Accomplice to Murder

[the_jason]

It sounds like her life is screwed up regardless. She sure could use the peace of knowing she saved a life, at least.

[SmilingRedhead]

Funky, my heart is aching for both you and your friend and my brain is ticking faster than ever to try to think of anything that would at all help save this unborn child and your friend from making what might be the worst decision of her life - and for you to not have this play on your mind forever were you to go with her...

As PC said...:

If your friend is still open to suggestions, see if there isn't an alternative pregnancy counseling center in your area. The ones that are pro-life often offer support--including finance and housing--to mothers who want to keep their babies (or adopt them out), but who's families cut them off. Time may be short, but maybe she'll wait a few days, if there is another way?

I really strongly believe what he says is a really good choice. As you already said, the dad would disown her if he ever found out regardless of keeping the baby or not - and things like this have a way of coming out so it's probably inevitable that he will find out... Killing a baby so as to not lose a place to live and be without money is not the answer. There is support out there! She is definately not the only girl in this kind of situation. I really truly believe she should not go ahead with the abortion. This is my opinion and I know Heavenly Father would not want this to happen either. There is a better solution to this situation - it's just not obvious what the solution is at the moment - all we know is that the wrong solution would be to kill the baby.

Perhaps this can help?

Crisis Pregnancy Support - Support, Getting, Important, Resources

or

LDS, Mormon Adoption - Agencies, Services, Parents, Forums. LDS, Mormon Adoptions

If she is adamant that she will be going then the decision lies with you whether you will support her or not. I can't tell you what to do - only what I would do...

If I was in your situation I would (as I know you have) tell her how I feel about abortions from my personal and religious standpoints. I would tell her that although I care about her as a friend I just cannot be a part of this moral crime. I would not be able to go with her but I would be there as a shoulder to cry on in the days/weeks/months after because she would most likely be very upset. I would still not be condoning what she has done but I'm not shunning the 'sinner' either.

It would be the same if a friend wanted me to come stealing with them to get food and supplies for their starving baby and family. Crime is not the solution - whether moral crime or legal crime. There is always someone out there who can help.

I know it's a cliche but what would Jesus do in this situation? That's something I would consider.

Funky, it must be such an awful time for you. I really hope that you can come to a decision that you can be at peace with.

~SmilingRedhead~

[prisonchaplain]

She has to go to a special clinic...that will do the abortion this late..in her 4th month. They only do the abortions on fridays...and this is the last friday that it is legal to have the procedure.

there isnt any time...she does it tomorrow..or she doesnt. no more time to think.

How sad. Well, if this isn't too late, here's a website with options. Abortion Risks - Risks of Abortion Procedures

In any case, be her friend, extend God's mercy. If you've shared your heart with her, she'll not be confused by your presence, only grateful that despite disagreeing, you stuck by her.

[funkyfool]

well, i just talked with her.

she seems more sure than ever that she wants the abortion. She talked me as though it was nothing, just as routine as going to the store or something.

i kinda liked it better when she thought what she was doing was wrong and sounded sad about it.

Thanks for the links PC and Redhead.

not sure what else can come from this thread.

ill tell her how i feel tomorrow morning. Im pretty sure she'll still stick with the abortion, and ill go with her in that case.

ill just feel like crap afterwards. Guess i cant complain too much cause i know that she'll feel worse.

[Canuck Mormon]

Ultimately she's the one who will have to answer for what she did.

Good Luck.

[Alaskagain]

I am going to be pretty straightforward here. (And the paragraphs probably aren't in the right order, but I really don't care about the rules of prose at this point. )

She is under 18. She is using an illegal ID to obtain an illegal abortion.

If you cannot convince her that this is not the right thing to do, you can go to the clinic with her, and as she is filling out forms, say in a LOUD voice "Oh, you are using THAT ID? Where did you buy that?", or you can say in a quiet voice to the administrator "She is 17 years old, and has a fake ID."

You can choose not to go with her, and call the clinic and say "She has an appointment at 9:00 am. She is saying she is 18, but she is not, she has a fake ID."

Maybe it won't change a thing; perhaps the clinic administrators will not care if she is using a fake ID. But maybe it will. Maybe it will stop it.

You can also talk to your parents, and/or her boyfriend, and/or her parents, tonight, before it is too late.

And what will happen if this event is stopped? She may try to hurt herself so that she will not have the baby. She may have the baby and neglect or abuse it. She may give the baby up for adoption. She may marry her boyfriend and together they may take care of the baby. They might get divorced later. They might stay married 56 years. She may reconcile with her family and they may support her and the baby. She might get a college degree with the help of her family. You do not know which of those things may happen.

