A Bishop by any other name...

[seashmore]

Twofold post here...

1. When you see your bishop/branch president/stake president out an about (say at the grocery store), what do you call him? Or anyone else at church who you normally address as Sister or Brother Lastname? Genuinely curious.

2. A lot of the youth in my branch call leaders by their first name, including the branch president. He's a  pretty laid back guy (and three of the youth are his) so I don't think it bothers him enough to reprimand anyone about it, but it bothers me. I feel it displays a lack of respect not only for the person, but for the office that he holds. I'm using the "What Does it Mean to Take Upon Myself the Name of Christ?" outline this Sunday, and plan to ask them to apply the answers to how they treat others who we know have also taken Christ's name upon them. If everyone puts on His jersey when they get baptized, shouldn't we treat our teammates with respect?

[Vort]

28 minutes ago, seashmore said:

1. When you see your bishop/branch president/stake president out an about (say at the grocery store), what do you call him? Or anyone else at church who you normally address as Sister or Brother Lastname? Genuinely curious.

I generally always call the bishop "Bishop", even in social situations, unless it would be inappropriate. A previous bishop of mine worked at the company I was at, and on the (rare) occasions I saw him at work, I would call him "Mike". (Which was bizarre, because his name was Jerry.) (Not really.)

30 minutes ago, seashmore said:

2. A lot of the youth in my branch call leaders by their first name, including the branch president. He's a  pretty laid back guy (and three of the youth are his) so I don't think it bothers him enough to reprimand anyone about it, but it bothers me. I feel it displays a lack of respect not only for the person, but for the office that he holds. I'm using the "What Does it Mean to Take Upon Myself the Name of Christ?" outline this Sunday, and plan to ask them to apply the answers to how they treat others who we know have also taken Christ's name upon them. If everyone puts on His jersey when they get baptized, shouldn't we treat our teammates with respect?

Interesting topic, with a definite generational aspect. I encourage young men and women to call me Brother Vort. Now, I'm in my mid-fifties, so that might not be too strange, but I've been doing that since I got married at 25. My feeling was and is that youth need to show me respect, not for my sake, but for theirs. They need to nurture respect for their elders, even if (as they often believe) they're smarter than their elders. My bishop now is younger than I am by probably twelve or fourteen years; he was just going on a mission when we moved into the ward with our (at that time) two children. Yet I always call him "Bishop", because I want him to know (and want to constantly remind myself) that he has that mantle of authority, and I respect both the mantle and the man who carries it. I feel better about things when I do that, and I want the youth to have that same opportunity to feel that way.

[Fether]

59 minutes ago, seashmore said:

Twofold post here...

1. When you see your bishop/branch president/stake president out an about (say at the grocery store), what do you call him? Or anyone else at church who you normally address as Sister or Brother Lastname? Genuinely curious.

2. A lot of the youth in my branch call leaders by their first name, including the branch president. He's a  pretty laid back guy (and three of the youth are his) so I don't think it bothers him enough to reprimand anyone about it, but it bothers me. I feel it displays a lack of respect not only for the person, but for the office that he holds. I'm using the "What Does it Mean to Take Upon Myself the Name of Christ?" outline this Sunday, and plan to ask them to apply the answers to how they treat others who we know have also taken Christ's name upon them. If everyone puts on His jersey when they get baptized, shouldn't we treat our teammates with respect?

1. Always bishop or president 'last name'. 

2. Think of it this way. His title wasn't something he chose. It wasn't something he was given by some virtue he possessed. It was placed upon him by someone great and it is a responsibility to be greater than one will ever become. I don't know that anyone has the authority to ask others to call them by anything other than what their calling asks them to.

Much like a rank in the army, the address the calling, not the man.

I also believe the only two callings that supersede any church calling is husband/wife/Hubbie/MyMidnightMoonBeam/WhateverPetNameYouHave and father/mother

am I wrong?

My question is this. Is there ever a time that it is more appropriate to refer to your spouse by their calling? Maybe during a Ward council meeting or while speaking in general conference and your spouse is a president of a presiding quorum?

(clarification: I believe God loves us more than he loves the calling, but one's title of bishop supersedes one's desire to not be called bishop. The title does not exist virtue of the person, nor does the person have control over the title, but is a trust placed upon them by the Lord)

Edited July 19, 2017 by Fether

[Jane_Doe]

1.  For me, if I saw him just randomly, "Bishop".  Now if we were in the military together then it would be "Private" (or whatever rank).  If it's a familiar peer situation (like our kids are on the same soccer team), then "Bob".  At church: always "Bishop".

2.  I agree that titles should be used for respect.  I recently was called to Achievement Days, and had a soul pondering moment of whether I was to be "Jane" or "Sister Doe" to the girls.  "Sister Doe" works much better: we can still be friendly, but I am in charge, and respect makes everyone's day easier. 

[Bad Karma]

I agree with Vort, I call the Bishop "Bishop". 

[Guest]

10 hours ago, seashmore said:

Twofold post here...

