I would choose not to marry him.  I might still choose to love him, as I take the commandment to love others seriously and that spiritual connection compelled me to do so, but it won't be as my spouse.

Edited April 20, 2017 by anatess2

[NeuroTypical]

So, what happened to the guy's companion?  5th wheels and back seaters like me demand to know!

[anatess2]

17 minutes ago, NeuroTypical said:

So, what happened to the guy's companion?  5th wheels and back seaters like me demand to know!

Well, that guy happened to work at a video game arcade so I ended up taking all my friends there every time we watch a movie.  So he got all these single ladies wanting to be super nice to him so he'll give them bonus prizes or bonus tokens.  And he was a good Italian Catholic boy who is taking care of his mama so my friends preferred him to the blonde inactive Mormon.  Alas, he ended up joining the military, went to Afghanistan and Iraq, had some PTSD issues when he came home that caused him to drown himself in alcohol.  He got married in-between tours, my husband was his best man, his wife left him though when he became an alcoholic.  Just goes to show even Catholics get divorced these days...

Edited April 20, 2017 by anatess2

[Mike]

39 minutes ago, anatess2 said:

 ... "I just saw the guy I am going to marry".  ...

You know what? That part of our experiences was similar. When I walked into the room I saw her slouched back on a sofa tossing grapes up into the air and into her mouth. I wouldn't call it a voice, and I didn't say anything to my friends. But the words came into my mind that I would marry her. So, my friend, you and I can relate after all.

 

[anatess2]

Just now, Mike said:

You know what? That part of our experiences was similar. When I walked into the room I saw her slouched back on a sofa tossing grapes up into the air and into her mouth. I wouldn't call it a voice, and I didn't say anything to my friends. But the words came into my mind that I would marry her. So, my friend, you and I can relate after all.

 

Of course we can.  You just have a strange way of putting it.