Last Days' Timeline

[Vort]

1 hour ago, askandanswer said:

I've always been a little puzzled about the fact that the Nephites, but not the Jews, were given a definite time, on several occasions, about when Christ would come, but we in the latter-days are given less specific possibilities. 

I suspect that certain of the Jews were given the same prophecies. That we have no record of such knowledge doesn't mean it wasn't present among the Jews of some prior period.

[Ironhold]

5 hours ago, Vort said:

I suspect that certain of the Jews were given the same prophecies. That we have no record of such knowledge doesn't mean it wasn't present among the Jews of some prior period.

Also, the leadership at the time was convinced that the Messiah would be a high-born military leader who would overthrow Roman rule and enshrine them as the powers-that-be. 

So they pretty clearly misread what prophecies they did have. 

[Kurtis]

On 5/30/2023 at 9:25 AM, Maverick said:

The only definitive timeframe that we have been given is that the Lord’s return is very near, even at the doors. 

From my studies I have concluded that there are still quite a few things that need to happen before the Lord’s return in glory in the clouds of heaven. My current belief is that something major is going to happen to really set things in motion and then most of the prophesied events that still need to happen will occur in pretty rapid succession.

The nagging question that I have is what exactly is next on the horizon for the church and the world at large? There are many events still to come, but what is next? 

Ezra Taft Benson once gave a talk entitled “Prepare for the days of Tribulation." 
https://www.churchofjesuschrist.org/study/general-conference/1980/10/prepare-for-the-days-of-tribulation?lang=eng

Is the tribulation of the saints as prophesied in Revelation, Daniel, Isaiah, and other places in the scriptures what comes next, or are there still other things that will precede it?

The Days of Tribulations is actually 7 years. Divided into 2 sections of 3.5 years each. They are not just for LDS or Jews but will affect the whole world. I believe that the middle or dividing point will be the "collapsing of the worlds economy" (except for communist countries who control there own financial situation). Quickly followed by the shaking of the earth. 

Many of the prophesied last day events will take place during the days of tribulation, Mostly in the last half. Great apostacy, World wide event with people of all religions turning from God. Mormon Exodus to Missouri to build the Temple.  Gathering of Israel. Jews to Old Jerusalem. Lost Tribes to New Jerusalem in Missouri.  U. S. A. being invaded by Russia (East Coast) & China (West Coast). Drought. Pandemics, People dying like flies. Cleansing of most wicked people. 

[Kurtis]

On 6/4/2023 at 12:11 AM, Vort said:

I suspect that certain of the Jews were given the same prophecies. That we have no record of such knowledge doesn't mean it wasn't present among the Jews of some prior period.

The book of Isaiah was specifically written for the Jews. It is all about the Jews rejecting Christ. Gospel being taken from the Israelites and given to the Gentiles. Prophecies about the second coming. The turmoil Jews would encounter from Christs first coming to his second coming. Fascinating read. Gospel will be given back to Israelites after the Gentiles reject Christ. 

[Maverick]

On 11/9/2024 at 11:25 PM, Kurtis said:

The Days of Tribulations is actually 7 years. Divided into 2 sections of 3.5 years each. They are not just for LDS or Jews but will affect the whole world. I believe that the middle or dividing point will be the "collapsing of the worlds economy" (except for communist countries who control there own financial situation). Quickly followed by the shaking of the earth. 

Many of the prophesied last day events will take place during the days of tribulation, Mostly in the last half. Great apostacy, World wide event with people of all religions turning from God. Mormon Exodus to Missouri to build the Temple.  Gathering of Israel. Jews to Old Jerusalem. Lost Tribes to New Jerusalem in Missouri.  U. S. A. being invaded by Russia (East Coast) & China (West Coast). Drought. Pandemics, People dying like flies. Cleansing of most wicked people. 

I have very similar views. I agree that the tribulation/destruction period is 7 years, broken up into 2 3.5 year periods. My current understanding is that the first 3.5 years are the last 3.5 years of the 6th seal and the second 3.5 years the first 3.5 years of the 7th seal. 