Some will say that you have no right to go to such lengths to interfere in her plans. You don't know what she is going through. It is her choice, and her choice alone.

You will have to decide if they are right.

If you take any of these actions, know that she will likely hate you for it. You can ask for her to forgive your "betrayal", and continue to try to help her.

But maybe, after a couple of years of not speaking, she came to you because she knew your beliefs. And maybe she wants someone to help her make the right choice.

Talk to her tonight. Ask her to pray with you.

I have all 3 of you in my prayers.

[jadams_4040]

A few months ago, i started talking to a friend i had not talked to for a couple years. Fairly quickly, i learned that she was feeling down about life and had become preganant at 17 years of age. She told me that i was the only one who she had confided this information in other than her boyfriend..

She and I have had several deep conversations as to what her options are as to what to do with the unborn child. At first, she was utterly opposed to abortion and was sure she wanted to keep the baby. She and her boyfriend even set up a date to get married...but she called it off. I took her to planned parenthood and was there as she received counseling as to all her options available.

A little background information on this girl. She is living with her boyfriend and has poor relations with her parents. Her father does not know she is pregnant but has sworn that if she ever were to be pregnant out of wedlock, that he would basically disown her.

i guess all the background information really isnt taht important at this point.

My friend and i had another very deep discussion about what she should do. Pennsylvania state law will only abort a baby of a woman 18 years or older (or younger with parental consent) within the first trimester. Her first trimester is over and she had to go talk to a counselor and be recommended by this person..in order to get the abortion now...in her 4th month.

Tomorrow morning, my friend wants me to come with her to get the abortion done. She has already said she feels terribly about it..and i can see it in her eyes. We've talked about all of her options. her boyfriend is bitterly opposed to abortion or adoption. He wants to keep the baby. She is also worried about what pepole will say when she starts to show...and being disowned by her family.

I told her, i would go to the abortion clinic with her, if thats really what she wants to do. I keep hoping, she'll change her mind. And it IS her legal right...kinda technically..to have an abortion

She has a fake ID saying she is 18, although she is a minor..but other than that fact, it would be her legal right to get the abortion.

I dont know what im supposed to do. She has no one else to back her up. Her life is falling apart. And for some reason she chose to seek me out and confide in ME as a friend after 2 years of not talking.

I wish there was more i could do. Maybe there is. But its her choice

Im an accomplice to murder...taking my friend to have her baby killed.

what on earth else is there for me to do?

Iv got until tomorow morning to figure it out. Doesnt leave much time for replies on the forum

Yep she will have to live with this the rest of her life, her dad and anybody else will get over it, i used too be a dad that said the same thing, then when it actually happened, things became differant. she can only make this decision once, there aint no goin back!

[funkyfool]

But maybe, after a couple of years of not speaking, she came to you because she knew your beliefs. And maybe she wants someone to help her make the right choice.

Talk to her tonight. Ask her to pray with you.

I have all 3 of you in my prayers.

I dont know what I believe. Iv been a poor example...in the time she has known me.

I do not pray. Maybe tonight i will try.

im goin to bed now though. We will see what tomorrow brings.

[MorningStar]

This is what gets me. Someday she will want a baby. She'll probably have a miscarriage someday and be soooooo upset about it, but as for right now she's treating this like it's no big deal? She's going to have her FOUR MONTH fetus dismembered and treat it like nothing???

Barf.

Alaska, that's a great idea about the fake ID thing. She's just making one bad decision after another.

[Janell]

I am very against abortion as are I'm sure a lot of people on here. I have always felt this tug to learn as much as I could about it. Both in High School and College--if there was a paper that I needed to get done and I could pick the topic--I always went with abortion.

Fast forward a number of years later. I am now married, with a daughter and for some reason we could not get pregnant a second time around. We tried for 2.5 years and nothing happened. My OB is LDS and she always told us to remain positive she as did we--felt there was more behind the real reason we couldn't get pregnant. Now, we did everything short of in vitro to get pregnant. My husband and I never felt right about in vitro.

Fast forward a couple more months. My parents came to Utah and told me they had something they needed to tell my husband and I but wanted to wait. A few days a later they took my husband and I for a drive and told us the following... Through various promptings of the spirit by many different people my dad found himself heading back to Hawaii from a business trip to NZ a week early. The only way for him to return to Hawaii would be for him to fly through Los Angeles. Now, my dad grew up in Southern California so he was looking forward to spending a couple hours with his brother and sister. LONG STORY SHORT--My Aunt informed him that my cousin was pregnant (She's 17) and that there have just been a lot of problems that have risen since learning about the pregnancy. My Aunt did inform my dad that they were seriously considering abortion. My Dad then gave her the number to LDS Family Services in her area and made her promise to give them a call to see what they could offer my cousin.