1. When you see your bishop/branch president/stake president out an about (say at the grocery store), what do you call him? Or anyone else at church who you normally address as Sister or Brother Lastname? Genuinely curious.

2. A lot of the youth in my branch call leaders by their first name, including the branch president. He's a  pretty laid back guy (and three of the youth are his) so I don't think it bothers him enough to reprimand anyone about it, but it bothers me. I feel it displays a lack of respect not only for the person, but for the office that he holds. I'm using the "What Does it Mean to Take Upon Myself the Name of Christ?" outline this Sunday, and plan to ask them to apply the answers to how they treat others who we know have also taken Christ's name upon them. If everyone puts on His jersey when they get baptized, shouldn't we treat our teammates with respect?

1. I think I could count on one hand the number of times I actually saw a member of my ward while I was out and about.
2. I would still call the Bishop "Bishop" if it were a casual setting.  If it were at work, I might call him "Bishop" at introductions.  But at all other times, I'd address him by what is normal for the setting.
3. In my current ward, I know virtually everyone by last name only.  I think I know about 6 or 7 men by their first name and two or three women by their first name.  It's not that we're not friendly.  We are.  We even organized an ad-hoc campout when the ward campout got rained out.  We had a campfire and we sang.  We told stories.  We're a pretty tight ward.  But for some reason, I just don't address them by their first names.  It's just never been a thing.

[NeuroTypical]

In general, I'm with Vort and all.  

But there is an exception: If you ever want to make someone smile ear to ear, call a newly-released bishop "brother [firstname]".  It recognizes the joy they're feeling at having the weight of responsibility over the ward lifted off their shoulders. 

When our Stake President was released and given some clerk calling, he came by my ward one week.  I said "hi there, random brother of no particular consequence or stewardship".  He was a short man, but he looked a good five inches taller with the burden of an entire stake off his shoulders.  

I mean, going forward I call them Bishop so-and-so and President whatsisname.  But that golden week of freshly-released freedom is a nice thing to celebrate with someone.

[seashmore]

12 hours ago, Jane_Doe said:

1.  For me, if I saw him just randomly, "Bishop".  Now if we were in the military together then it would be "Private" (or whatever rank).  If it's a familiar peer situation (like our kids are on the same soccer team), then "Bob".  At church: always "Bishop".

2.  I agree that titles should be used for respect.  I recently was called to Achievement Days, and had a soul pondering moment of whether I was to be "Jane" or "Sister Doe" to the girls.  "Sister Doe" works much better: we can still be friendly, but I am in charge, and respect makes everyone's day easier. 

The first line of thinking came about because my branch president was a patron at my place of employment. As he was leaving, he started calling me "Sister Seashmore," but kind of changed his mind halfway through the first syllable and switched to my first name. Mormons are a minority here, so I think he switched because he didn't want to create any awkwardness for me.  (He didn't know that even if it had, it wouldn't bother me.)

I love what you said about respect making things easier.

@NeuroTypical I had a Bishop in a YSA ward who addressed everyone by last name. His wife referred to him as Bishop whenever in the presence of ward members, even at home. I thought it was absolutely adorable. But they're pretty much my favorite couple in the universe, anyway.

[my two cents]

I rarely see anyone from church in public but would probably still stick with the titles.

There was an article about addressing each other properly and why it matters. I'll see if I can find it in a bit unless someone beats me to it.  

@NeuroTypical - fyi - After our last bishop was released, he made it very clear that still being called Bishop _______ bothered him and was not appropriate once that mantle was given to someone else.

[Fether]

38 minutes ago, my two cents said:

was not appropriate once that mantle was given to someone else.

It is fully appropriate

[Guest MormonGator]

1 hour ago, seashmore said:

But they're pretty much my favorite couple in the universe, anyway.

What, @LadyGator and I no longer hold that title? Ouch! 

I've only had two bishops. One asked to be called by his first name, the other never mentioned it. I don't really address him, come to think of it. 

Edited July 19, 2017 by MormonGator

[seashmore]

5 hours ago, MormonGator said:

What, @LadyGator and I no longer hold that title? Ouch! 

I've only had two bishops. One asked to be called by his first name, the other never mentioned it. I don't really address him, come to think of it. 

You're a close second. It's just hard to beat feeding me for two Thanksgivings and a Christmas.

[my two cents]

20 hours ago, seashmore said:

2. A lot of the youth in my branch call leaders by their first name, including the branch president. He's a  pretty laid back guy (and three of the youth are his) so I don't think it bothers him enough to reprimand anyone about it, but it bothers me. I feel it displays a lack of respect not only for the person, but for the office that he holds. I'm using the "What Does it Mean to Take Upon Myself the Name of Christ?" outline this Sunday, and plan to ask them to apply the answers to how they treat others who we know have also taken Christ's name upon them. If everyone puts on His jersey when they get baptized, shouldn't we treat our teammates with respect?

Two times this was addressed: New Era > To the Point > Sep 08, Mar 11