I also see the U.S. being invaded by China, Russia, and nations allied with them. The empire created by this alliance will conquer the whole world and make war on the saints in particular and overcome them. 

But the righteous remnant will escape and build the New Jerusalem and the less righteous who survive the 3.5 years tribulation will eventually join them during the 3.5 year destruction period. 

[laronius]

8 hours ago, Maverick said:

 

I also see the U.S. being invaded by China, Russia, and nations allied with them. The empire created by this alliance will conquer the whole world and make war on the saints in particular and overcome them. 

 

Do you have any scriptural or reliable prophetic evidence for the US being invaded? It's a common belief among a certain segment of the LDS population but I don't know that I've ever seen any credible support for it.

[Maverick]

43 minutes ago, laronius said:

Do you have any scriptural or reliable prophetic evidence for the US being invaded? It's a common belief among a certain segment of the LDS population but I don't know that I've ever seen any credible support for it.

There are many allusions to it in the scriptures and from Latter-day prophets.  For example:

”The “Horn” made war with the Saints and overcame them, until the Ancient of Days came; judgment was given to the Saints of the Most High from the Ancient of Days; the time came that the Saints possessed the Kingdom.” (TPJS, 159)

17These great beasts, which are four, are four kings, which shall arise out of the earth.

18But the saints of the most High shall take the kingdom, and possess the kingdom for ever, even for ever and ever.

19Then I would know the truth of the fourth beast, which was diverse from all the others, exceeding dreadful, whose teeth were of iron, and his nails of brass; which devoured, brake in pieces, and stamped the residue with his feet;

20And of the ten horns that were in his head, and of the other which came up, and before whom three fell; even of that horn that had eyes, and a mouth that spake very great things, whose look was more stout than his fellows.

21I beheld, and the same horn made war with the saints, and prevailed against them;

22Until the Ancient of days came, and judgment was given to the saints of the most High; and the time came that the saints possessed the kingdom.

23Thus he said, The fourth beast shall be the fourth kingdom upon earth, which shall be diverse from all kingdoms, and shall devour the whole earth, and shall tread it down, and break it in pieces.

24And the ten horns out of this kingdom are ten kings that shall arise: and another shall rise after them; and he shall be diverse from the first, and he shall subdue three kings.

25And he shall speak great words against the most High, and shall wear out the saints of the most High, and think to change times and laws: and they shall be given into his hand until a time and times and the dividing of time.

26But the judgment shall sit, and they shall take away his dominion, to consume and to destroy it unto the end.

27And the kingdom and dominion, and the greatness of the kingdom under the whole heaven, shall be given to the people of the saints of the most High, whose kingdom is an everlasting kingdom, and all dominions shall serve and obey him. (Daniel 7) 

3Then I lifted up mine eyes, and saw, and, behold, there stood before the river a ram which had two horns: and the two horns were high; but one was higher than the other, and the higher came up last.

4I saw the ram pushing westward, and northward, and southward; so that no beasts might stand before him, neither was there any that could deliver out of his hand; but he did according to his will, and became great.

5And as I was considering, behold, an he goat came from the west on the face of the whole earth, and touched not the ground: and the goat had a notable horn between his eyes.

6And he came to the ram that had two horns, which I had seen standing before the river, and ran unto him in the fury of his power.

7And I saw him come close unto the ram, and he was moved with choler against him, and smote the ram, and brake his two horns: and there was no power in the ram to stand before him, but he cast him down to the ground, and stamped upon him: and there was none that could deliver the ram out of his hand.

8Therefore the he goat waxed very great: and when he was strong, the great horn was broken; and for it came up four notable ones toward the four winds of heaven.

9And out of one of them came forth a little horn, which waxed exceeding great, toward the south, and toward the east, and toward the pleasant land.

10And it waxed great, even to the host of heaven; and it cast down some of the host and of the stars to the ground, and stamped upon them.