The goal is/was to keep this child alive. There is no reason this child should need to pay for his birth parent's mistakes with his life.

As my dad is telling my husband and I this story, we both start to cry and continue to do this as he explains to us the train of events that occurred. No words were needed, we knew without a shadow of a doubt that this baby was ours. This is/was the reason we could not get pregnant. After my dad told us, we both went upstairs, got on our knees and thanked the Lord for all our blessings. While we were in pain about not being able to conceive the Lord was smiling because he had a bigger plan for us. My Dad called my aunt the next morning and another train of events happened, but they agreed to let us adopt their son/grandson. I called my OB and she was in tears.

I guess my main point of this story is that I want to encourage you to at least encourage your friend to give LDS Family Services a call or any agency. This innocent child should not have to pay. There are other ways to dealing with an unplanned pregnancy. Had my cousin followed through with her plan, we wouldn't have our son. There is no doubt in our minds that the reason we couldn't get pregnant is because had we gotten pregnant we would not have been open to offer to adopt this child. The lord has blessed us in more ways then we will ever know. There are so many things I am leaving out, but the story behind it all is truly amazing. Our son and everyone else--is sent from Heaven for a purpose. I hope your friend allows her child to see his/her purpose in life.

[EmeraldIsle15]

When I was 15 my best friend, my only friend at the time, confided in me that her father had molested her and her sister. She claimed that he changed, but later on said she feared he had begun doing those same things to her younger sister. I was torn. I felt that I should speak to our bishop and yet, I was her friend and the only person she told. I maintained her confidence for months, but it weighed on me heavily. After many months of struggling with it I finally decided to speak to the bishop. She stopped speaking to me after that, but even now I am certain that I did the right thing. There is a young girl who will not be harmed by her father any longer. It was by no means easy for me, I am quite shy by nature and I feared losing my only real friend. I realized though that I owed it to her and to her sister and be a true friend and do what she needed for me to do rather than what she wanted.

You don't have months to make that decision. You should speak to the people at the clinic and let them know she has a fake I.D. and is underage. Perhaps speak to her mother rather than her father if that's possible. Encourage her boyfriend to be supportive of her especially if her family turns on her. She may be upset with you for awhile, but someday she will be grateful to you for it. A young child will have the opportunity to have a happy and fulfilling life, and I firmly believe when she holds that child she will understand that you are indeed her friend. You and she both will regret it always if you do not do so.

Anways take care and may the Lord bless you and give you the strength you need. Im pulling for ya =)

[Aphrodite]

My Aunt isn't active so it was no surprise that they wanted to have an abortion.

um..Isn't that extremely judgemental? Just because you're not a member does not mean you automatically agree with abortion. Most of the non members I know do not agree with abortion.

I feel for this girl. She obviously has a very rough life and I would not want to be in her shoes for anything. I think she is extremely lucky to have friend like funky fool who wants to support her. I understand peoples strong opinions on abortion but I think some of the self-righteous attitudes that go along with it are disgusting. I dont drink, but I go to bars. Thats not saying I agree with drinking. Applying that logic would mean you never set foot outside your house incase you saw/heard something that was contrary to what you believe.

I believe funky fool is being an amazing friend to this girl. She has clearly explained her thoughts and feelings on abortion, yet she is still wiilling to support her friend's autonomy, rights ands choices even if they differ from her own. Going with her is not supporting abortion, it is supporting her friend in her time of need. Friendship is not, 'I'll support you so long as you do the things I believe in, if not, goodbye' You are there for the best and worst of times.

I have had to nurse a few people who have had abortions. It will affect them for the rest of their lives. I also have a Mother who gave away a baby at 16 years of age. It has devastated her life and had a profound affect on her personality, behaviours, relationships and coping mechanisms. It is not an easy option to give up a baby, it is a devastating life changing decision as is abortion. She will be affected no matter what. I think the whole 'give up your baby and everthing will be ok' mantra is false. In my experience, giving away a baby is more devastating than abortion. Im not pro or anti abortion. It depends on the individual and the situation. Im pro-choice.

I really feel for her.