11Yea, he magnified himself even to the prince of the host, and by him the daily sacrifice was taken away, and the place of his sanctuary was cast down.

12And an host was given him against the daily sacrifice by reason of transgression, and it cast down the truth to the ground; and it practised, and prospered.

13¶ Then I heard one saint speaking, and another saint said unto that certain saint which spake, How long shall be the vision concerning the daily sacrifice, and the transgression of desolation, to give both the sanctuary and the host to be trodden under foot?

14And he said unto me, Unto two thousand and three hundred days; then shall the sanctuary be cleansed.

15¶ And it came to pass, when I, even I Daniel, had seen the vision, and sought for the meaning, then, behold, there stood before me as the appearance of a man.

16And I heard a man’s voice between the banks of Ulai, which called, and said, Gabriel, make this man to understand the vision.

17So he came near where I stood: and when he came, I was afraid, and fell upon my face: but he said unto me, Understand, O son of man: for at the time of the end shall be the vision.

18Now as he was speaking with me, I was in a deep sleep on my face toward the ground: but he touched me, and set me upright.

19And he said, Behold, I will make thee know what shall be in the last end of the indignation: for at the time appointed the end shall be.

20The ram which thou sawest having two horns are the kings of Media and Persia.

21And the rough goat is the king of Grecia: and the great horn that is between his eyes is the first king.

22Now that being broken, whereas four stood up for it, four kingdoms shall stand up out of the nation, but not in his power.

23And in the latter time of their kingdom, when the transgressors are come to the full, a king of fierce countenance, and understanding dark sentences, shall stand up.

24And his power shall be mighty, but not by his own power: and he shall destroy wonderfully, and shall prosper, and practise, and shall destroy the mighty and the holy people.

25And through his policy also he shall cause craft to prosper in his hand; and he shall magnify himself in his heart, and by peace shall destroy many: he shall also stand up against the Prince of princes; but he shall be broken without hand. (Daniel 8

In the last days a wicked empire, led by the little “horn” is formed that conquers the entire earth, including the Saints of God. The whole earth includes the United States. 

The Saints remain in his power until the Ancient of Days (Adam/Michael) comes and sits in Adam-ondi-Ahman (in Missouri) and the horn is defeated. 

It’s possible that a leader of the United States turns out to be the head of this last empire who conquers the whole earth, but that isn’t really any better. For the Saints that would be like being a Jew living in Nazi Germany rather than in nations conquered by the Nazis. 

Edited December 1, 2024 by Maverick

[laronius]

43 minutes ago, Maverick said:

There are many allusions to it in the scriptures and from Latter-day prophets.  For example:

”The “Horn” made war with the Saints and overcame them, until the Ancient of Days came; judgment was given to the Saints of the Most High from the Ancient of Days; the time came that the Saints possessed the Kingdom.” (TPJS, 159)

17These great beasts, which are four, are four kings, which shall arise out of the earth.

18But the saints of the most High shall take the kingdom, and possess the kingdom for ever, even for ever and ever.

19Then I would know the truth of the fourth beast, which was diverse from all the others, exceeding dreadful, whose teeth were of iron, and his nails of brass; which devoured, brake in pieces, and stamped the residue with his feet;

20And of the ten horns that were in his head, and of the other which came up, and before whom three fell; even of that horn that had eyes, and a mouth that spake very great things, whose look was more stout than his fellows.

21I beheld, and the same horn made war with the saints, and prevailed against them;

22Until the Ancient of days came, and judgment was given to the saints of the most High; and the time came that the saints possessed the kingdom.

23Thus he said, The fourth beast shall be the fourth kingdom upon earth, which shall be diverse from all kingdoms, and shall devour the whole earth, and shall tread it down, and break it in pieces.

24And the ten horns out of this kingdom are ten kings that shall arise: and another shall rise after them; and he shall be diverse from the first, and he shall subdue three kings.

25And he shall speak great words against the most High, and shall wear out the saints of the most High, and think to change times and laws: and they shall be given into his hand until a time and times and the dividing of time.

26But the judgment shall sit, and they shall take away his dominion, to consume and to destroy it unto the end.

27And the kingdom and dominion, and the greatness of the kingdom under the whole heaven, shall be given to the people of the saints of the most High, whose kingdom is an everlasting kingdom, and all dominions shall serve and obey him. (Daniel 7) 

3Then I lifted up mine eyes, and saw, and, behold, there stood before the river a ram which had two horns: and the two horns were high; but one was higher than the other, and the higher came up last.

4I saw the ram pushing westward, and northward, and southward; so that no beasts might stand before him, neither was there any that could deliver out of his hand; but he did according to his will, and became great.

5And as I was considering, behold, an he goat came from the west on the face of the whole earth, and touched not the ground: and the goat had a notable horn between his eyes.

6And he came to the ram that had two horns, which I had seen standing before the river, and ran unto him in the fury of his power.

7And I saw him come close unto the ram, and he was moved with choler against him, and smote the ram, and brake his two horns: and there was no power in the ram to stand before him, but he cast him down to the ground, and stamped upon him: and there was none that could deliver the ram out of his hand.

8Therefore the he goat waxed very great: and when he was strong, the great horn was broken; and for it came up four notable ones toward the four winds of heaven.

9And out of one of them came forth a little horn, which waxed exceeding great, toward the south, and toward the east, and toward the pleasant land.

10And it waxed great, even to the host of heaven; and it cast down some of the host and of the stars to the ground, and stamped upon them.

11Yea, he magnified himself even to the prince of the host, and by him the daily sacrifice was taken away, and the place of his sanctuary was cast down.

12And an host was given him against the daily sacrifice by reason of transgression, and it cast down the truth to the ground; and it practised, and prospered.

13¶ Then I heard one saint speaking, and another saint said unto that certain saint which spake, How long shall be the vision concerning the daily sacrifice, and the transgression of desolation, to give both the sanctuary and the host to be trodden under foot?

14And he said unto me, Unto two thousand and three hundred days; then shall the sanctuary be cleansed.

15¶ And it came to pass, when I, even I Daniel, had seen the vision, and sought for the meaning, then, behold, there stood before me as the appearance of a man.

16And I heard a man’s voice between the banks of Ulai, which called, and said, Gabriel, make this man to understand the vision.

17So he came near where I stood: and when he came, I was afraid, and fell upon my face: but he said unto me, Understand, O son of man: for at the time of the end shall be the vision.

18Now as he was speaking with me, I was in a deep sleep on my face toward the ground: but he touched me, and set me upright.

19And he said, Behold, I will make thee know what shall be in the last end of the indignation: for at the time appointed the end shall be.

20The ram which thou sawest having two horns are the kings of Media and Persia.

21And the rough goat is the king of Grecia: and the great horn that is between his eyes is the first king.

22Now that being broken, whereas four stood up for it, four kingdoms shall stand up out of the nation, but not in his power.

23And in the latter time of their kingdom, when the transgressors are come to the full, a king of fierce countenance, and understanding dark sentences, shall stand up.

24And his power shall be mighty, but not by his own power: and he shall destroy wonderfully, and shall prosper, and practise, and shall destroy the mighty and the holy people.

25And through his policy also he shall cause craft to prosper in his hand; and he shall magnify himself in his heart, and by peace shall destroy many: he shall also stand up against the Prince of princes; but he shall be broken without hand. (Daniel 8

In the last days a wicked empire, led by the little “horn” is formed that conquers the entire earth, including the Saints of God. The whole earth includes the United States. 

The Saints remain in his power until the Ancient of Days (Adam/Michael) comes and sits in Adam-ondi-Ahman (in Missouri) and the horn is defeated. 

It’s possible that a leader of the United States turns out to be the head of this last empire who conquers the whole earth, but that isn’t really any better. For the Saints that would be like being a Jew living in Nazi Germany rather than in nations conquered by the Nazis. 

It definitely alludes to something happening. I was just curious about your specific interpretation of it.