[WillowTheWhisp]

Everything will never be 'OK' whatever happens now because that time has passed when she got pregnant. However that was her mistake and now the choice she makes will be a hard one and one she will have to live with for the rest of her life. I know I would find it easier to live with myself if I gave that baby an opportunity for life in a family where he or she was longed for and wanted than I would if I deprived the baby of life. I cannot understand why by law we are allowed to kill an unborn baby but if a woman gives birth and then kills the baby she is a murderess.

It's an agonising decision to have to make but I feel that knowing the child was alive and well would be easier to cope with later when hopefully she will be in a permanent relationship and wanting to start a family.

[reveontiveros]

A few months ago, i started talking to a friend i had not talked to for a couple years. Fairly quickly, i learned that she was feeling down about life and had become preganant at 17 years of age. She told me that i was the only one who she had confided this information in other than her boyfriend..

She and I have had several deep conversations as to what her options are as to what to do with the unborn child. At first, she was utterly opposed to abortion and was sure she wanted to keep the baby. She and her boyfriend even set up a date to get married...but she called it off. I took her to planned parenthood and was there as she received counseling as to all her options available.

A little background information on this girl. She is living with her boyfriend and has poor relations with her parents. Her father does not know she is pregnant but has sworn that if she ever were to be pregnant out of wedlock, that he would basically disown her.

i guess all the background information really isnt taht important at this point.

My friend and i had another very deep discussion about what she should do. Pennsylvania state law will only abort a baby of a woman 18 years or older (or younger with parental consent) within the first trimester. Her first trimester is over and she had to go talk to a counselor and be recommended by this person..in order to get the abortion now...in her 4th month.

Tomorrow morning, my friend wants me to come with her to get the abortion done. She has already said she feels terribly about it..and i can see it in her eyes. We've talked about all of her options. her boyfriend is bitterly opposed to abortion or adoption. He wants to keep the baby. She is also worried about what pepole will say when she starts to show...and being disowned by her family.

I told her, i would go to the abortion clinic with her, if thats really what she wants to do. I keep hoping, she'll change her mind. And it IS her legal right...kinda technically..to have an abortion

She has a fake ID saying she is 18, although she is a minor..but other than that fact, it would be her legal right to get the abortion.

I dont know what im supposed to do. She has no one else to back her up. Her life is falling apart. And for some reason she chose to seek me out and confide in ME as a friend after 2 years of not talking.

I wish there was more i could do. Maybe there is. But its her choice

Im an accomplice to murder...taking my friend to have her baby killed.

what on earth else is there for me to do?

Iv got until tomorow morning to figure it out. Doesnt leave much time for replies on the forum

there is many parents out there that would adopt this child. get that threw her head because for real she doesn't know what she getting her self into my mom had abortion with my older brother an she smashes on her self everyday an its been 24 years. have faith in your self an confront her with that facts she might be being a little selfish if she doesn't consider the fact this child of hers could have another wonder life with some other family.

[funkyfool]

From reading some of your posts, IM not sure any of you realize the amount of time she and i have spent talking about her options. and about adoption especially...

The day came today...for the abortion. My friend and I went to the clinic. Her appointment was at 10:30 so we went to the mall before hand. We spent half an hour sitting on a bench in the mall. I again, told her how i felt about it, that it was her choice, id be there as her friend, but what she was doing was wrong. I know she feels like crap, there were a few tears shed. It was emotional just sitting there in the mall. It seemed like every person that walked by was pushing a stroller, or had a young child walking beside them. I know that it got to both of us.

We went to the clinic at 10:30 and had to walk past a group of about a dozen protesters. All holding signs...showing graphic pictures or aborted babies, and yelling at us...calling us murderers...

We had to be escorted in by security.

My heart had sunk so low...

We sat in that waiting room for hours with a number of other women and girls waiting for their turn..

At one moment, my friend got up to use the bathroom....i seized the opportunity..and quietly told the woman working there "my friend is 17, she's using fake identification, i dont want her to know i told you"

so...my friend gets called back..and the woman calls me to a backroom to talk to me as well...while my friend was gone so that she wouldnt know we were speaking. The woman proceeds to tell me that she ran the drivers license through the system as well as her SS# and that they both came back as verifying that she indeed was 18...

i was in shock... told her she was mistaken, because i KNOW for a fact...my friend is 17....and that her identification was fake. I swear, she lied to me.

all this time i can still hear the protesters yelling outside... i felt like crap

My friend is back in the room for over an hour....i was really really beginning to feel...even worse....

Id see one woman go through that door...and a couple hours, come back out after having the abortion..

id count...1dead baby...10 minutes later....2 dead babies....10 minutes later...3 dead babies...

I stopped smoking cigarettes lately, but i was flippin out...so i bummed a cigarette and just sat outside...sick to my stomache, and thankful the protesters had left by this point as it had been nearly 4 hours...

I composed myself..and my emotions, and went back in the building, my friend standing there...

they told her that her baby was too far along and they couldnt perform the abortion at this clinic...but referred her to another clinic that offered the procedure for this later term abortion.... IF she wants to pursue this one, it costs twice as much (money she does not have) and must be done within several days.

She insisted that i drive home, and for good reason. SHe was feeling terribly. She was so sick about what she was about to do..mixed with nausia from pregnancy period... that i had to pull over 3 times in traffic on the way home, for her to puke her guts out. It made her that sick... i really had nothing to say as sympathy...

on the way home, she called up the new referred clinic, and set up an appointment for tomorrow morning. She has to have an escort go with her to drive her back home...and she looks at me. and tells me that she has NO one else that could go with her. I told her straight up...that i felt horrible for taking her that day and i just could not make myself take her to the appointment the tomorrow. That it was her choice, i hope she understands (which she does) but that i want no more to have anything to do with her abortion.

So baby got one more day to live. My friend and I look at the Ultrasound pictures, and she's sure...that tomorrow she wants to have the abortion for real.

im sick.

[NeuroTypical]

Maybe I'm too late, but my wife and I would be willing to adopt her child.

Really. I'm serious. If there's still time, would you let her know? We're a stable family married for 11 years, with two girls 6 and 4, who would love to have another sibling of either gender.

LM

[funkyfool]

Maybe I'm too late, but my wife and I would be willing to adopt her child.

Really. I'm serious. If there's still time, would you let her know? We're a stable family married for 11 years, with two girls 6 and 4, who would love to have another sibling of either gender.

LM

Loudmouth, i SO wish i could...

She already has a family that says they would adopt the child... she said no.

[NeuroTypical]

What a hard situation. Bless you for trying your best to be a good friend and figure out what's right.

I sent you a PM.

[SmilingRedhead]

Funky, my heart reaches out to you. You have done so well in being there for her. Ultimately it is her decision what she does now - and she seems to have chosen...

And you also have made a decision that you do not wish to be part of her abortion anymore and I totally respect you for that. In any case I have much respect for you as this is such a difficult situation to be part of and from what I can gather you have treated it with much thought and consideration.

I've had this in my head since I first read your post yesterday. You've been in my prayers.

[Alaskagain]

Yes, Funky, BLESS you! What you did today took great courage! You are wonderfunkyful! Know that even though you think you haven't been a good example in the past, you ARE being a GREAT example to this girl. I am sure you are totally emotionally drained . ... so here's a big hug!

I will continue to keep all in my prayers, and hope for the best!

[the_jason]

Loudmouth, i SO wish i could...

She already has a family that says they would adopt the child... she said no.

Are you friggin' kidding me?? She'd rather kill a baby than give it to someone who really wants it and will take good care of it? That's sad, and very, very selfish. You can tell her Jason said so.

[WillowTheWhisp]

Loudmouth, i SO wish i could...

She already has a family that says they would adopt the child... she said no.

That is terrible. She has a family who want this child and she would rather kill it than let it have the life it deserves with parents who want it? One day she will face judgement for her decision. How can she deprive her baby of this chance of life?

[EmeraldIsle15]

It sounds as though your state requires parental consent for minors (I don't remember if u said it did) -- If so, there is still one avenue left open to you. Do you know if her parents approve of abortions? If there is any chance that they do not you can speak to them. Even if they do there is a possibility that they would not wish their daughter to have one.

It will be a difficult conversation but if you do so there is a possibility that her child will be born and given the opportunity to live. If she is firmly set against adoption, perhaps she and her boyfriend can try to forge a life together with their child. Her parents may even be supportive. One of my friends became pregnant at 17 -- she truly believed her parents were going to kick her out when she told them she was pregnant. She had all of her bags packed and was prepared to move in with my mom and I. But, when she told them, even though they were upset and disappointed they told her they'd help support her and her child. She was deathly afraid but it ultimately ended up not being anywhere near as bad as she had feared.

Anyways, no matter what happens in the days to come be satisfied with knowing that you did all that you could. Take care and I hope you feel better soon. =)

[Janell]

Yeah, it was. Sorry. I didn't even think--obviously.

[siouxz72]

jeepers! that sucks, funky! pm sent...keep us posted.

love love love you!!!